Gruesome Parry - What would you do with automatic critical threats?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


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Deeds of Renown: Gruesome Parry (Ex) wrote:
Some gunslingers wield guns and blades in concert, readying a shot to unbalance attackers and then eviscerating their assailants. At 7th level, the gunslinger can spend 1 grit point when she readies an action to make a ranged attack with a firearm against a creature that declares a melee attack against her. If she does, the readied ranged attack does not provoke attacks of opportunity. If this readied attack hits, she gains a +4 dodge bonus to AC against the triggering attack, and she can make a single melee attack with a slashing or piercing weapon against the creature that attacked her; if this melee attack hits, it is considered to be a critical threat. This deed replaces the dead shot deed and one other 7th-level deed.

So.

Spend 1 grit point when you ready a ranged attack, make the shot without provoking, and gain one non-action melee attack that is an automatic critical threat.

Sweet Iomedae that's good.
Well maybe not that great for the standard Gunslinger who lacks melee damage and doesn't have any hand free to carry a melee weapon. That Gunslinger would use a Cestus with a x2 crit multiplier and deal below 10 dmg.
But for the Funslinger who uses a Heavy Pick/Shadowshooting Buckler Gun, and has one level of Swashbuckler to regain Grit from melee crits, it's pretty damn great. We'll pick up Overwatch Style to ready multiple ranged attacks per round, and by some miracle we have a 'Sword and Pistol' build that actually synergizes well by blending melee and ranged.

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Now what can a character that has automatic critical threats do that normally isn't viable?

I'm talking about things like taking the Gore Fiend feat to regain rounds of rage from critical hits, and using the Feasting Bite rage power to heal each round from bite attacks.

Ideas?


You use butterfly sting to pass your crit off to the beast with a X4 2handed crit weapon threatening your target.


This would make multiclassing with savage technologist barbarians...what's the word. Oh yeah, TERRIFYING!


You might actually make it worth it to use those magic weapon abilities which trigger on crits, ___ burst & so on. Corrosive burst would add 3d10+1d6 acid damage to your pick.

Violent display, tripping strike and other feats triggering off crits could be useful.

If you've another character whose player is willing to work with you then outflank could be very useful.

Edit: of course, since this requires at least gunslinger 7 / swashbuckler 1 it's not a starting combo in most games. You need to make sure that you're still good at lower levels too. And that's not a great character for out of combat use, either.


Ryan Freire wrote:
You use butterfly sting to pass your crit off to the beast with a X4 2handed crit weapon threatening your target.

...or I become the x4 2handed crit weapon beast myself!

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Claxon wrote:
This would make multiclassing with savage technologist barbarians...what's the word. Oh yeah, TERRIFYING!

Thematically on point! Slim Jim would be proud.

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avr wrote:
Edit: of course, since this requires at least gunslinger 7 / swashbuckler 1 it's not a starting combo in most games. You need to make sure that you're still good at lower levels too. And that's not a great character for out of combat use, either.

Prob gonna start out with a level of Id Bloodrager for wands, and end with a level of Kata Master MoMS for Panache/Bonus Style feat at lv 9. My diplomacy should be respectable with skill focus from Id Bloodrager and a racial bonus from half-Orc, so I'll just snag a Figment Sage Familiar at lv 5 to contribute with knowledge skills, too.

Only having Power Attack gives me 106 dmg per critical hit, and Overwatch Style gives me two readied actions per turn. I still have two undecided feats at lv 7 and 9 which could be used for crit interactions.

Quote:
You might actually make it worth it to use those magic weapon abilities which trigger on crits, ___ burst & so on. Corrosive burst would add 3d10+1d6 acid damage to your pick.

Thundering is pretty nice, since it's only a +1 weapon ability and the more uncommon Sonic damage type. There's apparently a lot of weapon abilities that has interesting effects on crits, but are unfortunately limited by low save DCs.

Might be worth it to take Nullifying to battle SR at very high levels.

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Edit:

If you can take Free/Swift actions as part of readied actions, it would be pretty fun to use a undersized Scythe and the Divine Fighting Technique of Urgathoa to gain Temp HP equal to the damage of a Scythe crit. Would have to be CE, though.

Sovereign Court

Tangent: how do you guys read the Devoted Muse's Deeds class feature? Do you advance both Gunslinger Deeds and Swashbuckler Deeds? IE kind of a theurge Gunslinger/Swashbuckler?


Devoted Muse: Deeds:
This ability functions exactly as the swashbuckler ability of the same name with two exceptions. First, the devoted muse qualifies for and benefits from deeds as if she were a swashbuckler 3 levels lower than her class level (minimum 1). Second, the devoted muse doesn’t gain the opportune parry and riposte deed until 4th level. For the purpose of this ability, a devoted muse’s class levels otherwise stack with levels in any other class that grants the deeds ability.

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I'd say the intent is pretty clear from context. The ability functions as the Swashbuckler's specific type of Deeds, and the last sentence of the paragraph is still referring to that specific class feature.

So while you could advance the Deeds progression of a Virtuoso Bravo Paladin or Daring Champion Cavalier which both works as the Swashbuckler's ability, the levels would not stack for a Gunslinger or a Sleuth Investigator since the class feature is not the one being referenced by Devoted Muse.


Any source on the Gruesome Parry Deed? I can't find it on the archives. But I did find this

Deeds of Renown wrote:


Description Source: Chronicle of Legends
Swashbucklers and gunslingers perform impressive deeds through their grit and panache, but some are capable of truly spectacular acts known as renowned deeds. A swashbuckler or gunslinger (though not members of other classes) can select a renowned deed for her class upon reaching the class level listed in the deed’s description. This replaces the specific listed deed or deeds; if the character would not gain the appropriate deeds, she cannot select the renowned deed, as if selecting an archetype.


DeathlessOne wrote:
Any source on the Gruesome Parry Deed? I can't find it on the archives.

Looks like archives only has two of the seven Renowned Deeds for some reason. I found them by chance of the PFSRD website, so I'm unsure of the right page number.

Swashbuckler Renowned Deeds:
Vengeful Heart (Ex): Some swashbucklers are driven by vengeance above all else. At 1st level, the swashbuckler gains the samurai’s resolve class feature, treating her swashbuckler level as her samurai level. Whenever the swashbuckler spends a use of resolve, she must also spend a point of panache or a use of charmed life, or the use of resolve has no effect. This deed replaces the derring-do deed and one other 1st-level deed. Source PPC:CoL

Hilt Hammer (Ex): Precise strikes with a slender blade do little to hinder amorphous or incorporeal creatures; when encountering such threats, some swashbucklers abandon precision in favor of brutish strikes. At 3rd level, the swashbuckler can activate this deed before rolling the attack roll when making an attack that would benefit from precise strike. An attack altered this way deals only half the normal damage from precise strike, but this damage is not treated as precision damage. This deed alters (but does not replace) the precise strike deed and replaces one other 3rd-level deed. Source PPC:CoL

Dodging Dance (Ex): The swashbuckler moves around her opponents’ attacks to open them up for strikes. At 7th level, a swashbuckler can spend 1 panache point to move up to half her speed as a move action. If a creature makes an attack of opportunity against her due to this movement, she can attempt an Acrobatics check with a DC equal to the attacking creature’s CMD. If she succeeds, the attack of opportunity misses, and the swashbuckler can make an attack of opportunity against the attacking creature instead. She can attempt to evade multiple attacks of opportunity during this movement, but the DC of the Acrobatics check increases by 2 for each additional opponent that makes an attack of opportunity against her during this movement. If the swashbuckler has an ability that grants her additional attacks of opportunity, she can use them to respond to multiple missed attacks of opportunity with her own attacks. This deed replaces the swashbuckler’s grace deed and one other 7th-level deed. Source PPC:CoL

Vengeful Soul (Ex): Sometimes vengeance can take years or even decades, forcing the aggrieved swashbuckler to push the limits of her endurance. At 11th level, the swashbuckler gains the samurai’s greater resolve class feature. At 19th level, the swashbuckler gains the samurai’s true resolve class feature. The swashbuckler must have the vengeful heart renowned deed to select this deed. This deed replaces the subtle blade and cheat death deeds, plus an additional 11thlevel deed. Source PPC:CoL

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Gunslinger Renowned Deeds:
Thundering Shot (Ex): The gunslinger’s shots explode with deafening reports. At 1st level, as a standard action the gunslinger can spend 1 point of grit and make a single ranged attack with a firearm. All creatures in a 15-foot cone, starting at the corner of the gunslinger’s square closest to the target and extending directly toward the target, must succeed at a Fortitude save (DC = 10 + half the gunslinger’s class level + the gunslinger’s Wisdom modifier) or be deafened for 1 minute. This deed replaces the gunslinger’s dodge deed and one other 1st-level deed. Source PPC:CoL

Gruesome Parry (Ex): Some gunslingers wield guns and blades in concert, readying a shot to unbalance attackers and then eviscerating their assailants. At 7th level, the gunslinger can spend 1 grit point when she readies an action to make a ranged attack with a firearm against a creature that declares a melee attack against her. If she does, the readied ranged attack does not provoke attacks of opportunity. If this readied attack hits, she gains a +4 dodge bonus to AC against the triggering attack, and she can make a single melee attack with a slashing or piercing weapon against the creature that attacked her; if this melee attack hits, it is considered to be a critical threat. This deed replaces the dead shot deed and one other 7th-level deed. Source PPC:CoL

Lethal Patience (Ex): While wild flurries of bullets are certainly effective at felling foes, veteran gunslingers appreciate the value of lining up the perfect shot. At 15th level, the gunslinger can spend 1 grit point to line up a shot against a target as a full-round action. On her next turn, she can make an attack against the target as a standard action, and if the attack hits, the attack is treated as a critical threat. This deed replaces the slinger’s luck deed and one other 15th-level deed. Source PPC:CoL

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While not PFS friendly, the humble Axe/Warhammer Musket is a much cheaper alternative to the shadow-shooting buckler gun. While your melee attack only crits for 3x damage, you are always two handing your weapon, do not need to worry about your handedness, and do not need to worry about your enemies realizing your munitions are only 20% real. The downside to using an axe/warhammer musket is however being confined to playing as a Musket Master.

Additional magical properties I rather like on crit-fishing builds include the Thundering property that adds (in this case) 2d8 sonic damage on a 3x crit, a fortitude save vs Deafness, and only costs +1. With a heavy pick you would deal 3d8 sonic damage

Last thing worth noting, you need to spend the grit point when declaring your readied action. This is unfortunate as you burn a grit point if no one attacks you.


ShroudedInLight wrote:
While not PFS friendly, the humble Axe/Warhammer Musket is a much cheaper alternative to the shadow-shooting buckler gun. While your melee attack only crits for 3x damage, you are always two handing your weapon, do not need to worry about your handedness, and do not need to worry about your enemies realizing your munitions are only 20% real. The downside to using an axe/warhammer musket is however being confined to playing as a Musket Master.

The misfire value would be 1-3 instead of just 1, which is a problem when the broken condition would lower the crit multiplier to just 2x. Shadowshooting also circumvents the reloading-AoO which would trigger since we spend a lot of time in melee.

ShroudedInLight wrote:
Last thing worth noting, you need to spend the grit point when declaring your readied action. This is unfortunate as you burn a grit point if no one attacks you.

Yup, it's not without risks. You need three d20 rolls to regain Grit through the crit, so you better score some killing blows to keep yourself afloat.

A wand/oils of Bless Weapon is definitely on the shopping list.


ShroudedInLight wrote:

While not PFS friendly, the humble Axe/Warhammer Musket is a much cheaper alternative to the shadow-shooting buckler gun. While your melee attack only crits for 3x damage, you are always two handing your weapon, do not need to worry about your handedness, and do not need to worry about your enemies realizing your munitions are only 20% real. The downside to using an axe/warhammer musket is however being confined to playing as a Musket Master.

Why isn't the axe/warhammer a x4 crit? By the way it is listed, the warhammer/axe should have the exact same stats as the musket portion of the weapon. So 1d8 and x4 crit.

Not that it shouldn't have different stats, but I haven't see any rules to indicate otherwise.

Also I don't see any reason why you'd need to be a musket master. Early levels you use a pistol. Once you've got your trick set up you switch to your +1 shadowshooting Musket-Axe and never worry about reloading a musket again.


I believe that the Warhammer/Battle Axe portion of the weapon uses the statistics for a standard Battle Axe/Warhammer.

My reasoning is that the Axe Musket states that it does Bludgeoning and Piercing damage. Meanwhile, the Battle Axe does only slashing damage. Thus, the stats listed for the Axe Musket are only describing the Musket portion of the weapon and you need to refer to the Battle Axe weapon entry for that portion.

Making the musket shadow shooting seems reasonable instead of going for a Musket Master build.

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