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118 posts. Alias of Umbranus.


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Am I The Only One? wrote:

Nix ranger from that and add it to the list of in-game-world identifiables with wizard. Ranger is not only a class, but a related occupation, and was/is a real thing in real life, and definitely is an identifiable occupation/class (if you will) in Middle Earth and other fantasy sources.

It is. But it is one a slayer could fill, too. Or a barbarian or hunter. A guy who can track, knows the wilderness and looks rugged doesn't have to be class ranger.

At higher level with an additional dip into lame oracle there is nothing stopping you.

As the other thread got completely hijacked despite being asked to return to topic here is another one. Please leave speculations about monster literacy, necromancy and shrodinger's wizards in the old thread.

No, I did not say that a rapier benefits more from strength. What I said was that an axe is better for landing hard hits with low strength.
At some carnivals there is something called "Hau den Lukas" in german. I think it is High Striker in English. If you have the right technique you can be good at that without being very strong. But if you tried it with a light weapon (light as opposed to heavy) the stronger guy would surely win. Because with lighter weapons it is mainly the strength that creates the impact.

You've obviously never seen someone fight with a dagger, is all I can say.

I have seen people try to kill me with a knife. Or with a broken bottle. I have been doing martial arts, I have been doing sabre fencing for some time. And now I'm in an reenactment club that is closely working together (because of mixed members) with a club doing full contact swordsmanship duels according to the HMBIA (historical medieval battles international association). I own a sword meant for fighting and two suits of armor, one would be light, the other medium for PF. So I have some first- and a lot of secondhand knowledge when it comes to fighting techniques.

I think I could make my point clearer if I were a native speaker.

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Is it really important to the topic: "speculations on the unchained summoner" whether dragons or elementals can read?

Perhaps it would be better to make another topic for that discussion.

He is not the best in offence but has some tricks up his sleeve, is good at bull-rushing and has ok defenses.

Ulfen Shield fighter:

Human (ulfen)
Dual talent
Fighter (brawler) 3/Brawler (mutagenic mauler) 6

STR: 18 (14+2+2) DEX: 16(14+2) CON: 14 INT: 12 WIS: 12 CHA: 7 (15 PB)

- Shield bearer, Shield trained (gorum)

FB1: Power attack
L3: Improved Shield Bash
L5: Combat reflexes
BB1: Spiked destroyer
L7: Shield slam
BB2: Weapon focus (heavy shield)

For the two free feats I'm not sure yet. I might take iron will with one of them.
And I might change the race to something else that might grow up among Ulfen.

Advice is welcome.

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Tarantula wrote:
My2Copper wrote:
Tarantula wrote:
Val'bryn2 wrote:
Actually, in this case, no they aren't. A fireball isn't causing a sudden explosion somewhere, it is conjuring a bead of fire, which then travels at great speed, and then explodes. A fireball is an instantaneous spell. Shooting an arrow is an instantaneous attack. If you can react for one, you can react to the other.
The instant the spell is finished casting, that bead of fire instantly follows where the caster aimed it, and instantly explodes dealing damage. There is no passage of time during this instant. Either the caster is still casting, or the spell has completed and the effects are finished. There is no in-between.

Look at the AllyShield betrayal feat. It clearls lets you react to being targetet by some instant spells. Those that are ranged attacks.

I am on a mobile so no link.

1) A feat allowing you to do something shows that without that feat, you are not allowed to do it.

2) Fireballs are not ranged attacks.

Your point was that there is no time to do whatsoever between targeting an instantaneous spell and the spell hitting its target. The feat proves you wrong. I never said the feat would help with the fireball. Only that it works on instantaneous spells.

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How about this reason:
Most games I play in are at my place because we have a large living room and it is rather central for all those involved. But it is in no way child save. We have fragile things standing around, have 18rated material readyly available, dont put dangerous cleaning agents away out of reach.
Some of the sweets at the gaming table are hot enough to make real men cry.
Letting children into my flat is dangerous for both them and me.

Tarantula wrote:
Val'bryn2 wrote:
Actually, in this case, no they aren't. A fireball isn't causing a sudden explosion somewhere, it is conjuring a bead of fire, which then travels at great speed, and then explodes. A fireball is an instantaneous spell. Shooting an arrow is an instantaneous attack. If you can react for one, you can react to the other.
The instant the spell is finished casting, that bead of fire instantly follows where the caster aimed it, and instantly explodes dealing damage. There is no passage of time during this instant. Either the caster is still casting, or the spell has completed and the effects are finished. There is no in-between.

Look at the AllyShield betrayal feat. It clearls lets you react to being targetet by some instant spells. Those that are ranged attacks.

I am on a mobile so no link.

Magic missile can't target a fireball bead. Just saying.
And I would rule it as much easier to put yourself in the way of something than to hit it with a projectile of your own. It IS possible to jump in front of someone and take an arrow for him*. But it is not possible to shoot said arrow out of the air.

*There are some ways this can be done in PF.

I am not very familiar with it but in baseball it seems much easier to for the man behind the one with the bat to catch the ball than it is to hit the ball with the bat. Just as a point for taking the hit being easier than hitting the bead with something.

Sniggevert wrote:
Doing something like this is one of the things that can drive away starting players by overriding the cooperative play environment.

Reading threads like this is enough to drive players from PFS. Or keep them from trying it out. It sure did it for me. Not this thread but others on the boards here.

One thing to think about: Even if the BS is exotic you can use it as martial and there are bound to be more BS available than falcatas. If you can rely on always getting your weapon upgrades through magic mart that's ok. If you hope to find/loot a good weapon it might be wise to take the less exotic option.

The AoO from standing up clearly has the -4 for prone because they provoke before finishing standing up. For the greater trip and vicious stomp AoOs I'm not sure.

I know a different version of the peasant railgun:
Line them up and hand every one of them some arrows and one of them (on one end) a magic bow. Every one of them has the order to delay to pick up the bow, shoot it and drop it to one side. At the end of the turn (6 sec) every one of them has shot an arrow from the same bow no matter how many peasants you have. The next round they do the same just in reverse direction.
No on and off realism, just many shot arrows in little time with only one bow. And completely raw.

Gaberlunzie wrote:
Lincoln Hills wrote:
Reid Richter wrote:
...If he runs into one of the drow that performed these experiments, he would obviously lose it but my question is: after the interrogation (if [the drow is] still alive) could my NG bloodrager vengefully mutilate the drow to death and remain good or neutral?
You (the player) presumably aren't uncomfortable with the idea of the character's actions, but you may want to double-check with your fellow players - this act might make you "one of them" from the viewpoint of other PCs and seriously stress the cohesion of your adventuring party. In general, it's not good to be the guy whose actions break up the party: it'd be good manners to either foreshadow your actions in-character or give the other players an out-of-character warning, depending on your table's style.
And also, note that it's not just about how the other characters might feel about your character: For many tables, explicit torture and similar is just not something that's appropriate for the table. It might make other players - not just characters - very uncomfortable.

While, sure, you are right this brings up another problem: Would the others ask before playing their pc as they see it? If you ask them and the answer is: Don't do this and later another player does something that you, as a player, feel uncompfortable, how will that be for you?

Just a side question: Swashbuckler finesse and inspired finesse both state that they apply for feat prerequisites. Do they only apply for weapons that are affected or if it generally?
In other words: Could one with either of those abilities and perform: Dance 3 take dervish dance?
I did a search but no result seemed to answer the question without fully reading all the threads.

haruhiko88 wrote:
Everybody wants dex to damage. I want Str or Con to AC. Naked barbarians should be a thing.

That would be neat. And with dex to damage it would be in line for the cost of two feats.

Most people want to make a system where magic is less bountiful to help martials.
But most of the time the rules implemented squash martials under the caster's heels.

Dragon ferocity gives 1/2 str to damage in addition to the normal str to damage. But this FAQ* tells us that you can not add the same ability twice. So unless you have str to damage it seems dragon style now does not add damage.

Do ability modifiers from the same ability stack? For instance, can you add the same ability bonus on the same roll twice using two different effects that each add that same ability modifier?

No. An ability bonus, such as "Strength bonus", is considered to be the same source for the purpose of bonuses from the same source not stacking. However, you can still add, for instance “a deflection bonus equal to your Charisma modifier” and your Charisma modifier. For this purpose, however, the paladin's untyped "bonus equal to her Charisma bonus (if any) on all saving throws" from divine grace is considered to be the same as "Charisma bonus (if any)", and the same would be true for any other untyped "bonus equal to her [ability score] bonus" constructions.

Edit: I would not play it that way. But, as I read it, that is the RAW because of the FAQ.

I wonder how good a strength based daring champion would be.
You don't get any benefit from champion's finesse but every thing else should work all right. You can use power attack and everything the dex based guy can. What you will have less is AC.

You could build a strength based swashbuckler or daring champion.
Sure, you don't benefit from swashbuckler's finesse but you do benefit from almost every other ability.

With a cavalier (daring champion) you lose mount and get nothing for it (nothing you can use) but the other abilities are nice. Especially precise strike that adds your level to damage as long as you have 1 panache point. During a challenge you add level to damage a second time.
Add power attack and you're good to go.

With grudge fighter and the mindlessly cruel trait you get a nice damage bonus against enemies that attack you. Which you can provoke via reverse faint. (similar to CAGM but using up an immediate action instead of an AOO).

The result: Apart from still being a big strong brute you fight more like a swashbuckler.

Sarrah wrote:
I mathed out TWF feat chain earlier on someone elses post. According to math, the only time TWF is inferior to not TWF is when you need to roll an 18 exactly to hit (with not TWF).

And vs hardness or DR you have to overcome.

The dwarven favored class bonus applies to the warxe if he has slashing grace.

They just don't want "Hodor!" eidolon mounts.

it's just b in the [] not bold. Apart from that you are right that skill checks that are based on cha are cha based checks.

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swoosh wrote:
A battleaxe or bastard sword being more finessaable than a Dagger is silly.

They are not more finessable. You take weapon finesse and get to use dex to attack with daggers. That's not possible with the other two.

But if you put more work into it you can get dex to damage with those weapons on top of dex to attack. And that is not so much silly because in reality when you want to use your dexterity or agility to inflict more damage with a melee weapon you do that by using the weapon's own weight and momentum. The dagger has neglectable weight and momentum and because of that it is hard to deal more damage with it via dex.
Daggers are more about where do you hit and how deep can you push it in (which needs strength).

What would make sense is to give every weapon a minimum strength to use it with dex to damage. But that would make it complicated and MAD.

TL;DR You can make forceful chops with an axe or a sword or you can whirl it gracefully. Both ways increase the impact. Way two is impossible with a dagger.

Negative Levels, What is their Purpose?

To annoy. And to reduce party gold from 1/2 WBL to 1/4 WBL or worse.

IMO the worst and dumbest hold over from 3.5

Magda Luckbender wrote:
What do you need so much CHA for? You won't Selective Channel, so channeling is mostly for Out Of Combat healing. In that context, there's not that much difference between 5 channels per day and 3 channels per day. You could drop CHA as low as 10 without harming your character concept. Shelyn values inner beauty not outer beauty.

The main point about the pc I want to build is a feat that increases weapon damage for channel uses.

ACG wrote:

Energy channel: You destill your channeled energy into your weapon to empower it.

Prerequisites:Channel energy;Air, Earth, Fire, or Water domain or blessing.
Benefit:A swift action you can expend one use of channel energy to grant youur weapon attacks a bonus on damage rolls equal to twice the number of dice rolled for your channel energy. This additional damage is of an energy type determined by your domain or blessing. (...) This effect lasts for your next three weapon attacks or until the end of combat, whichever comes first.

In my op I misnamed the feat because I remembered it wrong.

Fruian Thistlefoot wrote:

My problem is why is a cleric of Shelyn so skilled and focused on combat?

That doesn't make sense to me TBH. You do know she is a godless that expects her followers to favor mercy over aggression and combat to be a last option only after peace has been offered and refused.

Perhaps yamatetsu is the better choice after all, fluff wise.


Secondly channel energy damage is going to feel like a waste of feats even for elemental channel. It will add some extra damage but it is not going to be OMG awesome damage.

I'm not sure how +level (or level-1 at even levels)on weapon attacks is weak. Perhaps you look at the wrong feat.

The one I want to take is from the ACG and adds damage to weapon attacks. 2 points per d6 you would channel.


Also find out what your end level is. If it is 12 or under I highly recommend a Warpriest. If it goes over 12 then cleric is the stronger choice.

Not sure yet. but I guess around 12-16.


Also you mention vital strike. Full BaB classes benifit more from vital strike then a 3/4 BaB class.

How so? They have more to lose.

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Thanks again.

My problem is that I need one of the elemental domains and the crusader cleric only gets one domain. So either I drop crusader or I can't take the other domains.

Shield of swings might be an option. For combat expertise my dex will not be high enough that it matters.

There is a new feat in the ACG that allows you to increase your weapon damage by expending uses of channel energy. In fact there are two:
- channel force
- element channel

I'm trying to build around the second of those two. The thread is called crusader cleric of shelyn. Perhaps there will be some input there that is helpful, to you, too.

Sadly I didn't find any online sources of the feats to quote, yet. And I don't have my book with me.

wraithstrike wrote:
If you have subdomain then you still have the main domain. You just have a different version of it.


And on the other two, I guess that's a no?

Because having a second elemental domain/blessing would allow me to choose which kind of damage the element channel deals.

Do subdomains count as fulfilling the requirement of having the base domain?
For example would a cleric with the caves or metal subdomain count as fulfilling the prerequisite of having the earth domain?

There is a new feat that I have not found online yet, with the prerequisite of having the Air, earth, fire or water domain or blessing.

And if the subdomain doesn't work, would having the feat that gives you access to a minor blessing or a 1st level domain power fulfill the prereq?

- War blessing gives you access to minor blessings
- believer's boon gives the 1st level domain power of one domain
Both do not have a special line about counting for prereqs, that other feats have.
- Element channel (not the old elemental channel) is the feat with the prereq in question.
All from the ACG.

As there is a feat that allows me to provide soft cover to an adjacent ally I thought about taking it and using vital strike once I qualify. With my 3/4 BAB my iteratives are few and do not hit well.

Perhaps I could, later, make vital strike better by adding grasping strike?

How this idea developed:
The idea for this build started when I found the new element channel feat from the ACG.
It allows you to use a swift action to expend one use of channel energy to deal elemental damage equal to the number of dice you would channel with your next three weapon attacks this fight.

Prerequisites are channel energy and to have one elemental domain or blessing. The damage dealt depends on the domain.

I wanted to be able to deal acid or lightning so air or earth where the options.

The crusader cleric can learn some weapon specific bonus feats only for the favored weapon.

I found Yamatetsu and Shelyn as options and thought the latter was nicer (pun intended).

So what I have: I want a cleric that is able to fight in the front line, I want to use element channel and I want to wield my deity's favored weapon. That is what I am set on. The rest is still open to change.

Human Crusader of Shelyn
STR: 16 DEX: 13 CON: 12 INT: 10 WIS: 14 CHA: 14
STR: 17 DEX: 12 CON: 12 INT: 12 WIS: 14 CHA: 12

Bonus: Weapon focus (Glaive)
Human: Element channel (Air)
1St: Open
3rd: Power attack
5th: Furious focus ?
Bonus: Heavy armor prof.
7th: Open
9th: Open
Bonus: Weapon Specialization (Glaive)

I could see me taking believer's book to get an additional 1st level domain power. And/or divine protection (only with cha 14). Or I could take eldritch heritage and later the feat that gives me the lesser bloodrage.

I have not yet looked into PrCs, but I'm open to gong there if it increases my channeling.

Any ideas or pieces of advice?

You could make your first attack with a two-handed weapon and the iterative attacks with armor spikes, because you never attack with both at the same time. Now why should I not be able to threaten with my armor spikes if I can attack with them?

Just worship Gorum and you are on the save side.

With the hunt trick a bird companion, even at low level, can hunt food for the party. Might not be a big thing but paying for rations as well as travelling at half speed can be a nuisance.

This is in addition to scouting, of course.

chbgraphicarts wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
Supernatural abilities normally don't provoke, unless noted so, in their description.
I'd like to see examples of that; generally, any ability of any kind which requires either a Standard or Move Action to perform will say whether it provokes an Attack of Opportunity or not.

Some examples:

Oracle revelations often do not state if they provoke. Nature oracle revelation: Life Leach (Su): You can draw life force from the bodies of enemies and channel it into yourself. As a standard action, you can drain the life essence from one living target within 30 feet...

Same with cleric domain powers: Community domain: Calming Touch (Sp): You can touch a creature as a standard action to heal it of 1d6 points of nonlethal damage + 1 point per cleric level...

Or sorc bloodline powers: Accursed bloodline: Horrific Visage (Su): At 1st level, you can draw upon your hag ancestor to cause one target to perceive you as having a horrifying appearance. As a standard action, you can force one target within 30 feet to make a Will save or be shaken for 1 round for every 2 sorcerer levels you possess...

And some feats: Blinding flash combat feat: Benefit: As a move action, you can expertly angle the blade of your weapon or shield to reflect light into an opponent’s eyes, dazzling your foe for 1 round. This feat functions as a gaze attack, and the target must make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 your character level + your Dex modifier) to resist the effect. This is a sight-dependent effect, and does not work on creatures that are already blinded or creatures that do not rely on sight as their primary sense. You must be wielding a weapon or shield with a polished or reflective surface in order to use this feat. You must be in an area of bright light to use this feat.

Neither the feat nor the gaze attack entry clarifies if it provokes or not.

Sneaky Maneuver wrote:

Benefit: Anytime a rogue with this talent could hit an opponent with a melee sneak attack on her turn, she may take a –2 penalty on her attack roll and attempt a dirty trick, disarm, steal, sunder, or trip combat maneuver instead of dealing sneak attack damage. If the attack succeeds, the rogue deals weapon damage as normal and then attempts a combat maneuver check as a swift action (the –2 penalty only applies to the initial attack roll, not the combat maneuver check). This combat maneuver still provokes attacks of opportunity unless the rogue has a feat or ability that allows her to perform it without provoking attacks of opportunity.
sulking slayer wrote:

At 1st level, when she could normally make a sneak attack, a slayer may instead make a dirty trick or steal combat maneuver with a bonus on her roll. This bonus is equal to her number of sneak attack dice for a dirty trick combat maneuver, or 1-1/2 × her number of sneak attack dice for a steal combat maneuver.

Both replace the sneak attack. And so do the options from the ACG as far as I've seen.

I am not sure you can give up the sneak attack for bonuses multiple times. As I read it you'd only get the highest bonus of all those abilities.

Each of the abilities basically states: You exchange the sneak attack for a maneuver. Some add a bonus. But if you already exchanged your sneak attack for the first ability you do not have them to exchange then for the other abilities as well. Just different ways to get a similar result.

Just take a length of twine and pull it taut. Now hold one end at the casters sqare and the other end in the direction the caster wishes. Count off the number of squares for the length.

The spell does what it states it does. It doesnt allow you to pull the caster. Pull free or let go is all you can do.

AndyTheGM wrote:

Lets say we have a small air elemental familiar who has mule back cords and ant haul cast on it, this air elemental has fly by attack as all air elemental do.

OK, I didn't notice that one of the two carrying enhancers is a magic item, not a spell. So it is a magical item and a spell.

my stance on this:

the rules tell us that grappling someone and then moving is possible.:

Grapple rules wrote:


You can move both yourself and your target up to half your speed. At the end of your movement, you can place your target in any square adjacent to you. If you attempt to place your foe in a hazardous location, such as in a wall of fire or over a pit, the target receives a free attempt to break your grapple with a +4 bonus.

And a grapple can be ended as a free action by the one initiating the grapple:

Although both creatures have the grappled condition, you can, as the creature that initiated the grapple, release the grapple as a free action, removing the condition from both you and the target.

Nothing in those rules state that the one grapples looses any kind of action. In fact they tell us that someone who is grapples still can make a full attack as long as he doesn't use a two-handed weapon. Why should that change in this case?

The players use a creature's full round action + 2 spells to allow the barbarian to full-attack. That's a some investment. And by the rules it seems legal.

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I think the stance on cannibalism varies very much with society's views on it:

Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you. John 6:53

taldanrebel2187 wrote:

-Antagonize has NO retry, and it is 1/day per target. It cannot be extended beyond 1 turn. Failure means it cannot be targeted again on the same guy.

My 2 copper: Most DMs run antagonize wrong. Make sure you see the errata'd version on the Pathfinder SRD site. It's a beefed up "taunt" ability. It isn't as good as most people believe. Sadly, even in Society, most DMs don't run it correctly.

I read my name so I had to come over.

Most of what you wrote is correct, but the 1/day is only true for the intimidate part.

The diplomacy version is best used in combination with broken wing gambit. If they attack someone else they get -2, if they attack you they get a bonus and provoke.
Or for a bard. Give him a good armor, shield, the flagbearer feat and antagonize. For safety add toughness. Then just stand there (in the back row) and buff your party via inspire courage and flagbearer and at the same time debuff the enemy via the diplomacy part of antagonize.

sowero wrote:
BRACERS OF ARMOR with BRAWLING will give you another +2

Bracers of armor are not light armor and as such are no legal target for brawling.

Jason Bulmahn wrote:

Bracers of armor do not count as light armor I am afraid.

Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing

Ok, I missed that someone already mentioned it.

H.P. Makelovecraft wrote:


Int damage on holy water vs undead is pretty good I've heard.

Water patron witch 1/alchemist x with false focus for free holy water with int to damage. Sadly it will not keep up in the higher levels.

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