Kingmaker AP - War of the Red River! (Inactive)

Game Master Haldhin

I've played with or seen some broken summoner builds and it left an impression that they should not be used.
Hence my dislike of the class, but I'll try not to knock it anymore until I've played one.

I think we've all got classes that vex us at least a little. I LOVE monk abilities, but sometimes trying to make them mentally 'fit' in a setting for me is tricky.

Oh, Bridgette, about that Arena idea... any more details? I think Bydar would personally dislike blood sports, but he IS a noble so I'm sure he's seen his share of tournies and jousts etc. So he could still be sold on it, it maybe all in the packaging :)

The Arena will be for non-lethal combat, sports, and contests.
That and also used as a training ground from time to time.

Most "broken" summoner builds I've ever seen were the results of bad math or misunderstood rules and players intentionally trying to break things.

When players set out to do that, it can be done with any class (except maybe the rogue).

I've never seen a summoner, even a broken one, that couldn't be completely outclassed by a well built Paladin, Barbarian or Druid or Wizard.

The issue with summoners isn't that they're more powerful than other classes, it's that there isn't just one way to make them powerful. They're easy, and a lot of different types of summoners are viable. They're not better. They just don't have as many options that are bad.

The other thing that makes them seem powerful is that most GMs don't know what their weaknesses are. They're newer, and versatile, so it's hard to tailor a challenge to them.

The Arena will be for non-lethal combat, sports, and contests.

That and also used as a training ground from time to time.

Okay, that sounds like it could be fun. Maybe with a statue or sculpture of Kurgess (did I get the god's name right) on display

For reference in future games, here's a short list of things Summoners hate/have difficulty with-

Magic Circle spells
Banishment
Dispel Magic
Incorporeal enemies
Archers
Wall spells
Any AoE spell that can catch the summoner and the eidolon
Sunder (summoners have to split their items, so they tend to go for versatile and expensive stuff)
Spell Sunder
Tanglefoot Bags (Eidolons tend to have very low touch ACs)

Basically any combination of two of these will put a Summoner on the defensive and seriously hamper their effectiveness

Psst... no need to give the GM ideas on how to take on our new Summoner :)

Oops. :)

I just thought the Summoner class looked fun, and I wanted to give it a try. ^^ I'm quite likely to dip a few levels in Witch, too, so stay tuned...

Ooh! If this self defence course gets off the ground, count on Belka to offer basic magic lessons to anyone who wants to try out if they don't have the muscle or dexterity for melee -- provided they'll swear loyalty to the Crown.
We could have a magical militia soon enough. ;)

So as Ruler, I get to pick out everyone else's arranged marriages right? :)

Jk.. Shelyn would frown on that I'm sure :)

Though I'm certain anyone on the council is probably considered a 'good prospect' by the gents and ladies of our budding land.

The self defense will cover armed and unarmed combat, and physical training to get that STR, DEX and CON score up.

But magic is a tricky one, in that the source determines the method of learning;
Wizards and Alchemists need to spend years learning,
Witches spend less years learning but need a patron,
Sorcerers get it naturally by bloodlines,
Summoners get it naturally but need some study,

Divine casting requires faith or to be chosen.

I'm not sure that a country founded on personal freedoms would be big on loyalty oaths. Maybe just an oath not to use what is taught to harm anyone (except in self defense)

Magic is different, though. We don't want a second Irrisen! ^^; Besides, quid pro quo: learning magic can be pricey. If we the government develop our spellcasters, we should be able to ask the spellcasters to do something for the nation in return, right? I'm thinking national defence. ^^

Well, we've tried to incorporate a lot of the Stolen lands rules into the rulership, hopefully making it go down smoother with the locals etc. But if we're upfront about a few years of service in exchange for training I don't think it would be bad.

Also, we probably won't train the weapons guys and the magic guys in the same location, so there maybe some variance between them.

In the academy, I'm planning on. It is more like a school in that you pick your classes (pun intended), provided you meet it's entry requirements.
This way some cross training can be tossed in. So for example someone learning Arcane magic can also pick up some unarmed combat knowledge to help them if they get closed in on.

I went a bit overboard in getting a Sara render as I could not decide on the style of the leather armour.
Sara Variant 1
Sara Variant 2

Sorry GM, but I can't add scars, as that will get into texture work, which I can only do the basics of, which would be a very bad looking set of scars.

and if Belka Blackpaw wants a render I'll require looks and height so if I do a Group render it looks right.

Current PC+NPC Height Reference.

That group shot looks like fun! ^^

Let's see... Belka is slightly below average height. She has auburn hair, mid-back length, one eye gold, one eye russet. Her figure is trim, but reasonably curvaceous. She has Kellid tribal tattoos on her left arm, but not on her hand.
She likes purple and black cloth, and prefers loose trousers over skirts.

How's that?

For Height I need it in feet and inches
as Human's of Golarion don't list the heights of each group and if lucky a vague idea of height is in their descriptions.
Human Female average is about 5"6' out of CRB.
To get a better idea of the curves are you closer to Arianna (Has Shoes) or Bridgette (Bare Feet).

And clothing style? Conservative/Liberal, Civil/Feral, etc.

No tattoos as they require texture work which I suck at and likely won't have time for.

Height: 5.5
Curves: About midway between Arianna and Bridgette.
Clothing style: Conservative; high collar, long sleeves.
Hairstyle: Loose.

Belka_Blackpaw_Rough

Wow. She's hot. :)

Which one; Sara, Belka_Blackpaw or both.

Belka. Looks like my kinda girl.

I just noticed I had the Camera at the wrong height when I did Belka's and Sara's Renders

Turn Summary:

Black Guild Members
Send one of the scouts with Lanner to meet with the Barons. Ask them for help in getting rid of the Black Guild members who have infiltrated the settlers moving to Corbenic.

Exploration
Tell Happs and Yiv to head east from Corbenic as they explore new provinces. They are to exercise caution, which should prevent them from encountering any potentially dangerous situations. The downside is that it will take longer to explore the provinces.

Infrastructure
**Claim Provinces**
Goldwarren (contains discovered gold mine)
Cost: 1 BP

**Build Terrain Improvements**
Road in Goldwarren – 1 BP
Other terrain improvement - TBD

**Create/Improve Settlements**
Granary – 0 BP (Build 2 / 2 turns)
(Free) House - No

**Other Items**
Council Options:
Create Town Guard (Warden) – 1 BP cost (ongoing)

**Income**
Silver Ore trade with the Sootscale kobolds. BP Gained: 1 BP
Sootscale gift: 2 BP

Going by what's above, the realm spends 2 BP, gets 3 BP.

**Individual Events**
Everything is resolved.

Outstanding items for the turn
Only questions I have are do you want to make another terrain improvement? There was some discussion about a farm - do you want to do that? If so, which province?

Also, you want to forgo the house this turn since you have enough space for all the settlers. Correct?

Raxus, have you heard anything from your contacts about another player who might be interested?

Working on it. I have one interested who said she'd check out the game and get back to me. That was yesterday. I'm reminding her now.

Turn Summary:

Black Guild Members
Send one of the scouts with Lanner to meet with the Barons. Ask them for help in getting rid of the Black Guild members who have infiltrated the settlers moving to Corbenic.

Exploration
Tell Happs and Yiv to head east from Corbenic as they explore new provinces. They are to exercise caution, which should prevent them from encountering any potentially dangerous situations. The downside is that it will take longer to explore the provinces.

Infrastructure
**Claim Provinces**
Goldwarren (contains discovered gold mine)
Cost: 1 BP

**Build Terrain Improvements**
Road in Goldwarren – 1 BP
Other terrain improvement - TBD

**Create/Improve Settlements**
Granary – 0 BP (Build 2 / 2 turns)
(Free) House - No

**Other Items**
Council Options:
Create Town Guard (Warden) – 1 BP cost (ongoing)

**Income**
Silver Ore trade with the Sootscale kobolds. BP Gained: 1 BP
Sootscale gift: 2 BP

Going by what's above, the realm spends 2 BP, gets 3 BP.

**Individual Events**
Everything is resolved.

Outstanding items for the turn
Only questions I have are do you want to make another terrain improvement? There was some discussion about a farm - do you want to do that? If so, which province?

Also, you want to forgo the house this turn since you have enough space for all the settlers. Correct?

Yeah. I think Bridgette did want a farm. So let's get started on that. Unless others object, I'd suggest we put it in Woodbridge, as it has a bridge for transport, and is in a good centralish location between Goldwarrren and Rivermeet.

And unless it goes to waste somehow, yeah, we'll forgo the house to save up for other projects next round.

Okay, unless I hear differently, I'm going to go with a farm but no house. Want to give people another 12 hours or so to chime in before updating the thread.

So I'll have the summary posted tomorrow, and Belka will be introduced as the event for next turn.

Belka_Blackpaw_Rough

Wow, looks great! Thanks! :)

Maybe we should consider opening an orphanage, too? Rough land often causes orphans, and it would be a Good thing to make arrangements for them.

I would keep farms near the towns and cites as food freshness tends to fade quickly when picked (especially certain fruits and vegetables).
One advantage of being a farmer, you get richer tasting food.

And if we get pushed back in a war, it's better to keep food production close to the towns so it can quickly be loaded up with the crops/animals before the invaders reach town.

@Belka Blackpaw
If anything is off about the render let me know.
The camera is at about gnome height.

I have posted Turn 2 results.

My to do list:
1. Get Belka details for her introduction (today/tonight)
2. Post Turn 3 details (today/tonight)
3. Update maps to show realm boundaries and improvements (tonight/tomorrow)

Yikes. our BPs are dwindling fast.

I really want that gold mine next round as it should bring in some more BPs for us, but the fortress is in need of repair, the orphans are wandering around helplessly, and the Shelynites are wondering whey they don't have a temple.

Heh. Well, maybe I can summon some earth elementals to help build that temple? ^^

As soon as possible, we should look into getting a Lyre of Building for Ari. They cost 13,000.

I have about 2700 gp to put towards it.

Buying a Scroll of Fabricate and making it ourselves would cost a total of 7,625 but would require someone with Craft Wonderous Item.

Hey everyone, I'm back! Recovering well from the pneumonia, but now I have a cold (wah-wah-wah...) Can't catch a break, but could be worse.

Welcome aboard Belka!

I agree with Bridgette - let's build the farm in Rivermeet if we can to keep it close to Corbenic.

Are we still sending the tribute to Howl-in-the-North? I've been assuming so...

Are we still sending the tribute to Howl-in-the-North? I've been assuming so...

Definitely!

...and I guess I was thinking Rivermeet would be our more 'urban' area, but one farm there won't kill us if it's not too late to change it

Everyone which clothing design would you vote for Sara?
Svana or Defiant

Go with closer to 6 feet. 7 is too tall.

I'll have the turn updated sometime today, which will setup Belka's introduction in game.

7 feet does hit Raxus' shoulder as you wanted (and is the max limit of female Ulfen height based on wording in Humans of Golarion)
Given the Height ref image
Raxus' shoulder is between about 6'6 and 7 feet above the ground when standing in a natural position.

Temp Height Ref Image of new comers.

And please vote for one of the armour designs above for Sara.

In the initial description of Sara, I didn't get the impression that she towered over most people. Just that she was a fairly tall, but normal sized, woman.

My mistake then, she wouldn't come up to his shoulder. I didn't make the correct reference. 6' or so is about how tall she should be. Sorry I wasn't more precise.

I'll put the result at either 6'3" or 6'6".
Which: 1d2 ⇒ 2 I'll go with 6'6" unless the GM wants 6'3"

And Which armour designs would you want as the default for Sara
Svana or Defiant

Shorter and defiant.

Cloth design
Svana: 0
Defiant: 1

I'll set her height to 6'3"

Which puts her right around the bottom of Raxus' chest.