A tale told of a place called Haven (Inactive)

Game Master Klokk

Lets see how long it takes to play out this turn. Ive got things scanned. Ill post the month of april tomarrow and will see how long it takes to go through everything.

The exploration is going to take longer then anything else. Do you guys want me to make the rolls on here with the /dice or you ok with me using my dice for things here?

You could use your dice.

Use your own dice. Most of us have probably been GM's before and know that in any roll done by a GM there is always a weebly variable, where by there is always a number you add for a reason other than what a player would see.~

Outside of Boss Battles I love adding +1 Damage to my Skulls party because I never f&%%ing hit them anyway...

Verio can you roll a d100 in the discussion thread here?

I warn you, that you will need to save the image as it is vary large.

I just realize that I had not posted a city map. Ive had issues getting the minecraft version to look right and frankly I did not like the look of the default distract maps with the stuff glued to it so I took some graph paper and made that up.

Looking at the City map it is aligned to the north. The lands on the left actually is a Dwargen made island, why he made it shaped like an L and not a K who knows. The either northern border is of the ocean water. You can see the two warehouses where the river turns. Remember with that river it is only 10' deep. there is no bridge to the west because warforged down breath and they just march across when its time to stand watch in the towers over there.

Do not ask me why the warforged built the shops over there.. perhaps they wanted to make that side of town the foreign quarter.

You can see the creation forge pretty much smack in the center of town. to the NW of the Forge you can find the Librarium as well as Joel, well more accurately Klokk's Tower. The foundry was placed right by the three smithy's.

For some reason it didn't take, but there is a little bit more on the bottom.. I may have to take two pictures and do it that way. But there is a small little island to the south in the river. There is a watch tower and some Dumps.

I am sure by now you noticed the 1 square wide roads around the boarders basically. Each of the black grids are not relivant.. they were to be districts, but when I was making, I decided after id drawn them to disreguard the standard district sizes and go with this shape.

On the two landward sides there is a palisade wall on the south and east, trees are cleared for a double bow shot's distance out.

Those of you that are in town, if you want to go ahead and choose one downtime action to do each week.

F: You did find a few forged ones that were interested in helping you out part time with your task history works. Do still need the d20 roll for the history check. I just need to see how well you know the history. Ill let you take 20 to talk to them.. but far as your understanding of a different worlds history, because its not your native worlds history you just may flat out get it wrong.

Will go with whatever works for the next two weeks, then switch to Wednesdays after Christmas for the Monthly turns. as I will not be online on Christmas day or eve, so it wouldn't be fare to expect any of you to be.

1d100 ⇒ 8

Thanks. That roll was for something you will find out, perhaps in a couple weeks, 9% chance of something occurring or not occurring.

Let me know what you guys & gals think of the City map.

all the buildings are in pencil atm on that map. Im trying to find a good piece of parchment the right size roughly 3'x3' then will actually draw it out with my good quills and ink. So graph paper and pencil before I spend the time to actually draft it.

As things are in pencil right now.. the stuff you are building this month 1/april can be moved wherever you all deem best, I actually asked joel where to place them and he said there, there, there & there so went with it. Hes actually placed most of the buildings that are there. id only placed the tavern and forge and let him do to the rest.

Those of you that are in town, if you want to go ahead and choose one downtime action to do each week.

F: You did find a few forged ones that were interested in helping you out part time with your task history works. Do still need the d20 roll for the history check. I just need to see how well you know the history. Ill let you take 20 to talk to them.. but far as your understanding of a different worlds history, because its not your native worlds history you just may flat out get it wrong.

I can take 20 on the history roll, and the result was in my previous post (35, for reference). This is from the Call to Mind cantrip.

In general, how common is world traveling? Not just planet traveling, but like, different worlds. I would think that it wouldn't need to be my native world; if there's ever been any information about another world, then I would probably know it.

Feroina.. I want a dang roll not a take 10 or 20. it is NOT FROM Your WORLD. You are trying to talk to them about a world you did not know existed a week ago.

I will roll one of my d20s if you refuse to.

World traveling is extremely uncommon, nobody will believe you unless they cast detect truth upon you. You have heard absolutely nothing. For that matter Feorina, you as a native to a world other then goloran, you wouldn't even know about that worlds history, there is not one single history book that deals with anything from Golorian.

The roll is to effect how well you have learned the lore from the world. No spells or your daughter or any other player can aid you.

You are trying to effectively teach about worlds that you did not even know existed.

There is no information about other worlds, not even the moons in Golorian are explored/known to be moons.

This is why in this instance I am requiring a roll, not allowing you a free +20 to the roll. Which I think is complete b&@~%~*~ that I require a roll for this and for the change your trying to do to yourself and you get a free +20 to that check when I say roll I mean roll not take 1 or 10 or 20. There will always be +'s and -'s that you as players do not know about, there will always be a reason I ask for a roll not just assume you know it or not.

I could easily rule that call to mind only effects things from your native world, not any others. I don't want to but if you keep refusing to roll a simply 1d20+15 or whatever check, then I will do so. It just not right that you can walk into a new world and know everything your character wants to within 1 week.

Exactly like you are trying to do with the Deathless racial change and this refusual to roll a f!*+ing dice.

Forgive the frustration in my words above, but There is a hidden penalty for unfamiliar worlds I am applying to skills checks of -20, I was not going to tell you the players. That penalty goes away if a roll hit a unmodified 15 or higher. and after you have lived on a world for six months or studied a world for 3 months exclusively.

This is why I want you to roll.

I figured that tell you all of that penalty would bum you out, as it did my table when Klokk first came to this world years ago and my party found out of that penalty.

I also assume that for the first 6 months you guys wouldn't try to do anything as crazy as try to change your characters race. I mean your only a third level characters right now, Sammy or joel could probally smoke the entire party in a round or two, at most. Not that they are against you, but just prespective.

Heck a pair say clockwork soldiers may cause a problem if you guys were in a fight.

THis whole campaign is a very long term campaign, with the implied intention of it being a generational game, with haven going for decades or perhaps centuries. If starting after Christmas, we go 1 week a year. in one year from now 4.3 years will have passed for your chracters, perhaps more if not much is done for a kingdom month. Most standard campaigns takes place may over the course of 5 character years

But see, that's the thing. I assume that the unmodified 15 is only for the first roll, correct? So I roll a:

1d20 ⇒ 16

Actually, that wasn't a problem. But say that I rolled below a 15, and took the -20 penalty. I would still be able to know a large part of the world's history with the penalty (just talking about if the only restriction was the penalty, not anything additional you added), just not the very obscure events. So perhaps know about Franco-Prussian war for instance, but not all of the silly Treaty of Parises.

That is why I am saying that regardless of the unmodified roll, I would still like to be able to use my abilities. I can still hit a 15 with the penalty and know enough for my needs.

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I would like to know how you plan to rule on knowledge, because I built my entire character around knowledge. -20 penalty makes sense, but if I also can't use call to mind when I need it most, that makes it somewhat difficult.

If the thing is a hidden -20 if I roll below an unmodified 15, then you could go ahead and roll the 15 by itself to check for it, but I would still like to take 20, unless I am actually misunderstanding you and you were saying that there was the unmodified roll AND I couldn't take 20. If that makes any sense.

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^

Trying to explain, not combative. It's just kinda important for me. In general, I hate rolling things myself, so I build my characters to make sure that I don't need to that often:

Take 10 or 20 as often as available, use SR: No spells with saves (no touch attacks), point-buy, etc.

The basically 75% chance of a -20 to Knowledge checks about an unfarmiliar world is every time you checks the skills until such time as your character is now part of the world, or could be considered a sage (with the three months of dedicated time cutting the world binding so to speak time in half)

Like say you rolled a 15, not 16. Your History Check would have been a total of 15+15-20=10, Which would have put a lot of false/confused information. As in you may have said that Revolutionary war was not fought between the feldglings united states and England but the US and UN. Minor little details like that would be off, and you wouldn't even notice. Your work in that case would be worth little more then a fiction book, that no historian worth his salt would think it is usefull. (as in no market for it, and penalties for using the Librarium until that falsehoods could be found out by someone else reading the book and making their check)

In your case because you rolled a 16-20 it Just works and your information is accurate and the books you spend the month having the warforged scribe for you are accurate.

The history section of the Librarium deals 100% with Eberron History, there is not one book within the entire Librarium that has to do with Galorian. Klokk was intending to get some heavy war horses and a portable hole worth of history books, but because of all the slaves he freed, he didn't bring back a single horse or book, he got distracted.

What im saying is that you can take 10 or 20 on one of the Knowledge checks until your bound to this world. Its a weird mechanic I know, and believe me when I say that my whole table of 10 player, even the co-dm let out a sigh and started complaining about it.

I the campaign that Klokk's is in we do skill checks vary differently.

1d6 = Basic information
1d10 = simply information
1d20 = common information
1d100= rare information
1d1000 = Supper duper rare information.
1d10000 = a chance the gods my give you an exact answer.
1d100000 = a prayer in hells chance.
1d1000000 = worse chance.
1d10000000 = IF get your RL date of birth, you gain 100 skill points.

That's the short version. I actually have to type everything up so ill most a post about it in the homebrew area in the next few days. If any of you are curious.

But in our campaign, even with hundreds of points into a skill. When we came to this world the first time he gave us the 75% of our skill just giving the wrong information. Penality was actually -75% to our skill checks, not -20. Im trying my best here to convert all our crazy houserules like that, into something at least close to pathfinder rules, because that is mostly what I started this campaign running under. Not the crazy combination of 1e, 2e, 3e, rifts, 3.5, pathfinder that the game I play Klokk within runs under.

I hope this helps put things a tad more in prespective. I know all about not liking to roll. in our campaign we can customized spells with our skill points, instead of putting them into a skill it can be added to spell to adjust a variable.

We use mostly 2e spells, unless it just does not exist in 2e, then we use 3x/pf spells to suppliment.
Wolvyn has 80 points into the Cure Critical spell, it heals 3d8+80.
Wolvyn has 10 points into Elemental Summoning making it 1 round instead of 1 turn to summon.
Klokk has 36 points in Fire Lance, which is a DD 1d6 per level of fire damage spell, save for half. He has put -36 to save in it.. so basically it will always hit something.
Fools gold has a 25 hour duration for Klokk.

What knowledges are affected by this? I assume it's just history, geography (in the sense of memorizing places, not like understanding rock formations), nobility? (Things tied to knowing facts about stuff that you've never seen)

Like, I can do what I was doing before with the other knowledges?

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It would be lovely to read your homebrew rules. It's very difficult to build anything without being able to check the rules in advance. In your example though, where I had rolled a 15 and gotten a 10 on my check. It says in the rules that a 10 would give me knowledge of common events, so I would get the revolutionary war stuff correct?

I think part of the confusion is im not too keen on the PF DC results to be honest. much more so with the crazy house rules which are a fair bit higher.

Dc 20 was for common knowledge, 30 uncommon 40 rare, 50 vary rare far as details.

Ill reread the PF DC check results and get that stuck in my head instead of the other rules we used.

Just getting ready to head over for my weekly wrath AP game at brothers. Last week they asked if I would be willing to convert from pathfinder mystic rules to 2nd ed.. SO I think this is the last day that I will DM or GM at my brothers table for a while. if that is the case.. I am not going back in time to the 90s.. if I could there is much more fun stuff id be doing then DMin 2e. That and I already run a every other sunday 2e game.

"Things tied to knowing facts about stuff that you've never seen"
That basically sums it up perfectly.

It says in the rules that a 10 would give me knowledge of common events, so I would get the revolutionary war stuff correct?

Only after you talk to someone that (or read a book about) knows about the rev war. You wouldn't just know it automatically, that would take a far more powerful magic then I have ever used.

I think that is assumed generally in the knowledge check, especially since you are already taking the -20 penalty largely into account (I assume that not getting above 15 is like having not met someone to teach you about it, hence the big penalty).

One thing that I realized was that many times, it's necessary to suspend disbelief. If you think about it, there are people in this game that have long jumps of 50 feet (not aided with magic). It's much like knowledge checks of 35 (-20 penalty makes it 15 or 10).

That might mean that once upon a time, a god knew vaguely of some other world, told his closest follower, that follower might have etched the story in a set of ancient runes, which were decoded by a colleague, which was passed through generations at a historian's guild, before being mentioned as a footnote in a rare book, which I read at some point.

With call to mind, that makes Feorina have a perfect memory, essentially. Much like the analogy with jumping.

If someone has a check of 30 on acrobatics, it's not like they can only jump 30 ft, if they are physically capable of it. Just the fact that they can make the DC 30 check means that they are probably already physically capable (possibly taking penalties for injuries).

Similarly, if someone has a high knowledge check, then it's assumed that they have done the learning already. If you give players books, for example, then you generally assume that they know the knowledge they read, no check required. So the knowledge check is more about if they have learned that tidbit over their long life. Knowledge 35 is like knowing the internet (assuming it can be hit consistently, which in this case, it can be).

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tl;dr Checks and penalties simulate learning the material already. If it's hard to find someone that knows about the rev war, then it's probably more of an obscure event in your world (which you already took account of by the -20 penalty). And, DC 35 is already well beyond human capacity, so it doesn't make sense to apply many aspects of "common sense" in what humans can possibly do. Based superficially on knowledge checks, Feorina is like an Albert Einstein of every field; it's not that the DCs are too low, but I've invested everything I have into knowledge.

It would be lovely to read your homebrew rules. It's very difficult to build anything without being able to check the rules in advance. In your example though, where I had rolled a 15 and gotten a 10 on my check. It says in the rules that a 10 would give me knowledge of common events, so I would get the revolutionary war stuff correct?

+1

Think of it from My perspective though. a level 3 character able to 100% of the time get at least 16 on any knowledge check.

Which means at 3rd level & having been on the world for a whopping 2 weeks.

You can automatically ID all 1st level spells cast
Identify mineral, stone, or metal
Determine slope
Identify dangerous construction
Determine a structure's style or age
Identify a creature's ethnicity or accent
Recognize regional terrain features
Know recent or historically significant event
Determine approximate date of a specific event
Know local laws, rulers, and popular locations
Know a common rumor or local tradition
Identify a common plant or animal
Identify unnatural weather phenomenon
Know current rulers and their symbols
Know proper etiquette
Know the names of the planes
Recognize current plane
Recognize a common deity's symbol or clergy
Know common mythology and tenets
Identify a monster's abilities and weaknesses (up to CR5)

That honestly makes me want to give you the DM control over the campaign, as you basically know everything of import.

IF you can manage to roll a 4, you basically know everything else.
and if you take 10 or 20 there is Nothing that you wouldn't know by raw.

There has Never been a diety from any of your worlds physically here. There has been zero books written about this world in any other worlds, beside the journal of Klokk and the journals of his companions, Which are all located on Eberron with the Chamber atm.

You guys haven't even run into a native culture yet, there is no way you could know most of that stuff. No suspension of disbelief, Its not just automatic knowledge, but there is zero reference in stuff you have read. This is all 100% new information.

Just for my sake of mind I may need to just implement john 75% reduction in knowledge based skills. I just see it as way way too OP other wise.

What am I am a DM supposed to do when one of my players breaks my campaign?

Fall back to dumb mechanic my DM put in place within this world, that I never liked, get argumentive and kinda ruin everyone's time, try to come up with a not as much dick move as my DM did to us, or ask the party what I am supposed to do.

Far as those house rules, this knowledge thing is the last thing in there that is relevant to this campaign. I need those rules up by this weekend so they will be there by then and like I said ill linky here to them.

Everyone expect for Resnit I need to know what your doing for the month of April. Hes going to go into the detail of his two missions, but its finals week for him so that's going to be delayed a day or two. Which is fine because what he finds or does should not effect any of your actions for the month.

For this time. There are 4 weeks in the month.
1 week is council duties 100% or wakin time.
3 weeks remain. each of those weeks you can do 1 thing from the downtime rules. Going to do it weekly, not daily as it will just get bogged down too much. That and the daily results are just a weekly result /7.

Warforged or sleepless people you can choose a 2nd or 3rd action for the same day, just know if you do 3 things a week, you will no access to your spells/prayers/powers as they all require 8 hours of rest to regain.

Remember the whole premise of this campaign IS the Light in the Darkness concept from 1e and 4e. So the whole knowing everything off the bat kinda defeats the purpose.. That's why I said I am willing to give you the campaign and just keep Klokk locked in the tower for the remainder of his time till his campaign resumes.

There is literally nothing known about this world. In hundreds and thousands of years, if joels math is correct. Klokk and his companions never encountered one living or undead creature in the are around haven. This is 100% similar to coming from Europe to the new world, only it was through a door to another world, not across the ocean & no natives have been encountered in over 1000 years.

I came when they first came to this world. I have not left it.

I have yet to see one flying creature.
All ground creatures are 1 size larger then they were on any of our homeworlds.
All sea creatures are also 1 size larger then I would have expected them to be.
I have not met a creature with more than ant or bee or animal intelligence.

This is literally all that is known of this world.
No creature has come to either of my Groves, not in a vary vary long time. My apprentice Wolvyn came with Klokk, some time ago. Other then him I have felt no contact with anyone upon the druidic weaves.

I hold the equilivant to two Grand Mastery doctorates in Knowledge History, in my centuries here I have yet to discover anything about this world that is relevant that you do not yet know.

For clarification, I meant that I knew things about other worlds that were not this world, that is, ones that were in contact before (I believe that is Golarion and Castrovel, unsure about Eberron) The idea is that I can trade knowledge from my experiences on other worlds for information on this one.

It certainly wouldn't be very fun if I just knew everything about this one. Clearly this world is different from the other worlds in the sense that it requires this magical gate.

Essentially, instead of bringing along a library with tens of thousands of books, I just know all the material. An adequate bargaining chip, I would say. Or, if you want to use the grand doctorates example, just because I may have the equivalent of hundreds of grand doctorates on knowledge from the old world, does not mean that I would automatically know everything about the new one.

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I think your main problem with the knowledges is knowing stuff about this new world that we're exploring, but that's not what I was trying to do at all. I am trying to access knowledge from the planes that we've already been on, before we stepped through these portals to this unexplored land. Hopefully that explains what I mean better and resolves this?

I do not claim to know about this new world, but I would also like to not be nerfed on my ability to know about the old one.

ah i get what Feorina is saying now. She is trying to make (and maybe later sell) stories of our old worlds. People might buy that. Fiction for some, research for others.

Anyway, as far as what Fabricator is doing, he will use 2/3 of his day to assist in the building projects that were decided upon.

Verio is researching everything he can that was ever written here, plus he is going to get to know the Stonescales and Warforged around him.

ah i get what Feorina is saying now. She is trying to make (and maybe later sell) stories of our old worlds. People might buy that. Fiction for some, research for others.

Anyway, as far as what Fabricator is doing, he will use 2/3 of his day to assist in the building projects that were decided upon.

Exactly. Alternatively, they could talk to me and ask questions, and then I could then ask them personal questions that we'd like to be answered. But in the past, books were lavish gifts for the royalty and powerful bishops, and they don't cost us huge amounts of money to make (unlike a solid gold statue).

Imagine if an alien civilization came to visit Earth. We'd probably want a set of encyclopedias (or a flashdrive, in modern times) about their world.

Except you need paper to make the books with, that is the only issue that I see at the moment. Not to mention hides or leather to bind the book. you have wood you could make wooden bindings. but you still run into the lack of paper/parchment.

I too see what your saying now. You want to make what would amount to is fiction books for this world.

It looks like we are going right into the May 1st council meeting in the game play thread so please all be present and join in. Neither Joel nor Samanthia are present yet in the Tavern. Though Wolvyn and Ssisal are sitting outside drinking warm milk and Wolvyn is teaching Ssisal to read/write in draconian.

OK so for April, Fabricator was helping 2/3 of the day with building structures.

In May, he wants to spend 2/3 of his day working on getting new mines going.

Its may01 in the gameplay thread. For this discussion thread I do not need to know what you plan to do for may.. that is what the meeting is for in the gameplay thread.

When I get home from the parade tonight I will post phase one and you can see how much BP you have for may's spending.. but its fairly low as all your forged were working on arms/armor production basically not mining/farming/gathering.

But in the meanwhile talk between yourselfs, your expeditions both yielded some vary good results.

Well, it's not fiction because it's all true. I imagine it would be very valuable. :p

Off for the holidays

I will be continuing gameplay on the a week from tomarrow, if it does continue on its own in the meanwhiles. Im around every day cept most of Christmas, and Christmas Eve after sunset cst.

I really wish that I could edit.

I forgot to say, I will wait until the 26th to post Phase one of the kingdom turn, to give ya all time to get your weekly turns for april posted. if they are all posted before then Ill post phase 1 before the 26th. Its all up to you. :D

1d6 ⇒ 4
1d6 ⇒ 41d6 ⇒ 6
1d6 ⇒ 41d6 ⇒ 5
1d6 ⇒ 5
1d6 ⇒ 5
1d6 ⇒ 4
1d6 ⇒ 3

Figured out what happened need to clear out my dice pool

1d6d6d1d6 ⇒ (2, 4, 5, 5, 3, 5) = 24
1d6 ⇒ 4
1d6 ⇒ 2
1d6 ⇒ 5
1d6 ⇒ 4

Merry Christmass

And a happy new year

I won a ps4 in a raffle.

I heard.. a little ratling told a dwarf I know. Congrats.

Merry Christmass all.

Merry Christmas from Ireland guys. Yeah I am a day late but only sobering up now! Hope ya'll had a good one!

Merry Chistmas to all.

Sorry, I missed your spoiler post, DM. In this timeline, what APs events have occurred? I might be a bit confused. This world that we're in is not any of the published settings, correct?

Pretty much all of the AP's, time back home is 2 months after Wrath of Righteous starts.

To the best of your knowledge, no this world is not either of the three worlds that your party comes from

Wont be on for a bit, having my birthday dinner with some friends and likely to be fairly tired, if not hung over, for a portion of tomorrow.

Just want to inform everyone that I will be on vacation in Hawaii from Jan 14-24 with limited to no internet access, so I wont be around.

ah, enjoy Hawaii. I live on Oahu right now. a great place to visit, not so great of a place to live.