Weight Seller

Nifty Butterfinger's page

29 posts. Alias of frank whited.


Grand Lodge

I just discovered these iconics. can anyone tell me if there is an Amiri mini in any of these packs?

Grand Lodge

Rysky wrote:

The only difference Lethal/Nonlethal means in P2 (aside from Resistances and Immunties) is whether it's the final hit to take someone down. You don't track 2 different HP tracks like in P1.

Nonlethal is a modifier to the damage, Mental is the type of dammage.

I have searched and searched but cannot find where the rules say only the last strike/hit which is non-lethal counts. Can you give me chapter and verse of where that idea/rule is presented in the game please?



Grand Lodge

Titandagger wrote:
well your wrong for 2e. "In most cases, Small or Medium creatures can wield a Large weapon, though it’s unwieldy, giving them the clumsy 1 condition, and the larger size is canceled by the difficulty of swinging the weapon, so it grants no special benefit. Large armor is simply too large for Small and Medium creatures." pg. 295 core which is why I don't understand titan mauler in 2e.

It's my understanding that the benefit for Giant Instinct Barbarians is that their rage provides greater damage (i.e. +6 vs. +2) while using the over-sized weapon

My question is does the weapon not gain a damage increase for being a large-sized variety of the base? From the rules in the equipment section of the CRB ("Increasing Die Size", pg. 279) it appears that there is a maximum damage type for any weapon, that being a d12.

I thought I had found an inconsistency because there are some giants in the MM1 (2nd Ed Bestiary - but MM1 resonates with my brain better - stick with me here - lol) whose large-sized weapon used 2d12 as opposed to the 1d12 but then I had to remember these pesky new-fangled "striking" runes do just that - they double the damage dice.

Does anyone have any information where the size increases to weapon damage actually goes above the d12?



Grand Lodge

Where is the best place to post errors in the product (like referenced page numbers in the 2E CRB being off)? I realize this is a published product but maybe an errata sheet or changes to the PDF to limit the confusion this might create.

Also, one of the monsters is referencing the PF Bestiary 6. Is this an error or should we have to have 1E books to run this AP?

Grand Lodge

I'm playing at being a necromancer today and do hereby resurrect this thread from the dead in order to ask the following questions:

1. What is the current [Aug 2018] state of using Realm Works/Hero Lab with the various VTTs out there?

2. Where does Paizo stand on selling content for Realm Works?

I ask these here because I just recently re-discovered my Realm Works program and am not up to speed on the most current developments

Thanks guys!


Grand Lodge

After reading all of this... I'm looking for the rules to make the Rat a PC class...lol

Call him "Boss Rat"!

Grand Lodge

The idea behind Resonance is an interesting one, but with no real ratification for overspending I am not sure that it make a lot of difference.

That is unless I read the rule incorrectly.

Grand Lodge

Cure Light Wounds

Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.


I forgot to answer your question,

The players will know about the inclusion of Mythic opportunities from the get-go and that they will be very difficult.

For the starting adventure, I plan on it being the very last thing they can do on the Shiv prior to being rescued - at least until after they defeat/drive off the BBEG. On the others, I feel in the latter 1/3 of the adventure is the appropriate place to put them.

I am thinking about slowing the leveling progression to the Advancement Track recommendation minus 1. This will keep the work of advancing critters to a minimum.


Grand Lodge

My hope is to have a challenge available for the group for each installment of the game with the headless god Ydersius being the final mythic challenge IF and only if the group pursue the mythic challenges of their own volition. I won't sit them in front of their path but I thought to use what ideas can come from this excellent and auspicious player base to make the discovery greater.

Thanks Tacticslion, I look forward to hearing back from you.


Grand Lodge

I do hereby Necro this posting for the sum reason of answering my questions. Do so to my satisfaction and you may return to your slumbers!

On the Topic of Mythic:

My players are intrigued with the Mythic Adventures which recently dropped and I am not inclined to hand them anything like the power of Mythic for which they have not worked. I was considering having the pictographs in the temple to Zura make references to an entombed champion of the serpent folk which they had plans to unearth and use in some pleasant debauchery, but the events of Earthfall made this plan null and void.

Fast-forward to present day Golarion and the PCs have a Mythic creature to earn their "wings" on by slaying it and taking its mythic power for themselves. I think the encounter should be hard and will warn them ahead of time that challenges like these will have to be searched out and will push them to prove their worthiness.

Do any of you have any thoughts about how best to make this event the most "mythical" it can be and any ideas about the "champion" itself? I had a Degenerate Serpent Folk in mind initially and now I am not 100% certain. I'll do the Advancement Track instead of XP so they'll be APL4 while I was interested in pushing a CR7+ or CR8 at them.


Thanks in advance...


Grand Lodge

Craig123, your math seems to be coming up pretty much right on, but some of the terms used are a little off. (You may ask why even bother bringing it up and the answer is: because some of these bonuses are specifically named and as a result do not always stack with another bonus of the same name)

Gnome Bbn1:

BaB: +1
Size Bonus to hit: +1
Strength bonus to hit: +3 (assumes a 16 or 17 STR score)

So the longsword to hit modifier is indeed +5 and he rolls 1d6+3 damage should the roll be high enough to hit his enemy. Should he use the weapon in two hands, the damage becomes 1d6+4 because he gets his STR modifier x 1.5 (remember to round down when multiplying) as a damage bonus instead of +3.

BaB: +1
Size Bonus to hit: +1
Dexterity bonus to hit: +2 (assumes a 14 or 15 DEX score)

The shortbow to hit modifier is +4 and he rolls 1d4 for damage. Should he begin using a composite shortbow, he could begin to take advantage of his higher Strength. Read the rules about Composite bows carefully because there are a few issues with having one and then getting your STR damaged or drained.

You do not normally add DEX bonuses to shortbow attacks.

Hope this helps,


Grand Lodge

What is your Average Party Level (APL)? How many critters of this CR are you dealing with? How many encounters are you having in a given game day?

All of these can be factors that make your games easier/harder.

Let's say your party of 4 are all level 10 so your APL is 10. If you have 1 or 2 encounters with a single CR10 monster each time, you probably will stomp through most encounters easily. If you start having 5-8 encounters of multiple monsters that equal out to a CR10 encounter, you will find that the latter 2-4 are very tough because you have used up much of your resources for the day.

There can be other mitigating factors, but these are common reasons that the encounters seem easy.

Grand Lodge

Can you give an example of the monsters/opponents you have been facing and have completely mowed them down?


Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I also think it depends largely on what the background of this critter is hiding in:

Is the Assassin Vine hiding among a mass of other, normal vines? If so and the Assassin Vine remains still (depending on the result of another Stealth check), I don't think the PCs should auto-spot it. They would have to take the Move action to try (maybe even do so twice in their turn for the round).

Is the Assassin Vine simply hanging by itself against some bare rocks then it would be pretty easy for a highly perceptive party member to point out what they suspect is an enemy ("Hey, that vine just moved! Right there, the vine on the rock! It moved!!"). Depending on how the PC has been roleplayed, the others may just think he is pranking them, but they could see it - even if they failed their Perception check.

Again, adding distance & darkness to the mix would alter this by each PCs vision & Perception rolls.


Grand Lodge

I could live with this too.



Gilarius wrote:

My take on this item is:

1. I don't like healing items which never run out, but 5 charges per day is not terribly excessive. I would however apply an additional limitation, that no individual can benefit from more than 5 applications per day. This is to rule out someone making lots of these and using them too many times. YMMV.

2. Restrictions. As far I am concerned, the price reductions from any restrictions only apply to the sale price. There is no discount on crafting cost.

3. Price. 3000gp, or 1500 to craft feels about right. Pricing is always an art, the suggested numbers in the rulebook are merely a place to start not the sole arbiter.

Grand Lodge

shadowkras wrote:

so you cant apply that rule for that item

Oh, but as the DM, I can, indeed apply that rule. From my perspective, that is a continuous item that has been modified to have charges per day. For this reason Footnote #2 can and does apply, but I decided the price was too high for what the item did. This was my judgement call as is my purview as arbiter in my campaign.

shadowkras wrote:

Also, that space multiplier (2x) is only for items that do occupy a slot normally, but wont.

I see this as an error in thinking because the wondrous item you are talking about falls under the footnote #3 where it says:

An item that does not take up one of the spaces on a body costs double
shadowkras wrote:

By the way, thanks, the term i was looking for is "balm", not "oil". But just couldnt remember the word we used.

Happy to be of assistance :)

shadowkras wrote:

Let me just quote the rules i mentioned on this post:

I think you got a little off base with the rules you are talking about on #4. That footnote is referring to spell component costs which was never mentioned in my response to your original post, but that is okay, Cure Light Wounds has no material component, costly or otherwise, so that rule has no bearing here.

We'll just have to agree to disagree about how we price things the players come up with in our own campaigns. Nothing you'll say will convince me that the way I would do it is wrong, just as I would never even attempt to say your way is wrong either. I believe in the purview of the DM - must be the old school in me. Ha ha!

One thing I didn't mention is that in our games we do not allow PCs to reduce the price of things that are clearly not disadvantageous for them to use. If they want to take a reduction in cost, they have to make it harder for them to actually use the item. Like making an item that can only be used by a class they are not and thus requiring an UMD check to activate it.

Tata for now!


Grand Lodge

I think you might have stopped too soon on the table (15-29 of the CRB, pg. 550) in pricing the item.

I agree with your assessment that this is a "use-activated or continuous" time since the user has to use the Heal skill to make sure it is rubbed in thoroughly (hence warranting the 10% reduction in price). This give the item a base price of 2,000gp.

From here we must look at the footnote #2. This spell (Cure Light Wounds) has a duration that is shorter than round/level and the shorter the duration, the more the items seem to cost. There is no duration shorter than rounds on the list, but I would either just use the rounds adjustment and multiply by 4 or even extrapolate that durations shorter than rounds get a x8 multiplier. For my example I'll stick with x4 and increase the cost of the item to 8,000gp.

From here we jump down to the somewhat confusing Charges section. This item contains 5 charges and according to the writing you are to divide the price by a number equal to (5 divided by the number of charges or "5" in this case). The result of this is you are dividing by 5/5 or 1, so no change in the price. If the charges were 10/day then you would divide by 5/10 or 1/2. In math, when you divide by a fraction, it is the same as multiplying by the inverse of the fraction (10/5 or 2/1 or 2 in this case). I only wrote about this section to clear up the math error Pupsocket was having and to say it is a common one people run into sometimes.

After this, you run into the fact that this wondrous item has no space limitation and must multiply the total by 2 which brings us to 16,000gp. Looking at this I am thinking this price is a bit much for an item whose only effect is to give an application of CLW, 5 times a day and one who you have to use the Heal skill to utilize. The use outside of combat I would probably ignore and just require that each charge takes 1 full minute to properly rub in. This will effectively make it unusable in combat, but if someone really wanted to, they could stand there for 10 rounds working this balm into the wounded person's skin as battle rages all around.

So let's take out the x4 requirement for the short duration (I suspect many of you disagreed with my assumption anyway, but that is of no concern - I was asked how I would rule) and the price drops to 4,000gp which is further modified by a 10% reduction due to the skill requirement making the total price 3,600gp and 1,800gp to craft. This seems appropriate to me because what if a PC decided to have 4 or 5 of these made and hand them out to his henchmen whose only job is to stand there during combat and rub the ointment into his/her wounds? Or the same PC uses the ointments to keep himself/herself fully healed between battles?

In any case, that is how I would rule it.



shadowkras wrote:

How would you guys rule the pricing for a wondrous item that allows cure light wounds 5 times a day?

Few sessions ago, the bard in my group asked me to let him craft an oil that can be applied on wounds that heals as cure light wounds (1d8+1) 5 times a day, with the restriction that he needs the Heal skill to apply it and that it cant be used in combat (the oil takes time to take effect).

I checked the table and following the examples (latern of revelation and cape of mountebank), if the effect is continuous it is 2000 po base price, but if it has a command word anyone can use it as long as they know that word, which goes to 1800 po.

What i dont get is why the use activated and continuous effect are the same price. Or it doesnt matter at all?

Anyway, i based the final price on 2000 po, with a reduction of 30% due to all the restrictions. And allowed him to craft it for 700 po.
Note that a skill restriction is only 10%, while a class or alignment restriction is 30%, and you cant apply both. I ruled it as 30% for being both a skill (RaW) and only outside combat (house) because otherwise he would just make it "bard-only" restriction, and since he is the one carrying it around and applying it, it didnt really matter.

Back to the initial question, how would you guys rule the creation of an item like that?

Grand Lodge

My group and I are a bunch of old curmudgeons who have played since the original pamphlets came out. Over the years we have developed, tossed and even forgotten reams of house rules. The list that follows are what currently fill the ToHR (Tome of House Rules)

- I am the DM and I reserve to right to enforce or throw out any of the "rules" as I see fit depending on the demands of my campaign. Generally I default to RAW.
- Characters use 2d6+6, 6 times, net modifier bonus must equal +1, & arrange to taste for ability score generation. (18,11,9,9,8,8 is unplayable)
- healing of those in negative hp works as such: at moment of healing, raise hp to "1" and count healing up from there (resultant from my penchant for running "rigorous" combats)
- death occurs at negative CONx2 (but monsters do not always change targets when the current one drops - the tricksey PCs are known to attempt to "feign death")
- <stolen from D&D Next> in between combats characters have a pool of health they can recoup by taking 10 minutes to rest, eat a bite and catch their breath (also requires the expenditure of 2 "uses" of a healers kit) . This pool of hp is a number of dice equal to their HD/Class Level. The size of the die is the same as they roll for hp increases. For example a Fighter would use a d10, a Cleric would use a d8, etc.; a 5th level fighter would have 5d10 they could spend to recoup. If after a battle and the fight character took little damage, he/she/it could choose to take a break and "spend" 2d10 of healing to repair the shock to his nerves and maybe put a bandage on the scratches (7hp worth of damage in game terms). He/she/it would then roll 2d10 and add the result to the current hp (up to max - leftover is lost). The fighter would then have 3d10 left to use later in the adventure day. Once the PC gets a good night's rest (8 hours or so in any given 24-hour period), the pool of health is reset.
- RP skills are dealt with by what is actually said, not the result of the skill check. telling the chieftain "Give us what we want.. or else..!" while rolling on a Diplomacy check and getting a "30" is still going to illicit a negative reaction. The personality of the player is also taken into account in these situations so that shy people are not overly penalized, so adjudicating these situations can be a little subjective.

There are many others, but this is enough for now.


Grand Lodge

Bodhizen wrote:
..."Good > Lawful, every day" is rubbish...

.. is rubbish, er.. I mean .. is garbage.

The sole reason for being a Paladin is to be Good. To do this you follow the moral codes set down by one's deity and you are Lawful about following them. The rules of Man (or Elf, Dwarf, Orc, etc.), where they do not coincide with that of your deity are not true laws and need not be followed. Where they are in lock-step with that great codified work you embody, there is no higher truth.

This is true for each of the Paladin orders in any game world and illustrates the complexity of personal and organizational point-of-view.

To hold Lawfulness above that of Goodness beholdens the Paladin to every whimsical "law" which might be passed in the area he/she/it happens to be traveling through at the time. Imagine a Paladin traveling through a nation where it was illegal to be a member of the Church of Sarenrae and he happens to run across a small cabal of said Sarenrae priests hidden away. By the Law, he/she/it would be required by the alignment strictures to turn these criminals in to the proper authorities. Even if by doing so he/she/it would be indirectly causing the death of these people.

So, I posit that Good is superior to Law in the LG alignment requirement of the Paladinhood. Defending life (good) is one of the highest callings of these people, protecting the property rights (law) is less so.

Just my 2cp


Grand Lodge

yeah, yeah, yeah... late to the party - what's new.

Dot for Effect!

Grand Lodge

Would it be possible to research a spell that exactly duplicates the spell you want to put into your spellbook?

It may be a little costly, but it should work - subject to DM approval

Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

these others have all touched on some good advice. my group is going through Carrion Crown and we play every other weekend for about 8-10 hours each session. We are older gamers and tend to be sticklers for the precise wording of the rules. We realize this slows us down (not counting the normal delay that age throws in there too) but want to make sure that we are using the RAW.

To combat some of our pace issues we have also developed a few things that help mitigate this slowness. They are:

  • Enforcing a rule that you roll "to hit" & damage together - its amazing how much time looking for your damage dice can add up over the course of a game.
  • We'll reuse initiatives from combat to combat. This helps to remind everyone when they are supposed to take their turn and be prepared for that turn.
  • From time to time, we will have people sit in initiative order and tap the guy next to him when he is done. This speeds the combats tremendously and if people like to switch it up, we re-seat at breaks for food/snacks.
  • I use DM's Familiar when I run and it helps a lot to manage keeping track of combats and even Campaign Details. Hero Lab is also a recent purchase that I think may help me with my time.
  • We sometimes use a dry-erase board to show the initiative order and buffs which are active.

Hope these help somewhat.


Grand Lodge

I don't think the OP gave us enough information. I have a few questions before I would be able to accurately adjudicate this myself:

  • Did the Paladin in question use his/her Detect Evil power to determine if the cult leader was evil?
  • Did the Paladin understand the nature of the effects of a Charm Person Spell? (the spell itself won't make someone act against their nature short of an opposed Cha check - which is reasonable I suppose, but it does not alleviate the cult leader's alignment)
  • Were there other pressing concerns that would not allow the Paladin the time to take the cult leader in for prosecution? Say letting an even greater evil live by dogmatically following the letter of his/her code?
  • How does the DM wish to run Paladins in his/her campaigns? (I tend to hold Paladins in high regard in my campaigns and the common people fawn over them and make much of their holiness & prowess - I also tend to hold them to a narrow line to walk. theirs is not an easy path and those who wish to do so know that they must carefully choose their actions. I also like to pursue the roleplaying aspects of fallen Paladins and their efforts to redeem themselves - but not all care for that kind of campaign)

I think a lot of these things (and others I cannot currently think of, certainly) are needed to understand the actual situation. Looking at what I do know:

The Paladin was part of a group who were battling a cult and as an extension of this understanding, I must presume that the cult was doing bad/evil things. He or she was justified in doing this.
Given that the person let go was the Cult Leader of the people the Paladin was justified in battling, means that the Paladin was justified in battling the Leader too. Mercy is a good quality in Paladins though.
After defeating the cult and their Leader, he/she/it was allowed to surrender and released afterward.

I must say that I feel the Paladin did indeed violate his or her code (the Leader was definitely bad or evil and releasing this individual is the opposite of punishing evil). Is it worthy of defrocking? Probably not if the DM does not want to be seen as a hard-liner (I'm not even that hard on Paladins - I would probably just refuse the use of the Smite ability until the Paladin role-played some serious penance after question to recapture the Leader). Is it worthy of a strong talking-to by the Paladin's order? Absolutely!

I hope I helped some!


Grand Lodge

let's see.. fun/challenging combat scenario with the houserules you use:

how about being attacked in an area of difficult terrain by polearm specialists who are not hindered by the terrain itself... or maybe druids in an area of heavy undergrowth PROTECTED by the polearm specialists!

The druids can cast their distance spells and should the melee types move to attack them, the polearm guys use trips and disarms to keep them at bay. Add in Protection from Arrows from a friendly local Witchdoctor and voila! fun/challenging!


Grand Lodge

also, in the area of combat combos and tactics you can use the following to make the PC's work for it:

One creature focuses on disarming front-line PCs and/or trips the tank to keep him prone. Takes AoO to keep him/her/it on the ground

Use a cleric-type to augment your tank with Shield Other spell and healing to make the hp last and last and last

Make liberal use of Teamwork feats and leave notes to remind yourself to use them!

While using crossbowmen, make sure they have 1 or 2 re-loaders each so they can fire the heavy things each round - bonus points for putting them in a difficult to reach location where the crossbowmen can have some cover (like the trees in the forest section - or heavy undergrowth in chapter 13 of the CRB)

Make the healer invisible and that way he/she/it can heal without ever becoming visible (spell duration not withstanding)

Use low-level sor/wiz mooks with Charm Person Wands. Sure the PCs may have to roll exceptionally low, but at this stage it is a numbers game anyway. Smart players will realize it too and will try to neutralize them as fast as possible. If the mooks have rings of Fire Resistance then there is a reduction to a nominally 50% go-to spell (i.e. Fireball)

Understand that adding terrain and advanced tactics can slow things down some and add to the deadliness. Remember, the PCs are supposed to be heroes and the whole purpose for the game is to make sure everyone around the table has fun. Rolf-stomping mooks is fun for Players but watching their well-loved PC get nickled & dimed into an early grave isn't, but you are smart and know this.

I just wrote it for any who hadn't thought about it or were new.

Grand Lodge

tonyz wrote some pretty good ones but don't forget some other, more common ones too:

It's raining hard which can provide concealment

It's foggy, which does the same thing

The wind is blowing quite strongly which gives all kinds of problems for archers and small critters - flying can be problematic.

Basically make chapter 13 of the Core Rule Book your study guide to using terrain and weather to liven up your game.

Grand Lodge

Ravingdork wrote:
Of course it can choose to just use natural attacks. If it does so, it does not take any penalties to them as it would with a manufactured weapon.

I'd like to remind downlobot that should the Synthesist use the natural attacks of the eidolon as part of a Full Attack action, he would suffer a -5 penalty to each attack.

Grand Lodge

Mudfoot wrote:
Yebng wrote:
Mudfoot wrote:
The decanter produces 5 gallons per second, or 22 litres. . .
Certainly not world ending but an interesting thought came to mind, waterwheel automobiles, how fast could one reasonably travel? (the roads would all have to run off into irrigation channels)

As I noted elsewhere the decanter provides a motive force of about 164N, or 36 lbs. So it's equivalent to your vehicle being pushed by that much force. The waterwheel is fairly irrelevant; it would result in some mechanical losses and a lot of splashing; you might just as well point the thing out the back of the cart.

Because this is essentially a rocket engine (a bit more powerful than anything an amateur can buy off the net, AFAICT), it doesn't produce a specific power like a car engine does (the power is proportional to the speed it's going). But we can approximate it to that of an animal pulling with a force of 164N, which isn't a great deal. You might consider it like a small but lively animal, say the dogs for a dog-cart. Its top speed is purely down to mechanical efficiencies in the wheels, air resistance and so on, which might allow some use for light transportation (it would be epic on a modern bike which would probably beat 100mph) but little use on a cart.

If the whole decanter could somehow be encased in a device where the sum total of the water was forced into ever-decreasing tubes and allowed to expel to atmosphere the effective force could be increased dramatically The velocity pressure would be larger with the decreased internal diameter of each successive tube.

It would work something like a large-ish pressure washer.