Hi all,
Wondering if anybody would be interested in playing a tweaked version of Kingmaker? This game would not be based in the Stolen Lands, it would take place in Ustalav. Would be played via PbP here on the Paizo boards.
The basic premise is that the end of Carrion Crown went badly for the heroes, and they failed to defeat Adivion Adrissant in the final battle. What followed their defeat was nearly 8 years of war as Lastwall declared a Crusade against the growing undead threat consuming Ustalav.
The Crusade has now ended, and Ustalav is in ruins. Most of its citizens were killed, and it has functionally ceased to exist/operate as an independent country. Lastwall, unwilling to have such an unstable situation on its border, has decided to send mercenary bands into the chaos to help pacify the remaining threats and bring stability to the area. As an added incentive, mercenaries that prove exceptionally capable will be encouraged to claim the lands for themselves with Lastwall's support.
The campaign would play like Kingmaker - hexploration, found and develop a realm, all the political conflict and intrigue, etc. Story and encounters would be changed to appropriately reflect Ustalav and it's environs.
Much, much more, but that's the general idea. Something worth pursuing?
Certainly sounds interesting - I'd think about making a character for it!
I would be down for it, would you be using the soucebooks for ideas. or do you currently have a idea on where you are going, and what area are you looking at on the maps of ustalav or reskinning the campaign traits.
Is this a new avatar? I like looking at DM's post history and style before posting, and would you be willing to disclose your old one.
You've certainly got my attention.
I’m interested.
Sounds awesome, I'd be definitely down for that. Undead and Werewolves instead of Fey, hell yeah.
I'd be in!
Interested.
Very interested and this character's background just might fit in with the concept.
I like the idea I'd be interested.
I'm interested. Any thoughts on starting level or house rules/alternate rules?
Thanks for responses so far.
As for some of the questions, this is my first avatar here. I've been lurking for a while, and I've done a small amount of PbP on other boards, but nothing significant. I've got little kids at home, and we're just getting into the "wow, we have some free time again" phase, and I'd like to get in some gaming. In-person doesn't really work for me (variety of reasons), and this seems like a good option. Happy to discuss philosophies and provide more background if people are curious. Feel free to send me a private message too.
Source material for the game would definitely come from sourcebooks, and I have a loose idea about the overall story arc. Campaign would probably entail 3 "chapters" and be set completely in Ustalav. And yes, I'd offer a handful of customized traits. Probably not a straight reskin, more like reskinned and tweaked.
Starting level would likely be 3rd or 4th. No idea about house or alternative rules yet. Something specific you have in mind, or just a general question?
@ Atorhal
As a stay at home father of two little ones myself, I very much understand how your life is right now. I got into PBP for the same reason. It is almost impossible to do a sit down gaming session with kids that young. I have found that I enjoy the PBP game because I can fit it into my schedule anytime I am free and not dedicated to a set time and date to game.
Thank you for taking the time to run this.
sounds like fun indeed. I've always liked Ustalav's feel and would very much be interested.
Fair play for giving GMing pbp a go!
I'm a fan of automatic bonus progression to cut down on magic items that just increase numerical stats, and background skills to help round out characters. Especially those from classes with smaller skill point ranks.
As for house rules, I really like the "Elephant in the Room" feat tax rules. They reduce filler feat requirements and allow PCs to make more interesting choices, while giving a bit of a power boost.
I just researched all those rules this week, and I agree with Decimus; I'm implementing them in my home game now!
I've been thinking about this, and I even have a royal accuser inquisitor that I built for an aborted carrion crown that would be perfect for an Ustalav based Kingmaker. With the prince of Ustalav gone he'd be very interested in taking care of the (assumed to be undead) usurpers and building a new kingdom in order to re-enforce the will of Pharasma in the region.
Please do this campaign!
I agree with some of what has been said about house rules..
I have my opinion and that is all they are. Many people will disagree with me or agree with me.
Back Ground Skills:
The background skills give a little bit more to flesh out the character and it is nice. I like it but I also can play around not having it.
Feat Tax rule.
I am like most people...I think, when I say that it takes a lot of useless feats to get to the point where you envisioned your character being. It can take a lot of extra useless feats just to get half way there. I like this personally but it can be overwhelming at times.
Automatic Bonus Progression....
I never have like this..never ever ever.
I am an old timer when it comes to gaming. I remember the Red and Blue box sets from way back when if you failed a save...you died. lol
To have all the nice magical items removed from the game and replaced with a boring +1 bonus to this or that...bah....I feel that it takes away killing the big bad boss and his henchmen. ABP is like a participation trophy for gaming.
I like not having to choose between skills a character ought to have and skills they need to have.
There are a lot of redundant feats in Pathfinder/3.x and anything which chops them is great in my book.
ABP doesn't remove all the magic items, just the ones solely focused on numeric bonuses. Hence focusing on items with interesting abilities. But tastes vary. I think it's excellent for a low-magic or no-magic item game, but can work well in other campaigns.
ABP looks like a chance to play with less commonly accessed items.
Not sure what I think about it, really, though. I need some play data to form a more reasonable opinion rather than my arm-chair assumptions.
<evil grin>
The campaign 'The Last King of Ireland' uses it, if you're interested in seeing an example.
Chiming in with my interest.
With regard to the optional rules, I like that ABP, feat tax rules, and background skills cover some of the “required” stuff you’re supposed to have so you can use your feats, gold, and skills to be a more unique character. I vote for using them whenever it’s an option.
Background skills is practically mandatory for building well-rounded 2+INT characters.
Feat Tax rules are also great for flavor. When your first levels aren't clogged up taking Power Attack, Weapon Finesse, PBS, Deadly Aim, etc, you can pick up some nice flavorful feats that you just couldn't have afforded in a build otherwise.
I haven't played with ABP, but I like it conceptually. Like right now I'm playing a Gunslinger, and really want to get a Beneficial Bandolier, which would be so cool any flavorful for a Gunslinger. But I need a Belt of Incredible Dexterity, because I'm a ranged combat guy. ABP would give me the Dex bonus and let me take the flavorful item, whereas right now I have to try to convince the GM to allow an alternate slot physical-boosting item (gloves of Dex? Bracers of Dex?) so I can get the bandolier. Or something.
I really enjoy rolled stats. Again, I feel like it allows more flavorful characters. Would I ever have bought a 14 INT on a Paladin? No, of course not. what does a paladin use INT for? But if I rolled well, I can do that, and now my player is less cardboard cutout "boost CHA and STR, then CON and DEX, etc."
It's a significant power boost, but I really like Gestalt. It opens up so many fun options.
My only problem with rolled stats is that it can create large imbalances between characters, so there should be house rules in place to avoid that - when we roll stats at home, I give a free 18 and have them reroll 1s. But I like heroically epic games :) And there are lots of options for those houserules.
My only problem with rolled stats is that it can create large imbalances between characters.
I like rolled stats in theory, but yeah, this is a major problem.
Kingmaker in Ustlav? Consider me interested.
As far as alternate/house rules go:
- Definitely a fan of Background skills
- Feat Tax rules I can take or leave. While I like what the intention was, in effect, it just seems like a bit of power creep.
- ABP? Another idea with good intentions, but the implementation leaves something to be desired in my opinion.
- Rolled Stats vs. Point Buy: Like previous posters have said, it can definitely create some imbalance, but to me the more damning aspect is that you can have a great concept for a character and then the dice gods (digital or otherwise) can crap all over you and ruin a concept. Then again, it can be fun to roll the dice and then build a concept based around the rolls on occasion.
Dotting for interest. I like the Ustalav setting.
Like Background skills.
Can take or leave ABP. I have never played a game using it long enough to really judge how effective it is?
Rolled vs Buy. I can live with either, though using rolled stats it's better to allow several rolls. You can get someone with bad luck rolling unusable stats. :)
Feat tax. Again I've never used it long enough to really test it.
I prefer points buy over rolled, for similar reasons to those said above. But I can live with either. Allowing either an alternative points buy or rerolls if the first rolls are dire does help if we do go with rolled stats.
Background Skills FTW.
ABP is alright--I don't think it's a bad idea, or even that great of an idea.
Can go for rolling or point buy.
No opinion on feat tax.
Seems like enough interest so I'll definitely run the game. Give me a few days to work through some details and I'll get a formal recruitment post up. (side question - is it okay to start another thread for recruitment, or should I just use this one?)
I'm liking the Background skills and I've actually played with the Feat tax rules back when it was just a blog post. Not sure about ABP, will look at those rules in detail. Probably not doing gestalts, trying not to do take on too much for first time at the rodeo.
I like trying to roll, but if stats are terrible, fall back on point buy. Will try to come up with something.
If you do make another thread for recruiting it's nice to put a link in this one. :)
I definitely think that rolled stats works best with some allowed rerolls and/or PB as a backup if you roll really bad. Just to be clear.
I'd lean toward creating a new recruitment thread. It's just a lot easier to refer back to the character creation rules and the like when it's in Post 1, not buried deep down a page. Admittedly that's nothing like an insurmountable issue, just a convenience thing.
I like rolling but it can be dicey. Points buy has grown on me.
Background skills are something I just put into all my games now.
The feat tax house rules are a bit much in some ways for me but I can live with them pretty happily.
Some of the alternate crafting rules in unchained make mundane crafting actually useful which in a game with a lot of downtime like a kingdom building one that is very useful.
Wow, a kingdom building / survival game in a pseudo-post apocalyptic undead ridden. Setting. Sounds amazing, and the perfect game for Mathias Gabriel, a demon cursed monster hunter of ragathiel.
I like the idea of rolled stats with point buy as a backup - call me nostalgic, but I enjoy the random factor. And I am a supporter of the feat tax rules as well. ABP I can take or leave, used well it helps restore the classic mystique of magic items while accounting for the numbers necessary to balance the d20 system.
A big question: alignment. I can see lawful evil characters working with a lot of others, out of a desire for order.
For example, Vincenzo Goya is a meritocrat who desires order. While also being an experienced killer and spy for hire.
Would he fit into this campaign?
Sounds interesting for sure.
And:
- Background skills are an excellent addition to the game;
- I've played a whole campaign with ABP.. and I liked it, as a whole. Was nice to not worry about headbands and belts. Special powers on weapons become more useful (and sought after). It changes the character of the game, bit generally makes it so magic items are cool and do nifty things instead of a necessity. Good either way, but support the idea.
- Rolled Stats v Buy: I'm point buy all the way. Keeping party members on an even footing is generally better for party cohesion.
- Feat Tax: Love the idea, don't fully love the implementation of the 'elephant in the room' - so I'm good either way... leaning yes.
I love kingdom building games. I would be interested for sure.
I'll be making another thread, but I'll be sure to note it here. Thanks for the feedback.
I'm on board regarding the potential disparity rolling vs point-buy. Want to make sure we don't end up with 4 20-point PCs and 2 60-point PCs. I'm pondering it.
Regarding alignment... I'm one of those people that doesn't really like the 9-box system. Would appreciate thoughts/comments on using another morality/belief/value system (and tweaking abilities, spells, etc to match)? I dont feel strongly enough to impose something like this, but if enough people are on board, I'd be open to it.
Regardless of the answer to that, I won't be a hard no on evil characters. Depends on PC in question (and the player).
Good to hear. I'm open to alternatives to the standard alignment system.
How about honour?
Or a colour wheel based on Magic: the Gathering?
I have always enjoyed the Rifts / Palladium RPG morality system.
It still has the ability to allow Paladins, but gives everyone else more of a moral code than a vague alignment statement. Also can tie your evil people into what would typically be "LE" versus "CE".