Amber Ambitions mentioned this combination in a different thread, but I figured it deserves more attention.
Crossbow Maven let's you start with any masterwork crossbow you want, and automatically grants you proficiency with it...
The Heavy Dwarven Pelletbow is a crossbow that shoots sling pellets dealing 1D6 Bludgeoning damage. It has a 19-20 crit range, and a x3 multiplier. A range increment of 60 feet.
The level four Gunslinger bonus feat should allow you to have Rapid Reload, Point Blank Shot, and Rapid Shot.
Five levels of Bolt Ace gives you Crossbow Training, which adds Dexterity to damage, AND increases the multiplier to x4! And you can take Crossbow Mastery as a feat.
After that you can go anywhere with this build you want to... just make sure you take Improved Critical as soon as possible to have a 17-20/x4 ranged weapon that you can target Touch AC with on a moment's notice.
Thoughts on where to go?
Inquisitor or Warpriest?
Sap Adept/Master somehow?
What do you think?
Trying to do sneak attack with a ranged weapon is an absolute pain unless you use the fog/smoke trick. And that usually pisses the GM off. I say look elsewhere.
Eldritch archer magus could be fun. You don't need much Int, and the extra attack from ranged spell combat could be handy for crit-fishing.
Or it's a bit late which would hurt the DC, but an urban aberrant bloodrager could get a dex bonus and stagger enemies on a crit, or fey could confuse them similarly.
On D20PFSRD, it says that feats and special abilities that work with heavy crossbows also work with the pelletbow.
|
"Feats and special abilities that don’t involve proficiency (that don’t depend on dealing piercing damage or firing bolts) that apply to a heavy crossbow also apply to a dwarven heavy pelletbow, and those that apply to a light crossbow also apply to a dwarven light pelletbow."
So, for example, the Bolt Ace 'pinning shot' deed or Gravity Bow spell wouldn't work, but many other crossbow options should. Crossbow Maven for a pelletbow might be debatable, but I'd allow it.
They never could get that language right. The bit about proficiency was a response to the hornbow and how technically elves would be proficient with it since it counted for effects that work on both longbows and shortbows, like elven proficiency.
I’d interpret this text to just mean that being proficient in heavy crossbows won’t make you proficient in pellet bow. But otherwise, effects and mechanics that work with one will work with the other, except for things that logically shouldn’t work, like how the pellet bow deals bludgeoning damage instead instead of piercing.
|
|
Yeah that's my point though. "That don't involve proficiency" and clearly these abilities do.
I just took that to mean that proficiency with crossbows doesn't grant you proficiency with pelletbows... though, come to think of it, that would mean that a Bolt Ace wouldn't be proficient with pelletbows unless they got it some other way.
though, come to think of it, that would mean that a Bolt Ace wouldn't be proficient with pelletbows unless they got it some other way.
That would only be a problem if you chose crossbow for the proficiency instead of pellet bow.
|
|
That would only be a problem if you chose crossbow for the proficiency instead of pellet bow.
There isn't a choice.
Gunslingers are normally proficient with simple weapons, martial weapons and firearms.
"A bolt ace is proficient with all crossbows instead of all firearms..."
Pelletbows are exotic weapons. Ergo, a Bolt Ace is not proficient with any pelletbow unless they get it from some other option (e.g. Exotic Weapon Proficiency feat).
Pellet bows are crossbows though. At least they are in the crossbow weapon group which seems like a good enough qualifier. The pellet bow is only limited by options they get by acting like a heavy or light crossbow. This is not one of those cases.
Of course assuming they didn’t trade out weapon familiarity, the dwarven bolt ace would be proficient even without the class granting it, as they have proficiency in all martial weapons and the pellet bow counts as a martial weapon for the dwarf.
|
|
I'd have a hard time concluding that 'proficiency with all crossbows' is NOT a 'special ability that involves proficiency with crossbows'.
Defining 'all crossbows' as 'all weapons in the crossbow weapon group' rather than 'all weapons with crossbow in the name' is a reasonable argument though. Could go either way.
However, as already noted, many other options could get you pelletbow proficiency. Being a Dwarf (note that the OP didn't state a race) would certainly be one of those.
In any case, I'd be fine with reskinning it to a 'Pellet Ace' since the "Bolt" in the name doesn't apply.
We have no other official designation of what is or isn't a crossbow though. So, we just have to make a judgement on that. They are in the crossbows group. And according to wikipedia, a pellet bow is a type of crossbow. So really, I think we'd need rules text saying that it does not qualify as a crossbow for it to be so limited.
Wow.
I really, REALLY just took that the Pelletbow is a crossbow and you can get proficiency with it via Bolt Ace... even start with a masterwork version of it.
Literally just assumed that was a given.
No need to be a Dwarf, although that really locks it in.
There is a bunch of discussion on IF it's even allowed, and that really surprises me.
As a GM, I am just not that picky...
To me, the Pelletbow is an exotic crossbow, and you can get access to other exotic crossbows via the Bolt Ace archetype.
It doesn't change anything, so why go out of your way to argue against it?
Obviously the things requiring bolts, like pinning and whatnot, do not apply, but I don't see any reason to disqualify the Pelletbow as a whole.
I let martials have nice things, because I am aware of the spellcasting/martial chasm...
The pellet bow is based off a real weapon that is considered a crossbow.
Link
If you read the article you will see that it is also known as a pellet bow or a stone bow.
I think the language for "you can use feats and abilities that apply to crossbows" pretty strongly implies that the pelletbow is supposed to be a crossbow.
The clauses in the "counts as" sentence are a response to:
1) It doesn't make sense to pin someone to something with a blunt object.
2) The kerfuffle back when briefly all elves were getting proficiency with the Orcish Hornbow because they got proficiency in longbows.
But since this is not a PFS legal weapon, this is all in "ask your GM" territory anyway.