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It is option 1 : you cast once per full-attack action (defensively if threatened), and if the spell allows a melee touch attack, you do a normal melee attack instead. On a hit, you deal weapon damage + spell damage, all multiplied on a crit.
And even if it was option 2, it would be pretty terrible, because you would rely on hitting with two weak attacks just to apply one spell.
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Don't forget arcane mark + spellstrike. Combat using a magical branding iron.
While arcane mark does no damage, it does allow you to get an extra hit off.
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None of the above.
A Guide to Touch Spells, Spellstrike, and Spell Combat
If you don't want to read all that, here's the short version.
Spell Combat: Full attack and cast one standard action spell in the same full-round action. That's all. Do whatever the spell says to do, and get a full attack with your weapon.
Spellstrike: Any time you could deliver a touch spell, either with a touch, a natural attack, or an unarmed strike, you have the option of using your weapon instead. If you do this, you target normal AC, and deal weapon damage in addition to delivering the touch spell. (Caveat: the spell must have been cast by you, and from the magus spell list)
That's all it does. Instead of finger, claw, or fist, you use sword.
So for your example:
1) Magus uses Spell Combat. (Full-round action)
2) Magus casts Shocking Grasp. Because he cast a touch spell, he gets to make a touch attack as a free action any time this round.
3) Magus takes a 5' step up to the orc.
4) Magus takes his free attack granted by casting a touch spell. He chooses to use Spellstrike to deliver it. He makes an attack roll (at -2) against the orcs normal AC. If he hits, he deals weapon damage and shocking grasp damage.
5) Magus then makes a full attack with his sword (all at -2).
As for chill touch, you only get the free attack the round you cast it. Every round after that, while holding the charge, you still are limited to your normal number of attacks. Remember that casting another spell dissipates any held charge.
Listen to Grick. He's basically a deity when it comes to spellstrike / spell combat.
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Listen to Grick. He's basically a deity when it comes to spellstrike / spell combat.
*puffs up with self-importance*
Ok so say a 15th level magus has gone the shocking grasp route all the way to spell perfection... Can he cast shocking grasp and steps up to make his free attack from spellstrike and then he makes his normal 3 attacks from bab... Can he then quicken a shocking grasp and use spellstrike again?
Ok so say a 15th level magus has gone the shocking grasp route all the way to spell perfection... Can he cast shocking grasp and steps up to make his free attack from spellstrike and then he makes his normal 3 attacks from bab... Can he then quicken a shocking grasp and use spellstrike again?
If "step up" means take a 5' step, then yes.
And yes, magus damage output can be quite good, for a while. They use up a lot of resources to do that, though.
Sagotel is a magus at first level, who has not yet played (PFS).
I shall, I think, print your excellent example.
Just remember that you don't get Spellstrike until 2nd level. Also, the -2 penalties from Spell Combat apply to ALL attacks you make as part of the full-round action. (They do not apply to AoOs or attacks made as a swift action outside of Spell Combat)
The key is understanding how normal touch spells work. Once you really understand touching, holding the charge, and how every normal wizard/sorcerer can use them, the magus makes a lot more sense.
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People like to use Arcane Mark with Spellstrike, because it is a cantrip with a range of touch. So, based on your example, Melvin the Magus (2nd level) faces another foe. He has no more first level spells available. He chooses to use Spell Combat and Spellstrike. First, he uses his normal longsword attack (net bonus 0: +1 STR, +1 BAB, -2 S/C). Then he casts Arcane Mark defensively. He gets one additional attack with his longsword (again at net bonus 0) and hits. He inflicts normal longsword damage and leaves, "MELVIN WUZ HERE" magically inscribed on his foe.
*EDIT* Let us now suppose that Melvin missed with his Spellstrike attack. He is now holding the Arcane Mark charge. On his next turn, he might choose to use Spell Combat and Spellstrike again. In that case, he repeats his last round actions exactly (attack, cast defensively, attack). If he fails his concentration check, he loses the spell, and cannot attempt a second attack, because he has no spell to deliver through his weapon.
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People like to use Arcane Mark with Spellstrike, because it is a cantrip with a range of touch. So, based on your example, Melvin the Magus (2nd level) faces another foe. He has no more first level spells available. He chooses to use Spell Combat and Spellstrike. First, he uses his normal longsword attack (net bonus 0: +1 STR, +1 BAB, -2 S/C). Then he casts Arcane Mark defensively. He gets one additional attack with his longsword (again at net bonus 0) and hits. He inflicts normal longsword damage and leaves, "MELVIN WUZ HERE" magically inscribed on his foe.
Yep. but not more then 6 characters.
"WHACK!" is just too damned funny to not leave.
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None of the above.
So for your example:1) Magus uses Spell Combat. (Full-round action)
2) Magus casts Shocking Grasp. Because he cast a touch spell, he gets to make a touch attack as a free action any time this round.
3) Magus takes a 5' step up to the orc.
4) Magus takes his free attack granted by casting a touch spell. He chooses to use Spellstrike to deliver it. He makes an attack roll (at -2) against the orcs normal AC. If he hits, he deals weapon damage and shocking grasp damage.
5) Magus then makes a full attack with his sword (all at -2).
I didn't think you could 5 foot step in the middle of your full round action? Doesn't the step have to come either before all of the other actions, or after it?
I didn't think you could 5 foot step in the middle of your full round action?
Move Action: "If you move no actual distance in a round (commonly because you have swapped your move action for one or more equivalent actions), you can take one 5-foot step either before, during, or after the action."
Full-Round Action: "The only movement you can take during a full-round action is a 5-foot step before, during, or after the action."
Full Attack: "The only movement you can take during a full attack is a 5-foot step. You may take the step before, after, or between your attacks."
Yar!
Grick has it. It is also stated in the Take 5-Foot Step sub-section of the miscellaneous actions section:
You can move 5 feet in any round when you don't perform any other kind of movement. Taking this 5-foot step never provokes an attack of opportunity. You can't take more than one 5-foot step in a round, and you can't take a 5-foot step in the same round that you move any distance.
You can take a 5-foot step before, during, or after your other actions in the round.
You can only take a 5-foot-step if your movement isn't hampered by difficult terrain or darkness. Any creature with a speed of 5 feet or less can't take a 5-foot step, since moving even 5 feet requires a move action for such a slow creature.
You may not take a 5-foot step using a form of movement for which you do not have a listed speed.
~P
There's always been reasons, yes. Just like almost every other spell.
It was just very rarely prepared unless it was necessary or chosen as a spell known.
Alright since this seems relevant, can you have 2 abilities with touch attack active at the same time? Also if you have 2 abilities that activate on a touch attack, could they both go off on the same attack?
A bit of a derail, so sorry for that.
People like to use Arcane Mark with Spellstrike, because it is a cantrip with a range of touch. So, based on your example, Melvin the Magus (2nd level) faces another foe. He has no more first level spells available. He chooses to use Spell Combat and Spellstrike. First, he uses his normal longsword attack (net bonus 0: +1 STR, +1 BAB, -2 S/C). Then he casts Arcane Mark defensively. He gets one additional attack with his longsword (again at net bonus 0) and hits. He inflicts normal longsword damage and leaves, "MELVIN WUZ HERE" magically inscribed on his foe.Yep. but not more then 6 characters.
"WHACK!" is just too damned funny to not leave.
You could do it several times. Nothing says you can't put multiple runes on the same target. 'Melvin' on the first round, 'wuz' on the second and 'here' on the third. In a long duel you could conceivably write an entire essay on your opponent.
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You're not doing a public service by bringing up that cheese maneuver in a question where it's not directly nrelevant.Don't forget arcane mark + spellstrike. Combat using a magical branding iron.
While arcane mark does no damage, it does allow you to get an extra hit off.
Is it more or less cheese to take the Close Attack arcana, and use Ray of Frost instead, then?
Still get an infinite set of two-weapon attacks, the first one that hits in a round doing a whole ...1d3! extra damage...
Out of curiosity then, If I hold a charge for a touch spell over into the following round, for whatever reason, and use a full round action I could do my attacks first, delivering my charged touch attack from an earlier round, and still cast a spell after all attacks are resolved?
So at say 8th level as in one of your examples I'd get 2 attacks. 1st one is at +4 (including penalty) and delivers my early touch spell, 2nd is at -1, and then I can cast any other standard action spell and /if/ it is another touch attack spell I also get a third sword attack. Either way two spell effects will potentially go off in the same round.
Or did I muddle something somewhere along the way.
Sagotel is a magus at first level, who has not yet played (PFS).
I shall, I think, print your excellent example.Just remember that you don't get Spellstrike until 2nd level. Also, the -2 penalties from Spell Combat apply to ALL attacks you make as part of the full-round action. (They do not apply to AoOs or attacks made as a swift action outside of Spell Combat)
The key is understanding how normal touch spells work. Once you really understand touching, holding the charge, and how every normal wizard/sorcerer can use them, the magus makes a lot more sense.
I am doubtful on not suffering the TWF penalties on AoO and any other attack you make in a round outside of the full round action, can't say it has actually come up yet in any game but do you have any clarifying sample or text ?
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This leaves me curious as to how exactly one determines if something is "cheese".When Jason Bulmahn has said it was on purpose, I think that disqualifies it from "cheese" status.Certain things are innately cheese, no matter who vouches for them.
Apparently, it is anything that someone does not like, or understand.
Then again, the meaning can change entirely over the length of one conversation. This can be done by the same person, who decides it means something else depending on mood.Seriously, I am really damn tired of it's usage.
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I am doubtful on not suffering the TWF penalties on AoO and any other attack you make in a round outside of the full round action, can't say it has actually come up yet in any game but do you have any clarifying sample or text ?
Here is a four page thread on the subject, which only comes to a conclusion when someone quotes James Jacobs saying "TWF penalties apply only when you make TWF attacks. Attacks of Opportunity are not part of that, nor are quickened spells."
In the end, you still have people insisting he's not official enough, and that they want to extend penalties an arbitrary length of time beyond the action in which the penalties are relevant. So ask your GM before you do anything involving two weapons. Or free actions. Or touch spells.
Out of curiosity then, If I hold a charge for a touch spell over into the following round, for whatever reason, and use a full round action I could do my attacks first, delivering my charged touch attack from an earlier round, and still cast a spell after all attacks are resolved?
Yep, seems right. I didn't verify the numbers, but yes, you can attack before you cast.
Yar.
I like cheese.
Om-nom-nom.
~P
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This leaves me curious as to how exactly one determines if something is "cheese".When Jason Bulmahn has said it was on purpose, I think that disqualifies it from "cheese" status.Certain things are innately cheese, no matter who vouches for them.
Cheese is anything that goes with lots o' whine.
Ba! Dum! Tish!!!Thank you, we'll be here all week.
When Jason Bulmahn has said it was on purpose, I think that disqualifies it from "cheese" status.
It's just a backdoor free attack every round is all, and thats what makes it cheezy. That it hangs off a 0 level Cantrip which is clearly not designed to be a combat spell.
I find it cheeze as all get out, but it is legit, so I don't complain - just because I don't like something doesn't make it 'wrong'.