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One of the things I am most excited about with Attack of the Swarm is the opportunity to learn how the Pact Worlds set up their military structures. Is there a Pact-wide military force, a la the UN Peacekeepers, or NATO's integrated multinational units? Do individual planets have their own navies, which might or might not offer units "on loan" to coordinated commands?
This is particularly interesting to me because the first adventure's title, "Fate of the Fifth," suggests that the PCs will be part of the Fifth, presumably some kind of military unit designation. Will there be rank and issues of command/promotion? A typical modern fireteam is composed of four members, just like the typical size of a role-playing group, but fireteams are not generally as widely-specialized as a RPG group, with medics and technical specialists part of the same group as the infantry. Will we see a description of military doctrine in the Pact that suggests that PC-styled units are widely used, or will the PCs be assembled from more disparate units that follow a more traditional structure, but have been decimated until only the PCs are left?
I was noticing that myself. If you think about it, all the core Starfinder races are minority or outsider populations within the pact worlds.
One of the things I am most excited about with Attack of the Swarm is the opportunity to learn how the Pact Worlds set up their military structures. Is there a Pact-wide military force, a la the UN Peacekeepers, or NATO's integrated multinational units? Do individual planets have their own navies, which might or might not offer units "on loan" to coordinated commands?
That's sort of what I've been seeing. The intent I've seen when representing the Pact Worlds is that they are less of a unified entity and more of a collection of common interests. For instance, the Corpse Fleet originally WAS Eox's navy until the undead decided to start playing nice and the Fleet was banished/left in disgust
The Stewards are something like UN Peacekeepers and maintain their own fleet but most of the might will likely come from member states and likely more than a few private militaries interested in keeping the Pact Worlds out of foreign hands. So along with members like Verces and the Idari joining a war effort, you would likely see representatives from groups like the Hellknights and the Starfinders.
Will we see a description of military doctrine in the Pact that suggests that PC-styled units are widely used, or will the PCs be assembled from more disparate units that follow a more traditional structure, but have been decimated until only the PCs are left?
It probably depends on the individual gm and party dynamics. When I run this for my home group, I'm definitely going to play up the angle of a hasty retreat in the face of overwhelming odds and definitely going to encourage my players to make characters that have less of a place on the frontlines.
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personally, if i had my druthers, the Stewards would be a standing, professional force. elite, top guys.
the Pact Worlds itself would have a military, but it would be sorta decentralized - Eoxian units, Aballonian units, Absalom units - etc.
Sorta like the Union Army in the American Civil War, where the states were raising the bulk of the soldiers, but they were under the US Army command structure.
So units were segmented, but command was unified.
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Sorta like the Union Army in the American Civil War, where the states were raising the bulk of the soldiers, but they were under the US Army command structure.
So units were segmented, but command was unified.
I really like this explanation. This is a great way to describe how the Pact Worlds might organize a military force.
dot.
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Not to knock Paizo, but I personally wouldn't hold out a lot of hope on this.
There aren't many game designers that I know of (since Roger E. Moore from the TSR days) with a long-term military background. The organization of a military force is strongly dependent on the primary mission: spaceship/starship combat requires different organizational structures than small units (i.e., commandos/scouts/marines); and both of them require different structures than large units (i.e., ground/planetary armies with non-spaceship/starship combat vehicles). Then you get into "combined arms" operations, where the different types of military units support each other. You literally need to have multiple types of military units because there are things that each does well and others that they do poorly: in military operations, you should try to use the right tool for the job; otherwise, things tend to (often literally) blow up in your face.
Generally speaking, a given pact world military will need at least a spaceship/starship force to interdict worlds/star systems, protect trade vessels, and project military power; a small unit force to (as mentioned) perform reconnaissance/scouting, probably act as boarding forces/counter-boarding forces for the spaceships/starships, and act as a precision strike force on planets/space stations; and a large unit force for large scale planetary/space station assault and/or defense, to include area/resource control/denial and providing secure staging zones for the other forces (such as bases/hospitals/supply depots, factories, shipyards, etc.). They might be under the same military umbrella (a "unified" military), but they will still have their own organization and training requirements because the mission sets are so different.
dot.
what In the Nine Hells does this mean?
dot.what In the Nine Hells does this mean?Making a comment so you can find the thread later.
Threads you've posted in show up on the forum main page followed by a dot.
Ah ohhkay.. thank you for clearing that up!
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Has it been said who we'll be involved with? I'm still nourishing a faint hope that the assumption will be to be part of the Azlanti Empire in a major confrontation with the Swarm, with the Veskarium and the Pact Worlds as worried onlookers. It also has the benefit of having something resembling a unified military structure, most likely.
believable futuristic cities with all that entails (weapon laws, competent law enforcement, etc)
We have very different experiences and ideas of law enforcement both in real life and in sci-fi, I see. :^)
The world being invaded...
You're in this system's military.
Has it been said who we'll be involved with? I'm still nourishing a faint hope that the assumption will be to be part of the Azlanti Empire in a major confrontation with the Swarm, with the Veskarium and the Pact Worlds as worried onlookers. It also has the benefit of having something resembling a unified military structure, most likely.
Nope, we're fighting for the sci fi equivalent a competent but under equipped small town police force as a huge gang of marauding bikers arrives.
Developer
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Nope, we're fighting for the sci fi equivalent a competent but under equipped small town police force as a huge gang of marauding bikers arrives.Has it been said who we'll be involved with? I'm still nourishing a faint hope that the assumption will be to be part of the Azlanti Empire in a major confrontation with the Swarm, with the Veskarium and the Pact Worlds as worried onlookers. It also has the benefit of having something resembling a unified military structure, most likely.
I like that image!
I like that image!Nope, we're fighting for the sci fi equivalent of a competent but under equipped small town police force as a huge gang of marauding bikers arrives.Has it been said who we'll be involved with? I'm still nourishing a faint hope that the assumption will be to be part of the Azlanti Empire in a major confrontation with the Swarm, with the Veskarium and the Pact Worlds as worried onlookers. It also has the benefit of having something resembling a unified military structure, most likely.
Please, feel free to describe this AP like that because that's exactly what this adventure feels like lol
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Hey there, this is Patrick the author here. The planet that "Fate of the Fifth" takes place on is called "Suskillon" and it is a far-off colony that has been under its own governance for over a century. I imagined Australia while I was writing it, as it has these huge cities but also large tracts of unspoiled wilderness between them. The description of 'marauding bikers' is funny because that makes me think of Mad Max.
I purposefully did not rewatch Starship Troopers while writing, but to be honest I have that movie like laser etched into my brain, so I hope some of the action percolated into this AP for you all and your friends to play in August!
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Hey there, this is Patrick the author here. The planet that "Fate of the Fifth" takes place on is called "Suskillon" and it is a far-off colony that has been under its own governance for over a century. I imagined Australia while I was writing it, as it has these huge cities but also large tracts of unspoiled wilderness between them. The description of 'marauding bikers' is funny because that makes me think of Mad Max.
I purposefully did not rewatch Starship Troopers while writing, but to be honest I have that movie like laser etched into my brain, so I hope some of the action percolated into this AP for you all and your friends to play in August!
Australia IN SPACE MATE!
Australia IN SPACE MATE!Hey there, this is Patrick the author here. The planet that "Fate of the Fifth" takes place on is called "Suskillon" and it is a far-off colony that has been under its own governance for over a century. I imagined Australia while I was writing it, as it has these huge cities but also large tracts of unspoiled wilderness between them. The description of 'marauding bikers' is funny because that makes me think of Mad Max.
I purposefully did not rewatch Starship Troopers while writing, but to be honest I have that movie like laser etched into my brain, so I hope some of the action percolated into this AP for you all and your friends to play in August!
This is where I'd put a Immoten Joe gif.
Now I want to play it even more.
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Australia IN SPACE MATE!Hey there, this is Patrick the author here. The planet that "Fate of the Fifth" takes place on is called "Suskillon" and it is a far-off colony that has been under its own governance for over a century. I imagined Australia while I was writing it, as it has these huge cities but also large tracts of unspoiled wilderness between them. The description of 'marauding bikers' is funny because that makes me think of Mad Max.
I purposefully did not rewatch Starship Troopers while writing, but to be honest I have that movie like laser etched into my brain, so I hope some of the action percolated into this AP for you all and your friends to play in August!
Got to have the entire party named Bruce :-)
I'M thinking a mechanic named Bruce with a drone named Bruce
So here's how I imagine the Pact Worlds actually defending themselves against all manner of foreign enemies . . . :)
"Militaries are irrelevant," the Confluence agent intoned in the minds of the strategists gathered in the Bastion on Absalom Station. The generals and other experts gathered to analyze recent reports from Suskillon ignored the large mass of floating appendages and bulbous body sac. The barathu was accustomed to this. It waited for another lull in the worried assessments of the humanoid and anacite members of the group.
"Sopeth Corporation has concluded its analysis of the Swarm genome and has created this." The barathu agent inserted a purplish appendage into a cavity revealed in its own body with a sickening sound of sucking tissue and removed what looked like a pasty pink cyst coated with mucus. The other humanoids winced. The anacites looked on passively, unblinking. "Introduce this into one of their carrier entities and the virus will spread through the entire species -- killing them all."
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So here's how I imagine the Pact Worlds actually defending themselves against all manner of foreign enemies . . . :)
"Militaries are irrelevant," the Confluence agent intoned in the minds of the strategists gathered in the Bastion on Absalom Station. The generals and other experts gathered to analyze recent reports from Suskillon ignored the large mass of floating appendages and bulbous body sac. The barathu was accustomed to this. It waited for another lull in the worried assessments of the humanoid and anacite members of the group.
"Sopeth Corporation has concluded its analysis of the Swarm genome and has created this." The barathu agent inserted a purplish appendage into a cavity revealed in its own body with a sickening sound of sucking tissue and removed what looked like a pasty pink cyst coated with mucus. The other humanoids winced. The anacites looked on passively, unblinking. "Introduce this into one of their carrier entities and the virus will spread through the entire species -- killing them all."
The only issue I have with that is the swarm don't appear to be a mindless threat.
They are simply hiveminded, and most likely quite intelligent. They can probably implement quarantine procedures and come up with a cure.
So here's how I imagine the Pact Worlds actually defending themselves against all manner of foreign enemies . . . :)
The only issue I have with that is the swarm don't appear to be a mindless threat.
They are simply hiveminded, and most likely quite intelligent. They can probably implement quarantine procedures and come up with a cure.
That certainly would be a contingency that would need to be considered.
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So here's how I imagine the Pact Worlds actually defending themselves against all manner of foreign enemies . . . :)
"Militaries are irrelevant," the Confluence agent intoned in the minds of the strategists gathered in the Bastion on Absalom Station. The generals and other experts gathered to analyze recent reports from Suskillon ignored the large mass of floating appendages and bulbous body sac. The barathu was accustomed to this. It waited for another lull in the worried assessments of the humanoid and anacite members of the group.
"Sopeth Corporation has concluded its analysis of the Swarm genome and has created this." The barathu agent inserted a purplish appendage into a cavity revealed in its own body with a sickening sound of sucking tissue and removed what looked like a pasty pink cyst coated with mucus. The other humanoids winced. The anacites looked on passively, unblinking. "Introduce this into one of their carrier entities and the virus will spread through the entire species -- killing them all."
Wow, how lucky for the Swarm they’ve never attacked the Pact Worlds!
Chiming in on the original topic of PW military forces, you figure you have the Stewards acting as system-wide security, each individual planet likely has it's own fleet and military and then you have independent groups like the Hellknights, Knights of Golarion, and the Skyfire Legion who are also capable of scrambling large numbers of troops and ships to engage with any invading force.
Plus any "corporate security" groups that might offer their services for money.
I actually can easily see many of the Pact World states providing little emphasis on "large standing army", due to the nature of the setting. Yes, some problems are best solved by tens of thousands of infantrymen and tank pilots and whatnot, but the number that wouldn't be *better* solved with either commando teams ( read "PC parties" ) or space fleets? Much smaller. After all, why send a thousand grunts at a problem when either a couple capital ships providing orbital firepower, a few teams of elite specialists with advanced gear and magic superpowers, or both, can fix things much more cleanly?
The main thing large "ground" forces can do that the others can't is hold and defend territory. If you want to rule a populace, or protect it from enemy attack, you probably need a large garrison spread over the locale. Otherwise, hostile locals or enemy infiltrators have the initiative and can do basically anything they want.
Considering the background story for Acuturn, I kind of don't WANT them to have a standing army.
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Considering the background story for Acuturn, I kind of don't WANT them to have a standing army.I actually can easily see many of the Pact World states providing little emphasis on "large standing army", due to the nature of the setting. Yes, some problems are best solved by tens of thousands of infantrymen and tank pilots and whatnot, but the number that wouldn't be *better* solved with either commando teams ( read "PC parties" ) or space fleets? Much smaller. After all, why send a thousand grunts at a problem when either a couple capital ships providing orbital firepower, a few teams of elite specialists with advanced gear and magic superpowers, or both, can fix things much more cleanly?
The main thing large "ground" forces can do that the others can't is hold and defend territory. If you want to rule a populace, or protect it from enemy attack, you probably need a large garrison spread over the locale. Otherwise, hostile locals or enemy infiltrators have the initiative and can do basically anything they want.
Aucturn is also implied to be sparsely populated (at least with creatures capable of organization) AND is fighting a constant side war against itself and the Dominion of the Black.
I'd love to run a series of adventures there though...
The best solution to Aucturn wouldn't be invasion, but destruction with some planetkilling WMD. Except for the little problem that a planet killing WMD might not *work*. . .
That's literally what happened to Eox. They went from being imperialist, genocidal jerks to being Undead, Nigh Immortal, imperialist, genocidal jerks.
The last thing I want is for someone running that horrifying place to look at the Bone Fleet and go "Yeah...that could work."
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Going from an outer god orbiting the sun at the edge of the system to an undead, no longer asleep, outer god orbiting the sun at the edge of the system definitely sounds worse.
Except for the little problem that a planet killing WMD might not *work*. . .
Or worse, might
All of these possibilities make me want to stay as far away from Aucturn as possible.