I Got Some Cards. Wanna See 'Em?

That droogami picture is that from some old artwork or was it made just for the card game?

Love the Droogami artwork.

That helm is pretty amazing, I look forward to playing Seelah in Wrath starting with it!

Very cool. I really hope these do well enough that we see the other non iconic characters get minis too. You just know Flenta wants a spell she can call her own.

One of the nice things about these cards from an organized play design perspective is that they're easy to integrate. If you're playing an iconic character and you have a promotional card from this line that's owned by that character, you can start with it. If you're not playing an iconic, don't despair—you might get an opportunity to unlock access to these cards through a scenario or some other special reward. Those of you playing Valeros might wish to pre-order Iconic Heroes Set #1 now.

First, fixed that for you. Second, does this mean that we are getting a mechanic in organized play to add these cards to the appropriate Class Deck boxes so they can permanently be part of an iconic Guild character's deck? That would be pretty awesome! Maybe a big Card Guild Guide update is coming soon?

However, if this is the case, it would make me a bit more sad that Lem, the only iconic I'm currently playing with, doesn't have his figure set projected for release yet.

Edit: Wow, didn't read the Tankard at first. If the above is correct, Potion of Flying in the Fighter deck just got epic.

+1 for including more of your character's traits. The only instance I remember seeing is that if some of the Giants in Hook Mountain Massacre would get a bonus if your character was human.

Edit: Wow, didn't read the Tankard at first. If the above is correct, Potion of Flying in the Fighter deck just got epic.

Yes the Tankard does seem really good to make all kinds of potions better.

pluvia33 wrote:

Edit: Wow, didn't read the Tankard at first. If the above is correct, Potion of Flying in the Fighter deck just got epic.

Yes the Tankard does seem really good to make all kinds of potions better.

There's a reason the Tankard isn't Owner: Damiel. :)

We've done the card for Lem already, pluvia33; I think you'll like it.

Oh, tease! Hopefully he'll be in Set 4, then. I'll probably want to play another Lem during Season 1. And I also can't wait to see Damiel's card! Hopefully I'll be able to afford getting all of these.

Cool, coffee cup for valeros...

Could save every healing potion he consumes...
No drop will be lost ;-)

Actually, Tanis, is having Tankard Owner: Damiel all that useful?

I mean, Damiel already has the second ability built into his character card (even though it works on Alchemical items only, so yay Rum Bottles?). The Tankard's not Alchemical either, so he can't discard it for 2d6+x.

Having it in the starting deck's pretty cool, but it's not like Tot Flasks aren't going to be what I crave anyway :)

Actually, Tanis, is having Tankard Owner: Damiel all that useful?

Maybe that's her point?

Wow, the cards and the figures both look great. Can't wait to add this to my game. I'm really interested to see more of this new "mechanic" as well, it sounds pretty fun.

The character I plan on playing is not on the currently announced Iconic Heroes miniature sets. What are the chances his/her mini will be released before WotR launches?

Is it highly dependent on the sets 1-3's sales?

I think that the first 6 sets are pretty much a definite. It is the non-iconic class deck characters that have only been discussed as perhaps a possibility, but nowhere near anything definite.

The exact rule that will be in Wrath for this is:

Some cards have the Owner trait, followed by the name of a character. If your character is the Owner of a card, you—and only you—may treat it as if it has the Basic trait.

This makes for some epic combinations, which you shall see in full in a few months.

I forgot they mentioned 6 boxed sets with 37 cards.

I guess that means not all minis will make it to WotR's launch. Unless they release more than one boxed set on a given month, some will be a little late. Or am I wrong?

Once of the nice things about these cards from an organized play design perspective is that they're easy to integrate. If you're playing an iconic character and you have a promotional card from this line that's owned by that character, you can start with it.

By 'start' do you mean start ANY scenario and include it in your deck, or is it strictly at the starting deck before your 1st scenario?

It would be quite a bummer if 5 out of 6 players could start with their mini and their Iconic Heroes card and the 6th player will end up having to wait to encounter her respective card during/after Adventure 1, because her mini isn't released yet.

...This makes for some epic combinations, which you shall see in full in a few months.

+1 for the "hold that thoughts" Mike's conspiration to make my brain explode. :-)

Will these cards be bundled with retail versions of the set, or only those sold from Paizo?

The previous spoiler (head-dress for the Oracle?) was a bit meh, but these are impressive - I might actually consider playing a Paladin with this card in from set B - suddenly the enchanter doesn't seem a problem...

The previous spoiler (head-dress for the Oracle?) was a bit meh, but these are impressive - I might actually consider playing a Paladin with this card in from set B - suddenly the enchanter doesn't seem a problem...

Interesting point; promo cards aren't normally added until AD1, by which time characters have normally built their decks and played the intro adventure (except for OP, which starts with adventure 1).

I expect the Owner cards in Wrath will be in the B set but where does that leave these promos? Do the promo-adding rules have an update to allow for owned cards?

Ooooooh, shiny. I love this mechanic. Especially the way it works with Organized Play.

Question though: Why limit it to iconics? I know there's an awful lot of characters, but why not just start with iconics and maybe get to the others later?

---

As a Lini fan, I'm loving Droogami. Even though I think the first ability isn't fantastic (too limited for my taste), it's a nice bonus on top of a cool explore ability - I would play Droogami just for the second ability.

Every time I type it's name, I want to type "Dragoomi." Anyone else? :/

---

Tanis, now you're making me itch to see Lem's promo...

That helm's pretty unbelievable. Don't get me wrong, armor's still armor, but an effectively basic armor that's reveal to prevent any-type damage? You don't start getting stuff that powerful until, like, AP5?

Question though: Why limit it to iconics? I know there's an awful lot of characters, but why not just start with iconics and maybe get to the others later?

In the discussion on the blog post announcing the line, it was said that a big part of the reason they are doing this kind is that card game players wanted the miniatures (hence why they gave cards in them). And they said if it sells well enough, they will look into doing other similar products, and one of the ones mentioned as a possibility is the class deck characters. So if they sell well, we might just see that.

Will these cards be bundled with retail versions of the set, or only those sold from Paizo?

The cards are part of the product itself, and will be in the box no matter where you buy it.

The Owner mechanic is one you'll be seeing more of in upcoming sets (coughWrathoftheRighteouscough) and it's featured on every card in the Iconic Heroes miniatures line.

Actually, there is one card in the set that does not have the owner mechanic. And that's all I'm gonna say for now.

It's Alain, isn't it? That guy is so vain, he didn't want his name associated with anything.

That droogami picture is that from some old artwork or was it made just for the card game?

Classic Treasures Revisited, page 34. (The title bar on the card is obscuring that Lini is blowing the Horn of Valhalla.)

I forgot they mentioned 6 boxed sets with 37 cards.

I guess that means not all minis will make it to WotR's launch. Unless they release more than one boxed set on a given month, some will be a little late. Or am I wrong?

WizKids has committed to releasing one set per month for six months. These will cover all of the iconic characters from the RPG to date. If an iconic has an important animal companion/familiar/eidolon/etc, the companion mini is included in the same set (and gets a promo card too).

These first six sets do not include the 6 iconics that will debut in Occult Adventures in July—if this line does well enough for WizKids to continue, we hope to make that the seventh set (and you will probably see a character or two from that book in the PACG set after Wrath...).

So yes, some will be out before Wrath, and some will come out after.

Tanis O'Conner wrote:

If you're playing an iconic character and you have a promotional card from this line that's owned by that character, you can start with it.

By 'start' do you mean start ANY scenario and include it in your deck, or is it strictly at the starting deck before your 1st scenario?

It would be quite a bummer if 5 out of 6 players could start with their mini and their Iconic Heroes card and the 6th player will end up having to wait to encounter her respective card during/after Adventure 1, because her mini isn't released yet.

We've never offered special rules about how you might add promo cards to your deck if you acquire the card while you're playing an AP. (Technically, you just add them to the box.) But if you want to swap a card in your deck for a promo card with the Basic trait, that's certainly not going to break anything. (As Tanis alluded to, she may have other ideas for PFSACG organized play.)

Will these cards be bundled with retail versions of the set, or only those sold from Paizo?

They're part of the set wherever it's sold.

It would be quite a bummer if 5 out of 6 players could start with their mini and their Iconic Heroes card and the 6th player will end up having to wait to encounter her respective card during/after Adventure 1, because her mini isn't released yet.

Yeah, it would be quite a bummer. We wouldn't do that.

Question though: Why limit it to iconics? I know there's an awful lot of characters, but why not just start with iconics and maybe get to the others later?

Sssssshhh! Spoil not my devious plans!

Ooooooh, shiny. I love this mechanic. Especially the way it works with Organized Play.

Question though: Why limit it to iconics? I know there's an awful lot of characters, but why not just start with iconics and maybe get to the others later?

Do you mean the minis set or the owner mechanic?

If you mean the minis set, it's limited to iconics because non-randomized visible minis sets historically don't sell very well. But the Beginner Box Heroes set did well enough that we were able to convince WizKids to give this a chance, and doing our iconic characters gives us our best chance at success.

If you mean the owner mechanic, we actually devised it while creating these promo cards; the fact that you're seeing it first with iconic characters is a direct result of that. There will be other cards that have the owner mechanic referencing a non-iconic character before long.

Droogami is pretty cool but as the iconic companion to Lini will he stick around or will he get replaced after an adventure or two.

His first Power (Stealth and Perception) is OK in early adventures but I feel it will fall behind eventually. Lini (RotR or SS) doesn't have access to either skill so she is rolling 1d4 + 1d8 using Droogami. Good at early levels but not so much later on.

His second power is pretty cool though and may be worth keeping him around. Allows Lini to explore two different locations in one turn. Also allows her to move and explore a location with a detrimental start of turn effect and then move away from it before the start of her next turn.

Anyways wondering if the iconic companions are designed to stay relevant for a whole adventure path or if they are expected to eventually be replaced.

It's a tricky act to make a card that is not too strong for the beginning but cool enough that you want to keep to the epic end. Looking through the reports of characters finishing ROTR, there are cards like this. Shalelu and Poog, for instance. For allies especially, they become part of the story and you can't just pitch them for something a little bit better.

I think Droogami might stick around and maybe get even more useful.

Lini (RotR or SS) doesn't have access to either skill so she is rolling 1d4 + 1d8 using Droogami.

Maybe it is a hint of Lini's yet to come.

We've never offered special rules about how you might add promo cards to your deck if you acquire the card while you're playing an AP. (Technically, you just add them to the box.) But if you want to swap a card in your deck for a promo card with the Basic trait, that's certainly not going to break anything. (As Tanis alluded to, she may have other ideas for PFSACG organized play.)

I think I get it now. So, the owner mechanic basically lets the listed owner treat the card as if it had the Basic trait; therefore, she may replace any card in her deck of the same card type with the Iconic Heroes card in between any scenario.

I know you're not implying that you can always go back to the box for cards with the Basic trait between scenarios. Only if there aren't enough cards of a type to make your deck list among all cards in the party. Right?

So Valeros can't pawn off his awesome Tankard (banish) to close a location and know for sure that he can get it back. Only if there are no extra Items after everyone makes their deck lists.

I know what you're saying, and that could be a pretty cheesy exploit. Maybe that's what Mike meant by epic combination? Magically returning Tankards. (/jk I know its gotta be a lot more epic than something like that)

But what I meant was only as you're adding the promo card to the game. Once it's in the box, it has to be encountered or as you said, when there aren't any of the card type left in the party. Not a recurring mechanic.

Even though Droogami's first power gets lackluster pretty quickly, being able to move and explore is nice, especially with S&S Lini putting him on top of her deck each time. That's an extra explore every turn.

Even though Droogami's first power gets lackluster pretty quickly, being able to move and explore is nice, especially with S&S Lini putting him on top of her deck each time. That's an extra explore every turn.

Any animal ally (escept the snake and eagle) gives her an extra explore each turn anyway, and the Velociraptor is better if you ignore the first ability.

But as a low AP card, Droogami is still awesome.

ryric wrote:

Even though Droogami's first power gets lackluster pretty quickly, being able to move and explore is nice, especially with S&S Lini putting him on top of her deck each time. That's an extra explore every turn.

Any animal ally (escept the snake and eagle) gives her an extra explore each turn anyway, and the Velociraptor is better if you ignore the first ability.

But as a low AP card, Droogami is still awesome.

While true, always being able to have "move then explore" every turn really lets you avoid those locations with bad start of turn effects.

I don't think dolphins give extra explores, just scouting, and coral capuchins certainly don't, but capuchins work poorly with Lini anyway since they discard other cards not themselves.

Orbis Orboros wrote:

ryric wrote:

Even though Droogami's first power gets lackluster pretty quickly, being able to move and explore is nice, especially with S&S Lini putting him on top of her deck each time. That's an extra explore every turn.

Any animal ally (escept the snake and eagle) gives her an extra explore each turn anyway, and the Velociraptor is better if you ignore the first ability.

But as a low AP card, Droogami is still awesome.

While true, always being able to have "move then explore" every turn really lets you avoid those locations with bad start of turn effects.

I don't think dolphins give extra explores, just scouting, and coral capuchins certainly don't, but capuchins work poorly with Lini anyway since they discard other cards not themselves.

Right, right, there are still times when I completely forget about cards in S&S (I've just played too much RotR).

Coral actually works very well with RotR Lini, because she can use it and keep the animal to reveal. Awful with S&S Lini though, for sure (which I know is what you meant).

Blog wrote:

The Owner mechanic is one you'll be seeing more of in upcoming sets (coughWrathoftheRighteouscough) and it's featured on every card in the Iconic Heroes miniatures line.

Actually, there is one card in the set that does not have the owner mechanic. And that's all I'm gonna say for now.

Wait, what? Literally every card except one has the owner mechanic in WotR?

In case there's any confusion: When I say "treat it as if it had the Basic trait," what I mean is "treat it as if it had the Basic trait."

Vic Wertz wrote:

Blog wrote:

The Owner mechanic is one you'll be seeing more of in upcoming sets (coughWrathoftheRighteouscough) and it's featured on every card in the Iconic Heroes miniatures line.

Actually, there is one card in the set that does not have the owner mechanic. And that's all I'm gonna say for now.

Wait, what? Literally every card except one has the owner mechanic in WotR?

There is one card in the Iconic Heroes Boxed Sets that doesn't have the owner mechanic. That is what Vic was talking about (he said the same thing over here).

So he was correcting the "it is on every card in the Iconic Heroes Boxes sets" part of the blog quote, not the "it is on some of the cards in WotR" part of the blog quote.

In case there's any confusion: When I say "treat it as if it had the Basic trait," what I mean is "treat it as if it had the Basic trait."

Right.

Which means Valeros can choose the Tankard for his starting deck, since for Valeros it has the Basic trait. Lini can not, since for Lini it doesn't have the Basic trait.

Valeros, if the group is short 1 item, can go back to the box and get the Tankard, since for Valeros it has the Basic trait. But if Lini is the one short, she can not choose it, since for Lini it doesn't have the Basic trait.

Valeros, if he banishes it after starting Hook Mountain Massacre, can remove it from the game, because for Valeros it has the Basic trait. Lini can not, because for Lini it doesn't have the Basic trait.

For Valeros, just imagine the word Basic is on the card. That is all the rule does.

In case there's any confusion: When I say "treat it as if it had the Basic trait," what I mean is "treat it as if it had the Basic trait."

The designers mean what they say they do. The designers don't mean what they say they don't.

Vic Wertz wrote:

Blog wrote:

The Owner mechanic is one you'll be seeing more of in upcoming sets (coughWrathoftheRighteouscough) and it's featured on every card in the Iconic Heroes miniatures line.

Actually, there is one card in the set that does not have the owner mechanic. And that's all I'm gonna say for now.

Wait, what? Literally every card except one has the owner mechanic in WotR?

Aww c'mon, you've been here long enough to know that anything vague sounding like that is vague on purpose and probably doesn't mean the most literal reading of it :)

Mechalibur wrote:

Vic Wertz wrote:

Blog wrote:

The Owner mechanic is one you'll be seeing more of in upcoming sets (coughWrathoftheRighteouscough) and it's featured on every card in the Iconic Heroes miniatures line.

Actually, there is one card in the set that does not have the owner mechanic. And that's all I'm gonna say for now.

Wait, what? Literally every card except one has the owner mechanic in WotR?

There is one card in the Iconic Heroes Boxed Sets that doesn't have the owner mechanic. That is what Vic was talking about (he said the same thing over here).

So he was correcting the "it is on every card in the Iconic Heroes Boxes sets" part of the blog quote, not the "it is on some of the cards in WotR" part of the blog quote.

Right.

Mechalibur wrote:

Vic Wertz wrote:

Blog wrote:

The Owner mechanic is one you'll be seeing more of in upcoming sets (coughWrathoftheRighteouscough) and it's featured on every card in the Iconic Heroes miniatures line.

Actually, there is one card in the set that does not have the owner mechanic. And that's all I'm gonna say for now.

Wait, what? Literally every card except one has the owner mechanic in WotR?

Aww c'mon, you've been here long enough to know that anything vague sounding like that is vague on purpose and probably doesn't mean the most literal reading of it :)

I like to think we're less vague and more deliberately obfuscating in these cases.

For example, if you want to know what the Iconic Heroes card is that doesn't have the owner mechanic, don't ask Mark Seifter, because he doesn't know.

See? Not vague at all.

I hope that new class decks have cards like this, and / or that promo cards sometime get released to give these to existing class decks. Would be cool to have Tarlin's banner, Qualzar's tome, Siwar's hand fan, etc.