Orelius Lionpaw's page

Can the Spell Rider (Magus/Cav) MCA be slotted in above Browman?

I've nearly completed it.

Feel free to adapt it, I think I actually like it better as a single replacement instead of a full MCA, plus I don't have the time to work on it.

Cool, thank you!

If you would, put the Spell Rider in the queue in place of whatever *my* next MCA will be, as I have more developed ideas for this one.

#Steak Summoner (accidental typo, but it's funny so I left it in)

I like it. Gills should be allowed for underwater campaigns.

I would like to adopt LoneKnave's idea for the Magus/Cavalier MCA, as it looks really interesting, and no one seems to have paid attention to it. I think the mount should be summoned by a Ray attack and then automatically Charge to whatever enemy was supposed to be hit by the ray attack, dealing the damage of one of those rays (if there are multiple). The mount would then last for, say, 1 round/level or 1 minute after that, dealing damage as a Cavalier mount chosen by the Spell Rider (I like the name and am going to keep it). The mount would act as a Cavalier's mount for the purposes of HD, saves, etc, except it could fly. There could also be Arcanas to give the mount Pounce and perhaps modify it (since it is composed of arcane energy).

The mount could also be summoned by some sort of "Spell Rider's Challenge," where the Spell Rider issues a challenge as part of a ray attack, and he and his mount gain Challenge bonuses against that creature - the Mount lasting as long as the Challenged creature is conscious.

Actually, I would LOVE to play something like that!

D:

it just seems so bland so far... I kind of want to wait if anyone else has any ideas on it.

Those are all great.

That's why I want something else to do with this MCA.

It's too easy.

Hm... I coulda sworn they got 6+INT skill ranks per level.
Oh well.

6+INT skill points per level would be best for this MCA, since it isn't INT-centric and it will have so many skills.

Whatever, I'm easy.

EDIT: Let's not worry about the name, you think of the MCA?

The MCA should be getting 6+INT skill points. The Summoner base skill point/level rate is 6+INT, not 2+INT.

There could certainly be more unique things in this class. I don't know what those things could be, though.

If we go with Stealth Summoner (I really don't hate it, just wanted to see if anyone had something better), then I think we'll just call the "stealth eidolon" an "eidolon" instead, to avoid redundancy of saying "stealth" for everything, as, it's really only some minor changes, not overhauls like other MCAs.

@Orelius
We can do that. I always find it easier to pare things down than building things up.

But the Stealth Summoner and the Stealth Eidolon must learn to Stealth Sneak and Stealth Kill together!

(Not as fun as using "space" or "in space" for everything. The Space Summoner must rescue his space Eidolon from the space-aliens! IN SPACE!)

#Stealth Summoner
I don't know, the name is kind of boring, but it rolls off the tongue so well...

Also, Elghinn, I really think we should allow at least the Large and Mount evolutions.

Can you clarify the 2 point evolution? Is it an extra die added to SA damage for all natural attacks?

I think there should just be a clause in the 1 point evolution: "If you spend an additional (2?) point(s), this Sneak Attack damage applies to attacks with manufactured weapons, stacking each time you select this upgrade."

So if the eidolon has access to 3 natural attacks, it can spend 3 or 6 extra points beyond the original sneak attack evolution to add this sneak attack damage to attacks with manufactured weapons.

Of course, we would then have to balance this with the good possibility that the Eidolon uses both manufactured weapons and natural attacks...

We could instead treat manufactured weapons as a separate natural attack, but make it so that the eidolon can stack SA damage dice on manufactured weapon attacks, up to a maximum of the Stealth Summoner's Sneak Attack dice (minimum 1). Each time the Eidolon adds one die to his manufactured weapon attacks, he may add a sneak attack die to one less natural attack. So at level 1, the Eidolon would use a Dagger(for example). The Summoner adds Sneak Attack damage to the Eidolon's attack with the dagger, and can now only add a die of sneak attack to two of the Eidolon's natural attacks.

Yes, we should be able to do both, as the reduction to paladin summoning will alos allow some adjustments to the eidolon, like I've suggested. If you/we (emphasis on you) don't want to go the sneak attack and rogue talent route with the eidolon, that's fine. Now, a limit of +1d6 in conjunction with it's multiattack would balance fine, as such attacks would need to be on the same target anyways. Ultimately, that could give it a total of +7d6 sneak attack with a max of 7 natural attacks. Could also limit it to only 1/2 its max attacks can be sneaks. Either way, we have lots of maneuvering room to build tis thing with paladin spellcasting.

So it would be one extra point cost per natural attack to get the sneak attack? or would it be a flat bonus?

I feel it should be able to take an evolution to get the same number of SAs as the Summoner if it uses a manufactured weapon (this is common later on).

Maybe the Eidolon could get a new 2-point evolution to take a Rogue Talent that is not an Advanced Talent. That way it could get Weapon Finesse, Poison Use, Etc.

#Stealth Summoner

I like the reduction to paladin spellcasting, since beyond 4th level spells, the Summoner starts to get world-changing Wizard toys.

Honestly, I kind of want both - though the 'stealthy summoner' should recieve more focus, since the Eidolon by nature is easy to change.

#Stealth Summoner

@Elghinn: We seem to be going in different directions with this. I wanted the Stealth Summoner to essentially be a Rogue with Eidolon support.

I think having such a reduced number of Sneak Attack dice AND an Evolution to give those to the Eidolon is going a bit too far in diluting the abilities.

Instead of Diminished Spellcasting, we could allow the Summoner to choose Rogue-Style SLAs, say one every two levels, up to 4th level spells. Each of them castable (4-Spell Level, up to a max of twice per day) times per day.

the MCA should get more RTs for losing the Summon Monster line, since he is losing a huge boon to flanking in return for his rogue talents. Actually, that gives me an idea for a Rogue/Summoner MCA... Add it to the queue.

And reducing the number of evolutions the Eidolon gets - especially for a Summoner-based MCA - is going a bit too far in my opinion.

your suggested Uncanny Dodge and Imp. Uncanny Dodge's point costs are too high considering the actual value of the abilities, especially since the eidolon gets fewer hit dice than a PC anyways.

I do like the limits on the Eidolon Magic line, but if players want to make their stealthy Eidolon Huge, they should be able to do it - the fact that it isn't a good idea should keep most from doing it.

@Secondary Discussion: I tend to go Starfox's way when it comes to building these things.

#Stealth Summoner

Maybe the Eidolon could only get SA from its target being flat-footed. Of course, a 2-point evolution to add Sneak Attack up to an upper limit of the master's would be a simpler solution, I think.

I feel like the Rogue talents themselves were originally meant to 'compensate' the Rogue's lack of spellcasting - of course, it wasn't very successful. Those RTs are there mostly for flavor.

And to your last point, this is a Summoner MCA - it only needs to keep from passing the Summoner, a T2 class.

We could just remove spellcasting outside of a few SLAs (e.g. Blur).

Alright...
here is
the stealth summoner (WIP class name)
Primary Class: Summoner
Secondary Class: Rogue

Sneak Attack (Ex): At 1st level, and every three levels thereafter, the Stealth Summoner gains one die of Sneak Attack, as the Rogue ability. The Eidolon gains an equal number of Sneak Attack dice. This replaces the Summon Monster SLA.

Diminished Spellcasting (Su): as the normal ability

Stealthy Eidolon (Su): The Stealth Summoner's Eidolon has the same base stats as an Eidolon of the Serpentine base form, no matter what their actual form is. In addition, its high saves are always Reflex and Will. This means that the Eidolon's base form only affects the base evolutions granted, and the weapon/attack size (in the case of a Biped base form).

Rogue Talents (Su or Ex): The Stealth Summoner gains a Rogue Talent every five levels, gaining access to Advanced Rogue Talents as normal for a Rogue of his level. The Eidolon also gains these talents. These talents replace spells lost due to Diminished Spellcasting.

Alright, so far, here is who is in the running:

Akoto - Goliath Psionic Warrior
Flibber de Gibbet - Blue Psion(Nomad)
Xarnaas Szell-Kazoth - Ophiduan Vitalist
Devian - Human Psion(Telepath/Kineticist)
Thak - Human Cryptic 1/Inquisitor 3
Diaz - Human Marksman

Various other ideas for marksmen, Aegii, etc.

please post at least a tentative background if you would like to join - otherwise I think we have our first party.

Things are looking good, Vrog!

@Talinthal: I've been pretty busy lately, sorry. I might be running a second party, depending on how many finalized characters I get. Lots of great character ideas so far!

@everyone else: there is definitely room for more!

;)

There is no slavery in Aeon, not on the surface.

Wealth is standard for your level.

Hi all! sorry I haven't been active lately.

There sure are a lot of Goliaths in this group. It'll be interesting, I think.

@Vrog, it would be best if you started the recruitment thread for the Arcane Horde, since you've spent time designing it and you will be DMing.

sounding off! still interested.

christos gurd wrote:

If I were to make a suggestion on this, simply grant a modified shadow bloodline and keep it simple.

I think we'll guse have the Bloodline entry say that the Shadow Bloodline complements the Ki Mage archetype. I know we on occasion do pigeonhole MCAs into specific bloodlines/schools/orders/etc., but I don't think it's necessary here.

Starfox wrote:

Trying to find something clever to say and failing. Swaps look ok, possibly a tad weak considering how expensive the spells are to use. The concept is a ninja movie classic.

If others feel the swaps could be a tad weak, we can always reinsert No Trace or Light Steps. OR we simply put Light Steps with the ki pool, allowing her to expend ki points to use it? Or have it be an "at least 1 ki point" ability. Haven't actually done the write-ups yet to see how it all fleshes out, probably tomorrow or so.

Orelius wrote:

Orelius - Resident Summoner MCA Expert

Resident expert? You've only done one MCA of your own so far, Orelius

(and yes it was a Summoner MCA). Just saying...:D ;)(Notice the smile and winky smile. I really wish they have emoticons on here)

Well I'm SAYING that because I've only submitted Summoner-based MCAs and helped out on others' Summoner-based concepts.

Here's my character sheet

Greatly simplified backstory- Thak was a small-time spy for one of Aeon's trading partners when he was kidnapped by worshipers of Asmodeus. Through a mixture of brainwashing and genuine conversion, Thak has been sent back to the city, a changed man, ready to promote his fiery lord's hand.

Note that Thak is Lawful Neutral, not Lawful Evil; probably Lawful Evil by your terms if evil means 'cares more about himself' rather than 'enjoys orphan sandwiches'.

It really depends on how far the character will go to help himself.

I'm using the "swap with powers known" ruleset.

@Davachido: yes, recruitment is still going - we currently have three characters entered, and I'm accepting up to six.

Can I see the Goliath build first, or should I just make a large sized half giant?

Oh, you misunderstood me. Goliaths are just renamed half-giants. sorry.

Yes, what vrog said.

#planar witch
I agree with Christos, the domain powers don't really fit the flavor of the class... besides the fact that they're wisdom-based. We don't need diminished spellcasting, as this is a caster class through-and-through.

-Orelius, resident Summoner MCA expert

@Arkwright: Standard Golarion deities, but worship is illegal in Aeon. A lot of people worship gods anyways though, barring Nethys.

@All: I really hope I don't have to boot anyone... I'll get with the guy who helped me build the city and see if he wants to run a secondary campaign. Or maybe I can just run a second party, idk.

Would you like me to re-do the background of my character and make an avatar? Would making a thrall herd be appropriate?

I don't know if a Thrallherd would be wise... I don't really like 'em.

Lots of Goliaths in this party, lol.

Do I have to post an actor? I know literally nothing about actors or their names or anything. I just like movies.

@Wesley: I am ok with this. I would recommend Soulknife, just because they get full BAB, and we have a sh*t ton of casters already.

I'll update my NPCs in accordance with Harvey's method, then.

@Talinthal: Yes, except it costs money paid in either time served in the Legion or just plain paid.

On a side note, after reading a short thing in another campaign about how to be evil, I really really hate the way DnD and Pathfinder portrays 'evil'. THEY portray it as the destruction of things for the sake of destruction, but in actuality, it's more of a 'I will take care of myself first and foremost' situation.

I'd like to join as a Maenad Wilder.

We're still pretty early in the recruitment phase, Talin. I'm trying to write up the campaign world info before I really get to deciding.

@Talinthal: Also, your character submission would be a good fit for the Psionic Academy, I think. Maybe add that into your backstory.

Alright, I *think* there's enough to start up or refine backstories. Also, worship of the Divine is forbidden in Aeon. There's an amusing backstory to that, which I will type up later.

Aw crud, sorry everyone, I've been... busy... playing Pokemon X and dodging essays all weekend. Also the system was down for all but 6 hours on the weekend and I couldn't be bothered with trying to use it after a while.

I'll start getting everything up.

@Arkwright, outside the City is a wilderness. The most powerful entity out there is a barbaric Horde, but they're too wrapped up in their own problems to give a fudge about Aeon at the moment. There are also several trading partners with the Eastern City, who I'm sure would LOVE to find something to blackmail the city with.

@Elton, thank you.

@Flibber de Gibbet, approved. Just remember that Evil characters aren't necessarily complete douches, they just care less about life that is not theirs.

I'm sure you will. You don't get hosed by dismissal lol. Aren't we all supposed to be on the super-hero level at level 10 anyway?

Oh crud, I forgot about dismissal... I'll be having Chomps take the Iron Will chain, then.

Hey, just for fun, could Nalgi's Sharks and Chomps take a teamwork feat to share the Capsize evolution, so that the sharks could Aid Another on Chomps?

@Steven: A 3rd party called Abandoned Arts. They create a lot of feats and stuff that flesh out the options available more.

@Nalgi: Don't worry, the scrolls cost like 2000 gold. Wands, though... I don't know.

So with my plan, it's a DC 35 check to capsize a Warship, and Chomps will have a Strength score of, like, 34 MINIMUM, and he will be around level 10 by the time we actually have to deal with one...

I suddenly see us needing some masks of underwater breath.

1. Take a level of Druid(Pack Lord) and purchase a Wand of Animal Growth.
2.Pay a wizard in one of the ports to cast Permanency.
3.???
4.Profit.

And then, I can get that wizard to cast Permanency on Chomps when I cast Enlarge Person, making him the next size up from Huge...

GARGANTUAN apparently. Geez.

About halfway through with the basic world info, still need to type up the descriptions of the Noble Houses and the standings of the different races.

You can see it in the campaign info tab.

yeppers, I'm the Halfling cavalier.

Yeah, kinda, sadly. I'm running a homebrew psionic campaign now, and there are a couple of psionic classes that have Eidolons if you're still interested.

There just wasn't enough interest in this thread.

Don't forget Antal. At 7th level, he will get Gills through the Aspect summoner ability.

I could totally see your sharks using Aid Another to help beat the DC.

CHOMPS, KING OF SHARKS

I must now make fanart of this and make a deviantart account and post it there.