I dont think there is a caster that strictly follows a certain damage type. Its crippling overspecialization as they have various spells, and not just damage.
Kineticist is more Blaster. Its rather specialized. You can have SOME ulility, but youre picking it to be a ranged damage class, not because it can heal(though water kineticist can)
If you want straight all-day blasting power and at-will flight, then go with kineticist. If you want more varsatility and additional options then go with a spellcaster. Infusions are far less confusing than the myriad of spells out there.
A lightning kineticist would really want to focus on long distance sniping from airborn position, that really is the boon of Air. You can fly overhead and never have to worry about cover!
I choose both. I choose the Havocker Witch!
Not really.
I'd choose a caster. I'd play an Air Elemental School wizard or a sorcerer. I'd play a Djinni, Air, or Stormborn sorcerer.
Stormborn Sorcerer going full up on Bloodline Mutations can be pretty fun.
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I choose both. I choose the Havocker Witch!
Not really.
I'd choose a caster. I'd play an Air Elemental School wizard or a sorcerer. I'd play a Djinni, Air, or Stormborn sorcerer.
Havocker witch makes me sad on a fundamental level.
You can do well with an air kineticist, especially if you branch out into either aether or earth at 7th. Electric damage is pretty nice to deal, you get some nice infusions in things like magnetic and such, and of course 6th level flight to rule the skies. That's if you'd rathern ot think as much, as the quoted suggestions are better if you're looking for something more complex and versatile but with a hard resource cap (I consider burn a soft resource cap).
Oh, oh! How about a blue or bronze Draconic sorcerer? Then take the Blood Havoc Bloodline Mutation (found here) to increase your damage further. Those claws wouldn't be doing you much good anyway so its a good trade I think. With this you'd do +2 damage per die on a lot of your electricity spells. Blood Havoc with any other bloodline might be good too.
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The decision is all about how much you want to stick to your theme.
Go Kineticist want to be all lightning (and maybe some 'thunder' with the physical air blast- because electricity resistance). It can throw out your desired element all day every day from level 1.
Other casters do not have the slots early on to really pull that off. Pulling out a crossbow when you run out of spells just feels lame (either that, or use cantrips- there is an eletric cantrip... but that is 1d3, and never grows past that). Other casters are of course usually attractive because they aren't so themed- they can do other things.
Go kineticist if you want to be the greek god Zeus, flying over everyone and shooting lightning. Go regular 9 level caster if you want to be a more general kind of god that can also sometimes shoot lightning.
If you have a fast-paced campaign or are going to start at a moderate level, I recommend druid w/air domain. Not as strong as an animal companion, but levels 1-2 you can shoot lightning darts, and levels 3+ druid has some of the coolest (although not best) lightning spells. Gozreh's Trident, Aggressive Thundercloud, and Call Lightning (storm) are key points, and you can do this as an air elemental. Not the strongest choice, but it has a cool flavor about it.
Storm Druid is pretty damn boss. Two domains, spontaneous domain casting, great spell list, air elemental goodness.
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If it was me:
Crossblooded Sorcerer (draconic, orc)
VMC Wizard (admixture)
With the bloodline mutations The Guy With A Face mentioned.
You would have xd6+3+1/2 your level (for evocation) in damage. The feats you would be looking at are spell focus, greater spell focus, elemental focus and greater elemental focus.
Admixture means you can turn your evocation spells into electricity.
At level 15 take creative destruction to gain temporary hit points equal to the number of dice you do.
Consider spell specialization and mastery for your favorite blast spell as well as a trait to boost the caster level as well. A few times a day you'll be able to add your charisma modifier to the maximum dice for a spell, which could net you lots of temporary hit points and lots of damage.
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Draconic sorcerer is hands down better in terms of damage and versatility. The same goes for a wizard or druid with a one level dip of sorcerer.
And while it can technically run out of spells, in practice it has so many spells per day that it won't. For example, at level 6 (when you get Lightning Bolt) you have eighteen spells per day, which easily covers four combats. It only goes up from there.
I choose both. I choose the Havocker Witch!
Not really.
I'd choose a caster. I'd play an Air Elemental School wizard or a sorcerer. I'd play a Djinni, Air, or Stormborn sorcerer.
Havocker witch makes me sad on a fundamental level.
Are Havocker Witches really that bad?
Yes, they are,
They cannot efficiently mitigate burn, and cannot access the other abilities of kineticists. And you give up too much of the witch abilities.
Yes, they are,
They cannot efficiently mitigate burn, and cannot access to the other abilities of kineticists.
Well, it appears to get rid of the burn system in favor of the traditional spell system. It uses spells on par with the infusion used (ie- an infusion with a level 3 needs a level 3 witch spell to be sacrificed).
But generally, yes, it lacks many of the features that kineticists have. Durability, any kind of BAB (which means you HAVE to pick an energy blast, just so you hit touch AC), additional elements and composite blasts, the ability to go between melee and ranged without being glass, defense talents, the ability to do metamagics (Such as empower, which is essential for kineticist damage)
Heck, with the inability to mitigate burn, she HAS to sacrifice her limited resources to do anything of note. A level 5 earth user can entangle all day as long as they use infusion specialization and empower. The witch would always have to spend spells.
And, y'know what? I might have excused all this. If it was tagged onto something like the sorcerer. The witch spell list is built for being kind of crummy, since they have hexes they can shoot all day. Now, putting this on a sorcerer, who has a good spell list worth trading some of the kineticist stuff for... and it can be thematic and work with the class's structure, since the infused blasts are basically like spontaneous spells anyway. So remove the bloodline, and MAYBE 1 spell per level, and it would be fine, since the kineticist stuff would automatically be restricted just by the fact that it is on a no BAB class (again- energy only).
Crossblooded air elemental and orc sorcerer, this gets you the ability to turn every spell into electricity damage and a nice +1 damage/dice for all spells, take blood mutations at every opportunity gaining you another +1 damage/dice for any spell affected by spell focus or that is a bloodline spell, you will naturally be taking spell focus evocation, a free better version of intensify spell a few times a day and the ability to reduce spell and energy resistance of your enemies. This trades out your 1st, 3rd and 9th level bloodline powers, you'll probably want to go with the air elemental flight power at 15. Other things to grab are spell specialisation, varisian tattoo, empower/maximise/daze/quicken etc. metamagic, spell perfection, so the typical blaster stuff. I think this is the first time I've seen a good reason to take crossblooded as more than a 1 level sorcerer dip.
Leaving out any arguments of which CLASS is better, Lightning Kineticists suck pretty hard, because they don't get any good unique Infusions to use. You might as well be straight Fire or Cold if trying to figure out what element you want, because they'll do the exact same amount of damage, and they get a lot more goodies to play with.
So I'd suggest a caster focused on Air and Electricity spells, since you will get those, plus utility spells, maybe something more.
A Magus in particular might be very on theme, and not just for Shocking Grasp. Stuff like Force Hook Charge and Bladed Dash flavor very nicely as transmuting yourself into electricity and traveling quickly across the battlefield.
For a blaster speifically, maybe Elemental Master Arcanist. Eldritch Heritage or VMC Sorcerer for Draconic Bloodline? Gives you a bit more flexibility than Sorcerer, a bit more staying power than Wizard, and a decent backup single target blasting option for when you don't want to burn a spell.
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A Magus in particular might be very on theme, and not just for Shocking Grasp. Stuff like Force Hook Charge and Bladed Dash flavor very nicely as transmuting yourself into electricity and traveling quickly across the battlefield.
The Magus even has a spell that directly turns you into a lightning bolt (Storm Step), which transports you and damages anybody standing in between.
To build upon what others have said, one route is a human (with a bonus to charisma), and the bonus feat being "Racial Heritage: Kobold". Crossblooded Sorcerer, with the Orc and Blue Draconic bloodlines. Blood Havoc as your first level power. Favored Class bonus is the Kobolds' bonus damage on electric spells.
So, at level 6, if you wanted to conserve spells, you could cast Jolt (the 1d3 cantrip), and it'll do 1d3+5 (plus an extra one if, for some reason, you have Spell Focus: Transmutation. Dunno why Jolt isn't evocation...). More than the average crossbow bolt.
At level 6, your Lightning Bolt, if you have Spell Focus: Evocation and Varisian Tattoo, averages 48.5 damage.
Though, personally, I'd not do the whole kobold thing, I'd instead use the humans' favored class bonus to get an extra spell known each level (even more helpful if you're crossblooded). Over 20 levels, almost doubling your spells known is better than +10 damage on your spells.
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If it was me:
Crossblooded Sorcerer (draconic, orc)
VMC Wizard (admixture)With the bloodline mutations The Guy With A Face mentioned.
You would have xd6+3+1/2 your level (for evocation) in damage. The feats you would be looking at are spell focus, greater spell focus, elemental focus and greater elemental focus.
Admixture means you can turn your evocation spells into electricity.
At level 15 take creative destruction to gain temporary hit points equal to the number of dice you do.
Consider spell specialization and mastery for your favorite blast spell as well as a trait to boost the caster level as well. A few times a day you'll be able to add your charisma modifier to the maximum dice for a spell, which could net you lots of temporary hit points and lots of damage.
Blood Havoc isn't compatible with Crossblooded. Take a look at the text in the magic tactics toolbox book before blood havoc where it mentions you can't use it with an archetype that modifies the powers.
Which, really, just means you get all the upsides of Crossblooded without the garbage.
The Magus even has a spell that directly turns you into a lightning bolt (Storm Step), which transports you and damages anybody standing in between.
A Magus in particular might be very on theme, and not just for Shocking Grasp. Stuff like Force Hook Charge and Bladed Dash flavor very nicely as transmuting yourself into electricity and traveling quickly across the battlefield.
Nice! Didn't know that was a thing. Thought you had to wait until Ride the Lightning to make that happen.
Blood Havoc isn't compatible with Crossblooded. Take a look at the text in the magic tactics toolbox book before blood havoc where it mentions you can't use it with an archetype that modifies the powers.If it was me:
Crossblooded Sorcerer (draconic, orc)
VMC Wizard (admixture)With the bloodline mutations The Guy With A Face mentioned.
You would have xd6+3+1/2 your level (for evocation) in damage. The feats you would be looking at are spell focus, greater spell focus, elemental focus and greater elemental focus.
Admixture means you can turn your evocation spells into electricity.
At level 15 take creative destruction to gain temporary hit points equal to the number of dice you do.
Consider spell specialization and mastery for your favorite blast spell as well as a trait to boost the caster level as well. A few times a day you'll be able to add your charisma modifier to the maximum dice for a spell, which could net you lots of temporary hit points and lots of damage.
Actually that's not true. It says you can take them in place of a bloodline feat.
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Actually that's not true. It says you can take them in place of a bloodline feat.Blood Havoc isn't compatible with Crossblooded. Take a look at the text in the magic tactics toolbox book before blood havoc where it mentions you can't use it with an archetype that modifies the powers.If it was me:
Crossblooded Sorcerer (draconic, orc)
VMC Wizard (admixture)With the bloodline mutations The Guy With A Face mentioned.
You would have xd6+3+1/2 your level (for evocation) in damage. The feats you would be looking at are spell focus, greater spell focus, elemental focus and greater elemental focus.
Admixture means you can turn your evocation spells into electricity.
At level 15 take creative destruction to gain temporary hit points equal to the number of dice you do.
Consider spell specialization and mastery for your favorite blast spell as well as a trait to boost the caster level as well. A few times a day you'll be able to add your charisma modifier to the maximum dice for a spell, which could net you lots of temporary hit points and lots of damage.
"...and a bloodrager or sorcerer cannot swap a bloodline power that she has altered or replaced with an archetype for a bloodline mutation." <-- Text in the book, right before the blood havoc listing.
Crossblooded is an archetype that alters how you can choose bloodline powers (you can choose either of the ones in the two bloodlines) and is therefore not compatible with blood havoc.
Looking at it RAW, however, it looks like you might be able to take it in place of a bloodline bonus feat, even if you are crossblooded. I have no idea if that is RAI or not... So you are correct there.
To be clear I meant that saying it isn't compatible is what isn't correct. It is compatible because you can take it in place of a feat (much like a wizard can take a discovery in place of a feat.
That's why it says "Alternatively you can..."
It's not an archetype it's an option that you can take in the place of a feat.
Notice Bloodline Mutations are not labeled as archetypes, it just says you can't take one in the place of a power altered by an archetype.
I'm interested in making a blaster focused on electrical damage and am torn between a traditional blaster caster and an air kineticist focused on the electrical side of the air element.
Warlock Vigilante gives you a taste of both options.
I'm interested in making a blaster focused on electrical damage and am torn between a traditional blaster caster and an air kineticist focused on the electrical side of the air element.
I was wondering what everyones thoughts were on which is the better blaster. My preference leans towards a kineticist because I don't like the idea of potentially running out of spells, but a caster seems easier in that you don't have to worry about collecting various infusions to get the various shapes you want; just select the right shaped spells and you're good.
This is a joke, right?
Kineticists are great because they are Constitution-based and Dexterity-based (for their attack rolls, if any), so they can build some AC and have quite a few hit points before they go down. Unfortunately, they're still only 3/4 BAB, despite rolling for Touch AC, and their range isn't really all that great without investment or specialization in certain mannerisms.
Quite frankly, their defensive benefits are the only things going for them. They lack quadratic versatility and scaling, and they aren't capable of Area of Effect damage; at least, nowhere near as powerful or devastating as a spellcaster. Plus, they are also equally as effective as any Kineticist, and have more self-buffs they can apply themselves to become absolutely brutal and devastating.
Also, if you're wanting the strongest thing, Full 9-level Spellcasters are the most powerful thing in the game. Ask anyone. Nothing short of GM FIAT or the player's knowledgable limits can stop them.
In addition, spell slots are only an issue if you either A. can't prepare them properly, or B. your spell of choice (AKA your go-to blast spell) isn't strong enough in comparison to how much you would value your spell slots; in which case, that's a resource optimization issue that can be easily fixed with proper building.
I'm in the middle of finishing a Master Blaster Caster guide (or at least, bringing it to a 1.0 stage), and when I'm finished, I'll PM you a link so you can browse through it.
For the record, there are two versions of the build, one for Single-Target (your typical Kineticist build would behave this way), and one for Area-of-Effect (great for destroying armies upon armies of mooks, and still fairly effective for stronger enemies).
In short, the results of the optimization guide is that the first build can very easily kill a Tarrasque, a creature with ~550 hit points on average, with a single round of spellcasts. The second one can very easily annihilate any CR-equivalent foe on the same time table, to any creature within the areas designated by your spellcasts.
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I'm interested in making a blaster focused on electrical damage and am torn between a traditional blaster caster and an air kineticist focused on the electrical side of the air element.
I was wondering what everyones thoughts were on which is the better blaster. My preference leans towards a kineticist because I don't like the idea of potentially running out of spells, but a caster seems easier in that you don't have to worry about collecting various infusions to get the various shapes you want; just select the right shaped spells and you're good.
I'm not a fan of the Occult so I can not say the Pros or Cons of Kineticist.
But when it comes to Casters then I can give some advice on which Caster classes. I tend to play conservative casters most the time and hardly find myself out of spells or options for the day beyond the early levels. But here is some of your top caster Choices.
Choice 1:
Admixture Wizard 5/Cross-Blooded Orc/Draconic Bloodlines 1/Wizard rest is one of the better builds out there. The ability to on the fly change elements is amazing as you will run into immunities on a regular. The added +2 damage per Dice for electric spells and +1 Damage per dice on all other damaging spells is highly worth it. Once you start tagging on intensified and Empowered meta magics you will be doing lots of damage. Dazing Spell will offer lots of crowd control while still killing enemies.
Choice 2:
Storm Druid- Not as much raw damage as above but plenty of Tricks in its bag. Has a lot of the better Lightning spells IMHO. Call Lightning and Call Lightning Storm are wonderful when you hook a Dazing Spell on them. Because of the long duration of the Call Lightning Spell you get more than just 1 big blast and done. You can use call Lightning for a few fights. This will help you from running out of spells since that seems to be a main concern from the Original Post. There are other nasty tricks on their List as well. For 3k you can buy a lesser Rod of Rime and Flurry of Snowball for a 30ft Cone with NO SAVE Entangled Condition as a 2nd level spell. I love this choice for Fighting Casters...First they have to save against damage to keep the spell and then fight the Entangled condition to cast the spell. Its pretty rough...you could also do it with a simple Snowball.
Choice 3:
Witch- Not the best choice for Raw blasting power compared to Choice 1 or 2...But they do get Electric spells. The Hexes give you something to do all day long when your not blasting or if you tap out on your spell casting. Since you are concerned about running out of spells the witch is a good fall back. Evil Eye or Ill Omen can also help the target fail it's save more taking full damage more regularly.
Something worth note for lightning-based casters is that they are best in melee-heavy parties. Unlike fire, many lighting spells have more controlled (but smaller) areas. Lightning Bolt is a line you can shoot between frontliners, aggressive thundercloud can fly above the melee affecting large creatures, call lighting is a vertical bolt that hits 1 square, etc. They take longer to take out crowds, but are less likely to grill friends.
I would start fights with aggressive thundercloud and greater, possibly tacking dazing onto the former at high levels. That way you can use move actions to do damage, as well as standard action spells and maybe a quicken or two. Also, most blaster classes have the spell, so it works with whichever theme of caster you might pick.
Finally, don't put all your eggs in one basket. Druids get spontaneous nature's ally when lighting immunity pops up, sorcerers can take some non-blast spells and spontaneously cast them, but I would make sure to pick up some recreational cold spells and buffs on a wizard/witch. Or be a kineticist with another blast type.
Something worth note for lightning-based casters is that they are best in melee-heavy parties. Unlike fire, many lighting spells have more controlled (but smaller) areas. Lightning Bolt is a line you can shoot between frontliners, aggressive thundercloud can fly above the melee affecting large creatures, call lighting is a vertical bolt that hits 1 square, etc. They take longer to take out crowds, but are less likely to grill friends.
I would start fights with aggressive thundercloud and greater, possibly tacking dazing onto the former at high levels. That way you can use move actions to do damage, as well as standard action spells and maybe a quicken or two. Also, most blaster classes have the spell, so it works with whichever theme of caster you might pick.
Finally, don't put all your eggs in one basket. Druids get spontaneous nature's ally when lighting immunity pops up, sorcerers can take some non-blast spells and spontaneously cast them, but I would make sure to pick up some recreational cold spells and buffs on a wizard/witch. Or be a kineticist with another blast type.
Line effects aren't particularly worthwhile, and serve only to get one or two enemies at a time. Aggressive Thundercloud is an all-or-nothing spell. Although with optimized save DCs, it's great, but doesn't scale particularly well, and only serves as a stepping stone to higher level spells (with higher save DCs).
In addition, if you're worried about friendly fire, there are several ways to address it. For starters, proper spell placement (and ally positioning). There's also Communal Resist Energy to cut back on collateral damage, and there is the Selective Spell metamagic (which only adds +1 to the spell level) if you're wanting to eliminate friendly fire entirely. For Area-of-Effect Blasters, this Metamagic feat is very convenient to have, and if optimized, only serves as a minor inconvenience to your blasting.
Druid Summoning is a garbage means of optimization, (even if it's one of the best things a Druid can do for their allies,) and if you're wanting to specialize in summoning creatures, Druids aren't the way to go; Summon Monster is infinitely better, because it has the larger array and versatility of creatures, and has better tools to synergize with. In addition, this is about making a Blaster, not a Summoner; Druids suck at blasting. Flame Strike at 4th level is perhaps the only "good" blast spell they get, if only because they get it before everyone else, but its area is small, its damage is weak, and can be easily resisted and reduced to as little as 1/4 damage on a standard successful saving throw. Call Lightning damages and scales worth a crap, and requires Standard Actions each round just to use the spell, and any improved versions don't get any better. There are better uses of 3rd level spells and Standard Actions, and Call Lightning isn't it.
Sorcerers are constant spontaneous spellcasters, and don't spontaneously spellcast the way you suggest, though certain bloodlines (AKA Orc Bloodline) offer some very powerful goodies for blasting. Unfortunately, it's hard to obtain them without some sort of extreme commitment. Wizards get bonus feats, have the best spell progression (and spell list), are the most MAD, and have the power to be relevant in most every combat with the proper school selection (AKA Admixture), and not have to memorize a bunch of different spells because people are stupid. They're also under the Batman paradigm, where they are only as effective as the player's preparedness and foresight, which may or may not be good.
You want a good spellcasting blaster? Arcanist. All the way. More specifically, the Blood Arcanist. They get the good spell list, an acceptable progression, the ability to enhance their spellcasts, and have the best of both classes; they can get the important Bloodline goodies from the Sorcerer, as well as the versatility of the Admixture school from the Wizard. They have the spontaneity of the Sorcerer (in which spells they memorize can be cast over and over) with the preparedness of the Wizard (in which they can memorize a set amount of spells for each spell level). They can also buff their spell power to a level that no Wizard or Sorcerer can even match, and even without them, is still as strong as any Sorcerer or Wizard of the same nature.
Line effects aren't particularly worthwhile, and serve only to get one or two enemies at a time. Aggressive Thundercloud is an all-or-nothing spell. Although with optimized save DCs, it's great, but doesn't scale particularly well, and only serves as a stepping stone to higher level spells (with higher save DCs).Agreed, but considering a fair number of games stop at levels 7-10, stepping stone spells aren't that bad. Aggressive Thundercloud costs very little for what it does. It was the signature spell for 2 separate blasters of mine (one ended at level 7, the oher is at 10 and waiting to progress). And considering a large number of fights tend to be against a few high-level creatures rather than a horde of mooks, 1-2 might be most of the enemy.
In addition, if you're worried about friendly fire, there are several ways to address it. For starters, proper spell placement (and ally positioning). There's also Communal Resist Energy to cut back on collateral damage, and there is the Selective Spell metamagic (which only adds +1 to the spell level) if you're wanting to eliminate friendly fire entirely. For Area-of-Effect Blasters, this Metamagic feat is very convenient to have, and if optimized, only serves as a minor inconvenience to your blasting.Allies aren't always willing to cooperate with you, and those unwilling usually aren't the types to take it well when you kill them with the monster because they weren't cooperating. This can avoid that issue. Communal Resist Energy is also a 3rd level spell slot. Which you could instead use for another lightningbolt rather than concerning yourself with hitting allies. Selective spell takes 10 levels to be an option (or a relatively expensive rod which keeps you from soending that money on other good rods like persistent, dazing, etc)
Druid Summoning is a garbage means of optimization, (even if it's one of the best things a Druid can do for their allies,) and if you're wanting to specialize in summoning creatures, Druids aren't the way to go; Summon Monster is infinitely better, because it has the larger array and versatility of creatures, and has better tools to synergize with. In addition, this is about making a Blaster, not a Summoner; Druids suck at blasting. Flame Strike at 4th level is perhaps the only "good" blast spell they get, if only because they get it before everyone else, but its area is small, its damage is weak, and can be easily resisted and reduced to as little as 1/4 damage on a standard successful saving throw. Call Lightning damages and scales worth a crap, and requires Standard Actions each round just to use the spell, and any improved versions don't get any better. There are better uses of 3rd level spells and Standard Actions, and Call Lightning isn't it.Druids don't suck at blasting. Fighters suck at blasting. Druids are not as good as sorcerers or wizards or arcanist, but they do have some merit as blasters. Summoning is an option. Druids may be garbage summoners, but since they never need to prepare summons it can be a backup for when your foe has strong reflex saves and high resistances. Call Lightning isn't fantastic per blast, but if you tack a nice effect on it (dazing) or need to save spell slots it isn't garbage. Its great because you get to try again if they make the save. Its one of a few blasts which lasts an entire fight. Although, it probably isn't as good as aggressive thundercloud.
Sorcerers are constant spontaneous spellcasters, and don't spontaneously spellcast the way you suggest, though certain bloodlines (AKA Orc Bloodline) offer some very powerful goodies for blasting.I probably worded my saying above this poorly, I meant that sorcerers are spontaneous casters. And so its easy to have one or two non-blasting spells because blasting isn't always a good choice, even for specialists.
Wizards get bonus feats, have the best spell progression (and spell list), are the most MAD, and have the power to be relevant in most every combat with the proper school selection (AKA Admixture), and not have to memorize a bunch of different spells because people are stupid. They're also under the Batman paradigm, where they are only as effective as the player's preparedness and foresight, which may or may not be good.
Do you mean SAD? I don't see how they are any more MAD than a sorcerer. They don't need "a bunch" of different spell slots, but if you face something incredibly resistant to blasts (high SR, strong reflex saves, lots of resistances, etc) then having at least one or two other strong options is better than not having them once you get a lot of spells on you.
As for the rest, Blood Arcanist, or the blood havoc orc/draconic VMC admixturist, is probably the absolute strongest.
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2) Damage for a spell is better (1d6/level) than a Kineticist (1d6+1d6/2 levels past 1) until Kineticist gets a composite blast (2d6+2d6/2 levels past 1, or 1d6+1d6/level essentially). And then, the Kineticist has to worry about Burn (or gathering power for a round, which is detrimental to damage output).
If you're looking at staying power, it is clear that any spellcaster has way more spells per day than a kinny has burn to spend.
Assuming standard amount of encounters per day (or even 50% more than that), a moderate-level spellcasters can cast a spell each round of combat and never run out.
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A kineticist doesn't need to spend burn unless he is going nova. Between infusion specialization, gather power, and internal buffer, you only need to use enough burn to max elemental overflow, and then you blast all day.
Yes, and the sorcerer or wizard also blasts all day (while having more utility and a better nova). That's the point.
A kineticist doesn't need to spend burn unless he is going nova. Between infusion specialization, gather power, and internal buffer, you only need to use enough burn to max elemental overflow, and then you blast all day.
A decently leveled wizard can blast every fight and can nova harder, lets assume the average 4 encounter day (this is what the game is balanced around after all) a wizard with 16-23 int can cast a fireball every fight at level 8, 6 if his int is higher, and while sure he probably wants to cast some other spells, he can also chuck out scorching ray or burning arc, maybe even a burning hands, not to mention the other ways he contributes with battlefield control and such. The sorcerer with at least 16 cha can pull it off from the second he gets his 3rd level spells. Now you might be thinking that the kineticist can chuck a blast every turn, but the wizard/sorcerer is hitting everything in a 20ft radius, in fact almost every blast in the game hits multiple targets, so our caster only needs one, and he soon gets more, and he gets metamagic, likely has options for using other elements when you fight that elemental/devil etc.. Oh and the caster is also one of those guys who can break the game with a few high level spells (and while metamagic means he might use high level slots blasting spells worth using are mostly low level so even the sorcerer can pick up whatever he wants).
Kineticists are nice if you want every action you take to be an elemental themed attack, but a blasting caster can certainly match or outdo them when it comes to killing everything in sight as fast as possible.
You really only need fireball and metamagic for blasting, you can spend the rest of your slots on utility, maybe at early levels you might want some other damage, oh and a properly built blaster should kill most things within a 20ft radius in 1-3 spells.
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As for Wizards lasting all day like a Kineticist, I think it's been fairly well pointed out that they can only keep up at mid-late level, and even then, only if they never have a long day.
Not at all. A realistic answer is level SIX, not some "mid-late" handwaving, to not run out of spells on a long day.
The math isn't hard. Consider four combats per day, and average of four rounds per combat. That means a wizard requires sixteen spells, which is easily doable at level six (8 spells baseline, +3 for specialization, +4 for 20 intelligence, +1 from a pearl of power). That's not counting cantrips, of course. A sorcerer, druid, or Magus can also do it at level six; a bard can do it at level eight.
All of these spells can be blasting (which will outdamage the kinny's default attack) or they can be mix-and-matched with utility or buffs or crowd control (which the kinny is pretty bad at).
If you insist on having longer days than this, there's wands and scrolls, or more pearls of power, or spells with a recurring effect (such as Flaming Sphere).
Seriously, a decently-played spellcaster doesn't run out of spells.
And if you're a good blaster, you don't have 4 rounds of combat. I have a low level blaster now, He uses 1-2 spells a combat, because everything dies in 1 spell.
I like at Kineticist. Touch attack rolls at will with medium BAB.
Thanks for all of the input everyone. It looks like blaster casters are becoming more and more possible as more options are released; I remember just a few years ago, if I asked about a blaster, I would have been told to be a "God Wizard" or to not bother with being a spellcaster at all.
I'm still leaning toward a Kineticist, but I'm starting to be swayed for a couple of reasons:
1) A spellcaster would have more options for blasting, from a lowly Jolt as a backup, all the way up to the highest level spell, using metamagic to push limits of damage. Kineticist tries to replicate this with infusions, but not all infusions are always available for the blasts I'm interested in.
2) Damage for a spell is better (1d6/level) than a Kineticist (1d6+1d6/2 levels past 1) until Kineticist gets a composite blast (2d6+2d6/2 levels past 1, or 1d6+1d6/level essentially). And then, the Kineticist has to worry about Burn (or gathering power for a round, which is detrimental to damage output).
If you're playing Core only, blasters suck because they don't have the tools needed to deal with their flaws to make them good. The later books have content that deal with their flaws, and when you use those to your advantage, blaster casters become extremely powerful, and still be (almost) as versatile as any God Wizard.
There's also the matter of Quickened spells. As far as I know, Kinetic Blasts can only be done 1/round, whereas spells can be cast as much as 2/round (or 3/round if you use some item gimmicks, like Spellstoring Weapons, but that's for Magi and the like).
Not to mention Kineticists have only limited utility, depending on which element they focus on, whereas other Full Spellcasters have all of the utility you could possibly need, and some utility that cannot be replicated anywhere. Of course, Divine spell lists suck for blasting, and even then certain Arcane spell lists (i.e. Witch) still suck eggs.
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The length of the fighting day is something to expect huge table variation at. I've been in groups where 6-8 encounters per day was more typical, with a few days going much higher. Those are the days where you are glad for a kineticist or a spherecaster. If you're going to be a regular caster there, you need to focus on spells that last all fight long.
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There's also the matter of Quickened spells. As far as I know, Kinetic Blasts can only be done 1/round, whereas spells can be cast as much as 2/round (or 3/round if you use some item gimmicks, like Spellstoring Weapons, but that's for Magi and the like).
Not to mention Kineticists have only limited utility, depending on which element they focus on, whereas other Full Spellcasters have all of the utility you could possibly need, and some utility that cannot be replicated anywhere. Of course, Divine spell lists suck for blasting, and even then certain Arcane spell lists (i.e. Witch) still suck eggs.
You can make full attacks with kinetic blade/whip which serves the same function, not to mention quicken blast and twin blast metakinesis, although those tend to eat a lot of burn.
As for utility, they don't have anywhere near the breadth utility of full casters, but they have a lot more depth in the utility they have. An air kineticist can be flying all day, haste the party all day, breathe anywhere, teleport 900 feet at will, and gust of wind all day. A geo has at will earthglide. A telekinetic can be invisible all day, lift anything, and move anything.
They will never match the breadth of utility a caster can bring. But they can do some very cool things that are difficult for caster to do and they can do those things all day.
I think Philo Pharynx's advice is something to think about greatly.
How long is your adventuring day?
I have played a wizard with 2-3 encounters a day and I could sling effective spells all the time. Another time I played one in a group where it was 6-7 encounters and my effectiveness in the later fights was limited.
Now I have some experience with a sphere caster in RotRL and my group of a Bloodrager, Slayer, Soulweaver, and Witch(me) managed to clear from the Nettlemaze to Nualia without a stop. Not sure how many encounters we had, but I lost track after 10.
Casters
Pros:
More flexibility
More utility
Full arcane caster
Cons:
Can run out of spells
Sacrifices blasting slots for utility [wizard]
Squishy if hit
Low level blasting spells lose scaling
Kineticists
Pros:
Can literally blast all day
Can easily switch hit with minimal investment
More survivability
Low level infusions become freebies as you gain levels
Cons:
Not as much utility
Have to focus on 1 or 2 elements until super late game
A lot of upkeep (burn, elemental overflow, NLD)