On the helmet, wouldn't it be more straightforward to use Trade (Forge Master) as that specifically is for creating and upgrading Astartes equipment?
The research is fine, I imagine it would take some time anyway.
A question on the exact effects of the master-crafted cortex implants, specifically the effects of a cogitator.
In DH2 p182, good craftsmanship cerebral implants give +20 bonus to Logic and Lore tests. Just checking if this is the rule we're using here?
Another question for the near-ish future, inspired by the 'Safeguard' alternate of use of the Security skill noted in DH: The Radicals Handbook, p145.
What measures could Valens (or others) take to ensure that the Dark Tide's machine spirits are as secure as possible from interference, attack, or sabotage?
I can think of possible uses for the following skills, but I don't want to make a huge number of redundant rolls if just following standard procedures is as good as it gets.
Forbidden Lore (Adeptus Mechanicus)
Forbidden Lore (Archeotech)
Forbidden Lore (Tech-Heresy)
Forbidden Lore (Xenos)
Logic
Scholastic Lore (Cryptology)
Security: Safeguard (Intelligence)
Tactics (Defensive Doctrine)
Tactics (Void Combat)
Tech-Use
Trade (Forgemaster)
Sure can use forgemaster instead of trade (armorer)... Not just one because you aren't going off standard STC design and you are improvising and inspecting an existing piece of equipment.
I'll look into that, I honestly hadn't considered that a big deal with the safeguard, just because it's not DH and figured things in DW more advanced and protected, but now that you mention it, I'll read up and check it out, get back to you.
As for your auger array inspection of Alric, what are you trying to do? And with what auger? You trying to xray vision him or something? I didn't see that equipment or bionic in profile, so can't think of how to respond.
@EVERYONE, I believe the rules have a a mention of a maximum +/-60 bonus, that usually doesn't apply to many, but does at higher levels, especially with techmarine and all their toys...
Valen, Im not sure where you got 100 tech use starting in your last roll... You have 60 int, +10 with with unnat int, then what? Once we sort through this I'll remember and won't have to deal with this so often, so bear with me, I glanced at your profile, but couldn't piece together exactly how you got your numbers. Once I know what you're trying to do, I'll know better what equipment and gear could help you have bonuses... Not entirely sure the Miu helps here...
Lastly I'll say the +20 bonus to logic and scholastic lore applies, but not to FB Lore... I'll reread about it, I just don't recall Xing using it for FB Lore or the +20 to others but I'm sure he'll be happy to know it's available.
Ok Valen, found more in your profile upon a deeper look, gotta check a few things in my books... Gonna do on my pc as it's easier to search the pdfs there, but incase you beat me to it or recall more easily, I'm looking into the following..
Artificer bionics is just reqular requisition or only for wargear talent... Its a chapter relic and it's not something you can give back..
Sense corruption from Jericho reach book? How and where did that come from.
You have a ton of bionics, I'm assuming that's all in line with what we discussed and what I rolled for you to have? Not a big deal, just double checking, not as important as first two concerns... I found your auger array, I'll reread that to get a better idea how to respond to your IC post
Found it all more easily than I thought, memory of stuff coming back.
First on the auger roll, it gives +20 to awareness tests and tech use to detect unseen environmental stuff, not sure how it applies to scanning a human, but you'd still need an awareness test. Also, the Miu wouldn't help in this case as Miu is like wifi connection and the bionic auger is already hardwired into you... For future reference, if you want to use tech roll to amplify auger it will be straight int, unnatural bonus, and your +20tech use bonus from talent, I can't see any other equipment or tool you have that would aid in the function and grant further bonuses, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong or make a case if you feel differently.
As for sense corruption, I completely missed your diving into that salient and those bonuses, but its there and fits your pc and matches history, so I'll let you keep it, though I would have liked to of known beforehand... As for any further purchases there with xp, that's the only thing you took right?, we'll have to agree on it..... This is going to make for some interesting RolePlay with Xing, as you are about to detect some shimmering robes he nabbed from a Daemon the kill team defeated... Its nothing the others don't know, but now you will soon, just give me some time to incorporate it as it should have happened earlier, I just didn't know about your solo ability.. Sorry.. Your profile is a bit of a mess and not exactly organized as much as I'd like.. Please when you get a chance try to separate and list things in categories together.
* Cool. Trade Forgemaster it is.
*Valens is aware of many ways in which technology can be usurped, corrupted, or breached. He would want to do everything he could to ensure that the Dark Tide's systems are secure. But if that boils down to "just do things as he normally would", that's fine by me.
* Exceptional Auger Array is in my list of bionics. I'm using the auspex function to "spot things not normally detectable to human senses". What Valens is trying to do is get an idea of Alric's cybernetics (if any) and data on his terminator armour and weaponry. This isn't any malign intent, it's just part of Valens drive to gather information, particularly about technology. I would argue that the MIU makes it easier for Valens to finetune how the auger array is examining a target during the scan.
* I believe that +/-60 applies on top of the skill, not the attribute. If I'm incorrect in this, let me know. I'll further break down my last tech-use roll. Please let me know if there are any problems here or I've put something into an incorrect category.
Skill
Intelligence 60
Skill +20
Talented Talent +10
Master Enginseer Talent +10
Altering Difficulty of Test
Unnatural Intelligence (x2) -10 to difficulty (counted in roll as a +10 for simplicity's sake)
Modifiers
MIU upgraded with artificer bionics +20
* I'm content with that ruling on the cortical implants.
* Ah, I overlooked that aspect of the artificer bionics. My mistake, and I'm happy to correct it. I can think of a few ways to resolve this:
a) That the artificer bionic components are "plugged into" Valens' current MIU systems and are not a permanent fixture, and can/will be removed after the current mission ends.
b) I spend the requisition as normal for this mission, but take the Signature Wargear and Signature Wargear (master) talents before changing requisition for another mission.
c) That we retroactively have the artificer bionics not installed, with or without replacement gear for the requisition cost.
* Cybernetic breakdown, cybernetic and source:
Servo-Arm - Techmarine
Servo-Harness - Forge Master
Bionic Hand - Iron Hand
Bionic Respiratory System - Techmarine
MIU - Techmarine
Cortical Implants - Techmarine
Bionic Arm - Omnissiah's Call Deed
Enhanced Potentia Coil - One of five additional cybernetics
Bionic Locomotion - One of five additional cybernetics
Auger Array - One of five additional cybernetics
Cybernetic Senses - One of five additional cybernetics
Hermetic Infusion - One of five additional cybernetics
* On the auger roll, I imagine Valens would be looking for characteristic electromagnetic emissions from cybernetics, something he would be very familiar with between his background and medicae training. I assumed that the tech-use test would have been the more appropriate of the two given that angle, but awareness is fine by me.
* As for augmenting the auger array with tech-use, I could see the MIU working much like components in a car do (the ones with more wireless systems anyway). If not, then would electrograph use work as its a wired system? A combi-tool is trickier, but Valens must be able to do maintenance on his cybernetics, so some sort of interfacing with a tool perhaps might work in the field. If not, fair enough.
* Yeah, I thought I had listed Sense Corruption in pm before. No worries on delay, I imagine Valens has been very focused on technology and learning about the Necrons. Now he may have more time to study his companions...
* I will reorganise my sheet. It's harder than I'd like to find information myself.
FF pg 96, The artificer bionics must be taken with signature wargear talent... If you haven't taken that yet, then you may spend the xp if you have it, to aquire the talent and upgrade your MIU. As it's cost is 40, that means it requires master signature wargear... I don't think you have enough xp (500xp and/or 1000xp)to spare to buy these talents... If not, then let's just hold off on it then and you can purchase in the future.
I just posted a reply. I don't have the spare xp, and I'm loathe to cut into Valens' lores. I'd rather lose the artificer bionics if it came to that. In my recent reply, I included a few options for the artificer bionics, see what you think.
Ok, cool, quite a post and some points for me to think about... Thanks for breaking down where the bionics come from, my last issue to resolve with them is their quality, as you Start with a common and get an exceptional at current renown... All of yours are EQ and 2 are master.. Trying to find my exact post about how many you could have and what quality, this is what I saw, just cut and pasted the following
decide, 2 master and 2 exceptional, or 1 master 4 exceptional, or 3 master... From any book fine.
So not sure where 5 EQ and 2 MQ come from..
Chapter stuff, especially something augmenting an Miu would need to be permanent, so no on the temporary basis, but I'll take a closer look at your previous post and your reply before deciding, is after 1am here, been at this for a few hours, gotta sleep and get to work in the morning. Sorry I didn't get to this before we began, was eager to move things forward and get everyone posting.. We'll figure it out, it's nothing that will affect what we are doing now significantly
No problem. Deathwatch is a complex game even before adding in additional elements, and as it turns out I made some mistakes in character creation and requisition.
One of the exceptional bionics is from the Omnissiah's Calling deed. Ah, now I see the error. I assumed for some reason that Valens had reached Famed level of renown, which is where a techmarine gets master-crafted bionic would have come from.
I very much want to hang onto both the cortical implants and the enhanced potentia coil, though they don't both need to be master-crafted.
Ideas:
a) Cut the MC enhanced potentia coil and the EX hermetic infusion, and take a EX enchanced potentia coil as one of the five additional bionics.
b) Take the Price of Victory deed and cover MC enhanced potentia coil and another MC cybernetic. Costs a fate point, but it would correct the error in another way.
And certainly.
Was it a house ruling that the MIU is a wireless connection? The description of the MIU give me the distinct impression that it is explicitly a physical connection:
These devices, also known as sense-links, allow the owner to directly interface with a machine or technological device. MIUs see widespread use among Techmarines. A basic MIU implant involves a single spinal or cortex connector, while advanced variants include wrist connector probes—and possibly mechadendrite connectors—in addition to the spinal plug.
I had been basing it off RT additional text that I'd read and played long ago with my first GM.... You are right Ulrich, I took a glance at the deathwatch and it's different. Rogue trader has the following additional text
. In addition, an
MIU gives the user the ability to experience the senses of any
familiars he controls (such as a servo-skull or grapplehawk, see
page 375) as if he were present.
That isn't necessarily a wireless connection to equipment though and I think the physical plug makes more sense... So here's how we'll do it.
Valen will have the spinal or wrist connection probes and one on a mechandrite... His artificer armor includes one too, but its redundant at this point... You need to plug in to stuff, but can control and have senses of servitors and familiar, as per the text.
Valen, I know it's different than originally thought, if this impacts your decision to have it in relation to the conversation above where we are figuring out your bionics, I'll allow you to change or remove it.
For Valens long post
The +/- modifier is on top of attribute
The master enginseer bonus is +10 to emergency repairs extended action, not tech use in general.
Let's go with option C.
I think I explained auger before and in light of reading description, it's just tech roll, nothing else helps.
You may choose a or b for covering the number of bionics, up to you.
Nice to know about the cortex implant bonus. And glad to hear about heavy weapons, it's what I had in mind when I requisitioned one.
* Understood on the +/-. I'll bear that in mind for future.
* I was thinking of other versions of the Master Enginseer talent that add a +10 to tech-use tests. Also one to bear in mind for future.
* With option c, do you want me to choose alternate requisition? Or just leave it? If alternate, then he'll take the following:
Reductor 8
Multikey 15
Pict Recorder 5
Astartes Harness 8
Astartes Combat Webbing 3
Extra Repair Cement 1
* Auger, understood.
* For Price of Victory deed (Rites of Battlee, p81), it excludes certain cybernetics (e.g. MIU). For MC cybernetics taken with the deed, is it just bionics I take, or can I choose other cybernetics from other books that are not specifically excluded?
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Choose alt. requisition, what you have chosen looks fine.
I'd prefer bionics, as it makes more sense in a DW marine context and the nature of the deed, being injured in battle etc, but if there is something particular in mind you'd like to have, let me know and we can decide.
As for sense corruption, here's how I think it can be used and how you can apply the bonuses and when in the future:
The +30 bonus will be to scrutiny, and for a particular part of a conversation, it doesn't cover anything and everything said, you'll need to roll it anytime you think there is something suspect. The rank 6 bonus, I'm going to rule the same. It will depend greatly on your role-play and you won't ascertain much if they aren't talking to you. Wearing a helmet also obscures view, etc, so keep that in mind when trying to roleplay and think of what you are looking at specifically, think body language, voice, eyes, speech, etc...
For our current example with Alric, you have only heard greetings, so there is nothing for him to deceive you about through his words or actions yet, so I don't think it's appropriate,and it would be impossible to detect anything with such limited exposure to his nature.
I don't want this ability to be a shortcut for role-play, without proper interaction, the modifiers and difficulty will be greater, and you won't know what they are, and/or when you fail/pass. (Obviously, if you pass you'll get something,but failure to a great degree, could have you mistakenly accusing someone, so having some interaction and more than pure "intuition" will help set the scene for your actions and convince your brother... This will be the first ability I've seen that will make me roll off the forums, b/c merely rolling here could imply deception, so I'll be rolling with dice on my phone. If people are pure, like Alric, then there won't be rolls, but you won't know either way.
Hope this clears up the use of this ability, if you have any questions or other hypothetical scenarios you'd want me to break down for you, please think and ask now, before it becomes important.
That should be all OOC stuff we need to clear up if I'm correct, afterwards, I can begin putting more thought into your FB lore rolls.
I'm happy with that interpretation of sense corruption. I'll work on the rest when I've time later.
Here is my revised cybernetic breakdown. The Price of Victory deed involving massive damage to Valen's body and mechanicus implants endured during a particularly brutal battle against the ***REDACTED*** xenos species.
Let me know if this looks okay.
Servo-Arm - Techmarine
Servo-Harness - Forge Master
EX Bionic Hand - Iron Hands
Bionic Respiratory System - Techmarine
EX MIU - Techmarine
EX Bionic Arm - Omnissiah's Call Deed
MC Cortical Implants - One of five additional cybernetics
EX Auger Array - One of five additional cybernetics
EX Cybernetic Eyes - One of five additional cybernetics
EX Bionic Heart - One of five additional cybernetics
EX Bionic Locomotion - One of five additional cybernetics
MC Hermetic Infusion - Price of Victory Deed
MC Enhanced Potentia Coil - Price of Victory Deed
Has Valens got any biological parts left? He sounds like a brain in a metal box!
Oh sure! Most of his left arm above the wrist, some of his chest and head, ears, and I imagine several of his Astartes-only organs like the secondary heart. He has "The Flesh is Weak" taken twice, and can take that three more times by rank 8, so I believe there is yet more augmentation to go.
And rephrased slightly, he would take that description as a compliment. :)
He doesn't have the machinator array yet, nor the enhanced bionic frame...
Still too many fleshy bits....
;)
He does have the machinator array, which counts as a talent, but agreed on the over-abundance of flesh! ;)
"You do not need a Chaplain.
You need a well-oiled screw-driver and a proper reboot,
that's all!"
;-)
What is hermetic infusion?
You should stay away from magnets... Or with your weight, they should stay away from you...
If in doubt - power down and restart! ;)
Hermetic infusion is from DH: Inquisitor's Handbook. It replaces blood and blood processing organs with a far more efficient biomechanical serum. It offers extra resistance to toxins and radiation, and good quality or better gives Regeneration. And magnets might be a problem!
Sounds like he is essentially a mini-dreadnought!!! Now its time to upsize your scale! Titan form, here we come!
He does have the machinator array, which counts as a talent, but agreed on the over-abundance of flesh! ;)
Ah. That explains why I didn't see it. What about the Enhanced Bionic Frame? Semi/Full Auto as a half action is pretty sick!
High level techmarines can get some very impressive defenses. As it stands, there are vehicles that can take less punishment than Valens.
Enhanced bionic frame is definitely on the wish list. Literally a walking weapons platform!
So I don't think hermetic infusion is suitable for a marine...
After reading the disadvantages, you need a special supply of blood and /or a Magos Bioligis to fix you and that's not something readily available to Marines and and a burden to carry more blood and its limited, given where Marines are fighting.
Additionally, it replaces organs, which I think would be a big no no for a marine and their specific genetic design... Marines get prosanguine, that should be your healing...
I really like that you explored the books and created something truly unique and I've given you almost everything you've wanted, but hermetic infusion kind of goes beyond what any marine or techmarine is designed for. Everything else fine, just need to switch that one. Even letting you have the cybernetic that replaced both legs instead of one at a time, Ive given you more leeway because you are Ironhand. So switch out hermetic infusion and we'll be good.
Working on a few key npcs onboard and I'll be ready to update
Hi guys, I am going on vacations starting this tuesday.
I am venturing into the depths of the Scottish Highlands for two full weeks – boy did I longed for that :-)
Our far-off cottage is said to have (slow&unstable) wifi so I may be able to drop a couple of posts, but don't expect especially lengthy or regular posts until the 3rd July from me.
@GM: Could you please bot me when it becomes necessary?
My alias page(s) should contain all necessary numbers and some dice macros.
Deleos! I didn't know you were Ghost! :)
(Or maybe I did and just forgot....)
*Twinkle*
I think I posted about my game as I set it up (over a year and a half ago - can you believe it?) and pm-ed you as I lost some players if you wanted to join since I remembered that you had interest - but no time during the initial recruitment :-)
No problem, enjoy the holiday, we'll be here when you return.
@BayouSnowman: That's a reasonable ruling. And thanks for your thoughts.
Do you think Black Bone Bracing would be a suitable replacement? Basically to have Valen's bones or core artifical struts rebuilt to be as strong as possible after his many horrendous injuries. And I'm aware that I can't double up on the Bulging Biceps talent so I'm not seeking anything from that aspect of the replacement.
@Deleos: As I said earlier, enjoy!
Yea, that sounds fine.. That's the one that gives bonus to unarmed attacks right?
Yup. RT: Into The Storm, p141. It gives a +2 to unarmed damage, the Iron Jaw and Bulging Biceps talents. I'll change my cybernetics list and fate points now.
Cybernetics List
Servo-Arm - Techmarine (not currently attached)
Servo-Harness - Forge Master
EX Bionic Hand - Iron Hands
Bionic Respiratory System - Techmarine
EX MIU - Techmarine
EX Bionic Arm - Omnissiah's Call Deed
MC Cortical Implants - One of five additional cybernetics
EX Auger Array - One of five additional cybernetics
EX Cybernetic Eyes - One of five additional cybernetics
EX Bionic Heart - One of five additional cybernetics
EX Bionic Locomotion - One of five additional cybernetics
MC Blackbone Bracing - Price of Victory Deed
MC Enhanced Potentia Coil - Price of Victory Deed
Sorry, unfortunately having serious technical issues. Laptop has completely failed due to an update and phone has now died as well. Having to use a frustratingly slow old tablet, so posting may be sketchy until I can get a new phone. Feel free to not me as needed.
Happy Father's day to all dads. Happy Dragon Boat Festival for anyone familiar with China... And it's world cup, I don't watch or care, but best of luck to you if you're gambling or rooting for a team.
I know Deleos and Pyros having issues potentially posting for a little while, gonna try to minimize needing them or their input as much as possible, will bot them if needed, but won't make them choose decisions, those will be up to the remainder of the crew or just the captain, depending on how Vartas handles it...
Keeping in my non linear tradition, choices have consequences and will affect the story, just reminding new players not familiar with my style, there are always multiple ways to approach things and I prepare for what I can anticipate and will do more if you choose something I haven't anticipated... Sometimes might be slow when I'm preparing for the fork in the road, but after it'll be more fluid.
I feel this way does keep me from specific planning too far ahead, but giving you choices really makes you feel like it's your story and not just part of A story...
Clarifications and explanations are welcome.
I'm a big fan of offering players choices - and consequences for those choices.
Clarifications and explanations are welcome.
I'm a big fan of offering players choices - and consequences for those choices.
Do you hear your last name as Ko-vak or ko-vatch? Just curious...
@Ulrich:
Cheers for asking! 'ko-vatch' or 'kaw-vahch' are closest to what I had in mind.
@Ulrich:
Cheers for asking! 'ko-vatch' or 'kaw-vahch' are closest to what I had in mind.
If not for altered carbon, I might not have though to do so.
@Ulrich: Altered Carbon is great. The books are even better IMHO.
@BayouSnowman: Cheers for the heads up on the forbidden lore checks. If they are nothing that affects current decisions, then I've no issue waiting a bit longer. Especially since you're busy.
@Ulrich: Altered Carbon is great. The books are even better IMHO.
There are books? Excellent....
Sorry about the 4am drunk dice...Buddy in from the states and we hit it hard last night, up at 8am for work, saw the post and don't know how i got those numbers at all...Anyways, I did it properly and will update soon.
No worries! Catching up with friends in person is important.
So, I can explain the drunk dice...
If you put 1d100 inside the dice expression, it rolls a percentile die.
If you put 1D100, it messes up.
That being said, I got a chuckle out of that so, no worries. :)