Kingmaker: Legacies (Inactive)

Game Master Wolfspirit

I WILL CUT YOU

Is this where I insert a youtube link to a certain 90's song by Brandy and Monica?

There's got to be a way to port that music across our fledgling nation. Freestanding speakers connected by Message spells?

(Player actually lived in Santa Monica for ~10 yrs)

If it's Hanukkah or Kwanzaa
Solstice, Harvest, or December 25th
Peace on Earth to everyone
And abundance to everyone you're with!

(Holiday stuff should be winding down tomorrow giving me a day to get some more work in.)

Hope everyone's Holidays have been going well; I've been working on some stuff!

I've been poking around at the Kindom Sheet for a while, trying to set up some formulas, then I discovered THIS which blew away my previous attempts.

Things are rolling along fairly well now, though there's a few more decisions I need from everyone.

Emil: I'll need to know what you want to apply your bonus to (Economy, Stability, Loyalty.)

I'll also need people to start looking at what you want to build first. Here's a reminder of some of the initial Settlement rules and BP Costs:

You'll start with 50 BP, so after Claiming / Preparing your hex, you should have 47 BP left over. Having your Capital City being built on the ruins of the Stag Lord's Keep gives you a +1 to Economy, Loyalty, and Stability, *and* gives you the ability to purchase a castle at half cost. However, I would caution the party to not spend more than half of your Treasury on one thing for a while (it'll slow down your kingdom building immensely)

There are a few other sites that have bonuses that you know of. I'm compiling a list.

So! First off, I made a horrible mistake. I meant to put Túrante up for Marshal, not Warden. I would like to trade places with Kesten Garess, if possible. (I'm a better Marshal anyway due to the high Dex, and from an RP perspective having Kesten as our urban law enforcer and Túrante as the fringes/hinterlands sheriff makes more sense.)

Because of the ordering for Kingdom Building rules, we technically start with a 0 hex kingdom and skip the first Upkeep phase and go straight to Edicts.

I recommend:

• Initial hex is the old fort by the Tuskwater as the heart of Summergold (3 BP, as the DM stated above - 1 to claim, 2 to prepare).
• Southern border is water (the Tuskwater). This is important later for making buildings that require a waterfront.
• Build a House lot for our first settlement - the discount from building Tenements first is the same as the cost of building Tenements (so it's a wash) and Tenements increase your starting unrest, so those only really are worth something if you are super-pinched for BP. The House lot would cost 3 BP.
• Then, since we have the House, we build an Inn (10 BP) to get the nice bonuses from that.

So the total spend there is 16 BP, leaving us with 34 BP.

This hits the limit of stuff we can do for a size 1 kingdom in terms of making new buildings.

Consumption = Size, which is 1, so we have to pay 1 BP next kingdom turn. (Next turn I would recommend that we claim another hex and make a Farm, which will zero out our Consumption.) Modified by our holidays and promotions (see below).

Control DC = 20 + Size (1) + Districts in all settlements (1) = 22.

Stability = 2 from Neutral alignment. Modified by promotion edict (see below). +General's Str/Cha. +Grand Diplomat's Int/Cha. +High Priest's Wis/Cha.
Loyalty = 2 from Good alignment, +1 from Inn once it's done. + Counselor's Wis/Cha. +Enforcer's Dex/Str. +Warden's Con/Str.

Edicts: We can set up how many holidays we have per year; mechanically this affects Consumption each turn and gives a small Loyalty bonus. Story-wise this should probably be either 1 (Founding Day) or 6 (add some religious holidays).

We set a Promotion edict to help make the kingdom grow. For now we can safely set it to None, because the Stability -1 penalty is not a killer, or a Token level, for +1 Stability and +1 Consumption.

Tax level should probably be Light, just for story reasons (we are not tyrants, after all).

THEN it's the Income phase! This is the fun money part! We roll an Economy check. If we have Light taxes then our Economy is just +1 from that, plus 1 from the Inn, plus possibly our ruler's Charisma (if this is the area the ruler focuses on), plus the Magister's Int or Cha (whichever is better), plus the Marshal's Dex/Wis, plus Treasurer's Int/Wis. The roll is divided by 3 and added to the treasury as BP, so unless we have a really crummy roll, we will likely gain enough BP to cover our current costs.

Our Ruler needs to decide where his Charisma bonus is going - Stability, Loyalty, or Economy.

In our NEXT kingdom turn we start having to make Stability checks or getting unrest, and paying Consumption.

Sound slike you've been playing around with kingdom rules! I certainly don't think that's a bad idea. But I am curious as to what our other options are.

That's a lot of great info, Túrante. I don't have any experience with the kingdom rules, but I did check out the buildings we could start with. Housing seemed like the best first option, as you said. The inn looks like a perfect starting building as well. I wanted to propose a Watchtower to represent Fort Owlbear. It would be thematic, but not as beneficial as an inn, unfortunately...

Could we say the repairs are still underway, and build something else later to represent the fort?

So, a Watchtower is a fine alternative, as it gets you headed down the track to a Castle eventually, and we know we get a discount on turning the ruins of the fort into a Castle. Also, technically a Castle doesn't require any prerequisites, so getting the discount on it due to the fort ruins means we could just build that first out the gate at 27 BP. I don't know if the 50% off for the ruins is supposed to stack with having a building discount from other buildings; if it does, then we could go Watchtower -> Town Hall -> Castle and get it with another discount (the watchtower reduces the cost of the town hall, which reduces the cost of the castle).

A Castle is a really good building because it has lots of mad bonuses. BUT... remember what the DM said: We shouldn't spend more than half of our BP on one purchase right now, and we are starting with 50 BP; even at half price, a castle is 27. So that's a warning that the castle is a bit rich for us to tackle right now.

A lot of KM is about making careful build choices and doing a slow and steady expansion.

Another alternative is to do a House now and also work on a Bridge, Brewery, or Smithy then do the others the next kingdom turns. The advantage to that is these are cheap (6 BP each) and they give an Economy bonus, so it starts on the path to earning back some of that BP.

Basically it all depends on where you wanna wind up with your bonuses; bonuses to Stability mean you are more likely to make Stability checks each turn, which keeps Unrest down. Bonuses to Economy mean more money (each +3 to economy is one more BP in earnings each turn). Bonuses to Loyalty mean we are less likely to have problems with spies and disasters. As long as we think we can hit the Stability checks reliably (remember, DC 22 right now), I tend to focus on Economy after that, to make sure we get a good run of BP each turn. If you're losing cash it will keep you from building any more!

That said, the other reason for a Watchtower as an option is that it is part of a good start on military defenses, and eventually we will need an army...

ALTERNATIVE: Since you asked for an alternative, Emil:
Each kingdom turn we can build one House, Tenement, Noble Villa, or Mansion, in addition to all other building construction. (Still pay normal cost.) Tenements pretty much aren't worth it for the reasons I specified before. I would normally recommend the House so we can do an Inn, but we could instead do a Mansion (10 BP). The Mansion is not great, it's a lot of BP for just a +1 Stability bonus. If we do that, it can be turned into a Noble Villa for an extra 12 BP - buying a Noble Villa outright on its own is 24 BP, so not really a great option. The Villa is basically +1 to everything so it's nice to have one eventually. The Villa doesn't really provide any bonuses that you can't get from just having a House district, though, so it's pretty expensive and doesn't lead anywhere super-useful.

So when we start, we basically have one building that can be anything, and one building that can be a House or Mansion (for the reasons listed above, Tenement and Noble Villa are poor choices).

If you like, we could choose not to build a House or Mansion at all. This would be a little weird as lots of stuff requires you to have a House district (or 2!) in your town, and having Houses gives you a discount on many buildings.

For whatever we do eventually choose as our first building, it should be inexpensive and either open the door to more buildings, or provide a very clear bonus. That's why I mentioned the Bridge/Brewery/Smithy earlier; they are all relatively cheap and all improve economy. A Library is another option in that vein: 6 BP, gives Economy and Loyalty +1, and the town of Summergold gets a bonus to its Lore stat (basically, its citizens are better educated). A Mill is 6 BP and gives +1 Economy and Stability, so that's also a good choice, and it improves the settlement's Productivity (not super important to the kingdom overall, but establishes that Summergold is a town of activity and industry). The Tannery is another 6 BP +1 to two stats building, but it has -1 Society to the town, basically meaning it characterizes the town as being kind of a crude frontier place and very smelly.

So there are some choices! :D

Having fort Owlbear as a castle (and a town hall before that) sound great, but I agree that we definitely shouldn't stretch too far right now. I think an inn is the better choice right now, and I could see that working along with the houses. Just a simple building with a few houses next to the ruins of Fort Owlbear, to give the workers a place to relax and meet up. After a while, we could declare the work on the Fort finished and buy our Town Hall/Castle, skipping the watchtower.

Also, wanted to take the opportunity to say that I loved Túrante's letter home. Really lovely way to get into the 'Elven' mindset!

I'm glad to help!

I've actually not used the kingdom rules before, but I am a professional game designer, so I did some checking on how the system works and did my best to make an evaluation of what would be (a) befitting the tone of our town and (b) a good investment for our kingdom mechanically.

Ok, thanks for the options. I agree that the one you presented is the one I feel more comfortable doing, I did want to see if any of the other options was more appealing to me.

Hey guys, I have to admit I'm a little swamped with stuff IRL (2 year old toddler, second child due end of Feb!), and don't have the wherewithal to dig into the kingdom building side of the game. Instead, I have complete faith in whatever decisions you guys make, and am happy to keep playing along on a post-by-post basis even if it means I miss out on some of the more thorny and intricate discussions about the allocation of points and resources.

Hope you all don't mind!

I've been working on a couple of visualizers to try and aid with the campaign expenses (which I didn't realize how daunting it was to run beyond someone just saying "This is what we built this time." I'm almost done with the monthly kingdom sheet, but if we have a seconder for either of the plans, we'll run with that and move on.

One thing to note is that you aren't really "building a house." You're "encouraging houses to be built in a district." There's probably other construction going on, but that's the predominant structure that's being constructed.

Basically the in-game side is that we encouraged people to move here and said we were going to set up shop and pay people to help, so construction workers have set up tents and are getting paid for their day labor. The pay comes out of our BP, and the town springs up around whatever structures we build. It's... kind of how medieval towns actually sprang up around castles and cathedrals. :)

So my suggestion is house + inn for this very first turn, and hope that we make the Stability roll on the next kingdom turn! Then next turn probably a Mill (6 BP for +1 Economy and +1 Stability) or Smithy (same).

I'll second Túrante's plan for this turn: House + Inn.

Concurring voice, here.

Let's get a solid start and hope for the best.

I'll fourth that.

Fifthed!

So, now that I've had time to really page through the buildings, I think Turante's plan sounds pretty sound. House + Inn this time around. House + Smithy/Mill next go-around.

I like that you could build Tenements (1 BP) then upgrade them into Houses (for an extra 2BP) later if need be. It seems like (as long as we have the BP/space) we should almost always be adding Houses and/or Tenements- -so many buildings need to be "adjacent to a house."

Janna will likely press towards a Town Hall (22BP, good bonuses, better discounts) and various fortifications- -Watchtowers, Barracks, etc.

The problem with Tenements is that they have a negative effect on your settlement, and the "discount" isn't really much of a discount - although I guess you could argue that rounding is always down and thus that a House lot zoned from Tenements would cost 1 CP. Still, it causes more Unrest than gets removed by the subsequent Housing, and thematically I think it is not something that our characters would endorse. We're not slumlords! :)

The trick with Houses is to basically have them on inner blocks where they can be adjacent to multiple other structures.

I also agree that getting a Watchtower going reasonably early on is a good choice, both thematically and in terms of building inexpensive structures, and that should probably be in the middle of the city where it will eventually get upgraded someday to a Castle.

I'll try to move along the Kingdom building to month 2 tonight, but have some other commitments tonight. On the other hand, I'm adding an interlude to interject some RP while we dicker with mundane management!

Also, as we’re going to be officially starting on Book 2 with your kingdom “started”, everyone please level to level 4. I was doing the logistics for how much gold everyone should have, and it would be much easier if everyone just resets to 6,000 gp. Please don’t spend more than 3k on a single item however. *rubs his hands together eagerly*

Whee! I get a pretty cool ability this level: Terrain Bond! When in forests the whole party gets a bonus:
When in his favored terrain, the Ranger grants all allies within line of sight and that can hear him a +2 bonus on initiative checks and Perception, Stealth, and Survival skill checks. Also, as long as they travel with him, the Ranger’s allies leave no trail and can’t be tracked. The Ranger can choose for the group to leave a trail, or even specific members of the group to leave a trail if he so desires.

Janna is doing his best to look the part.

Purchases:
+1 agile breastplate (is this okay?)
Masterwork Heavy Steel Shield
Masterwork Longsword
Masterwork Lance
Masterwork Chainshirt Barding

Nothing too crazy as far as abilities go. +1 Charisma, and all the things our fearless leader got last level, heh.

Just realized I'm intrigued by living steel armor. I'll tack that onto the list of "cool loot that would be interesting to find".

Meanwhile, I'm purchasing a +1 lance, a masterwork set of full plate and some mulback cords for Flora. I'm debating getting a potion of Fly or Remove Blindness, but that could just be too much PFS.

Do you need a level up summary?

+5 hp
+1 Int (was even, so no effect)
+1 Fort, Reflex
5 skill points: Knowledge Arcana, Local, Religion, History, Æther. Spellcraft.
2nd-level spells: Create pit, Glitterdust.

--
Equipment (N denoting new purchase):
N Cloak of resistance +1. 1000 gp
N Handy Haversack. 2000 gp.
- Wand of Cure Light Wounds (28 charges). 420 gp.
- Scrolls (4x 1st level). 100 gp
- Potion of lesser restoration. 300 gp.
- Misc. equipment. 300 gp.
N Scrolls for scribing in spellbook (3x 2nd level: Scorching ray, Communal endure elements, Bear's Strength). 450 gp.
Left: 1430 gp.

--

Items of note for future interest:
- A Wizard's spellbook with assorted spells
- Expedition pavilion
- Silver raven figurine of wondrous power

Túrante gains (in addition to the neat team ability above):
+1 BAB
+1 Fort & Ref saves
+7 hit points
+1 Dexterity
Ranger's Focus: 1/day -> 2/day

Skills:
+1 to each of Diplomacy, Knowledge (nature), Perception, Sense Motive, Survival; Handle Animal, Knowledge (nobility), Perform (dance)
+2 Knowledge (geography)

Money:
About four weeks after she sends her letter home, Túrante receives a package and a letter back. In addition to the letter from her mother's chancellor, she receives a mithral elven dueling sword (1520), a heavy mithral shield (1020), an achingly beautiful royal court dress with a matching signet ring, earrings, diadem, and necklace (1000 - based on value for regalia of the stock NPC of a king), a wondrous forest-green hooded traveling cloak (cloak of resistance +1, 1000), a simple ring etched with a few arcane runes (ring of protection +1, 1000), and a very well made elven bow (mighty 1 masterwork composite longbow, 500). (Remaining cash helps cover my other gear expenses & leaves a little pocket money.)

No worries on the level up summaries, unless its helpful for you.

Sounds good though

a simple ring etched with a few arcane runes (ring of protection +1, 1000)

I'm sorry, Túrante, but I believe a ring of protection to be 2000 gp.

Oh right, in a hurry. Meh.

Lessee... raised INT from 17 to 18 which is fun, which results in +1 bomb/day ontop of my level increase and an extra +1 to damage...

Oh, took Frost Bomb discovery. DC 16 Fort saves or the bad guys get staggered now ;)

And...2nd level spells! Took Cat's Grace to help with throwing bombs. DM, can I buy spells with my gold?

Yep, you certainly can!

Uh... is the combat over? That was insane!

Me: "CR 6? This should provide a challenge and get people into some action."

Emil: "No."

:)

:)

I am concerned about the math error you spotted though. I'm not seeing it, but I want to go over it with you if you don't mind, as if I made a mistake I would like to have it corrected for the next time. I don't like it when my player make mistakes like that, so I sure as s$&* don't accept it at all from myself. Do onto others and all that, you know.

Best laid plans, Wolfspirit... :)

Emil, I think you actually had the damage rolls backwards, in your post.
The initial (non-critical) hit would have done triple damage, because of spirited charge. That's 3d8 + 3*(7+3).

Then, when you crit with a x3 weapon, you add twice the normal damage. That would be 2d8 + 2*(7+3) extra.

The total is the same, in this case. However, if the crit hadn't confirmed, I think you would have done yourself short.

Mmm, also, just as an eye to the future:

I've built Túrante primarily to do sword-and-board, with an eye to eventually getting slashing grace with the dueling sword (taking full advantage of her high Dex) and bashing with a heavy shield (using Shield Mastery, which comes from the ranger 6 style feat). (Alas, I can't get the trait that makes a heavy shield into a light simple weapon, because it's a religion trait.) If we last long enough and she goes into the Noble Scion PrC she'll gain sneak attack bonus damage as well, which makes two-weapon (well, weapon and shield bash) very viable.

BUT, we already have a couple of tanks - Emil and Janna - so I could instead switch gears and go more heavily into archery. Taking the Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot feats, then branching into Empty Quiver Style, could make Túrante pretty good with a bow; not quite as much damage, but definitely good ranged support.

I mention this because, before I pick all my upcoming feats, we should decide as a group which role is better for our dynamic. :)

Apologies for going quiet; I had some personal stuff come up this weekend. Will try and catch up.

I hope everything is well.

Take your time.

Hey there, I wanted to provide an update and a bit more explanation as to what all has been going on. I'm keeping things somewhat vague, but if anyone wants more details, send me a PM.

You ever have one of those weekends that start with excitement and grand aspirations as to getting caught up on gaming, and then life wrecks your car? That was my weekend. Plus, between then and now the dealership managed to lose said car, which I had to help track down. Between everything my head really hasn't been in the game (pun intended.) The fact that I'm punning *is* a good sign, and I've carved out a few hours tonight I plan on spending on game stuff. So, thanks for being patient and hope everyone is doing well.

Hang in there amigo! Take care of yourself first and foremost, and I'm sorry to hear about your vehicular woes.

I'm sorry to hear that, Wolfspirit. I hope everything sorts itself out in the end. Take the time you need, and take care!

Wolfspirit, the URL below your avatar is broken. Has been for a while, I think. Could you fix that, maybe, if you have the time? (It messes with the forum layout on my phone.)

Done and one. Sorry, I knew it was broke, but didn't think it was impacting anything. Stupid character limit on links.

Have things sorted themselves out irl? I have my fingers crossed for you!

Well, the car is in the shop until the end of the month, probably, but we've got a rental car so that at least I don't have to schedule everything around carpooling. That was... unfun :)

Ok, so what kind of foot traffic are we looking at here, going through town/living in Summergold?
- There is light to moderate. There haven't been many official roads, but given that pretty much everyone is a transplant, it is a more mobile populace the usual.

Was last night a full moon?
- Yes

Does this region of the Stolen Lands have a reputation for anything beyond fey?
- It has a reputation for all sorts of monsters and enemies. Nothing seems immediately called out by these attacks, but it could be anything.

Where there any incidents before the ones being mentioned from communities from afar?
- Not that you're aware of.

Just wanted to ask: Is everyone still on board for this game? It was awfully quiet last week, despite the opportunity to talk with Jhod. I feel like the game is sort of petering out, which would be a shame considering the point we're already on...

Still here! I think we're kind of in a weird transitional space, with the lycanthrope hunt and the beginnings of realm building?

I'm sorry, I really am, I've been wanting to get my thoughts together on what questions to ask but this week has not been kind to me. I am going to think about it for tomorrow and post.

Still here, still active, just... Busy with a couple other things.

Sorry!