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Very well, I shall now offer my wisdom on the topic, hoping to redirect the randomness that becomes entropy. You protean shall not win!
With that say, in order to answer the question is needed to understand.
1) What are eidolon in the specific campaigns, and if specific eidolon can be different from the "general" eidolons.
2) What is sex (an act devolve to physical/intellectual leasure and pleasure or a biological process that leads to fecondation and the creation of another live)?
3) what is "can". We intend "can this action possibly be performed" or "should this action possibly be performed", and also "do the subject of the action perform the action knowingly"?.
Now, the problem is each of this points cannot be overlooked to gain a proper answer.
I'll try with one that may reflect what a got from my readings.
1) Eidolons are "intellects" whose shape is determinated by summoners that exist in this reality throught a pact. therefore, they have shape following the summoner desires, not looking at why or because of what certain summoners have them in certain shapes. Therefore, they potencially can have form that can experience sex in animal-like, android like or human-like ways.
2) Eidolon, if able to perform sex, "can" perfom sex. the question is to understand what degree of freedom there is outside combat rules. Here we enter in the moral ground of the topic that was in truth already covered by another post and shall not be adressed.
3) Eidolons may or may not able to impregnate other beings or being impregnate if their nature is defined in such way. A question could be what the fruit of such union could be, and how will affected by the parents nature and bond. If in your campaign eidolons are just summoned creatures, in depends by the degree of similarity with the summoner, length of presence on the material plane and other situations.
In my campaigns, eidolons are one kind beings that come to the world through a magical practical process called "eidolosis", and so could be everything. Also, if an eidolon is given an human body, is needed an extreme knowledge of his anatomy to have it work in that way. It this knowledge is not possessed by the summoner, the eidolon is basically a doll with no inside anatomy that would allow to reproduction and/or possibility to experience pleasure.
If an eidolon exist with the physical capacities provided to experience pleasure, then it can have sex. If an eidolon is purposely sculpted to be able to impregnate or be impregnated, then it can bear progeny from the summoner, if the environment allows a proper development of the progeny. Such progenies resent of both parents nature (as such, an ipotetical drow summoner/six armed snake eidolon would get a many armed hybrid child).
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They were Aeons in FFX. Eidolons were in FFIV though, and as I recall Rydia created them from her own mind, not simply received them from a place.
Odd, it seemed to share far more in common with Final Fantasy summoning like from FFX. Y'know, the one where Yuna calls out a big beastie to fight the BBEG for a bit, it gets smacked down, she calls another big beastie, etc. I think they might have even been called Eidolons in that (it's been a while since I played).Besides, pokemon trainers 6 different pokemon for different purposes. Everyone knows that! :P
Final Fantasy XIII every character is a Synethesist Summmoner... with Eidolons!
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Okay, I lurked for awhile, but now that I've finished my popcorn here are my two cents, for what they are worth.
What about clothes? Can Eidolons wear clothes? That kind of depends on what you consider when they cannot wear armor. If they can wear clothes, well then when you summon them they are butt naked. Better keep a robe with you to hand to your eidolon summoned in combat unless you dont' mind the enemies and other players knowing you are a perverted gnome with a fetish for hot buxom redheaded humans and seriously why is she always naked? Seriously, you're such a pervert!
Or, they do have clothes when you summon them, at which point if the clothes are anything like the rules for armor (as in you can define that their natural armor looks like full plate, but that full plate cannot be removed, as it's a part of them) then the clothes can't removed... so then there is two possibilities... Either they can't have sex cause they're wearing clothes that don't allow such things... or you are a serious pervert (which really, I think this whole thread shows that we are all perverts (yes, me too) for thinking about this) and have your hot buxom redheaded human always ready because she's wearing a miniskirt and no underwear.
Either way, this really is a case of "How perverted are you and your GM? If you are both perverted, sure."
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Who has a thing for buxom redheads in miniskirts, again? :)
The Summoner would routinely fling himself into danger, and the Eidolon would protect him, heal him with Life Link, and chastise him for his recklessness. They had an fantastically dysfunctional relationship.
How could that work? Life Link lets the Sommoner take damage for the Eidolon. Life Bond is the ability that lets the Eidolon take damage for the Summoner -- but it is not available until a relatively high level.
I personally don't think that Eidolons should be barred from wearing armour. It makes no sense to me. Share the armour/robe slot sure, but being unable to wear armour at all? Seems silly.
Yay! New house-rule!
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For Eidolon clothing, I would generally have them wearing whatever they were wearing when they were last dismissed or banished. Most Eidolons are sufficiently non-humanoid in appearance that it wouldn't matter, but I assume that the Eidolons who are the subject of this thread are not of that sort.
At low levels, since it takes a minute-long ritual to summon an Eidolon anyway, there is a good chance you can summon the Eidolon in privacy and not expose the party to something they might prefer not to see.
In my campaign, this only became a big deal when my Summoner retrained into the Evolutionist archetype. The mundane clothing worn by the Eidolon obviously would not resize with her, so she got a lot of use out of that single rank she put in Craft (Clothing). A Rod of Splendor helped tremendously in that regard.
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No, Rydia's summons really were actual creatures - she actually had to go meet them before she could summon them in the first place!
They even had their own kingdom down in the depths of the world.
Yeah, the Day Outside, Year Inside realm. There were some unusual cases involved in that game too, like one person becoming an Eidolon after death. Which made the Whytkin/"eidolon larva" thing introduced in the DS remake even less sensical. (I love almost everything else about that remake though)
There was one possible case that might have been close to what Rynjin WS thinking of, with the connection between Rydia's mother and her Eidolon, but I figured that was more of a bonded creature situation.
The Eidolons autonomy becomes more of a plot point in The After Years too.(which needs a Steam release already, SquareEnix)
(guess it's pretty obvious which FF is my favorite)
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...
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... Tactics, right? I'm pretty sure it's FFTactics.
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For Eidolon clothing, I would generally have them wearing whatever they were wearing when they were last dismissed or banished. Most Eidolons are sufficiently non-humanoid in appearance that it wouldn't matter, but I assume that the Eidolons who are the subject of this thread are not of that sort.
At low levels, since it takes a minute-long ritual to summon an Eidolon anyway, there is a good chance you can summon the Eidolon in privacy and not expose the party to something they might prefer not to see.
In my campaign, this only became a big deal when my Summoner retrained into the Evolutionist archetype. The mundane clothing worn by the Eidolon obviously would not resize with her, so she got a lot of use out of that single rank she put in Craft (Clothing). A Rod of Splendor helped tremendously in that regard.
This has me imagining Eidolons with their "clothing" being integrated as part of their bodies now. Retractable layers of leaves(or leaves that die, fall away, and regrow at will). Chitin and gossamer dresses. Flexible membranes used for flight or swimming draped about oneself.
You could get really fey or alien looking beings out of that.
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... Tactics, right? I'm pretty sure it's FFTactics.
As much as I like tactics, the one that introduced young!me to paladins and OT3's while being pumped full of redemption themes will always be the closest to my heart, even if I can recognize that the other SNES entries had more solid gameplay or writing. It's the one that's influenced me most.
Also, whaleboats and moon wizards.
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As much as I like tactics, the one that introduced young!me to paladins and OT3's while being pumped full of redemption themes will always be the closest to my heart, even if I can recognize that the other SNES entries had more solid gameplay or writing. It's the one that's influenced me most.
Also, whaleboats and moon wizards.
I knew I was right! Man, I love those whaleboats and moonwizards in Tactics!
#whynoI'mnotindenialwhydoyouask
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Can we get back to the topic of summoners schtuping their eidolons, PLEASE?
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I sometimes describe NPCs as looking like actors. For instance, wererat Rogue "Pete the Rat" (name shamelessly borrowed from Infocom) looked like Steve Buscemi. Regarding redhead eidolons, if you describe your eidolon as looking just like Bianca Beauchamp people will probably guess where your mind is at without further RP. I wonder whether latex could count as an eidolon's natural armor. Maybe I should go do some research...
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Most Eidolons are sufficiently non-humanoid in appearance that it wouldn't matter, but I assume that the Eidolons who are the subject of this thread are not of that sort.
Oh, you do? How adorable. :)
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I sometimes describe NPCs as looking like actors. For instance, wererat Rogue "Pete the Rat" (name shamelessly borrowed from Infocom) looked like Steve Buscemi. Regarding redhead eidolons, if you describe your eidolon as looking just like Bianca Beauchamp people will probably guess where your mind is at without further RP. I wonder whether latex could count as an eidolon's natural armor. Maybe I should go do some research...
Yep, I do that although not so much famous people (though some, like the werecheetah I played in a Werewolf game I had look like Adrian Slade from I Kissed A Vampire) like Zelda here looks like an internet model that I know (and wonderfully the avatar is pretty spot on too!) and so is her mother (though I don't know that model). Then her mother's best friend is a redhead Czech porn star LOL so it's funny you mentioning Bianca Beauchamp (though it's not her) and her ex-boyfriend is a fashion model. I Google with SafeSearch off and even if I have to just do head avatars, that's cool with me. :P
As to the topic, I know I was mostly joking about the clothes thing, but it is something to consider because by the RAW it would suggest that they look like they look and don't wear clothes, but if it actually did come up in my games, when I was done laughing I'd probably say their clothes vanish when they do and they are wearing whatever they were last wearing when they return, unless as part of the minute ritual you redefine the clothes. Cause really if freely letting a summoner choose a red shirt instead of a blue one is OP, you've got more serious issues to contend with.
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Bianca Beauchamp
Okay, I get the implication, and I'm going to show off my ignorance, but... who?
The Summoner would routinely fling himself into danger, and the Eidolon would protect him, heal him with Life Link, and chastise him for his recklessness. They had an fantastically dysfunctional relationship.How could that work? Life Link lets the Sommoner take damage for the Eidolon. Life Bond is the ability that lets the Eidolon take damage for the Summoner -- but it is not available until a relatively high level.
Honestly I don't know. Wasn't my character.
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I think I was part of the first conversation on this topic, when I explained on a PFS thread that my Eidolon would not be grouped with animal companions because she was my character's wife. I was so happy about my cool innovative idea.
Then I explained that they were a nice aristocratic couple who joined PFS because they need to pay tuition for their kids aristocratic Taldan education.
Then I saw someone's eyes pop out of their skull and skin melt ala Raiders of the Lost Ark, through the internet.
God was I naive.
And I'm saving my last aasimar certifcation for one of their kids, who will show up once these two are retired.
I dare say, if I can do this in PFS, you can do it anywhere.
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Bianca BeauchampOkay, I get the implication, and I'm going to show off my ignorance, but... who?
She's a very buxom red haired porn star.
I think I was part of the first conversation on this topic, when I explained on a PFS thread that my Eidolon would not be grouped with animal companions because she was my character's wife. I was so happy about my cool innovative idea.
Then I explained that they were a nice aristocratic couple who joined PFS because they need to pay tuition for their kids aristocratic Taldan education.
Then I saw someone's eyes pop out of their skull and skin melt ala Raiders of the Lost Ark, through the internet.
God was I naive.
And I'm saving my last aasimar certifcation for one of their kids, who will show up once these two are retired.
I dare say, if I can do this in PFS, you can do it anywhere.
And there we have it, Kerney kinda wins the thread by quoting PFS experience. If it's allowed in PFS, that pretty much is as much of a thumbs up from Paizo themselves as you're going to get. :D
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Well, hell. Feels like this thread died.
She's a very buxom red haired porn star.Bianca BeauchampOkay, I get the implication, and I'm going to show off my ignorance, but... who?
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... makes sense that I had no idea who she was, then!
(Also, thanks!)
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It's the circle of life, OP...
*David Attenborough voice on*
As the thread dies, many of its once inhabitants flock to the endless fields of the Pathfinder Society to continue it's purpose. The old thread's carcass, seemingly forgotten, is savoured in the minds of many summoners and their companions. In due time, the thread's sacrifice and its allowance of procreation with planar beings, would have resulted in many little nightmares, crawling in the heads of their co-players and GMs.
*David Attenborough out*
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It seems like it ought to take an evolution point. Two for really good sex.There's already a Mount evolution for one point
I figured that doing the deed with a female serpentine eidolon required one of the following:
1) The Eidolon gaining a single pair of legs to enable mating with a humanoid, or
2) The Summoner assuming a compatible form (so that capstone "Twin Eidolon" provides "benefits" outside of combat).
A male eidolon needs nothing more than at least one Tentacle evolution.
Tribbles are in fact eidolon eggs, so yes.
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Well, hell. Feels like this thread died.
"You think this is over, Broadhand? No! It's not over... It goes on..."
I don't see any reason why a similar body shape would be required.
A humanoid could certainly mate with a serpentine creature, you just need to think creatively about the position.
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The suggestion of using the Tentacle evolution in creative ways reminds me of some anime an old housemate used to watch. It also reminds me of using Tentacle to give a PC's toad-like eidolon a tongue attack with Reach and Grab. More recently another PC took the Tentacle discovery to give himself a prehensile devil tail. Tentacles have all sorts of uses.
Regarding American Pie, I could imagine somebody having a redheaded eidolon who "looks like a girl from band camp". I could also imagine somebody having a serpentine eidolon named Green Snake who uses a Greater Hat of Disguise to look like Maggie Cheung Man Yuk. Unlike Ms. Beauchamp, Ms. Cheung should be fairly safe to look up on the Internet, and I highly recommend the Green Snake film (which is fantasy not porno though if you'd prefer a familiar instead of an eidolon there is another movie where Diana Pang plays a horny shapeshifting rabbit - unfortunately it is not a very good movie though it does have the always entertaining Elvis Tsui). I heard about all this and Ms. Beauchamp "from a friend" of course...
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Just for general knowledge, are the other two the Caster-Martial disparity and Roll vs Roleplaying?Whoops. S%$*. I think we're in critical danger of invoking three of the five-or-so Neverending Discussions:
- Fooling around with the eidolon
- Succubus in a grapple
And now,
- PaladinsI think the Caster-Martial disparity and the rogue thing both fit into a "someone starts a thread arguing the generally accepted point that some classes are weaker than others" category.
There's also the Tyrannical GMs versus the Entitled Players arguments, which can take many forms.
Sorry I'm late. I blame the entitled players, with their "WBL" and their "survival" and their "PC classes". Whiners. That said, this thread does give me some ideas for new punishments.
As for the topic at hand (so to speak), this is why I never got an eidolon. They seem so... clingy. Besides, it takes all the fun out of breaking them to your will. I much prefer cohorts...
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No, Rydia's summons really were actual creatures - she actually had to go meet them before she could summon them in the first place!
They even had their own kingdom down in the depths of the world.
Yeah, the Day Outside, Year Inside realm. There were some unusual cases involved in that game too, like one person becoming an Eidolon after death. Which made the Whytkin/"eidolon larva" thing introduced in the DS remake even less sensical. (I love almost everything else about that remake though)
There was one possible case that might have been close to what Rynjin WS thinking of, with the connection between Rydia's mother and her Eidolon, but I figured that was more of a bonded creature situation.
The Eidolons autonomy becomes more of a plot point in The After Years too.(which needs a Steam release already, SquareEnix)
(guess it's pretty obvious which FF is my favorite)
But... Celes.
:(
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No, Rydia's summons really were actual creatures - she actually had to go meet them before she could summon them in the first place!
They even had their own kingdom down in the depths of the world.
Yeah, the Day Outside, Year Inside realm. There were some unusual cases involved in that game too, like one person becoming an Eidolon after death. Which made the Whytkin/"eidolon larva" thing introduced in the DS remake even less sensical. (I love almost everything else about that remake though)
There was one possible case that might have been close to what Rynjin WS thinking of, with the connection between Rydia's mother and her Eidolon, but I figured that was more of a bonded creature situation.
The Eidolons autonomy becomes more of a plot point in The After Years too.(which needs a Steam release already, SquareEnix)
(guess it's pretty obvious which FF is my favorite)
But... Celes.
:(
I still cry during the Opera. You're not alone.
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I figured that doing the deed with a female serpentine eidolon required one of the following:
1) The Eidolon gaining a single pair of legs to enable mating with a humanoid, or
2) The Summoner assuming a compatible form (so that capstone "Twin Eidolon" provides "benefits" outside of combat).
You apparently don't watch enough anime if you think this is going to even slow them down :)
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Strolls innocently into the thread.
*Blink, blink*
Backs out carefully, making no sudden moves that might draw attention to herself.
was Fancy when she mentioned this place...
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So I was reading the clothing discussion and started asking myself if eidolons can wear clothing and benefit from Magic Vestment.
I think this is a bad sign.
Anyway, plenty of xenoporn has retractable covers for the "naughty bits." So you can make an eidolon in improbably-skimpy armor and then still get your perv on after hours.
Actually the answer is simple.
Yes they can but then the summoner cannot. Eidolons share magic item slots (I think it's really weird, but I see where it's necessary from a balance standpoint) So, if you are wearing a cloak of Charisma the your Eidolon cannot wear a Cloak of Reisistance. If you have a ring of invisibility then your Eidolon can wear a ring of protection on the OTHER finger. Etc. So yeah, Paizo saw the "bad sign" and made it not quite so bad.
Also, if you DO have magic items that both you and your Eidolon are wearing, yours take precedent. So, if you don your Cloak of Charisma, then your eidolon's Cloak of Resistance deactivates until you take off your cloak.
Now, not sure if this is by the RAW but I'd allow it if i were your GM... pay the extra for "slotless" on your Eidolon's magic items and the slot doesn't matter, they always work. If you're paying that much gold then that's less magic items for you overall then I'm okay with that. Again though not sure if that flies by the RAW, that's just my interpretation and/or house rule on the matter.
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Ioun stones are always helpful... But they can be... Distracting.
Shiny...
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So now Ioun stones are being allowed in the 'belt' slot?
I must say I've 'Ben Wa'-iting for that ruling for some time, though I am certain some of the ladies have been internalizing the concept longer.
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One of the ioun stones sustain people without air...........
Bauble...