Price 189,000 gp
Edit: to expand on that, it's more than twenty times the weight of an average android in gold.
Besides the cost there is the fact that the caster level of the creator is 15. Characters above 11th level are supposed to be world class characters with only a few in the entire world. That means that there are not a whole lot of people even capable of creating them. So while the Technic League may have a couple of people able to create them, they don’t have enough to mass produce them even if they had the available resources to create them.
Besides the cost there is the fact that the caster level of the creator is 15. Characters above 11th level are supposed to be world class characters with only a few in the entire world. That means that there are not a whole lot of people even capable of creating them. So while the Technic League may have a couple of people able to create them, they don’t have enough to mass produce them even if they had the available resources to create them.
except caster level has little to do with the requirements of making a magic item. It merely sets the DC required to craft them. A third level character with craft wonderous item can craft a caster level 20 magic item provided they can make the craft check (see pearl of power FAQ)
I agree with others it probably doesn't see wide spread usage because it's cost prohibitive. Even the substantially cheaper suppression-gem is probably cost prohibitive.
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The only android I'd be willing to use such an expensive item to control would be one with a bunch of class levels in some arcane spellcasting class, who, most likely, would beat the DC 23 Will save and then frag my butt. (Divine caster would be more of a waste, since I'd invariably order it to do something no-no to it's divine patron and result in it losing it's powers. Or get myself cursed by it's patron. Or smited by it's patron's herald... And a non-caster? Goodness. For 180,000+ gp, I can just buy their services for however long I want one!)
Big dumb otherwise-mostly-magic-immune golems seem like the optimal use for this item. (Or giant spider-robots-with-cannons... Mwa-ha-ha!)
Plus, slavery. That story never ends well, for the slaver.
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The only android I'd be willing to use such an expensive item to control would be one with a bunch of class levels in some arcane spellcasting class, who, most likely, would beat the DC 23 Will save and then frag my butt. (Divine caster would be more of a waste, since I'd invariably order it to do something no-no to it's divine patron and result in it losing it's powers. Or get myself cursed by it's patron. Or smited by it's patron's herald... And a non-caster? Goodness. For 180,000+ gp, I can just buy their services for however long I want one!)
Big dumb otherwise-mostly-magic-immune golems seem like the optimal use for this item. (Or giant spider-robots-with-cannons... Mwa-ha-ha!)
Plus, slavery. That story never ends well, for the slaver.
I've always had a problem with the concept of "God see's person tricked/forced to do something it doesn't approve of" and punishes the person rather than the one doing said tricking/forcing.
I've always had a problem with the concept of "God see's person tricked/forced to do something it doesn't approve of" and punishes the person rather than the one doing said tricking/forcing.
When a tool is misused, you remove that tool from that person's possession, and you only give it back when it won't be misused. Whether or not that is punishment is a matter of subjective opinion. In the case of forced slavery, removing the power you grant to the caster deprives the controller of their tool. The caster, whom worships you, should already have the faith required to understand that you are doing what is best and the matter is not over.
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I've always had a problem with the concept of "God see's person tricked/forced to do something it doesn't approve of" and punishes the person rather than the one doing said tricking/forcing.When a tool is misused, you remove that tool from that person's possession, and you only give it back when it won't be misused. Whether or not that is punishment is a matter of subjective opinion. In the case of forced slavery, removing the power you grant to the caster deprives the controller of their tool. The caster, whom worships you, should already have the faith required to understand that you are doing what is best and the matter is not over.
Perhaps just seems to me if I'm sitting their on my divine throne and notice
"Oh Jacks being mindcontrolled to abuse his powers."
It'd send a better message to free jack to kick his enslavers hind end or hit them with a divine smite than to take away Jack's powers. Otherwise you just get opponents of your order controlling/tricking your priests into a situation where they lose their powers thus weakening your order on earth. As an opposing religion if this worked once I'd be using it over and over till it stopped working. It's not about getting miracles granted for me, its about denying an opposing deity their powerful clerics.
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Perhaps just seems to me if I'm sitting their on my divine throne and notice
"Oh Jacks being mindcontrolled to abuse his powers."
It'd send a better message to free jack to kick his enslavers hind end or hit them with a divine smite than to take away Jack's powers. Otherwise you just get opponents of your order controlling/tricking your priests into a situation where they lose their powers thus weakening your order on earth. As an opposing religion if this worked once I'd be using it over and over till it stopped working. It's not about getting miracles granted for me, its about denying an opposing deity their powerful clerics.
If I were GMing such a situation, it would depend on the god and my mood.
Some might not care if their clerics get mindjobbed. Some might have subcontracted out the smiting and portents to a minion, who is terribly literal and doesn't get the nuance of 'he's mind controlled, not violating the anathema of his own free will.' Some might be annoyed at their cleric for not resisting said mindjobbery. (I gave you a good will save, and you should have bought a better cloak of resistance, and the Iron Will feat!) Some might be indeed smite / curse the person who mindjobbed their cleric, instead, but, as GM, I'd be very unlikely to give the cleric a free power out of the deal, that anyone who hits him with a mind-control effect gets auto-cursed! It'd be a very situational thing, not a freebie, and certainly not something to be counted on!
I'd probably still have the bad juju hit the cleric, as well, to let them now that their god isn't thrilled that they let themselves get mindjobbed into committing an anathema. (But not generally to the level of 'loses his cleric powers,' and certainly not for any great length of time. That's just cutting off your nose to spite your face! As you point out, the cleric is the god's primary interface with / way of getting there agenda done in this world, shutting them down for any length of time for something that isn't really their fault seems counter-productive.)
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To be honest I've been opposed to it since I read a fanfic where the author used it to reward the characters they liked and punish others.
Basically one character had to make the choice kill enemy X who's been attacking them, their family and friends constantly, is essentially mad with power and taunting them that their fiancee is going to die and there's nothing they can do as they're a puny mortal bug and they are a god who wont let them get the cure. So they killed them. Skip forward to story start. Another character who's granddaughter was competing for the attention of the first character decided since he'd chosen the other person they'd make him pay and set up a trick to get him and their granddaughter to enter a forgotten temple of a goddess of "mercy" while they stayed well away having slaughtered hundreds of enemies over their life and are currently setting in motion events to ensure someone will be divinely punished for essentially not doing what they want they know they'd get hit with a curse as well. Said goddess proceeds to curse the first character for having killed and stating if put in the same situation they'd do it again that they will never see their fiancee again and everyone's hand will be raised against them. Then proceeds to bless the granddaughter who has not killed (but has spent the entire series trying to kill or get rid of every obstacle to their geting the first character including magic items, brainwashing and blackmail).
It'd send a better message to free jack to kick his enslavers hind end or hit them with a divine smite than to take away Jack's powers. Otherwise you just get opponents of your order controlling/tricking your priests into a situation where they lose their powers thus weakening your order on earth. As an opposing religion if this worked once I'd be using it over and over till it stopped working. It's not about getting miracles granted for me, its about denying an opposing deity their powerful clerics.
I think this is just a lesson about two things... 1) Don't get your power from some other intelligent force that has the ability to deprive you of it for any reason if you can't handle the full consequences of such a decision, and 2) There is a reason that gods do not take direct action in the material realm (whatever reason that YOU want to make up to justify it is up to you) and you can't expect them to help you out of any situation.
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It'd send a better message to free jack to kick his enslavers hind end or hit them with a divine smite than to take away Jack's powers. Otherwise you just get opponents of your order controlling/tricking your priests into a situation where they lose their powers thus weakening your order on earth. As an opposing religion if this worked once I'd be using it over and over till it stopped working. It's not about getting miracles granted for me, its about denying an opposing deity their powerful clerics.I think this is just a lesson about two things... 1) Don't get your power from some other intelligent force that has the ability to deprive you of it for any reason if you can't handle the full consequences of such a decision, and 2) There is a reason that gods do not take direct action in the material realm (whatever reason that YOU want to make up to justify it is up to you) and you can't expect them to help you out of any situation.
Rule 1 about creating life: Don't create anything you can't destroy if needed.
Rule 1 about creating life: Don't create anything you can't destroy if needed.
I think that is more an issue or advice for those cosmologies with a single, all powerful deity, rather than hundreds (or more) of near equally powerful outsiders of immeasurable strength competing over a relatively fragile and delicate plane of existence that we like to call the Material Realm.
I am quite sure that any deity in the Golarion setting could reach out and utterly squash any particular life form that has earned their ire. The fact that they do not implies something important.
That item is pretty bland IMO. It uses the Possession spell, which has the dumbest missing feature: you CANNOT activate the body’s extraordinary or supernatural abilities, nor can you cast any of its spells or spell-like abilities.
You are possessing a Red Dragon? You can't use its breath weapon.
You are possessing a Stone Giant? You can't neither catch or throw rock.
You are possessing a Mithral Golem? You can't use its Fluid Form.
The kicker? Even the Greater Possession spell still doesn't allow you to use the creature's abilities. Seriously, if the spell would just let you completely hijack a creature and could use every power in its arsenal, that would have been the best.
So basically speaking, the Diadem of Control, if used on an android, would be pretty useless, since you couldn't use any of the targeted android's abilities.
For any mindless task more standard mindless constructs would be substantially cheaper to create and control.
A clockwork servant seems like the cheapest easiest option, though not exactly technological in nature its close.
I've always had a problem with the concept of "God see's person tricked/forced to do something it doesn't approve of" and punishes the person rather than the one doing said tricking/forcing.When a tool is misused, you remove that tool from that person's possession, and you only give it back when it won't be misused. Whether or not that is punishment is a matter of subjective opinion. In the case of forced slavery, removing the power you grant to the caster deprives the controller of their tool. The caster, whom worships you, should already have the faith required to understand that you are doing what is best and the matter is not over.
The best part is they remain depowered until they get an atonement spell which is kind of hard to do in the middle of a fight with a vampire.
The best part is they remain depowered until they get an atonement spell which is kind of hard to do in the middle of a fight with a vampire.
Well, that depends entirely if they fell out a favor with their deity (and thus must atone) or the deity has simply cut them off so their power can not be abused. I am sure you can set up the scenario a number of different ways to favor one side or the other.
Generally, it takes several occurrences of acting against a deity's portfolio or teachings to garner the attention of said deity, who proceeds to warn their worshiper and then, eventually cut them off. It takes a very large misstep to loose it entirely. Well, if you are running deities outside how they are outlined in the Inner Sea Gods material, this doesn't apply, I suppose.
Generally, it takes several occurrences of acting against a deity's portfolio or teachings to garner the attention of said deity, who proceeds to warn their worshiper and then, eventually cut them off. It takes a very large misstep to loose it entirely. Well, if you are running deities outside how they are outlined in the Inner Sea Gods material, this doesn't apply, I suppose.
Nope
A cleric who grossly violates the code of conduct required by her god loses all spells and class features, except for armor and shield proficiencies and proficiency with simple weapons.
This spell removes the burden of misdeeds from the subject. The creature seeking atonement must be truly repentant and desirous of setting right its misdeeds. If the atoning creature committed the evil act unwittingly or under some form of compulsion, atonement operates normally at no cost to you. However, in the case of a creature atoning for deliberate misdeeds, you must intercede with your deity (requiring you to expend 2,500 gp in rare incense and offerings). Atonement may be cast for one of several purposes, depending on the version selected.Restore Cleric or Druid Spell Powers: A cleric or druid who has lost the ability to cast spells by incurring the anger of her deity may regain that ability by seeking atonement from another cleric of the same deity or another druid. If the transgression was intentional, the casting cleric must expend 2,500 gp in rare incense and offerings for her god’s intercession.
The bolded portion appears to show that not only can you lose your powers unwillingly, but that you require the spell to get it back. With that said, I don't run it that way because I'm not a jerk, but that's apparently what the rules say.
Nope
Yep.
A cleric who grossly violates the code of conduct required by her god loses all spells and class features, except for armor and shield proficiencies and proficiency with simple weapons.
The bolded portion is where all the subjectivity comes into play. Just because you've acted outside of your deities wishes a few times, they could have been minor issues that can be overlooked or that you are going to be warned about. See the Inner Sea Gods book for information on how the various deities express their displeasure with their worshipers. A GROSS violation is a very serious trespass that would warrant your powers being taken away immediate.
So, yeah. Most often, an atonement spell isn't necessary unless you have done something so bad as REALLY piss off your deity. Gross violations are not always the only thing that may cause a deity to pull back their support, they just happen to be something that isnt explicitly called out in the pure mechanics of a class.
Paizo has had a multitude of encounters with divine spellcasters who do not perfectly follow their deities' codes. One of them- Ceto Malderra, a warpriest of Iomedae- is even a boss fight in Tyrant's Grasp, and despite attacking the heroic PCs at the behest of two evil undead chreatures, does not lose her warpriest abilities during the fight. The only thing that I can find as an instant loss of power is renouncing or letting go of your faith in your deity, which is often much more gradual than blasphemy or the like.
The rules for losing divine power, and the situations in which they are lost, are somewhat blurry, but as far as Paizo's in-game examples of divine spellcasters and heretics go, it isn't black and white by any means.