RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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Your characters can have bandoleers, they just can't use them for anything. Nor would they cost money. They would just be a fashion item. Part of Explorers clothing, perhaps.This just occurred to me: if I make a Core PC, they don't get to have my standard pair of criss-crossing bandoliers. How the frick am I supposed to make my PCs look like badass explorers without bandoliers?!
Hey, not a bad idea... I'll say that the "pockets" listed in the Explorer's Outfit description are located in the leather straps crossing my chest. ;)
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Hey, not a bad idea... I'll say that the "pockets" listed in the Explorer's Outfit description are located in the leather straps crossing my chest. ;)Your characters can have bandoleers, they just can't use them for anything. Nor would they cost money. They would just be a fashion item. Part of Explorers clothing, perhaps.This just occurred to me: if I make a Core PC, they don't get to have my standard pair of criss-crossing bandoliers. How the frick am I supposed to make my PCs look like badass explorers without bandoliers?!
Don't forget a wooden stick that looks remarkably like a shotgun.
Shop smart. Shop S-Mart.
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Kind of
** spoiler omitted **
A flame, equivalent in brightness to a torch, springs forth from an object that you touch. The effect looks like a regular flame, but it creates no heat and doesn't use oxygen. A continual flame can be covered and hidden but not smothered or quenched.
Light spells counter and dispel darkness spells of an equal or lower level.
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This spell does not stack with itself. Deeper darkness can be used to counter or dispel any light spell of equal or lower spell level. <--- has the same language. That doesn't mean it wins in case of a tie. What does though is this..
Darkness: Magical light sources only increase the light level in an area if they are of a higher spell level than darkness.
Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria
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** spoiler omitted **
Sure a normal continual flame won't increase the light level (well if it is dark, it will stay dark if brought into the area of a deeper darkness. But neither does the deeper darkness work, so it is just regular dark in that place.
Deeper darkness cast in broad daylight, and continual flame result in broad daylight since they cancel each other.
Well at least that is how I have always understood it, and considering the item in question, I thought, that this is supposed how it should work, after all darkness is a level 2 spell, a heightened continual flame would be a waste of energy if it could deal with deeper darkness.
Ok now I am confused too, might be the lack of painkillers... and two days without sleep...
Really would love to get a FAQ on this issue, or a paizo blog.
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Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria
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Yes, I am planning a gnome Barbarian/Paladin/Sorcerer/Draconic Disciple.
I am looking forward to still making the GM quiver in "WTF!!!", even with core only.
Oh if you are mentally flexible, and your GM isn't (which really doesn't apply to mine) some actions like making a lot of noise so the enemies start to buff themselves into the stratosphere, and then just waiting till their buffs run out... can get that reaction.
Or something like a tactical retreat, how often do the enemies decide where the battle takes place ^^
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Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria
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Counters and dispels is a separate system from their effects canceling out.
ooo an elephant.
(Was up all night waiting for the blizzard, followed by a little shoveling )
^^ Was up part of the night playing PFS, then talking about PFS, then reading about CORE, then playing Heroes of the Storm ... and well the next day is almost over ^^
Hope this helps. :)** spoiler omitted **** spoiler omitted **
Thank you a very insightful, do you have an oppinion about spells like :
Burst with light (level 4 kinda conplicated in PFS), Shield of the Dawnflower (level 4),
School evocation [light]; Level cleric/oracle 1, paladin 1, sorcerer/wizard 1
CASTING
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
EFFECT
Range medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Target one nongood creature
Duration 1 minute/level
Saving Throw Will negates; Spell Resistance yesDESCRIPTION
This spell causes the target to glow as if surrounded by a halo of light. This halo sheds normal light in a 20-foot radius from the creature, and increases the light level by one step for an additional 20 feet. This halo makes it impossible for the creature to gain concealment in non-magical darkness, and in dim or darker conditions, the creature's glow can be seen even if it is not within direct line of sight.
If unwelcome halo is brought into an area of magical darkness (or vice versa), the effects of both spells are temporarily negated, so that the otherwise prevailing light conditions exist within the overlapping fields of effect.
Oh and thank you for convincing me to not exchange darkvision for skill points on my new (as yet unplayed) PFS character^^
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Admittedly, it does put you behind in spellcasting progression, but the HP is beautiful. As is the +10 move.The first commandment of playing a full caster class: Thou shalt not slow thy spell progression without a darn good reason! ;-)
Magical Knack is legal thanks to the web enhancement, so you don't have to lose caster level at least.
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Prestige Classes suddenly become more attractive.
Duelist is a way in core to make an effective dex based melee fighter without the swashbuckler.
Shadowdancer is attractive for hide in plain sight, evasion, and the shadow pet.
Dragon Disciple is a good way to boost str and do some minor gishing without the bloodrager.
Arcane Archer is your go to for trick arrows without the Alchemist and Zen Archer.
Early entry is shut down without alternate race traits or school abilities to grant the SLAs.
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Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria
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Duelist looks better than it actually is, but yeah those classes are mostly fine, otherwise blood ragers would not always ask about that bloodline thing. ^^
Arcane archer has the problem, that it comes online a little bit late, and doesn't really do all that much until your pathfinder career is almost over.
I think you are forgetting, how damn good an undiluted paladin/fighter archer can be. Especially considering, that the typical PFS tactic of buying every scroll, that can't run away fast enough still very much works, and the ability to exchange PP for wands is even more effective in this setting.
I am currently finishing build an half orc monk (kata master) paladin (sacred shield) of shelyin, and while I am cheesing with fait's favored and sacred tattoo, it is pretty much intentional overkill so I can later get lazy and multicast to take cool stuff.
However that character would work just as well in CORE, I would make it a sword and board paladin with two weapon fighting, of you have smite active , it doesn't' really matter what you use to hit^^
I would miss my tangleshot shuriken though, and even blunt arrows aren't available.
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I do have to ask the obvious question... customization aside, how optimized DO you have to be to survive Pathfinder Society games?
You don't really.
Base characters played well can do very well in PFS.
On the other hand, over-optimized characters can ROFL stomp many scenarios with or without backup.
As long as you built a base balance, you're fine.
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Quote; "Kits are gone, so players need to do their homework on encumberances, costs, etc."
Players needed to do that anyway. Most kits come with ten torches (10 lbs), an iron pot (4 lbs), and various other accoutrements that NEVER get used. And yet you have the little 10 STR/ 18 DEX ninja (or whatever) running around with a kit that weighs upwards of 30 lbs.
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I do have to ask the obvious question... customization aside, how optimized DO you have to be to survive Pathfinder Society games?
For me, the extra options aren't about optimization they're about variety.
With core only I can make a powerful character, but after 16 years of playing effectively the same game I like the variety of options that are out there outside of core. My wild empathy focused druid doesn't work without fast empathy, a dex based fighter type really doesn't work in core (and i like the swashbucklers penache mechanic), and some of the crazier options i'd like to do don't really work well enough in core only.
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It still has to be re-cast every scenario for a constant GP drain.Listing sum stuff:
No ioun torches, so light sources become a bit of a hassle. Darkvision is yet more powerful.
Continual Flame can be put on anything and the spell itself is Core.
So continual flame jewelry are still usable
You can have one continual flame spell carry over per The Guide still...
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So, what do you think will be the main effects on character creation and development of the Core campaign? Who are the winners and losers, what tactics have to change, what key options are no longer available?
I
There are no losers. It's essentially like playing Pathfinder Society in Season One when the CRB was the only Player Book out.
The standard PFS campaign is still out there if you want a cart load of books available for character creation. The core campaign makes winners of those who want something more old school.
It is an everyone wins situation.
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RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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I do have to ask the obvious question... customization aside, how optimized DO you have to be to survive Pathfinder Society games?You don't really.
Base characters played well can do very well in PFS.
On the other hand, over-optimized characters can ROFL stomp many scenarios with or without backup.
As long as you built a base balance, you're fine.
I believe that's the level of optimization he's asking about.
And to answer the question:
The best answer I've ever encountered—one which gives you something tangible enough to actually mean something, while still remaining sufficiently flexible for all the different possible builds/roles/etc—is to look at the Monster Creation chart in the Bestiary/PRD and calculating backwards to get numbers you're comfortable with.
For instance, do you want your character to only get hit on a 17+? Or a 13+? Or maybe you have other defenses (like illusions or sheer range) and are okay with your AC only screening out the rolls under 7? Look at the attack bonuses listed for CRs near your level and do the math.
This way, you can make a decision that's tailored to your specific situation, while still having a reference point so you don't vastly over- or undershoot.
Hope that helps!
It means I have to register PFS char #'s 36-40. So much for THAT New Years resolution.
-TimD, Unapologetic Alt-a-holic™
And here I thought I had a lot, guess not.
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It is an everyone wins situation.
Except if you want to play one mode and the only games available are the other mode.
or maybe the game store only hosts D+D 5th, or GURPS, or HERO, ad nauseum. it's a choice for players and DM's who want something other than a campaign full of freak races and freak classes.
if you've been one of the ones complaining of "rules bloat", or the expense of buying suppleents, this is the campaign for you.
And after a post like this, "...campaign full of freak races and freak classes", people wonder why some of us have concerns about the change.
Seriously how hard would it be for you to stop being insulting to people who like things you don't?
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Venture-Captain, North Carolina—Asheville
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Listing sum stuff:
No ioun torches, so light sources become a bit of a hassle. Darkvision is yet more powerful.
Continual Flame can be put on anything and the spell itself is Core.
So continual flame jewelry are still usable
You can also get a standard wayfinder. I haven't had too many experiences thus far where it was both dark and imperative that my identity as a Pathfinder remain secret.
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I do have to ask the obvious question... customization aside, how optimized DO you have to be to survive Pathfinder Society games?
Optimization, Competence, and Preparation are related factors.
I take optimization to occur at the character construction level. Did you spend your build points efficiently, did you discover a combination of classes, archetypes, feats, and equipment that enables you to perform significantly above the core baseline? (IMO the core baseline is taking one of the base classes and making all of the obvious good choices from the core rules. For example, a paladin who takes a good strength, good charisma, and good constitution and takes feats like weapon focus, etc. Keep in mind, there is such a thing as reverse optimization too. I view the iconics as generally being inferior to the core baseline (though some come close to it) and I've seen some characters who make the iconics look like paragons of optimization).
Competence is related but not interchangeable with optimization. Plenty of people can read a character build on the internet without being able to use it effectively. If you can analyze what the tactical situation calls for and work with your party to do it, while avoiding doing stupid stuff, that is what I have in mind with competence.
Preparation is more closely related to optimization but I think it deserves its own category. It is entirely possible to have a highly optimized character and play that character well at the table but fail if you did not take the time to prepare your character for various common adventuring situations. How do you deal with darkness? Invisibility? Flying opponents? Damage Reduction? Swarms? Preparation is having ensured that you or your party has some way to deal with these common scenarios even if it is through using consumables. If your character comes to the table with a +1 greatsword, +1 fullplate, and 5 prepared Divine Favor spells, you could be very highly optimized for beating things in the face without being prepared for the challenges that don't call for beating things in the face.
The three categories work together to determine how hard it is to survive. If, as a player, you have no tactical competence and have not properly prepared your character, no amount of optimization is sufficient. Your character can be as min/maxed as the Incredible Hulk, but if you decide to charge into the teeth of a tactical trap without an effective weapon or proper defenses, sooner or later, the optimization will not be enough to survive.
On the other hand, tactical competence and preparation can go a long way towards making PFS survivable with minimal optimization and IME will make a relatively balanced party able to survive with more or less baseline core optimization. A very well prepared and competent group of players could probably succeed with sub-baseline optimization (such as the iconics).
That said, since you are not the whole party and you will sometimes end up sitting with incompetent players playing sub-iconic, unprepared characters, in unbalanced parties, a little optimization is helpful for when you have to not only carry your own weight but make up for someone else's dead weight as well.
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Always nice to see a venture officer belittle those who don't agree with them. And you wonder why there are those that feel this is going to hurt the player base and the game.
Really? So after multiple pages throughout numerous threads both in these forums and other places like Facebook, Yahoo, etc. where I have, up to this point done nothing but try to "sell" the possible benefits of CORE, offer suggestions as to how some people can use it to their advantage, and ask them to give it chance before destroying it out-of-hand only to be met with constant derision and negativity, I'm the one that gets called out for supposed bad behavior?
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Rangers are once again stuck with two-weapon fighting or archery only builds and lose access to instant enemy.
No one is stuck with anything. The standard campaign is still running. If you want all the options, don't play CORE. Nothing, not a single rule, game mechanic, ability, skill, or what have you has been removed from the game. In fact, a completely new option has been added to the game IN ADDITION to the standard campaign.
I keep hearing people saying things are being taken away and it baffles me. If McDonald's decided to add a value meal what was just the sandwich and drink, no fries, they did not take the option of fries away from you. Just order the regular value meal with fries.
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Always nice to see a venture officer belittle those who don't agree with them. And you wonder why there are those that feel this is going to hurt the player base and the game.Really? So after multiple pages throughout numerous threads both in these forums and other places like Facebook, Yahoo, etc. where I have, up to this point done nothing but try to "sell" the possible benefits of CORE, offer suggestions as to how some people can use it to their advantage, and ask them to give it chance before destroying it out-of-hand only to be met with constant derision and negativity, I'm the one that gets called out for supposed bad behavior?
If your response to valid concerns is to call someone a "negative Nancy" then yes, you are showing bad behavior, you are not dispelling those concerns, and that venture captain title by your name is giving your insults an air of legitimacy and making those that aren't sold on core less likely to give it a chance because the campaign leadership is telling them they don't matter.
I get that this is a volunteer job, and that the VOs have know about this longer than we have. But ignoring our concerns in this matter is only making it look worse for the campaign from my point of view.
how optimized DO you have to be to survive Pathfinder Society games?
To answer your question, I have a funny (or not funny?) story about my first time in PFS, and how not-optimized I was.
I was used to playing home games in D&D 3.5 and Pathfinder, where we focused on politics, talking, role-playing, and so on. So I created a bard, and I didn't build him for combat. I mean, he could fight, but he wasn't built for "combat is going to be a challenge and a main theme!" kind of fights.
For my first game in PFS, I arrived at the game day to play a trilogy -- the Shades of Ice trilogy. I walked in and they greeted me warmly. I told them who I was and what I was playing. They were happy with it, and said, "Cool, we're playing up!" I told them I didn't know what that meant. They assured me it would be fine, and said, "Don't worry, we'll keep your character alive."
In the very first round of the very first fight of my very first PFS game, my first character was dead. Even worse, I looked around the table, dumbfounded, wanting to say, "I thought you said it was fine?!?!?" but these guys were all looking at ME in disbelief, and someone looked over at my character sheet and declared that I was terrible at building characters and it was my own fault.
I got to play for a whopping 15 minutes before my game was over and I left, pretty upset.
I would have quit Pathfinder Society right there, but I was at a convention and had signed up to play all 3 parts of the trilogy. So I went back to my room and angrily made the most amazing barbarian I had ever made. I thought, "These guys want a combat brute, I'll give them a BRUTE!!!" I brought it to part 2 of the trilogy, and lived! Then, I brought it to part 3 of the trilogy, and died. Again.
I was dumbfounded. My brain couldn't do the math -- how could I build a character that withstands that much damage? Pathfinder Society seemed immensely unfair.
Fast forward to today, 3 years later. I just played a level 7 barbarian with a bunch of level 9 characters, and they all enthusiastically said, "We're playing up!" I know what that means now, and I shrugged. We murdered that module. I could have soloed it. Our gunslinger killed a greater shadow creature of some kind on round 1, by himself. I declared that my contribution to the fight would be to lean against the wall and applaud him.
The point is, this is all relative. That bard that I brought to my first game? He had 6 hit points and AC 13 (yes, CON was my dump stat!!!), and could only fight with martial melee weapons, nothing ranged. Yeah, I put an easy-to-hit, extremely low-HP character into melee. Why? Because in my home groups, that was fine. We'd have 1 fight every 3 games or so, and it'd be mostly cinematic, with people swinging from chandeliers or leaping down a flight of stairs, hurling improvised weapons and chasing villains, and it'd end with their surrender. Nobody ever died, neither PC nor villain.
In Pathfinder Society, there are some season 0 modules where that style of play is even possible. Some enemies have 4 hit points and AC 12.
Compare that to the first 3 modules of season 6. The monsters are basically unhittable or unharmable, and in one case does something like 45 points of damage per round, in a level 1 module. I know even a veteran who quit, after playing through that. I survived by being ruthless -- I locked a fellow PC on one side of a door with the monsters, while the rest of us fled and regrouped. That player lost his character instantly. We spent the rest of the game using guerrilla tactics, peppering the monsters with attacks from afar, running constantly, even hyper-optimized veteran characters scared of dying.
So to answer your question: depending upon the module, you need an unusually prepared, optimized character -- so optimized that you will fail on your first try and declare PFS to be unreasonable and sucky -- OR, you will bring a so-so character and curbstomp every bad guy in the module, and find yourself thinking, "I don't know what all the fuss is about."
Generally, the older the module, the easier it is. Something from season 0 or 1 is fine. Something from season 5 or 6... well... if you've never played... I hope you have weapons with special materials even at level 1. Do NOT think of these games like home games, where there are no fights and the GM will fudge dice rolls. If there is a critical hit in Pathfinder Society and it does 38 points of damage at level 1, then it just does.
Oddly, I am now so good at character building that even with a level 1 character, a 38 point critical hit wouldn't defeat me. It's just all relative.