BotBrain's page

Aw that's a bit of a letdown. I was hoping for a smidgen more, but alas.

At least it's a very good example of why you can't use LLMs to answer rules questions, because the LLM is clearly pulling from the older books since that's what it's got more data for.

Anything notable wrt to new class options? You don't need to transcribe them all obviously, but I'm wondering what's in there outside of the bard muse mentioned in marketting. I'm especially curious about psychic, since the memory magic struck me as a good fit.

Oh it's so much less jank and confusing. Splitting it across three archtypes made narrative sense but it also made building a hellknight far more clumsy than it needed to be.

Oh the "which books have been remastered" is going to be useful to point people towards. Good idea.

Numerian metal kinecist feats would be so cool. Paizo please I will pay you to let me write the numerian book.

I don't think I remember it ever working properly.

On topic I played one in a one shot, and thematically it was very fun. Drained wasn't a big problem out of combat really, and in combat it was easy enough to alleviate.

+1-ing wanting more Druid stuff than yet more plant-based orders.

Including better fungus-based ones. I mean, I just learned Hollow Knight's story might have been the result of a proxy war between two parasitic fungi: https://www.reddit.com/r/HollowKnight/comments/8jyn56/lore_spoilers_royalty _radiance_and_wyrms/ We need mind-control druids!

A 5e option I really miss in pf2e is their Spores Druid. It could be a really good necromancer class archtype actually!

Probably not, but even if we put my specific build aside I do think it's a bit of a gap in the system, and if more classes come out like mechanic which are encouraged to keep a hand free, I do think people will feel it.

Not a fan of accusing people of having issues for wanting something you don't.

Besides, there's options that require free hands, ways to increase magazine size or decrease ammo expenditure, and it's really not a stretch of the imagination to see some kind of feat that lets you reload if you have a non-weapon in your hand.

Yeah I get why the team are hesitant to add one handed automatic weapons but I don't think 1d4/1d6 automatic weapons would set the game alight. Playing a technomancer with some inspiration from Overwatch's Sombra is one of those builds I have floating around but rn there's no real way to get her gun.

Impulses are as text-heavy as normal feats though...

Adding 2 or 3 per element shouldn't be this complicated.

Same with general feats for the class, such as "you can use Element A with Area of Effect B".

2-3 feats per element is 12-18 feats which is a lot.

I like doing it! It's really fun but yeah it doesn’t come up too much.

I checked my copy of ROE to be sure and the preamble on page 5-6 states that elemental planes were all created together, but then the evil elemental lords' plot caused the planes of metal and wood to vanish.

Yeah it is more of a sustained effort. I am really hoping for some kind of outer planes book where you could easily justify Aether/Void feats.

NotADragon wrote:

I think Paizo should provide more support for existing classes.

However, I do not think my players would buy a book with no classes in.

I would, but I'm the GM, and therefore a smaller market.

So I think the solution is either adding content for older classes into new class books, or relying on 3rd party publishers, some of which are actually good.

Yeah you hit the market reality I think. As a GM I'd love a book of "just stuff for already existing classes/ancestries", but it almost certainly doesn't sell as well as a new class.

They have been doing more of this though. Battlecry added the Thaumaturge shield implement for example, and I hear we're getting another one.

Some classes have gotten more of it than others and there's ancestries that really need some love (looking at you, Shoony), but I'm upbeat about the general direction with these kinds of releases.

The upcoming unseen world is getting pretty close to it tbh. Annoyingly for the thread here there's no kinecist options, but from the content page up on the store, we've got a thaumaturge implement, wizard school, witch options, monk spells, druid order and animist apparitions. There might be a couple others but it's hard to judge what's setting details and what's class details. I wonder if "Tools of invocation" are inventor options or just regular items.

If we see more of that going forwards I'll be very happy.

BotBrain wrote:

Yeah the decision to not have a metal order in RoE really annoyed me. Paizo broke from metal = unnatural and even introduced an elemental plane of metal and then ... druids didn't get a order for it. Very frustrating.

I remember reading that they were going to have a metal-related order in RoE, but then the OGL thing happened and the base druid lost the restrictions it had on metal armor and such. Doing a bit of googling, this wargamer article mentions an iron druid archetype. So I guess they didn't have the time and/or resources to retool it after the change.

Hm, I didn't know that. Maybe one day...

BotBrain wrote:

Yeah the decision to not have a metal order in RoE really annoyed me. Paizo broke from metal = unnatural and even introduced an elemental plane of metal and then ... druids didn't get a order for it. Very frustrating.

The reappearance of the Metal plane is VERY recent. Having something as structured as a Druidic order based on it suddenly appearing out of the blue feels somewhat off.

Eh... True, I suppose. But it could have been an order based on the plane, an esoteric order from antiquity few knew about and so on. The same book mentions Talos and Ardande existed on golarian in small enclaves despite the loss of their planes.

Yeah the decision to not have a metal order in RoE really annoyed me. Paizo broke from metal = unnatural and even introduced an elemental plane of metal and then ... druids didn't get a order for it. Very frustrating.

There's probably also an element of preventing redundancy in there. If you make a generic potion option that functions identically to scrolls, what's the point outside of flavour?

Not to denigrate flavour by the way, it's probably more important than mechanics to me a lot of the time, but if I wanted a potion of whatever buff to function like a scroll, I'd just rename a scroll.

Assassin's Garrote! With ghost operative, alter ego and a pistol or two you can be agent 47 from hitman.

Bahhhh stop doing research on easily accessible resources you're making me look bad.

To be fair the starfinder team has managed to implement ancestries in their APs with them feeling like fully fleshed out ancestries. Obviously the two teams are different, and tackle things very differently, but it could bleed over.

NoxiousMiasma wrote:

We've got several different species that have really drastically different biology between their adult and immature forms (like, skittermanders aren't even sapient when immature!), so I'm wondering about a new ancestry based on, like, mayflies, botflies, or silk moths, where the adult stage has no digestive system or mouthparts, and lives only for a short while on nutrients obtained as a larva. What if we had a playable option that was only sapient as a larva?

Imagine a species that lives their whole personhood in their larval stage, and regards metamorphosis and their adult stage as the first point of the afterlife. Decorating cocoons with flowers and garlands, and then farewelling their elders again when their animal-selves (and animal-souls?) depart after laying eggs. It'd be really cool and different, I think.

Speaking of insects and metamorphosis, it might be interesting to have an ancestry where, as you level up, you go through metamorphosis and change form.

Surki or Automaton have a good model of how this could be handled, feats with extra stuff you need to activate with a higher-level feat.

One sad point about the power of the class being so dependent on feats is that Natural Ambition becomes very much a feat tax. Meaning a Kineticist who does not take Human ancestry or Adopted Ancestry Human is definitely one big step behind one who does, especially at low levels.

Idk whenever I've made a kinecist build I've never felt like I really need another first level feat. The fact you get two impulses and an additional class feat on top of that is incredibly generous. Several classes don't get a first level feat for less.

I also don't know how notable it is to say that a class with natural ambition is better than one without, because that's true of most classes. Natural ambition is just really bloody good.

Driftbourne wrote:

"Something old, something new, something borrowed, something blue."

So who's getting married?

Could Raia and Danese be tieing the knot? They're the only long-term relationship among the 2e iconics that I know of.

Or maybe Keskodai and his partners are renewing their vows, and Chk Chk is going to bring Dae as his plus one?

I have to see Chk Chk in a little tux now.

I would like a Dominion of the Black themed book. What are THEY up to? Now that Nyarlathotep* has been banished, has that effected them?

In the same vein, I'd like to see what the Grioths are up to now. Since their primary god is gone, has their society changed?

*spelled that right first time, hehe

Perhaps this is me but I don't see why someone couldn't self-teach themselves a hybrid study. If they're able to work out regular spells on their own, or via a book, they could have come across a tome describing their hybrid style, or lucked into it. It's unlikely but adventurers become adventurers after unlikely events.

BotBrain wrote:

The feat literally says that it doesn't work on hostile animals. I'm not seeing why it's unreasonable to apply that to an animal being actively threatened by a dragon.

Is this a case where if there's a bear in the vicinity, you become hostile to everyone that's not your friends?

No, because you're a person and not a computer who can't work out nuance.

BotBrain wrote:

FlyJonat wrote:

BotBrain wrote:

I don't think this is a contradiction, really. We could have the same conversation about why a legendary in athletics can't jump 1000 feet in the air unaided, or a legendary in survival can't forage when there is literally nothing around. Some things just aren't possible with skills, and attempting to calm an animal that is in active danger (against a dragon no less) is one of those.

Is is really impossible when there is literally a level 1 skill feat to reduce panic of creatures? This exact feat is diplomacy instead of nature but you get the idea. And yes, my PC has +30 diplomacy.

The feat literally says that it doesn't work on hostile animals. I'm not seeing why it's unreasonable to apply that to an animal being actively threatened by a dragon.

I get your frustration here but this just isn't a failing of the rules, as is being framed. Your GM decided a check was impossible and didn't let you do it. Legendary proficiency doesn't let you override that.

It does not talk about hostiles animals

"You attempt to reduce panic. Attempt a Diplomacy check, comparing it to the Will DC of creatures in a 10-foot emanation around you who are frightened. Each of them is temporarily immune for 1 hour"

My bad, I thought you were talking about tame animal.

Oh sure I don't expect mech rules until several years into the systems lifespan, if for no other reason than the starfinder team pretty recently already did mech rules, and they seem to prioritise doing new things not yet done in starfinder.

BotBrain wrote:

I don't think this is a contradiction, really. We could have the same conversation about why a legendary in athletics can't jump 1000 feet in the air unaided, or a legendary in survival can't forage when there is literally nothing around. Some things just aren't possible with skills, and attempting to calm an animal that is in active danger (against a dragon no less) is one of those.

Is is really impossible when there is literally a level 1 skill feat to reduce panic of creatures? This exact feat is diplomacy instead of nature but you get the idea. And yes, my PC has +30 diplomacy.

The feat literally says that it doesn't work on hostile animals. I'm not seeing why it's unreasonable to apply that to an animal being actively threatened by a dragon.

I get your frustration here but this just isn't a failing of the rules, as is being framed. Your GM decided a check was impossible and didn't let you do it. Legendary proficiency doesn't let you override that.

I don't think this is a contradiction, really. We could have the same conversation about why a legendary in athletics can't jump 1000 feet in the air unaided, or a legendary in survival can't forage when there is literally nothing around. Some things just aren't possible with skills, and attempting to calm an animal that is in active danger (against a dragon no less) is one of those.

BotBrain wrote:

I dunno if they're going to add collosiborn and they just get large instead of being integrated with the mech rules I'd rather they didn't bother. The entire appeal of them, to me anyway, is the beautiful nonsense that is a character becoming a mech. Innate enlarge should just go to a new ancestry.

I see Colossiborns as Kaijins, or Tokusatsu / Super Sentai monsters.

They're already monstrous in appearance, but has this special power to grow.

Yeah, and that's not a fantasy that would be fuffiled by the ability to become large. You need them to become, well, colossal, which can only really be achieved with the mech rules, or equivalent rules that allow for gargantuan PCs which really are the same thing.

I dunno if they're going to add collosiborn and they just get large instead of being integrated with the mech rules I'd rather they didn't bother. The entire appeal of them, to me anyway, is the beautiful nonsense that is a character becoming a mech. Innate enlarge should just go to a new ancestry.

I always kind of thought Junk spells were made to cater to the specific fantasies of one team member. Is there broad demand for Junk? Do your games have that much Junk lying around? What Junk is in your Null Space Chamber?

I very much enjoy the fantasy of repurposing and recycling as applied to fantasy and scifi settings.

Yeah I thought a beastmaster equivalent was a given for one of the archtypes

I really want gargoyles to have a tradition where they try and one-up each other by pulling the silliest/scariest face they can manage.

Wacky: You're a cartoon character and thus your form is a bit more maelleable, allowing you to spend an action to stretch your limbs for an extra 5ft of reach.

I know I just complained about the goofier options but this is excellent, I like this.

BotBrain wrote:

Zoken44 wrote:

There are 18 Level 0 weapons.

There is only 1 ranged Martial 1hand weapon, but it is a thrown weapon (20ft) called a "Laserdisk"

Ah nuts. Thanks for answering though!

The one martial laser I heard of was a 2h with "blaster" in the name, and modular between a short ranged laser and physical concussive modes. Sort of a laser shotgun.

That's pretty neat but for my impending character I need it to be 1H. I'll see if my dm is willing to let me swap damage types on one of the existing pistols.

Well unless Modify doesn't need a free hand anymore but I didn't spot that in thraben's video.

I would ask the DM if they can bump you up to a 2-slot caster in line with magus and summoner, especially since you're lacking a dedicated caster (though alchemist does provide caster-esque) utility.

Zoken44 wrote:

There are 18 Level 0 weapons.

There is only 1 ranged Martial 1hand weapon, but it is a thrown weapon (20ft) called a "Laserdisk"

I wonder if they will make a shurriken version of it called the Compact Disk.

It then needs to be superceded by a gun that shoots a blue laser. A blue ray, if you will.

There are 18 Level 0 weapons.

There is only 1 ranged Martial 1hand weapon, but it is a thrown weapon (20ft) called a "Laserdisk"

Ah nuts. Thanks for answering though!

I'm going to be cheeky and ask one question then for someone with the PDF and some time. How many level 0 weapons have been added? ThrabenU's preview showed there's a lot of higher level weapons but I've still got my fingers crossed for a martial 1H laser gun.

Idk three feats for 24d8 minimum is a pretty nuts return on investment. I can't think of anything that pushes that highly. I'm fully expecting quick draw to get either flourish or a 1/turn restriction in there.

Even if the klar did follow buckler rules, you wouldn't be able to use it for anything whilst two-handing the earthbreaker, since that hand would be also holding a weapon.

I am now picturing a SRO and a Kalo shipmember getting into an argument about who gets the water supply.

There is a need for pop culture in a scifi world, because a scifi world would have pop culture. I've been thinking on it for a bit now and I think the shock comes from it being our pop culture. A lot of the scifi I've read is a couple decades to a century old, so these worlds feel "old" despite being in the future. You can see this if you watch old futurama episodes where the 3000s is in many regards less technologically advanced than the actual 2020s.

And yeah, it's a bit silly and might sometimes ruin the tone but I can't deny it does make sense for memes to enter the spellcasting space. We have genes named after pop culture characters, it's not that farfetched.

I'm still puzzling out how I feel and what I want but I can't deny it's not entirely out of place.

I haven't seen it in full yet but I'm very enthused by the decision to sit down and make a new style of combat, but then ask "how do we fit this with the rest of the system". The delay was certainly a good call to try something a bit bolder.

YEAH!!! go omas!!

wait this thing has words in it? I was looking at the space whales being cool