Rise of the Runelords - Pathfinder Society (Inactive)

Game Master JCServant

The E can't 'just move with the H', it's done in turns, and in discrete squares. Can't stand in the center of a 10' hallway so you have cover from the one guy you're fighting, you have to choose one or the other 5' square. So the archer and his friend can make the archer win. OK, random archer, random friend, no coordination, fine. But we are PC's, we are the Heroes of Sandpoint. We are beloved of two goddesses, steeped in ancient magics and ascetic lore.

Yes, the mace-cleric likes to charge. Yes, the elf-wizard likes to pretend he doesn't need to sleep, and then nod off during fights. The shaman is crazy. And the archer can only get lucky with the girls.

But we're allowed to try. A model that denies our chance to try to coordinate is a model that takes a LOT from us. If your tables haven't used such, I weep for them. But I'll rage for us, if you try to deny it.

10' hallway:

E-
H-
--
A-

H 5' East, and attacks E.
A attacks E. No obstructions.
E 5' East, attacks H. Or, charges A, takes AoO. Assuming 5' East.
H 5' West, and attacks E.
A 5' East(or Southeast), and attacks E. No obstructions.
E? Same choices as before. This pattern can repeat forever.

A wider hall, or open field, same situation. And you can put a polearm guy 'P' behind H, and he does fine, too. E has to 5' forward to start messing this up. And that's where we'd have to leave the EFL/PFL method.

The lack of map is costing Zeriax hugely. Costs Meg some, too, I have a'lay down trap' power, it does as much as my spear and it always hits, and I can't see when it might be a good idea.

I don't see how to solve my problem. But I offer this for Z: If Meg or Brenton is EFL/PFL with a foe, and we declare "5' lateral to clear (selected enemy) for Zeriax", we stop counting as obstructions on the path Z->Enemy, until the Enemy moves again. Consider the hallway above.

And yes, I suppose if this is fair, it goes both ways, and would work for Meg's spear, too. You can even bring back the 'in melee' penalty. but... Then we'll start 5' stepping diagonally back, so we're not in melee, either.

Gotta drive, hope I've been helpful.

All the above. While I have time today, many days I barely have time to eek out one round of abstract combat. Also, once you go map, you usually want to go order of initiative. It slows things up a lot. Here, in our Pbp method, we knock out most battles in 2 days or less.

This weeks BLUE LIGHT SPECIAL

Any items that increases attribute scores either permanently or temporarily. Examples include a potion of bull strength, an ioun stone that raises a stat, or a belt of dexterity.

The percentage off is 24%

You have until Thursday midnight EST to email those purchases at that discount. Thanks!

Ascetic monk gots no gold.

But we're allowed to try. A model that denies our chance to try to coordinate is a model that takes a LOT from us. If your tables haven't used such, I weep for them. But I'll rage for us, if you try to deny it. I'm not sure it takes a lot from you, so to speak. But, again, we don't disagree on the fact it 'denies our chance to try to coordinate.' Working with the abstract model though, how often does such coordination work out in real gameplay? I think that's where we have a true difference of opinion.

Here's the current house rule in testing.

Number of people between archer and target // AC Bonus from Cover
1 -- +2
2 to 3 -- +3
4+ -- +4

So what do you all want to do? If you want to say that cover never plays a role, you render feats like Improved Precise Shot obsolete. Perhaps we reduce it further.

1 or 2 -- +1
3 -- +2
4 -- +3
5 -- +4

Or maybe we do like we do with spell casting...a percentile is used to determine if cover exists.

Roll d4- (# of ppl between archer & Target). If it's 0 or lower, full cover AC bonus to target applies. If its 1 or higher, the archer has a clear shot.

You tell me. It will work for bad guys too, and they almost never take improved precise shot...so I'm going to guess that loosing up the restrictions only helps them more in the long run. You may see it differently.

Again, keep in mind, There's nothing stopping the monk from joining the party on the front line or running to the enemy back lines to avoid cover penalties in most circumstances...aside from possible AoO's along the way or giving the enemy a clear run towards them.

the elf-wizard likes to pretend he doesn't need to sleep, and then nod off during fights

lol, thats funny. I have been poor with posting times recently - a combo of busy work and easter break. A couple of times i have been at a loss with what to do. Control spells like grease have a greatly reduced effect in this method (although I was goin to grease the three armed guys sword next) and I see future pit/wall/fogs being difficult to manage going forward. I know these guys are immune to mind affecting so colour spray is out too. Even with a touch attack the cover penalties are a killer so snowball is hit or miss (mostly miss).

Magic missile and instantaneous effect AOEs look to be the order of the day now.

On a side note I'll be back to posting regularly from now on.

It's so funny...but lately from stinking cloud to cloud traps, the lingering AoE debilitating spells have actually been making other players cranky in our live tables, lol. Long story. Funny, though :P

Will be hard pressed to post today for the last two posting cycles.... I may be able to post for the last one but likely with 30min / 1 hour delay.

Apologies but I am taking an exam in the evening.

Ok...a few things here....

First, we had a lot of conversation about five foot stepping and cover attacks. Granted, I know you all want to let the 'debate' go, so to speak. And, as far as the 5' foot rule goes, I've made my mind on that, so that conversation is done and over with.

Yet I've agreed with Z and Meg on several major points regarding the issue of cover in my Pbp method. And, while we disagree on the finer point of how often in normal play archers get clear shots, I have conceded that I would be open to softening the rule even further in order to reach a happier medium. I've outlined that proposal 3 posts up. Again, I'm not looking for further debate. This is more of a "I agree with you for the most part, so how much do you want to turn the dial in order to address this" type of question. Normally I take baby steps in addressing balance issues, however, since this impacts the bad guys as well as the good guys, I'm willing to take larger steps to address an issue that clearly makes some unhappy. However, I need everyone's input (because this DOES impact everyone. Wizards, it will only be a matter of time before you're in a combat with archers focusing on you while casting).

Second, Emrys, regarding your spells...you're the first arcane spell casters to run my Pbp rules since I started doing this. Ironically, one of my players who started a more CC type of caster in another group is feeling the same way despite playing on a grid. I'll give you the same advice I would give him. Give it time. I've played a LOT of D&D and pathfinder. Casters always feel underwhelming at lower levels. Furthermore, it's really, really hard to judge a class / build after just a level or two. Pathfinder is a slow burn. And, there's the fact that I'm continuing to evaluate certain aspects of the Pbp and will be changing them as we go along for better balancing (again, keeping in mind that changes affect both sides). Ultimately, however, the decision is yours.

Now, I have another question for the group as a whole, related to campaign pacing. We can either focus on going through the book pretty much as written, with few side encounter (and this includes RP encounters as well as additional side quests, rooms, etc) or we can turn this adventure into something longer. Keep in mind, XP is adhoc, so if we stick to just the story, you will level 'faster' as, by the end, you will be a certain level no matter what. Fluffing it out with other encounters gives you more opportunities to earn gold, items and power points, as well as allow you, as players to learn more about the people of Sandpoint and the land of Varisia. The challenge is that, the longer the Pbp runs, the higher chance that people will drop out and the group falls apart before the end of the adventure path.

What say you?

The play's the thing. Picnic lunches for Zeriax. Meg starts making mirrors in the glassworks. Side-quests and the application of your relationships model from CoT? I'm good with all that.

But if the rest want to push through, I'll ride along, too.

I would vote for the distracted wandering until crisis du jour comes up. But I'd hate to have some scenario clock strike midnight while we were partying.

Only one of us knows enough to guess what works best. :)

Firstly, regarding the direction Emrys is going. It'll probably take me until level four or five to earn the power points to potentially change school specialization anyway so I'll have a few levels to see how it plays out in any case.

The pacing of this campaign is fine by me. I don't mind expanding the NPC interaction a little anyway, Emrys has been banging his head against a brick wall with Ameiko since the start anyway.

I'm more of taking the scenic route type of player. More options to improve the player through extra loot and power points appeals to me.

The relationship model I use in CoT was a modified one from Jade Regent, which I enjoyed a lot in playing that AP at the table. I think the players enjoy having a visual idea where they stand with the NPCs and the such as well as a foundation of how they can work in closer with them. Like any other additional layers, it slows down the game a tiny bit, but not much.

Looking at this AP, so far it's one thing-leads-to-the-next deal unless I interject some things (or options) in between. I am also noticing some very obvious loose ends that beg further exploration, but, again, doing so slows everything down.

But I'd hate to have some scenario clock strike midnight while we were partying.

My normal default mode is to push AP's fast and hard because I'm so afraid of this. I've had a number of groups fall apart over time enough to have this be a concern in the back of my mind...though, in fairness, I've never done a Pbp before. They are going to move slower regardless because of the medium...and I'm concerned that this fact combined with too much side stuff may make it super hard to reach the end with the majority of players still at the table.

On the other hand, I love side stuff like relationships, tying up loose ends, exploring other parts of the lands, etc.

Yeah...so that's why I'm looking for input. I'm kinda at a crossroads here, and the answer determines where we take this next.

Ok...not a lot of feedback, so I'll go with my gut on this one.

I'm changing the house rules one more time in regards to ranged attacks. In the end, abstracting stuff to keep it simple (and at the same time address your valid concerns) won out. I'm also tweaking AoE spells a bit while I'm at it.

General Assumptions

I don’t use combat grids in Pbp, but "Combat by Description" found on page 8 of the core rulebook. This requires a fair bit of abstraction to work well, especially in combat. Generally, most player groups (and some bad groups) have a front line of melee attackers who protect ranged attackers behind them. These are referred to as PFL (Party Front line) and EFL (Enemy front line). Those behind them are listed by the distance they are from those front lines. A front line may contain any number of characters, but they are not considered to necessarily be standing shoulder to shoulder. Enemies and players may move into or through ‘front lines’ with no penalty (outside of provoking if it’s more than 5’), unless space is constricted (such as a hallway).

Characters are considered to be flanking a monster once two separate characters have attacked a single monster for one round (the converse is true, as well). The 2nd round onwards the monster/player is considered to be flanked until an enemy is killed, moved, etc.

Ranged Penalties in Play by Post
Friends do not provide cover against attacks made from allies in the back to enemies in the enemy front line. However, enemies in the enemy front line do provide cover to their allies behind them. This works in reverse, as well. Allies in the back lines have cover protection against most ranged attacks from the enemy. Note that this impacts reach weapons as well. Friendlies no longer provide cover for enemies that are being attacked with reach weapons.

AoE Casting in Play by Post
The GM adjucates whether enemies, outside of your primary target, are in the area of an AoE spell or effect (assuming spell reaches) and whether they are engaged in melee with friendlies. If you are willing to hit your friends with spells, you will generally get more enemies as well. Please look at grid below for the guideline the GM uses to determine which enemies in a valid grouping are in range of an AoE.

Base chance that additional enemies are in AoE spell
(note: The primary target chosen by the caster is always considered in the AoE, therefore, a 10’r spell cast in melee will still hit one enemy. There’s just a low chance it will hit other enemies. Eligible enemies’ row must be within range of the AoE to have chance to be covered by spell. A D6 is rolled. A result of 6 or more means that the addition target(s) is covered)

Spell is 10’ or less Radius: +2
Spell is 15-20’ radius or cone: +3
Spell is 25+’ radius or cone: +4

Enemy “line” is engaged with friendly in melee: -1 if enemy number is more than party on front line, -2 if enemy number is equal to or less than party on front line.
(Note: this penalty is negated if wizard is willing to hit friends or is using selective metamagic).

(Note: this penalty only applies to targets on engaged in melee combat with allies, even if reach is involved

When I have time, I will solidify the relationship rules/mechanics in my next rules update.

On another note, Emrys, I did take a look at roll20, which I know some Pbp's use...but in researching it, I can see that not working well on phones...which is a problem since some of us do rely on phone during busier periods.... Grrrr.

Google Docs might serve as a map.

Spreadsheet, to be specific.

Example

There haven't been many updates on my end since I was mostly absent this evening, but I will add my two cents after I've had some dinner - and yes, it is 00:20 over here ;)

Wow, I like the map a lot, as simple as it is.

That map is not my work, it's from another Paizo forum game I'm in.

BTW, Handaxe is usually a monk's weapon. Cound Zeriax use the mwk handaxe? In an emergency, of course, I dont' mean in preference to his bow.

We probably should sell the sword, and keep the dagger around for somebody.

Regarding the altered AOE rules. I can't really judge how well they work/balance until we've had some time to play test them. Looking forward to doing just that.

As for roll20. I can't comment because I've not tried it. I have just started running a pbp game and, touch wood, Map Tool is working really well. I use the characters avatars as tokens and just utilize its built in grid coordinates. I then export a screenshot of the map and upload it to google docs and link the updated map at the end of each round. So far, so good. And since its just a jpeg in google docs it works on phones which is a bonus.

Also, I hear your concerns about initiative orders in pbp and share them. I particularly dislike the fact that several people can be waiting to post their actions because one individual is tardy (lets be fair, that's been me recently so this is kinda pot calling the kettle black.)

To remedy this I came up with my own house rule on initiatives. Essentially the heroes and monsters have a flat 50/50 chance of acting first. All members of that party act as a block i.e. ALL monsters act and then ALL heroes act or vice versa.

The heroes can modify the chance of them acting first through a weird house-ruled initiative check. On their behalf I roll a d20 + perception + initiative modifier. This is versus a DC of 15 + encounter challenge rating + average monster initiative modifier. If the heroes check succeeds they add 10% to their chance of acting first. This usually gives them about a 70/30 chance to act first as a group which I then determine on a d100.

Initiative within the round is then fluid - essentially the initiative order is the order i which they post. All of this sounds clunky and complicated but its really quite straightforward and so far seems to have helped alleviate the issues of waiting for everyone to post to progress the combat.

I'm aware I haven't explained that very well but below I have copy/pasted an extract of the game to demonstrate.

As Ralph moves back beside Domingo, they both catch the faintest glimpse of a man before them in the dim light - seemingly appearing out of nowhere! The man mutters a few words before unleashing a riotous cascade of scintillating colours that washes over the warrior and the alchemist.

Colour Spray. Domingo and Ralph please make a DC 15 Will save or;

Unconscious, blind and stunned for: 2d4 ⇒ (2, 1) = 3 rounds
Then blind and stunned for: 1d4 ⇒ 2 rounds
Then stunned for: 1 = 1 round

Initiative check vs DC 19
Gelbor 1d20 + 10 + 4 ⇒ (7) + 10 + 4 = 21 +10%
Ralph 1d20 + 5 + 3 ⇒ (1) + 5 + 3 = 9
Davos 1d20 + 3 + 3 ⇒ (16) + 3 + 3 = 22 +10%
Domingo 1d20 + 3 + 4 ⇒ (3) + 3 + 4 = 10

1d100 ⇒ 9

Heroes act first - Round 1

Domingo and Ralph. Roll your will save before you do anything, that will determine whether you can act or not.

Gelbor, this guy is not flat-footed.

Map updated

Example Map using Map Tool.

Hey, I know that map :D

Sshhhh....

This particular encounter didnt come with a map in the module so I just nabbed this off google images.

LOL...I've seen it too!!! Hahahahah

Yeah, for me, I don't always have access to maptools and the such. Not to mention, it seems like it would be a lot of extra steps for me to move everyone's pieces around based on the coordinates they tell me in /gameplay (especially on the seven player game). Currently, it takes me about 20-30 minutes to resolve CoT and RotRL if one of the two are in combat (which is often the case). It almost seems that this would make it even more.

Perhaps its a matter of quantity over quality, lol :) I might have the time if I cut down to one campaign. :P

With all that being said, in my Skype games, Maptools is da bomb. I have two campaigns I run with those tools on the weekends....good stuff!

Yeah its really useful. And free!

New House Rule (Really just clarifying what I normally do). This one only applies to the RotRL group, as the CoT group is already too large to have an NPC helping them in combat for long.

Extra Party Members (For campaigns with 3 players or more)

Occasionally the party may find themselves in need of a certain role to be filled or find an NPC helping them in an adventure as part of the story. Parties may ‘hire’ adventuring NPCs (or invite those in the story to join them). These NPCs will always be at the same level as the party, and will take a portion of the gold found, or money made from sold items. They will only take items found if offered to them. (If they are with the party for a while and never given a magic item, they may get cranky). They also count as a party member for the GM’s purposes of calculating the challenge rating of encounters.

No posts this morning? No answer to my question about visiting the mayor?

been vy busy, sry

Will be hard pressed to post today for the last two posting cycles.... I may be able to post for the last one but likely with 30min / 1 hour delay.

Apologies but I am taking another exam in the evening - next week things should slow down back to normal a tad.

House rules have been updated with relationship mechanics. It starts at the bottom of page 22 or around there. I use something similar in Jade Regent and it worked really well. So, I started using those rules, modifying them / improvising as I saw fit. Now that I had some time today, I got them all posted in the DOC file, solidifying the process so you all have a better idea of what you're working with, and what you can do.

So, if you want to 'start' relationships with any of the NPCs, now is a great time to do so. There is one relationship that's already on the books...

Zeriax - Shyaliss: 8
Shayliss seems to fall for guys fast and hard, and the latest one, a new town hero named Zeriax, seems to have really captured her interest... for now!

The following is a short list of NPCs you can start relationships with, and the base score you will start with if you do, based on events thus far. Your actually starting score would also add your charisma modifier to this.

Ameiko: 8 After standing up for her in front of her father, and saving her from her father, Ameiko is already favorably disposed towards any of the party members.

Sheriff Hemlock: 4 [i]The Sheriff would know most of you from growing up or being in Sandpoint for a while. However, seeing you in action and defending the town against the goblins has earned you a measure of respect.

Shelelu: 2 - Shelelu only knows a few of the locals personally, but your friendship with Ameiko gives you a measure of respect with her.

Foxglove: 4 (Emrys: 6) - Having saved the nobelman earlier, he seems to have taken a liking to you all, especially Emrys.

There are other NPCs (such as the father, town gossip, and many, many more) in town you can start relationships with. However, only ask to initiate relationships with those you intend to follow up with over the long term. Evaluate them based on RP reasions for your character. Whether its romance, a competitive relationship to better yourself, the Father if you wish to deepen your character's faith (even if he's not a cleric), etc. If you have questions, let me know.

Well Emrys has been hitting on Ameiko since the get-go and being someone who is so close to his father, genuinely empathizes with the fact hers was murdered. They seem to have differing opinions on certain things such as in the episode with the runewell so all in all I think that's a good one for him to pursue.

We haven't had a huge amount of interaction with Foxglove or Shalelu yet so I'll see where that goes.

As far as Zeriax is concerned, I have been thinking somewhat about the character development and I would think there are three main paths for him to follow in terms of his participation in the AP - but this is for now, and of course unexpected paths are more than welcome ;)

For the time being:

- Shayliss: Zeriax is admittedly attracted to the girl, mainly for her completely different perspectives and expectations in life, and of course because she his an attractive one :D He is committed to his own principles though, and this is something he is not ready to stray from, for the time being;

- Sheriff Hemlock: The monk has taken a particular interest in the protection of Sandpoint - this is second nature for him, and he will keep on doing his active best to make sure the inhabitants are safe. This probably means a relation with the town guard, and more specifically with the sheriff;

- Shalelu: This one will probably play a major part in conjunction with the above - Zeriax abilities are surely useful in defending Sandpoint but he is an eager learner and not the most social able person in the world, so he would appreciate immensely the possibility of learning much more regarding the outdoors - being involved in scouting and patrolling activities outside of town - in mechanic terms, I would like to start adding some points to Survival, Knowledge (Nature), etc.

- Last but not least, Zeriax is a humble tiefling - he recognizes the value of mercy, and he has been taught with values of unselfishness, helping your fellow man or woman, and voluntary work. for this reason he will make himself available to the church and authorities for whenever and for whatever such works and assistance may be needed.

A bit all over the place, but that is how I picture the boy ;)

I was checking my Dropbox PDF and noticed that Zeriax is sitting on top of approximately 1000gold, which immediately got me thinking about the uncanny advantage that bracers of armor represent for a monk - pondering this some more, hope to have a definite decision in a couple of hours.

Ponder the larger advantage to an archer-monk of stat-boosting items.

And the general presence of Mage Armor, +4 AC, from Meg. If you buy a +1 AC, casting the spell is only 3 more AC... A wand of Mage Armor might be better long-term. Shareable, less cost, more effect.

Yep, I was actually considering that - Bracers of Armor +1 is REALLY not that huge for Zeriax at the moment. I am inclined to the Wand of Mage Armor to offer to Emrys/Megekki.

Still finishing up my math on bows and such :D

Ok...so you'll start with 8, and if you want, you can put your level 1->2 relationship point there as well. Let me know.

Now's a good chance to do any diplomacy and relationship enhancement stuff, as things have settled down. While you don't know a lot about Ameiko just yet, you can tell by the way she decorates her bar that she has an interest items relating to her native culture (That is, Tian items).

Well, for Shayliss I have left the flowers there, and I'm half expecting I will be bumping into her sooner or later.

The sheriff is out of town right, Shalelu also?

I believe I posted that Shelelu returns to Ameiko's inn that night.

Sorry guys I am at work right now - how much would a wand of mage armor cost to Zeriax?

750 gp.

Blue Light Special
Buy any one item, and you might get a similar or same item absolutely free. (Chances of winning are about 1 in 3). Limit of one attempt per character. Purchase must be received by 10am EST on Thursday via email. You may purchase the one item even if you are in a dungeon, though you will not technically have it available until you are out. Happy shopping!

750 gp.

We had at one point had a discount at the local source. Has that lapsed? Or is a Mage Armor wand not 'in stock'?

If you can find a quote regarding the magic store, let me know (for some reason I remember an armor store discount).

BTW...in Gameplay you posted about making a scroll. You'll want to send me an email to that effect so I can update the PDFs appropriately this weekend. Scribing scroll costs 1/2 the normal price of buying one outright.

Ok...we need to come up with a rule about how to handle magic items. Y'all are having discussions (sometimes) and what's happening is, unless someone calls really hard for it, y'all trail off on the discussion, and final fate of the magic item(s) never get settled.

And if I don't get an email, I don't put it on anyone's character sheet.

So, here's my idea. Y'all choose a party leader type in charge of loot division. When y'all run across something, it is that person's responsibility to email me who gets it, or if it is to be insta-sold. Y'all can have discussion here in discussion about who should get it if that's a conversation that needs to happen. But he/she is bottom line responsible to make sure that 'no item gets left behind', that conversations happen that need to happen, and that I get an email at the end of it all.

If y'all have a better idea, I'm open to it.

Ill split the cost of a wand with you Zeriax, Emrys will use it on both of us.

I think we have a deal - will check how much cash Zeriax has when I get home.

Oh and I forgot to say thanks to Meg for the scroll of Mount :) Are there any spells in my book you can benefit from?

I've never seen your book published anywhere. Some readied spells, but no list of spellbook spells. If you want to shop Meg, the spells in the mask are possibly scrollable, and if on Wiz list, you can learn them. I suppose technically, any domain and cleric spells, if on Wiz list, can also be learned from scrolls. And Meg has Scribe Scroll now, so, feel free to shop. Might be better to talk shop with Greg Rye or find another voice in Megekki's head, might go smoother than, "Black Horse! BLACK HORSE! Elf on BLACK HORSE!!" (faints)

:)

To be usable, any spell would have to be on the Witch list. But I'll check that, once I see your spellbook.

All level 0

Burning hands
Grease
Identify
Color spray
Mage armor
Magic missile
Silent image
Snowball

I'll add this into my profile when i get a chance.

Emrys, we got a deal on the wand - that is 375gp from each of us, and I'll leave it with you for safekeeping.

At level 3 Zeriax is taking point blank master so... I may want to try a more "up in their face attitude" - why not? So the mage armor will be useful ;)

Who is going to do the book-keeping?

Of that list, only Burning Hands and Identify are usable by Witches.

I expect you could use Unseen Servant?

From when we were talking about buying a CLW wand. This is probably all our discounts.

GM-JCServant wrote:

Essentially, 25% on all curing scrolls, potions and wands available at the temple. Anything that cures, heals or restores using up to level 3 magic.

I've been digging... also 10% off maps, and 20% off in-stock items at Savah's Armory.

OK, so at 25% off 750 for CLW wand that's going to cost 562.5, and need to be a group effort. Put me down for a fair share of 140GP, for now.

I'll email shortly.