Draconian's could also be really big depending on what type of dragon egg they were from. I wish they had made them playable and smaller.
Sadly, those belong to WOTC due to Dragonlance. I do love the variety though, the Noble and Metallic Draconians.
Still wanting a playable aquatic elf. That would be a great party now that the locathah and the merfolk are available.
I think a versatile heritage related to kaiju would be sick—iirc from one of the recent streams kobolds get a heritage for this in Tian Xia Character Guide because of course they do, but I want it for everyone!
Also, while kholos do somewhat scratch the big dog itch for me (not to mention Awakened Animals are here), a more straightforward canine ancestry would be nice. I would also gladly take a shoony rework/expansion so they aren't all small pugs.
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An Octopus based ancestry. Obviously their primary aquatic, like the mermaid, with a low land speed. Smal/Medium size, with an ancestry feet chain to become larger, or a heritage of Krakenink to start as large.
They, by and large, have playful attitudes, and their ire usually results in pranks and tricks that are not intended to be physically harmful or permanently damaging, but when they don't understand how ships work, or have any sense of "money" this can lead tot heir pranks to be seen as much more malicious.
Their Anathema would include "pay back non-violent offenses with violent responses". Meaning, if you insult them, they won't haul off an deck you, they will, steal something when your back was turned and send it to the bottom of the ocean.
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An Octopus based ancestry. Obviously their primary aquatic, like the mermaid, with a low land speed. Smal/Medium size, with an ancestry feet chain to become larger, or a heritage of Krakenink to start as large.
They, by and large, have playful attitudes, and their ire usually results in pranks and tricks that are not intended to be physically harmful or permanently damaging, but when they don't understand how ships work, or have any sense of "money" this can lead tot heir pranks to be seen as much more malicious.
Their Anathema would include "pay back non-violent offenses with violent responses". Meaning, if you insult them, they won't haul off an deck you, they will, steal something when your back was turned and send it to the bottom of the ocean.
Are we talking humanoid octopus folks like 1e's cecaelias, or like full-on sapient octopi (that aren't just awakened animals with extra steps)?
Why not a merfolk heritage with its own feats?
I think a versatile heritage related to kaiju would be sick—iirc from one of the recent streams kobolds get a heritage for this in Tian Xia Character Guide because of course they do, but I want it for everyone!
If it finally comes with detailled artworks of every single Kaiju catalogued, I'll take it.
Also, while kholos do somewhat scratch the big dog itch for me (not to mention Awakened Animals are here), a more straightforward canine ancestry would be nice. I would also gladly take a shoony rework/expansion so they aren't all small pugs.
I'm still puzzled that they used pugs instead of converting the Rougarou from Bestiary 6...
Oh, I forget, is there a medium-sized centaur heritage? Can I play a deertaur yet?
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Oh, I forget, is there a medium-sized centaur heritage? Can I play a deertaur yet?
Yes there is Ponygait Centaur is medium. What is more I can link to it now.
Oh, I forget, is there a medium-sized centaur heritage? Can I play a deertaur yet?Yes there is Ponygait Centaur is medium. What is more I can link to it now.
Haha, great timing.
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Not exactly an ancestry, but I'd like an "adopted" versatile heritage that give the equivalent of the "adopted ancestry" general feat right from the first level. Or maybe a background that does the same (altho I would prefer the background to stay "free", in that I would like it if I could have an adopted character whose background isn't solely that they're adopted, so an heritage would be better IMO).
It always seemed weird to me that having been raised by another ancestry than your own is something backed in a character backstory, yet there's no real way to reflect this from level 1 (unless you're a versatile human, but I'd really like this not to be restricted to a human only thing, anyone can be adopted).
It's especially important for characters that would like an early access to the ancestry specific lore or weapon familiarity feat. A character from ancestry "X" using the signature weapon or tactics of ancestry "Y" because they were raised by them is a fairly big trope, and it's weird that it's not really doable from the start when the whole point of the trope is that it's how they started.
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Absolutely delighted with the look of Lashunta in the SF2 playtest. Between that hitting today and HoW delivering us Minotaurs, I'm very nearly out of Ancestry requests! I can't believe how thoroughly Paizo has spoiled me over the years.
Little of the list remains: Wyrwoods are essential and inevitable, while I hold out unlikely hope for both Sekmin and Sedacthy someday.
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I've been fed well with my love of reptiles, body horror and arthropods so can't really think of what is missing right now besides like old ancestries I liked like wyvarans and ones I wanted to see done better like "silhoutte based on that greek myth about people who eat scents" or something
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Holding out hope that we'll eventually get Arcadian (Wyrwood, Rougarou) and Darklands (Sekmin, Xulgath) ancestries, but otherwise I'm feeling quite happy with what we currently have. Starfinder releasing will also scratch that itch for some extraplanar ancestries to use in campaigns that feature planetary travel, so there's that too.
I would like a fey versatile heritage.
Based on what?
What Fey creature could offer a versatile heritage?
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I would like a fey versatile heritage.Based on what?
What Fey creature could offer a versatile heritage?
Wouldn't need to be based on a specific fey, surely? The ancestry would presumably be similar to dragonblooded, nephalim and so on, where you just have some of the power of that given creature type in you.
Some sort of Nephilim where you are altered by the energy from the first world could work.
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Some sort of Nephilim where you are altered by the energy from the first world could work.
Yeah I wonder if we'll just see Nephilim as a catch all for all extraplanar stuff going forward. Obviously we may one day see Aphorite and Ganzi get folded in, but i don't think there's anything particularly stopping a first world or netherworld option, even if those might be better served on their own.
Holding out hope that we'll eventually get Arcadian (Wyrwood, Rougarou) and Darklands (Sekmin, Xulgath) ancestries, but otherwise I'm feeling quite happy with what we currently have. Starfinder releasing will also scratch that itch for some extraplanar ancestries to use in campaigns that feature planetary travel, so there's that too.I honestly feel Howl of the Wild was a missed opportunity for introducing Rougarou to 2e (especially since wolf/dog-headed humans is a common trope in European folklore) instead we got water-confined Merfolk.
I think Rougarou are being saved for an Arcadia book, alongside Wyrwoods and maybe Syrinx.
Maybe you guys can help me fill the blanks here...
ARCADIA
ANCESTRIES
- Syrinx
- Rougarou
- Wyrwood
- Deep one hybrids
HERITAGES
- Mitzenki catfolk
- Ningyo merfolk
- Sasquatch vanara
- Coatl nagaji
DARKLANDS
ANCESTRIES
- Sekmin (serpentfolk)
- Xulgath (troglodyte)
- Mongrelmen (could be folded into fleshwarps)
- Ulat-kinis (skum)
HERITAGES
- Sekmin nagaji
- Drathnelar gnomes (svirfneblins)
- Vegepygmy leshies
CASMARON
ANCESTRIES
- Panottis
- Harpies
- Cyclops
- Wemics
HERITAGES
- ...
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Maybe you guys can help me fill the blanks here...
ARCADIA
ANCESTRIES
- Syrinx
- Rougarou
- Wyrwood
- Deep one hybridsHERITAGES
- Mitzenki catfolk
- Ningyo merfolk
- Sasquatch vanara
- Coatl nagajiDARKLANDS
ANCESTRIES
- Sekmin (serpentfolk)
- Xulgath (troglodyte)
- Mongrelmen (could be folded into fleshwarps)
- Ulat-kinis (skum)HERITAGES
- Sekmin nagaji
- Drathnelar gnomes (svirfneblins)
- Vegepygmy leshiesCASMARON
ANCESTRIES
- Panottis
- Harpies
- Cyclops
- WemicsHERITAGES
- ...
So many of my players are going to drop out of Pathfinder because they can't remember or pronounce the names of all the new and revised things.
Even for those who will stay, they're not using any of the new terms; they'll simply say "skum" instead "uulat-kinis" for example.
Makes it much harder to immerse yourself when you don't keep the vocabulary relatively straightforward. I'm also going to have a much harder time recruiting replacements with the way things are going.
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Maybe you guys can help me fill the blanks here...
ARCADIA
ANCESTRIES
- Syrinx
- Rougarou
- Wyrwood
- Deep one hybridsHERITAGES
- Mitzenki catfolk
- Ningyo merfolk
- Sasquatch vanara
- Coatl nagajiDARKLANDS
ANCESTRIES
- Sekmin (serpentfolk)
- Xulgath (troglodyte)
- Mongrelmen (could be folded into fleshwarps)
- Ulat-kinis (skum)HERITAGES
- Sekmin nagaji
- Drathnelar gnomes (svirfneblins)
- Vegepygmy leshiesCASMARON
ANCESTRIES
- Panottis
- Harpies
- Cyclops
- WemicsHERITAGES
- ...So many of my players are going to drop out of Pathfinder because they can't remember or pronounce the names of all the new and revised things.
Even for those who will stay, they're not using any of the new terms; they'll simply say "skum" instead "uulat-kinis" for example.
Makes it much harder to immerse yourself when you don't keep the vocabulary relatively straightforward. I'm also going to have a much harder time recruiting replacements with the way things are going.
This is such a strange complaint to me - I understand there being a delayed time to get the new names, but I cannot understand it being this big of a deal. It's not like we've not had complex names in ttRPGs before, and they're a mainstay in almost all fantastical fiction. Why is charau-ka not an issue in these complaints when they could be more simply (and problematically) called "monkeyfolk" or something like that? If that's fine because they've always been that way, why would it be game-ending for them to be renamed to charau-ka in the 2nd edition change like most of these did? We've had complex names since the start, these are a few more of them (and often aren't more complex anyway, just new). Even ignoring that, if you get the name wrong for a while, what does it matter? If you struggle with the new names and just stick to the old ones, what does it matter? I just cannot fathom why this would be game-ending, and the idea that this will meaningfully effect recruitment seems outright unreasonable.
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So many of my players are going to drop out of Pathfinder because they can't remember or pronounce the names of all the new and revised things.
Even for those who will stay, they're not using any of the new terms; they'll simply say "skum" instead "uulat-kinis" for example.
Makes it much harder to immerse yourself when you don't keep the vocabulary relatively straightforward. I'm also going to have a much harder time recruiting replacements with the way things are going.
Born of obscene aboleth science and immorality, modern skum — also known as the ulat-kini — are the result of countless centuries of experimentation that fused captive humans with abominations from the ocean’s depths.
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So many of my players are going to drop out of Pathfinder because they can't remember or pronounce the names of all the new and revised things.
Were your players put off by having PF1 with Adaro, Aphorite, Astomoi, Being of Ib, Boggard, Caligni, Cecaelia, Gathlain, Grindylow, Kuru, Lasunhta, Monkey Goblin, Munavri, Naiad, Orang-Pendak, Reptoid, Rougarou, Sahuagin, Shabti, Triaxian, Triton, Trox, and Yaddithian PC options? Or was this just inherently not a problem because you're only going to need to know what one of these is if you're playing one, and you're only going to find out about it because you're reading the book that explains what it is?
Like are they absolutely allergic to Starfinder because in Starfinder you can choose to be Alkainan, Amrantah, Anassanoi, Astrozoan, Astriapi, Bantrid, Barathu, Bolida, Borai, Brakim, Brenneri, Cephalume, Contemplative, Copaxi, Damai, Dessamar imago or instar, Dirindi, Draelik, Dromada, Elanaya, Elebrian, Embri, Endiffian, Entu colony or symbiote, Espraksa, Ferran, Formian, Gathol, Ghibrani, Gosclaw, Haan, Hadrogaan, Hanakan, Hologram, Hortus, Huitz’plina, Ijtikri, Ikeshti, Ilthisarian, Ixtangi, Izalguun, Jububnan, Kaa-Leki, Kalo, Kanabo, Kayal, Kevri, Khizar, Kiirinta, Kish, or Loqan and that's just in the first half of the alphabet?
The thing is if you just fead these lists of fictional words, they seem like nonsense probably. But if you read them in context, like in the book that tells you about a place and the people in it, or in the Alien Archive then they're not nonsensical. Since they come with context- a picture, some words that explain what these people are like, some rules, etc. Like no one who has figured out "A Tiefling is someone with fiend blood, they are often red or pink and often have horns, hooves, or tails" will struggle with "A Syrinx is an owl-person."
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If anything, after changing Gnolls to their cultural name of Kholo (or Half-Elves to Aiuvarin, and Half-Orcs to Dromaar), I was disappointed that they didn't go all the way: Catfolk to Amurruns, Lizardfolk to Iruxi, and Ratfolk to Ysoki. It just feels kind of reductive to me that you have such cool ancestral name with an underlying culture, but the average player will just call you a catfolk/ratfolk/lizardfolk because they are mostly just gonna be glancing at feats. There is an incentive to learn Kholo, Aiuvarin, and Dromaar, because you see them every time you look up the entry, but there is no incentive to remember Amurrun, Ysoki, and Iruxi except for the fact it's a language, which would not be checked that often.
All a player will see is you are *insertanimalhere*folk
Agreed. I suppose gnolls was more of a Paizo's hand was forced situation, but I do certainly prefer the "proper" names to Xfolk. Perhaps it's just a new player thing? Ratfolk is more immedietly obvious what it's about than Ysoki, but then things like shoony aren't "dogfolk".
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Something else is bugging me on the note. Because there are the Animalfolk as mentioned above, but we now have awakened animals. But animalfolk are not awakened animals. A catfolk is not an awakened cat. A lizardfolk is not an awakened lizard.
The story even goes on to say that amurruns, iruxi, and ysoki know their cultural name. And humans use it as a simplification. Yet for some reason, as you said. They don't call shoonies pugfolk or dogfolk, kholos hyenafolk, kitsunes foxfolk, Vanara monkeyfolk, tripkees frogfolk, Minotaurs bullfolk, etc, etc.
The "real" answer is probably just a legacy thing. Lizardfolk have always been called that, but shoony are new, and so are christened shoony as it's a more interesting name. The remaster would have been a good chance to break with that, but I'm sure Paizo have their reasons.
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Questions.
Yes.
If Paizo's hand was forced, they could have safely used the legally safe hyenafolk instead of gnoll.
True, but that would have been somewhat deflating...
The cultural ancestral names now add an identity to those characters, and for some, it's already a thing based on real-world folklore, like how foxfolks are called "Kitsune", like the actual mythological creature.
The way I see this is that the animalistic ancestries were created by deities (and then procreate), while awakened animals were [mostly] created by "mortal magic".
For instance, Lao Shu Po was an ordinary rat that consumed a god's flesh to ascend. She then created her people in her new image, which led to ysokis. This is different than casting Awaken Animal on a rat companion.
Like are they absolutely allergic to Starfinder because in Starfinder you can choose to be Alkainan, Amrantah, Anassanoi, Astrozoan, Astriapi, Bantrid, Barathu, Bolida, Borai, Brakim, Brenneri, Cephalume, Contemplative, Copaxi, Damai, Dessamar imago or instar, Dirindi, Draelik, Dromada, Elanaya, Elebrian, Embri, Endiffian, Entu colony or symbiote, Espraksa, Ferran, Formian, Gathol, Ghibrani, Gosclaw, Haan, Hadrogaan, Hanakan, Hologram, Hortus, Huitz’plina, Ijtikri, Ikeshti, Ilthisarian, Ixtangi, Izalguun, Jububnan, Kaa-Leki, Kalo, Kanabo, Kayal, Kevri, Khizar, Kiirinta, Kish, or Loqan and that's just in the first half of the alphabet?
Ugh, don't remind me... THOSE, I would gladly take a "common name", because alien names have already a tongue-twisting property ^^;
(Except for Hologram, that's easy enough :P )
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Maybe you guys can help me fill the blanks here...
ARCADIA
ANCESTRIES
- Syrinx
- Rougarou
- Wyrwood
- Deep one hybridsHERITAGES
- Mitzenki catfolk
- Ningyo merfolk
- Sasquatch vanara
- Coatl nagajiDARKLANDS
ANCESTRIES
- Sekmin (serpentfolk)
- Xulgath (troglodyte)
- Mongrelmen (could be folded into fleshwarps)
- Ulat-kinis (skum)HERITAGES
- Sekmin nagaji
- Drathnelar gnomes (svirfneblins)
- Vegepygmy leshiesCASMARON
ANCESTRIES
- Panottis
- Harpies
- Cyclops
- WemicsHERITAGES
- ...So many of my players are going to drop out of Pathfinder because they can't remember or pronounce the names of all the new and revised things.
Even for those who will stay, they're not using any of the new terms; they'll simply say "skum" instead "uulat-kinis" for example.
Makes it much harder to immerse yourself when you don't keep the vocabulary relatively straightforward. I'm also going to have a much harder time recruiting replacements with the way things are going.
I feel like the main thing you post about the people you play with is that they're all willing to quit playing the game at the tiniest change in the status quo, such as the company forming a union.
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I feel like the main thing you post about the people you play with is that they're all willing to quit playing the game at the tiniest change in the status quo, such as the company forming a union.
My primary in-person play group are very opinionated people who stubbornly resist change.
Regarding the union, I believe they feared it would result in a loss of quality in end product. I don't recall anyone threatening to quit over the union formation specifically. Insofar as I'm aware, there has been no such loss (if anything quality appears to have improved in some respects), and so no one has left on that account.
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Like for most people in this hobby the exchange when a player picks an unusual thing for their character goes something like:
- "I'm a [fantasy word thing]"
- "Oh, what's that?
- "It's a [description of thing]"
- "OK, got it."
Like if someone tells you about their Iruxi or your Amurrun, or their Ysoki PC and they can add additional context with "lizard person", "cat person", or "rat person" then we're all going to be fine.
Like if nothing else, the argument "they're not going to call themselves 'person, but lizardy', to them they're normal and it's weird that other people don't have scales" is pretty easy to understand.
Just see the new names as how these people pronounce it in their native tongues.
"Lizardfolk" in Common, "Iruxi" in their language.
"Catfolks" in Common, "Amurrun" in their language.
"Ratfolks" in Common, "Ysoki" in their langauge.
Whether or not they correct you, that's up to the GM :p
A Vesk will not appreciate being mistaken for an Iruxi and will likely prove their point using their doshko ^^;
Seriously, the Vesk are literally Paizo's take on the Klingons from Star Trek, as a heavily-militarized people who conquers and rules any and all and wear their armaments with pride.
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Not to linger on this, but I truly cannot imagine a funnier reason to quit the game than "they renamed some creatures". Like, gosh, I like catgirls too, but I don't throw my books in the trash when it takes me an extra half-second to find them.
Here is my list of every potential ancestry that I found in 1E sources. Please note that I pulled list together awhile ago and there are several things that have been updated in 2E. I have made annotations for some of them, but I have not kept up with it. I will inevitably give the list a deeper review at somepoint and make updates. Oh, and Giants are for the most part not on this list as I had assumed that large ancetries were mostly off the table, but that is not the case! If you want to learn about any of these, I recommend searching on Archives of Nethys in the 1E section. Some of these are really interesting peoples.
Aasimar, Aballonian, Adaro, Adherer, Adlet, Amurruns [Catfolk], Android, Animate Dream, Apallie, Aphorite, Aquatic Elf, Astomoi, Atomie, Automaton, Azarketi [Gillman], Azer
Beastkin [Skinwalker], Being of Ib, Boggard, Bugbear (Wikkawak), Buggane, Bog Strider,
Caliban, Caligni [Dark Folk], Calikang, Caulborn, Cecaelia, Ceratioidi, Changeling, Charda, Charau-ka [Apefolk], Centaur, Contemplative (Enlightened), Cyclops
Deep One (Elder), Deep One Hybrid, Denizen of Leng, Derhii, Derro, Dhampir, Dire Corby, Doppeldrek (Awakened), Doppelganger, Dragonkin, Drow (Drow Noble), Duergar, Duskwalker, Dwarf
Elf, Enlightened Construct,
Faun, Fetchling, Fleshwarp, Firbolg, Formian,
Ganzi, Gargoyle, Gathlain, Ghoran, Ginever, Girtablilu, Gnoll, Gnome, Goblin (Monkey Goblin, Kijimuna), Graeae, Gray, Green Martian, Grindylow, Grioth, Grippli
Half-Elf, Halfling, Half-Orc, Harpy, Herne, Hobgoblin, Human
Ichthyocentaur, Ifrit, Iruxi [Lizardfolk](Scion),
Kappa, Karkinoi, Kasatha, Kaava [Kech], Kerakinsi, Khaei, Kitsune, Kobold, Kuru,
Lashunta, Lava Child, Leng Ghoul, Leshy (Vine+), Locathah,
Maftet, Magmin, Mannequin Robot, Medusa (Euryale, Eygreas), Mephit, Mercane, Merfolk (Deep Merfolk), Merlucent, Mezlan, Minotaur, Mongrelmen, Morlock, Mortic (Angheuvore, Jitterbone, Gurgist, Lifeleecher, Etioling, Relictner), Muckdweller, Mudlord, Munavri, Murajau (Paguroida), Myceloid
Nagaji, Naiad, Nephilim, Nephlei, Nightgaunt, Ningyo
Ogrekin (Half-Ogre), Oneirogen, Onyvolan, Orang-pendak, Orc, Oread
Panotti, Pech, Petitioner, Poppet, Primitive Human,
Reptoid, Rougarou
Sabosan, Saguaroi, Sahuagin, Salamander, Samsaran (Reborn), Sandman, Sasquatch (Fen Mauler), Saumen Kar, Saurian, Selkie, Sekmin [Serpentfolk], Shabti, Shae, Shobhad, Shulsaga, Siyokoy, Skeleton, Skulk, Skum, Soulbound (Doll, Mannequin, Shell), Spriggan, Sprite+, Strix, Stygira, Suli, Svirfneblin [Deep Gnome], Sylph, Syrinx,
Tanuki, Tengu (Daitengu), Tenome, Thorgothrel, Thremindyr, Thriae, Tiefling, Tikbalang, Triaxian, Triton, Trox
Udaeus, Umasi, Unfettered Phantom, Undine, Urdefhan
Vanara, Vegepygmy (Thorny), Vishkanya, Vodyanoi
Wayang, Witchwyrd, Wooden Protector, Wyrwood, Wyvaran
Xill, Xulgath [Troglodyte]
Yaddithian, Yeti, Ysoki [Ratfolk],
Zhyen
1E Monstrous Humanoids
Anunnaki, Basavan, Buggane, Gargoyle (2E = Beast), Gegenees, Ghole, Graeae, Grendel, Hag (2E = Humanoid), Humbaba, Jorogumo (2E = Humanoid), Kappa (2E = Beast), Krampus (2E = Unique Humanoid), Lamia (Matriarch) (2E = Beast), Maenad, Mothman (Elder) (2E = Aberration), Nependis, Ningen, Popobala (2E = Humanoid), Psoglav, Pukwudgie (2E = Fey), Qallupilluk, Rawhead, Rokurokubi (2E = Humanoid), Stormghost, Svathurim, Vouivre
1E Ooze
Apallie, Thorgothrel, Doppeldrek (Awakened), Mezlan
1E Aberration
Yaddithian, Grindylow, Merlucent, Siyokoy,
1E Plant
Ghoran, Myceloid, Saguaroi, Vegepygmy (Thorny), Wooden Protector, Leshy+,
1E Construct
Aballonian, Poppet (Tiny), Soulbound (Doll, Mannequin, Shell), Wyrwood, Enlightened Construct, Automaton, Mannequin Robot,
1E Dragon
Dragonkin, Wyvaran,
1E Fey
Atomie, Faun, Gathlain, Sprite+, Pech, Naiad,
1E Outsider Native
Aasimar, Aphorite, Duskwalker, Fetchling, Ganzi, Ifrit, Nephilim, Oneirogen, Oread, Shabti, Suli, Sylph, Tiefling, Undine, Urdefhan, Daitengu, Triton, Unfettered Phantom,
Outsider Other
Mephit, Zhyen, Thremindyr, Denizen of Leng, Nephlei, Sandman, Mudlord, Magmin, Xill, Caulborn, Mercane, Petitioner, Shae, Shulsaga, Salamander, Azer,