ZenFox42's page

Atlas - please check your PM...

Third try :

I took more Hindrances than needed, but didn't spend the extra points.

I've added Shooting, which I can boost up to d10, and even tho the Persuasion is d4+1, that's better than a plain d8!

For me to be happy with this, I *really* need to exchange the Rifle for another Wilk's Classic (the Classic costs less, so this shouldn't be a problem).

Be aware, this is Savage Worlds RIFTS. Are you familiar with that system?

Atlas - please check Recruitment again...

Second try :

I took more Hindrances than needed, but didn't spend the extra points.

The GM I first created this for allowed me to sell :
Wilk’s 320 “Classic” Laser Pistol : 3d6 AP 2, 15/30/60, weight 2 (Shooting +1) : 11,000
NG-L5 Laser Rifle : 4d6 AP 2, 24/48/96, weight 10 : 16,000

At half price, and replace them with :
Vibro-Longsword : d6+d10, AP 10 (11,000)

Would that be ok with you?

This is an invitational PC, Recruitment is not open.

I have yet to make my rolls for cash, goods, and Hero's Journey

Atlas - please check Recruitment for a preliminary PC outline

Atlas - please check your PM...

Atlas - please check your PM, thanks!

Hey - I just saw this. Is it too late to get in on this game? I love anything done in Savage Worlds!

I already have a PC concept in mind - a CyberKnight. Haven't read all the posts yet to see if anyone else wants to do that. If so, would it be ok if there were two?

Yes, this is not open recruitment.

Swapped out Marksman for Combat Reflexes.

Ready for review.

PWGM - I'd like to add Night Vision Goggles ($500) to my equipment.

Karma - what do you see as your character's role in the game? With only d6+d8 melee damage and 2d6 ranged damage, she will probably be near-useless in combat.

Also, you need to calculate and show your "derived" stats (SWADE Core, p. 10) : Toughness and Parry (and Pace, which is almost always 6).

I don't see any superpowers to boost Toughness and Parry, so you'll be easy to hit and go down quick. <time passes> Ok, I just saw Intangibility which means you'll be hard to hit or damage at all, until the GM arms his NPC's with energy weapons. ;)

With Intangibility and Flight, you could be an excellent "scout", scoping out places we want to get into. If you could swap something out for Invisibility (8 SPP), you'd be the perfect scout.

The attacks in SPC3 are called Melee Attack and Ranged Attack, but in SPC2 they're called Attack, Melee and Attack, Ranged (as you have them). Also, Undead in SPC3 is 8 SPP, not 4. That, along with your mentioning that Undead have a -2 to Charisma makes me think you used SPC2 instead of SPC3.

Ok, the equipment didn't take long...

Comm Link $100 (depending on your answer to my previous post)
First Aid kit $10 (does anyone have the Healing superpower? If so, I'll drop this...)
Lockpicks $200 (I *am* a thief...)

Would you care to price an item that opens electronics locks, if such a thing exists?

I can't believe SWADE Core doesn't list a motorcycle in its vehicles list! I did find one in SWD for $3000, still beyond my price range.

P.S. - yes, I would be interested in being able to get Marksman eventually...

PWGM said : "Ranged Attack is not subject to Power Down so I am ignoring that bit. Let me know if that's in error."

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that every power in the "activation" list was also subject to "power down". That's why I only mentioned Force Field.

Go ahead and review my PC now, I will replace the Marksman Edge with something else (I was having problems finding Edges I liked, so it might take me a while). I will do my gear as a separate post soon if that's ok.

Quick question : in my game Dr. Destruction gave everyone a comm link. If not everyone buys it, we won't be able to work well as a team. Should everyone be told to buy one, or will it be provided?

PWGM : here's my PC for your review (pending your ruling on Marksman) -

I have a question about activations : Force Field and Dodge require a rolled action with the Requires Activation Modifier (and no action without it), Invisibility requires a no-roll action, and Ranged Attack requires a rolled action, yes?

How does this interact with Power Down? The rules say "Anytime a character with such a power is Shaken or Stunned, he must succeed at a Spirit roll or all those powers that may Power Down do so instantly after resolving the action causing the effect." But Force Field without the Requires Activation has no other roll to make to activate it, so...if it powers down, it would come right back on the next round?

PWGM said : "Humans get a free edge. Hybrids get a free edge or Aquatic as they desire. "

No, I know about the free Edge. I was referring to something in the SPC3 settings rules that I *thought* said we got an extra Edge. No? Maybe I'm thinking of the extra Hindrance we got.

Regarding Edges and superpowers, I'd like to take Marksman for my Ranged Attack. It specifically says Shooting, but I'd be rolling Focus, with a Trapping of (telekinetic)Force. Whatdayathink?

Also, I just wanted to mention this : since so many superpowers affect the die roll to be hit from a distance, usually as a penalty to the roll, instead I came up with the "Ranged Attack Target Number", or RATN, which by default is 4. But if a superpower subtracts from a ranged attack die roll, instead the PC increases their RATN by a like amount. It kept me from having to remember "oh, this PC is harder to hit at range, I've got to subtract N from my NPC's attack roll". Use it or not, fine with me.

You run as fast as you can and don't get anywhere (it's from Alice in Wonderland).

But, Heavy Weapons don't do any extra damage against "normal" Armor, so that's not an issue when we're being fired at.

Toughness is...well...tough to quantify. (As of right now,) my Toughness is 15, but 10 of that are armor, so an attack with AP 10 and damage of 10 will Wound me. But someone with a natural Toughness of 15 needs to be hit with 20 damage to get a Wound.

I've run simulations, and found that it's far better to not get hit, than to let the Toughness absorb the damage. So if you can boost your Dodge and Parry with SPP, that's a better way to go.

ALL - I'd like to suggest that everyone take Mind Shield. It's only 1 SPP (you can change one of your existing powers to Requires Activation to get that point), and since Mind Control is in play we certainly don't want any of the bad guys turning us on our comrades!

PWGM - what's your stance on Secret Identities? As (ex)villians, shouldn't we all have them, otherwise the authorities could walk up to our homes and arrest us?

Also, I'm assuming that your notation "Free AB Superpowers" means we get the Superpowers Edge for free? I know it may seem obvious, but I just want to make sure...

And, this is driving me crazy - I'd swear that somewhere in the mountain of optional setting rules, we get an extra Edge. Is that right, or is my memory playing tricks on me (which is entirely possible)?

Finally, regarding Edges : can we take Edges that involve the Shooting skill if we have a Ranged Attack Power? Likewise for Fighting and Melee Attack.

PWGM - I found the Improvised Weapons after I made my last post, but thanks! I can't get beyond d12+1 with TK because of the 15 point cap. And speaking of which...

I said : "And finally, TK is *weak* - even with 8 SPP of Power for a Strength of d12+1...".

You said : "I think your math is a tad off...".

I meant "8 SPP of Power" literally, as in the Power modifier, so I was talking 11 SPP of TK (without any other modifiers).

And yeah, I had forgotten how wonky SW's Heavy Armor / Heavy Weapons worked, thanks for the refresher! I just noticed that Force Field talks about "reducing damage", not increasing Armor or Toughness, so I think the "Heavy" issue is moot.

But looking at the numbers...

14 SPP of TK allows me to do d8+d12+1 damage (average 13.3), IF there happens to be a heavy enough object available (and would the -2 to the Improvised attack roll still apply?), and get Flight at Pace 6.

Using Ranged Attack, I can do 5d6 Heavy damage (average 21.3) for 12 SPP, and get Flight at Pace 12 for 2 SPP.

Finally, I don't know if you've mentioned this anywhere else before, but I'm wondering : will we get any more SPP as the game progresses?

I was going to go for the Telekinesis and Force Field powers, but :

Armor allows for Heavy Armor, but Force Field does not, so...Force Field is completely useless against Heavy Weapons? Why not allow a Heavy Armor Modifier for Force Field? Altho it does say it "reduces incoming damage", which doesn't specify ordinary damage or Heavy damage...what are your thoughts about this wording?

Telekinesis specifies an effective Strength, but SPC3 does not appear to have SPC2's Heavy Weaponry table - so does a TK attack only do its Strength in damage? I wanted to be able to pick up lampposts and cars and throw them or swing them at my enemies. If I can't do that, I would be better off putting those points into Ranged Attack (which I did).

And finally, TK is *weak* - even with 8 SPP of Power for a Strength of d12+1, according to the Super Strength Encumbrance Table (125 lbs), I can't even lift a normal person.

FWIW, on average, my 6d6 damage will only do 8 more points of damage than Dave's 4d6.

Also, I wanted to ask you : would it be ok if I rolled Focus for my Ranged Attack instead of Shooting? Focus seems to be the "super power skill", and I thought it would make more sense to use it.

Finally, SW is all about Trappings - so if I say "my Ranged Attack is a telekinetic punch", it is... ;)

PWGM - here's my first tentative build. I may change it drastically as I understand the SPC3 rules better (especially the Telekinetic and Force Field Powers), but I wanted to run this by you :

p52 : Armor(5), Heavy Armor(+4), Requires Activation(-1) : +10 heavy armor (8 SPP)
p63 : Flight(4) : pace 12 (4 SPP)
p80 : Ranged Attack(15), Heavy weapon(1), Lethal(-1) : 6d6 heavy damage (15 SPP)
p57 : Dodge : -5 to be hit by Ranged attacks (5 SPP)
p69 : Invisibility : -4 to be Noticed and vs. attacks (8 SPP)
p78 : Parry : +5 Parry (5 SPP)

All with the Trapping of telekinetic force.

How soon do you want our builds? I have to purchase SPC3, read it, and read it again, to figure out how to build the kind of PC I want. It could take a couple of days...

a) A human male who uses some form of telekinesis for just about everything he can do.

b) Average height, thin, blonde hair with blue eyes. Didn't/doesn't wear a costume. By changing his clothes for each job, he figures he won't stand out as much. He does have a signature knee-length black coat that he likes to wear sometimes, however.

c)His TK separates him from everyone - he was born with it, so he's known since he was a small child that he was different from everyone else. He can do almost anything with it, from flying to lifting things (including other people), throwing things, deflecting things coming at him, etc. [Details TBD by his build.]

d)Before the V'Sori, he was a successful sneak thief. He would use his TK to enter a place, open the vault / safe / whatever, and get the goods. He could crush any security cameras, so no one ever got a good look at him. He vividly remembers that his last job before the V'Sori wiped out the heroes was a high-end jewelry store.

e)In the last two years, he's really stepped up his game. He's been using his powers to nip at the heels of the V'Sori, decimating their patrols, attacking lesser-guarded facilities and wrecking them, destroying their smaller flying machines (while they're on the ground), doing whatever he can to weaken their coordinated efforts to control mankind. He was captured at a facility that was more heavily-guarded than he expected (in retrospect, he thinks that might have been due to he previous attacks, so in a sense he was his own reason he was captured).

f)The most interesting person he's ever met is Flying Fortress. He met her by accident, they both happened to attack the same V'Sori station at the same time. She wears complete-coverage armor that enhances her strength and allows her to fly, so together they made quick work of the place. Their banter during the attack led to their meeting up IRL, which eventually led to their hooking up to do jobs and...other things. She was just recently killed by the V'Sori while attacking a large research installation, and he still mourns her loss, and now his anger at the V'Sori is personal.

g)The greatest thing in his life *was* Flying Fortress. His current goal, the most important thing in his life, is to wipe every single V'Sori off the face of the earth.

PWGM - the Mind Control power was SUPER (pardon the pun) overpowered in SPC2. I haven't looked at the SPC3 version, but you'd better make sure it can't be abused.

I would like to join, but it will take me some time to decide what kind of super my PC is (there are so many options!).

How many PP are we starting with? Is it 4-color, or something else? I know you said we don't need to create a complete PC, but I want to plan ahead...

FWIW, the most current version of Savage Worlds core rules has a red-headed woman standing in a snowstorm on the cover.

It's also available as a downloadable PDF for $10. If you buy it from Pinnacle (the company that makes SW), all future revisions of the document are free! You can get it HERE.

Just FYI, in SW, a skill like Driving is typically only needed when you're chasing or being chased. You never need to make a roll under normal just-going-from-here-to-there conditions. But it's your PC, you can do what you want with him.

Yeah, I forgot about the free Human Edge, and I meant Driving, not Riding (still probably not much call for that), you could put those 2 steps into Fighting and Shooting if you want to be *really* good at fighting.

Oh, I think I might have forgotten about the free Human Edge. I'll have to check that tomorrow morning.

Mokshai - according to my spreadsheet, you're 2 points over on skills.

You could get rid of Riding (probably not much call for that) and Healing (we have plenty of healers), and boost your Athletics to d8 if you want to be a strong all-around fighter (it covers throwing daggers and grappling with opponents). That will bring your skill points to the desired value.

I didn't check the cost of all your gear, but other than the skills, everything looks good!

Will check it early tomorrow morning, EST, and post comments.

I have a spreadsheet that I created myself to help me build Savage PC's. It's not user-friendly, so I don't want to send it to you, but I could use it to enter your PC and let you know exactly what needs tweaking, if you're interested.

Mokshai - a couple of issues : you can only have 4 points of Hindrances, so you'll have to drop the Major one or two of the Minor ones.

Also, my description of Heroic tells you how you have to act (you "never says no to a person in need"), but does not increase Agility by one die type. So you must drop Agility to d6, and update the skill dice values to stay at 12 points.

I don't see Persuasion and Stealth included as some of the "free" d4 Skills.

If you're going for a Fighter type (thanks!), an Athletics of d8 would be good (but not necessary). It now covers a LOT of activities in SWADE (including throwing things, like daggers, which you should have several of, including at least one non-metallic one [twice the cost]).

Also, with a Vigor of d6, your Toughness would be 5, and with a Fighting of d6, your Parry would be 5.

Are you using the SWADE core rules? My cover of the book has a red-head woman standing in a snowstorm.

ALL - I've made a post in Discussion that I'd like everyone to read (altho you don't have to do what it asks...).

Mokshai - if you can just get your money back from that website, I'd suggest you to to PEG's (the company that created Savage Worlds) website. I've never had any problems with them, and once you've paid your $10, you can download updated versions for free forever! You can purchase the PDF
HERE.

ALL - it sounds like we're getting into some roleplaying already, so go ahead and post how you came to be on the ship in Gameplay. You can banter with each other for the next couple of days while we're waiting for new PC's.

If you haven't posted a PC yet, don't worry, I will check Recruitment every day, and won't start the actual game for another couple of days.

So, to recap :

The Captain is the owner of record of the ship, and we don't need to say who exactly paid for the ship. The rest of what the Edge does is at the bottom of my last post, above.

The Nouveau Riche Edge gives you the starting money from Filthy Rich without any continuing income.

The +4 military armor is now $500.

We're taking 20% off the top of your profits for food, fuel, maintenance, insurance, taxes, and docking fees.

Please update your PC's accordingly. Sorry for the changes, but the setting will be better for them. Thanks for all your ideas and input!

Rigor - I had considered a group-owned ship, and since you and Atlas agree, let's go with that.

Rigor said : "For maritime law, you would probably need an official Captain, for the registration, and to be responsible for making sure the ship and its maneuvers comply with maritime law."

I've already made changes, and the Captain's Edge currently reads "You are the owner of record of a starship." That accounts for the registration and responsibility, and contract-signing. Now that I think about it, with this in the Edge, do we even need to define whether one person or the entire group "owns" (paid for) the ship?

Rigor said : "Day to day, we might function more as a democracy, with the captain winning in the case of a tie. The captain would also have in the moment authority to make decisions necessary for preserving the ship."

That's basically what Therenger said earler, and I've already incorporated it into the new version of the Edge. Altho I've added your tie-breaking, thanks!

I'd say that to expect any kind of continual income from Filthy/Rich in this setting, you'd have to live in and belong to the Alliance, for access to those modern banking and investments. But the PC's don't. I think the Nouveau Riche Edge is good as-is, since it gives you the starting money from Filthy Rich for just one Edge.

Now that I think about it, in-game availability of the +4 armor really isn't the issue, it's the in-system price-for-performance that matters. If it's priced too low, everyone will take it.

Does anyone else have an opinion on having the +4 armor available only as an Edge (pro or con)?

If we don't use the Edge, I've re-thought the price : $500 means that you can start with the armor *and nothing else*, or take Nouveau Riche Edge, or wait until you can afford it in-game. Similar to SWADE's kevlar-with inserts price. ALL - thoughts?

Atlas - your well-reasoned and realistic description of how to handle the overhead is exactly what I'm trying to avoid (FFF, remember?) :). And in the current setting rules, you get paid by the ton and by the week, so that's already factored in. And along with the 20% off-the-top, I think that's a good tradeoff between gritty realism and ignoring the issue altogether.

As far as space combat goes, your ship has no external weapons (they're illegal in the Alliance), so if the Alliance shows up, you stop and let them board, and if pirates show up, you can try to out-run them.

ALL - since it now covers many more things now than just food, fuel, and repair, I'm going to go with 20% off-the-top.

The Captain's Edge currently reads :

You are the owner of record of a starship. You can spend Bennies on any Piloting, Astrogation, or Repair roll concerning your ship, even if you’re not making them. You are also the one who signs the contracts, and are legally responsible for any goods you are transporting. Because this is not the military, you cannot order your companions to do things that they must obey. The entire group makes decisions, with the Captain breaking any ties. However, if there is a decision to be made that specifically affects the ship itself, after deliberating with your companions, you have the final say. You and your companions share profits and losses equally.

Thoughts?

Rigor - just as a by-the-way, you said about Filthy Rich : "However, without the income, the edge is next to worthless, as starting money will very soon been ancient history, so it makes permanently sinking an edge pretty unwise."

But I just noticed in SWADE, it says about Rich (and Filthy Rich, too) : "If a regular income is appropriate for this setting, the hero receives the modern-day equivalent of a $150,000 annual salary."

Sounds to me like the option to only get a boost in starting funds is already built-in. But I'm not going to argue the point, I'm just going to add Nouveau Rich.

Therenger - If Inrk doesn't make a post in 2 more days, you can have Captain.

Putting this in a Spoiler, just because...

Ok, several issues to discuss...

Rigor - I can understand your going to the Sci-Fi Companion because I brought it up, but...sorry, there's too much stuff in it that players might want, that would be non-canon and/or unbalanced. However, I did say in the setting document that Rich and Filthy Rich were unavailable, and the Filthy Rich I was offering the player to get the spider-walker was just being used as an example of why the legs were unavailable. Sorry for the confusions.

I think I can solve the debate about the Filthy/Rich Edges by creating a new one : Nouveau Riche. It provides the starting wealth of Filthy Rich, but no extended income. So you're getting part of the benefit of two Edges for the price of one. Sound good? (P.S. - I'm open to better names for the Edge...)

I wanted to offer the armor that we saw Zoe had, but if I offer it as an item that can be bought, then if the price is too low, everyone will have it, and if the price is too high, why offer it at all? Hence, I thought offering it as an Edge puts a high "price" on it that everyone could "afford" if they wanted to. How about this : make the price $2000, so that you *have* to take the Nouveau Riche Edge, and it leaves you with the $500 regular starting money. I know the price is not in-line with SWADE armors, but this is Firefly, and these things are *rare*. Thoughts? Preferences on Edge vs. high price?

I concede the issue about swords, both Rigor and Atlas make good arguments. No need even for specialization.

Therenger said : "I would also never seek to infringe on any other player's agency, but I would expect that whenever there is a decision to be made that specifically affects the ship itself that after a respectful deliberation the Captain would get final say". Well said! Can I add a variation of that to the Edge? Irnk hasn't posted since his initial post 3 days ago, so I'm inclined to say you can be the Captain.

Therenger said : "If we take a job for 1000 credits, that's assumed to already account for the cost of fuel, food, port fees, regulations, taxes, administrative overhead, etc..." Actually, in the setting description, you take 10% of your profit and "throw it away" to pay for food, fuel, and repairs...

Adam - I know it makes perfect sense for there to be a "trader's union", but I'm going to introduce the concept as a major plot-line in the game. Also, regarding insurance and inspections (and docking fees), in my head I had rolled those into the 10% of the take put towards food, fuel, and repairs. I'll add those in explicitly.

ALL : since now food, fuel, repairs, insurance, inspections, and docking fees are being skimmed off the top, does 10% sound too low? Maybe 15% or even 20%? (Yes, I know that greed is going to want to make you say 10% is fine, but I want to be at least a little realistic... :)

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now about the legalities issue I brought up, which I knew was going to open a big ol' can-o-worms...

I'm looking for something that addresses the issue, but is simple to implement.

I don't want some faceless NPC to own the ship, part of the charm of the series is that everyone is invested (emotionally, at least) in the ship.

It seems like the best solution is to have the Captain own the ship (handwaving how he got it), so he signs all the paperwork, and is legally responsible for it and its actions. And he agrees that everyone on board gets an equal portion of the profits (since his expenses are being paid for by that lost 10-20%) and losses. Thoughts?

I'm thinking I should add that last part to the setting rules, so that some future player who becomes Captain can't decide to take 50% of the profits and the other PC's split the rest...

Mokshai - sure, no problem, it will probably take several days to get the various issues of discussion sorted out!

Philo - sorry you won't be joining us, good luck in the future!

Adam - I forgot about the test drive. <time passes> I just looked at it, and it only gives basic rules on how to play, but nothing about how to create a character.

Just thinking out loud...

Something Adam just said made me start thinking...someone's got to be "legally" responsible for receiving and delivering cargo (even when you're smuggling it), and that person would probably have the title "Captain".

Problem is, that sounds more like a Hindrance than an Edge.

I suppose the PC's could create an association, partnership, or co-op (not technically legal, but by consent) which makes everyone equally responsible? That would also guarantee everyone gets an equal split in the profits (or losses). But someone would have to be the one who signs their names to the paperwork (or shakes the hand of the smuggler).

I haven't had time to take it any farther, anyone want to comment on this idea, or run somewhere with it?

And, just checking, does any of the existing PC's have the Captain Edge? No need to reply if you don't.

Mokshai - I don't know of any free ones, but the SWADE PDF costs only $10.

Cucumber - we have 4 finished PC's, and 4 people who have expressed an interest but haven't posted PC's yet. So sure, create a PC if you're interested. I'd suggest you read all my posts here before starting, because I've made some changes to the rules in the original setting document. But yes, only one psionic on the team, and we already have one, sorry.

Rigor - just looked at your PC, and sorry, but the Sci-Fi Companion is off-limits (it would open a WAY too big can 'o worms!). If you want extra armor, take the Military Armor Edge.

The medications you listed as items will be available in the ship's medbay.

You can have the Rich Edge, but it's only a one-time startup thing, you don't get any guaranteed monthly/yearly income. I actually disallowed it in the current setting rules, but I think this is a good trade-off.

Atlas - you list two Powers. You got one for free with the Gifted Edge, just checking that you spent character creation points for the second? Also, can you list your specific delusion and habit?

Sorry, the Stun Gun is off-limits (non-canon [actually, the Alliance has them, I'll have to add that to the setting]). Besides, because of your freaking out, no one in the party is going to let you carry *any* kind of weapon!

Therenger - can you describe your debt? Also, I don't have time to cross-reference everything, but I calculate your Parry as 4 and your Toughness as 6(1), unless Obese or something else factors in.

Adam - really sorry, but for reasons I can't get into now, there isn't a "Free Traders Union" (never thought anyone would think of that). Maybe your connections can be Alliance or ex-Alliance people? It would be very handy to have some people still in the Alliance that can do favors for you.... Your NPC's can still be traders, but they're independents.

Waiting on PC descriptions from : Mokashi, Philo, Joseph, Irnk.

You don't have to make your PC from these archetypes, but it might be good to have a repairman (Atlas has graciously offered to have these skills, but it just seems strange having a psionic also doing repairs) and a really strong fighter-type (high Shooting, Fighting, and Athletics). No problem at all if you want to do something different.

So far we have the following PC's :
Rigor - Able (medic)
Therenger - Perenian (pilot)
Adam - Mark (ex-operative)
Atlas - Emma (psychic & repair)

Once everyone posts a PC, I'll open a Discussion board and you can describe how you ended up on the ship. You can have been on-board for some time, or just boarded on the current planet the ship is on. Be thinking about it until then...

So, if this is too much information, just ignore it...

Regarding weapon specialization :

For both a d6 and d8 attack, specialization reduces your chance of hitting a target with Parry 5-7 (remember, in Firefly, you don't wear armor in a sword duel) by about half (as compared to without the -2). But, that still means that a d8 attack against Parry 5 has about a 25% chance of hitting.

Based on Mal's performance in the TV show, that's still too high. If I recall correctly, he didn't get in a single hit in the entire fight (well, he got one minor cut in, but it was implied that the other guy let him get that).

But with the default d4-2 I'm suggesting for Fighting/Swords, you'd have only a 6-12% chance of hitting. I like this better.