Most Painless Way for Rogues to Wield Sword Canes?


Advice


Pretty much what it says on the tin. A group I am part of were talking about an all rogue game, and that got me interested in rogue builds and characters.

I know that the sword cane isn't the best weapon out there, but I like the image of a mastermind rogue fighting with one.

I'm wondering what the easiest way to get a sword cane into their hands would be. So far, the best option I've found is the Gladiator archetype and burning two feats on it ... is there a better way?
Makes me wish that sword cane had gotten some text about working for rogues. It feels like a distinctly roguish weapon.


By RAW, the easiest way is probably Tengu Weapon Familiarity. Would mean you have to be a Tengu, of course.

Alternatively, talk to your GM. The Description of the sword cane says it's rapier-like and rogues are already proficient with the rapier. Maybe your GM will just let you use it.

Or see if you can justify picking it up via Unconventional Weaponry. Maybe you can argue that you're rogue is from somewhere sword canes are mostly unheard of so you qualify for the "different culture" part of the feat.

Liberty's Edge

Yeah, I think most GMs would allow Unconventional Weaponry to work even if it's not strictly allowed by the rules.


Ah thanks. I'd forgotten about those options.

And they probably would. Honestly, it may be a moot point anyway since most of my group are with me in that the sword cane should probably be a rogue weapon anyhow. It's good to keep options in your pocket for other tables though.


an all rogue game sounds like an incredible idea considering the class is so versatily and offers so many skill feats.

Shadow Lodge

Schreckstoff wrote:
an all rogue game sounds like an incredible idea considering the class is so versatily and offers so many skill feats.

The major hangup I see (beyond the general lack of spellpower) is that rogues are fairly fragile, so I'd expect boss fights to be bloody.

Oh, and anything resistant/immune to precision damage will take forever to kill (pretty rare, but such things do pop-up from time to time).


Taja the Barbarian wrote:

The major hangup I see (beyond the general lack of spellpower) is that rogues are fairly fragile, so I'd expect boss fights to be bloody.

Oh, and anything resistant/immune to precision damage will take forever to kill (pretty rare, but such things do pop-up from time to time).

AC should be alright for a ruffian with sentinel dedication.

Eldritch Trickster will be slow to go online but provide some spells eventually.

Something like a Ruffian Sword and Board character, a traditional Thief, and 2 eldritch tricksters a blaster that maybe archetypes into eldritch archer later in addition and another with access to primal or divine for some heals and buffs few of which needing a high spellcasting modifier.

Also rogues can complete the medic archetype (and a bunch of others) through skill feats within 2 levels, so everyone could be a decent healer rather easily.

Back on point tengu weapon familiarity does seem to be the only way to get scaling proficiency, adopted ancestry would give you access at lvl 5 for any heritage.


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By the handle. If you hold it by the blade, it hurts.

Shadow Lodge

Schreckstoff wrote:
Taja the Barbarian wrote:

The major hangup I see (beyond the general lack of spellpower) is that rogues are fairly fragile, so I'd expect boss fights to be bloody.

Oh, and anything resistant/immune to precision damage will take forever to kill (pretty rare, but such things do pop-up from time to time).

AC should be alright for a ruffian with sentinel dedication.

Eldritch Trickster will be slow to go online but provide some spells eventually.

Something like a Ruffian Sword and Board character, a traditional Thief, and 2 eldritch tricksters a blaster that maybe archetypes into eldritch archer later in addition and another with access to primal or divine for some heals and buffs few of which needing a high spellcasting modifier.

Also rogues can complete the medic archetype (and a bunch of others) through skill feats within 2 levels, so everyone could be a decent healer rather easily.

Hit point pools will still be kinda weak, and spell casting archetypes eat up a lot of feats without giving you much in the way of spells (at 11th level, you'll only have a 3rd, a 2nd, and 1 or 2 1st level slots with trained proficiency).

Schreckstoff wrote:
Back on point tengu weapon familiarity does seem to be the only way to get scaling proficiency, adopted ancestry would give you access at lvl 5 for any heritage.

Tengu are not a valid option for Adopted Ancestry as they are 'Rare' and the feat requires you to select a 'Common' Ancestry. So, RAW it's Tengu or nothing...

This is one of the oddities of PF2e: With ancestry feat, it's generally easier for a Rogue to gain scaling proficiency in an uncommon martial weapon than it is in a common martial weapon like the War Razor or the Sword Cane.


Taja the Barbarian wrote:
Tengu are not a valid option for Adopted Ancestry as they are 'Rare' and the feat requires you to select a 'Common' Ancestry. So, RAW it's Tengu or nothing...

Tengu are Uncommon rather than Rare. They are still not technically legal for Adopted Ancestry, however.

Shadow Lodge

Mr. Pedantic wrote:
Taja the Barbarian wrote:
Tengu are not a valid option for Adopted Ancestry as they are 'Rare' and the feat requires you to select a 'Common' Ancestry. So, RAW it's Tengu or nothing...
Tengu are Uncommon rather than Rare. They are still not technically legal for Adopted Ancestry, however.

Oops, you are correct...


Mr. Pedantic wrote:
Taja the Barbarian wrote:
Tengu are not a valid option for Adopted Ancestry as they are 'Rare' and the feat requires you to select a 'Common' Ancestry. So, RAW it's Tengu or nothing...
Tengu are Uncommon rather than Rare. They are still not technically legal for Adopted Ancestry, however.

Yep, Shoony is the rare ancestry.


Taja the Barbarian wrote:
Hit point pools will still be kinda weak, and spell casting archetypes eat up a lot of feats without giving you much in the way of spells (at 11th level, you'll only have a 3rd, a 2nd, and 1 or 2 1st level slots with trained proficiency).

yeah the feat tax is high but they give access to wands. With so many skill feats at least 1 player should be great at crafting wands in downtime.

Won't make up for a full spellcaster of course.
Taja the Barbarian wrote:

Tengu are not a valid option for Adopted Ancestry as they are 'Rare' and the feat requires you to select a 'Common' Ancestry. So, RAW it's Tengu or nothing...

This is one of the oddities of PF2e: With ancestry feat, it's generally easier for a Rogue to gain scaling proficiency in an uncommon martial weapon than it is in a common martial weapon like the War Razor or the Sword Cane.

huh didn't notice that bit with adopted ancestry, is that so everything it can do is within the CRB?

Slight tangent is it possible in any way to use Eldritch Shot to deliver a heal? Make the arrow not deal damage. Not that it'd be better than just adding the range to the heal but it'd be funny to shoot arrows at allies to heal them. edit: wait no there's no spell attack roll for heal.

Shadow Lodge

I should probably add the obligatory 'Getting proficiency in a weapon through Tengu Weapon Familiarity does not add this weapon to the weapons that get the critical specialization feature from the Weapon Tricks class feature' disclaimer: The weapon becomes simple for proficiency purposes only and remains a Martial weapon (that is not on the list of rogue specific martial weapon proficiencies) for critical specialization.


Taja the Barbarian wrote:
I should probably add the obligatory 'Getting proficiency in a weapon through Tengu Weapon Familiarity does not add this weapon to the weapons that get the critical specialization feature from the Weapon Tricks class feature' disclaimer: The weapon becomes simple for proficiency purposes only and remains a Martial weapon (that is not on the list of rogue specific martial weapon proficiencies) for critical specialization.

Tengu Weapon Study fixes that problem, though.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Quote:
huh didn't notice that bit with adopted ancestry, is that so everything it can do is within the CRB?

It's more likely because the feat wasn't intended to be a backdoor around the ancestry rarities that are in play in your campaign (whether or not they match the published defaults).

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