Cantrip level for spellhearts

[Hilary Moon Murphy]

Do spellheart cantrips auto-heighten like cantrips from other sources?

[HammerJack]

Yes. They would have to say that they don't, rather than needing to say that they do.

[breithauptclan]

Some items do specify the spell level of the cantrips that they have, such as Flame Tongue.

[Hilary Moon Murphy]

Thank you both!

[graystone]

breithauptclan wrote:

Some items do specify the spell level of the cantrips that they have, such as Flame Tongue.

Or feats like Arcane Sense and it's set level for Detect Magic.

[BretI]

HammerJack wrote:

Yes. They would have to say that they don't, rather than needing to say that they do.

Could you please point to something in the rules indicating this?

I am not disagreeing with you, I just would honestly like to know where in the rules it says that.

[Cordell Kintner]

Cantrip rules. Basically, unless it says otherwise, it will always heighten. Cantrips on Spellhearts don't list a level, so they would follow that basic rule.

[breithauptclan]

That's my understanding on it too. The general rules for Cantrips and the Cantrip trait both say that Cantrips always heighten based on character level.

For a Cantrip to not heighten it would need a specific override of the general rule.

[BretI]

Thanks, that is what I was looking for.

[Hilary Moon Murphy]

Honestly, this has made spellhearts my favorite magic item. They're so cool, and give every spell caster a chance to have one spell outside their main tradition.

[Cordell Kintner]

Spellhearts are great. A little TOO great in my opinion... But I will save my complaints on them for later.

[The Gleeful Grognard]

Cordell Kintner wrote:

Spellhearts are great. A little TOO great in my opinion... But I will save my complaints on them for later.

Agreed, although I think it would be less of an issue if offensive cantrips weren't quite so poorly balanced.

[Perpdepog]

Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

Honestly, this has made spellhearts my favorite magic item. They're so cool, and give every spell caster a chance to have one spell outside their main tradition.

Potentially as many as three spells, depending. You can attach one to your main hand weapon, one to an offhand weapon, and one to your armor or clothes.

[Gortle]

Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

Honestly, this has made spellhearts my favorite magic item. They're so cool, and give every spell caster a chance to have one spell outside their main tradition.

It means everyone gets one extra cantrip. Mostly that will be Electric Arc for Occult and Divine Casters, and perhaps Forbidding Ward for Arcane Casters, Shield for Primal Casters. It does help round them out but it will also make them more the same. It is nice, but I would have prefered a couple of extra cantrips in each tradition that approached the value of the best cantrips in that tradition.

[Errenor]

Gortle wrote:

perhaps Forbidding Ward for Arcane Casters, Shield for Primal Casters.

Are there Forbidding Ward and Shield Spellhearts? O_o

Gortle wrote:

It is nice, but I would have prefered a couple of extra cantrips in each tradition that approached the value of the best cantrips in that tradition.

You mean overall, not 'in that tradition'? Nothing bad for Divine in having a good attacking cantrip. Though they will probably get it in the remaster.

[Ezekieru]

Errenor wrote:

Gortle wrote:

perhaps Forbidding Ward for Arcane Casters, Shield for Primal Casters.

Are there Forbidding Ward and Shield Spellhearts? O_o

Yep! Enigma Mirror has Forbidding Ward, and Warding Statuette has Shield.

[Errenor]

Ezekieru wrote:

Errenor wrote:

Are there Forbidding Ward and Shield Spellhearts? O_o

Yep! Enigma Mirror has Forbidding Ward, and Warding Statuette has Shield.

Thanks! Interesting. I didn't research TV enough :)

Warding Statuette is very nice.

[BishopMcQ]

Would they use the character's level or the item level for the heightening?

[shroudb]

BishopMcQ wrote:

Would they use the character's level or the item level for the heightening?

Character level.

[BishopMcQ]

Thanks.