|
Half-Elf or Half-Orc: Can a character of either of these races select human racial archetypes (such as from Advanced Race Guide?
Yes. Half-elves and half-orcs may select racial favored class options, archetypes, traits, and so on, as if they were a full member of both races (a half-elf can select elf and human rules elements, a half-orc can select human and orc rules elements).
Edit 9/26/13: This is a reversal of an earlier ruling. This resolves a discrepancy between this FAQ and two Advanced Player's Guide FAQs.
Some PLs in my group doubt whether the "and so on" includes alternate racial traits, feats or spells. The focus is on Moonkissed, an alternate racial trait of elf, secondly is on Blend, a ARG spell only access to elf.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
the spell should be ok.
the alt racial abilities, like any other alt racial ability depend if the half elf has the racial ability to trade it with.
And if he does, I would allow it. (some other GM might not. be sure to ask yours)
if he doesn't have the ability to trade then no. -the same as any other race who would like to trade an ability but find out he lack it
say for example, a human who already traded his bonus feat, can't take another alt ability that trade the bonus feat.
so let's take a closer look at the 'moonkissed' alt ability:
"
Moonkissed
Source Heroes from the Fringe pg. 11
Some Spiresworn, especially those born within the Spire itself, are mystically warded from birth against dangers both mental and physical. Elves with this alternate racial trait gain a +1 racial bonus on saving throws.
This replaces elven immunities and keen senses.
"
ok so it trade the elven immunities and keen senses. if the half elf has exactly the same alt abilities (but it would say half elf instead of elf). i would allow the trade off
the elf's 'elven immunities and keen senses' say:
"Elven Immunities: Elves are immune to magic sleep effects and get a +2 racial bonus on saving throws against enchantment spells and effects."
"Keen Senses: Elves receive a +2 racial bonus on Perception checks."
and the half elf has:
"Elven Immunities: Half-elves are immune to magic sleep effects and get a +2 racial bonus on saving throws against enchantment spells and effects."
"Keen Senses: Half-elves receive a +2 racial bonus on Perception checks."
seem alright to me!
Story-wise id say his elven parent was a Moonkissed elf (so they never had the elven immunities and keen senses but got the moonkissed ability). like this, while Atavism is a thing, there is more sense that their child, who they had along with their human partner, will show the same abilities then go back to the ancestral elven abilities.
said elven parent was also a spellcaster who knew how to cast the 'Blend' spell and tutored their child on the method to cast it.
I agree with zza nil. As long as the half elf has the racial trait that is being given up, they should be able to take the alternative racial trait. The feat Elven Spirt allows you to gain the elven magic racial trait and specifies that you can exchange that for any one racial trait that elves can exchange for the elven magic trait.
RAW, it applies to spells, feats, magic items, archetypes, favored class bonuses, prestige classes, and Race traits. Alternate racial traits are not interchangeable between halfblood races and their parent races per RAW. That said, as others have states, your GM may permit it if the race has the same base racial abilities to replace.
The RAW is at best vague, because the FAQ says, "and so on".
i find it easier to explain then having the human mother try to explain how come her child from the moonkissed elf father got abilities which, while common for other elves, non of them have.
Almost as if the real father was a mere common-every-day elf...
"..Honestly..i heard of this theory about something called 'Avatism' and it say that..."
While it's not always a good source for rulings - HeroLab allows a half-elf to access both. (And for this case, that's good enough for my game)
Elf Blood: Half-elves count as both elves and humans for any effect related to race.
Yes. Half-elves and half-orcs may select racial favored class options, archetypes, traits, and so on, as if they were a full member of both races (a half-elf can select elf and human rules elements, a half-orc can select human and orc rules elements).
Alternate Racial Traits: This section lists alternate racial traits for each of the seven core races. Many of them play on racial themes not reflected in the standard racial traits, like the elven alternate racial trait fleet-footed, which grants the Run feat and a bonus on initiative checks instead of the normal keen senses and weapon familiarity traits, reflecting the grace and uncanny reflexes of that race. To take one of these alternate racial traits, you must exchange one or more of the existing standard racial traits available to the race. You can exchange one or several of the standard racial traits, but you cannot exchange the same racial trait more than once. For example, an elf who takes the fleet-footed racial trait cannot take the urbanite racial trait, because the latter trait also replaces keen senses.
The FAQ is not changing the rules it is clarifying it. The actual rule states that a half elf counts as a both an elf and a human for any effect related to race. The FAQ confirms this and clearly states a half elf can select elf and human rules elements. That sentence actually removes the ambiguity of the term effects related to race, or and the phrase so on. It specifies that a half elf can select a rules element as if it were either a human or an elf. Alternative racial traits are rules elements. That means a half elf can select any rules elements that is available to a human or an elf that is not prevented by something else. The rules for alternate racial traits specify they can only be taken if you have the trait being replaced. So, as long as the half elf has all the base racial traits, they can select the alternative racial trait.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Elf Blood: Half-elves count as both elves and humans for any effect related to race.
Yes. Half-elves and half-orcs may select racial favored class options, archetypes, traits, and so on, as if they were a full member of both races (a half-elf can select elf and human rules elements, a half-orc can select human and orc rules elements).
Alternate Racial Traits: This section lists alternate racial traits for each of the seven core races. Many of them play on racial themes not reflected in the standard racial traits, like the elven alternate racial trait fleet-footed, which grants the Run feat and a bonus on initiative checks instead of the normal keen senses and weapon familiarity traits, reflecting the grace and uncanny reflexes of that race. To take one of these alternate racial traits, you must exchange one or more of the existing standard racial traits available to the race. You can exchange one or several of the standard racial traits, but you cannot exchange the same racial trait more than once. For example, an elf who takes the fleet-footed racial trait cannot take the urbanite racial trait, because the latter trait also replaces keen senses.
The FAQ is not changing the rules it is clarifying it. The actual rule states that a half elf counts as a both an elf and a human for any effect related to race. The FAQ confirms this and clearly states a half elf can select elf and human rules elements. That sentence actually removes the ambiguity of the term effects related to race, or and the phrase so on. It specifies that a half elf can select a rules element as if it were either a human or an elf. Alternative racial traits are rules elements. That means a half elf can select any rules elements that is available to a human or an elf that is not prevented by something else. The rules for alternate racial traits specify they can only be taken if you have the trait being replaced. So, as long as the half elf has all the base racial traits, they can select the alternative racial...
I agree with your conclusion. But for the Elf Blood racial trait in CRB, I think it just for "effect" . IMO, "effect" refer to what influence characters, such as spells, sp, su or some environment effects, it has nothing to do with the Build.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
The CRB wasn't as legalistic and pedantic as later books came to be. In this case, "effect" was meant to mean just about anything.
You cannot take alternate racial traits, but you can take race traits.
Alternate racial traits require you to give up some racial ability that you almost certainly do not have.
Race traits are those half-feats called traits in the category of race. Since you count as an elf, a human, and a half-elf you can take a race trait with any of those races as a prerequisite.
For feats, classes, spells, and magic items you count as elf, human, and half-elf. You also count as all 3 for favored enemy and bane weapons.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Half Elves do have some of the same racial traits as elves. Both have Low-Light Vision, Elven Immunities, and Keen senses. They can also take the feat Elven Spirit to gain the Elven Magic, and that feat specifically states you can trade out the elven magic for an alternative racial trait that elves can exchange for elven magic.