New Options

Monday, July 14, 2014

The Year of the Sky Key, Season 6 of the Pathfinder Society Organized Play campaign, is approaching, and that means the new Guide to Pathfinder Society Organized Play is on its way. It's still a few weeks before we preview the new guide, but we can share a few new options available at the start of Season 6. In fact, there's something for players and something for GMs and organizers.

I imagine you've already spotted the art and guessed that expanded race access is one announcement—spot on. Just as non-standard race access is a hot topic on the messageboards, it's a common talking point during our meetings. It's tough to balance the lure of race boons for conventions against letting as many people as possible play the types of characters they want. Add to that the heated discussions about whether or not some non-standard races are overpowered and the concerns about the so-called "cantina effect." That's a lot to juggle when making a decision, but we decided that introducing a few new options would be best for the campaign. Beginning August 14th 2014 at Gen Con, three new races will be available for play without requiring a special Chronicle sheet: kitsune, nagaji, and wayang. These races have been in circulation through extra Chronicle sheets for nearly three years now, and even though some players have had an opportunity to create these characters, we want newer players to have new options to enjoy. Like other race options, it is still necessary that a player have a book or watermarked pdf reference for the race, such as from Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Dragon Empires Gazetteer, Pathfinder Player Companion: Dragon Empires Primer, Pathfinder RPG: Advanced Race Guide, or Pathfinder RPG Bestiary: Bestiary 4.


Illustration by Eva Widermann

So let's see... seven core races plus three Bestiary races plus three Dragon Empires races. That equals 13, right? Well, there's one piece missing from that equation. We're also removing two races.

For several years, aasimar and tieflings have enjoyed a prominent role in the Pathfinder Society, but as the organization concludes its work in Mendev—where numerous pit-born fight for recognition and heaven-blooded warriors wage holy war—it's time for them to step back. Beginning on August 14th, creating an aasimar or tiefling character will require a special Chronicle sheet, as was the case years ago. The exception is any aasimar or tielfing character with at least 1 XP; these characters are grandfathered into the campaign.

Does this mean you can create several new characters, play a scenario with each, and have several native outsiders waiting for when you need them? Well, we debated long and hard whether to require 4 XP per character, as at that point one is past the free rebuilding stage. However, we also recognized this as unnecessarily punitive to casual players who may only be able to play once or twice in the next month. To answer your question, yes, you can make 10 aasimars and play The Confirmation an equal number of times, but we're trusting you'll exercise some good taste and respect a decision made with the larger community in mind.

Now that we've covered the more controversial news, let's wrap things up with something outright awesome.

We (both Mike and John) both have experience as venture-officers and event coordinators, and we understand that sometimes it's tough to convince a new player to commit to a full 4-5 hour experience. Some events just are not conducive to running a full game, whether that's because it's a weeknight with lots of folks who need to get to bed early or because the location is only open for a few hours. What do you do when a scenario just isn't short enough?

For years the answer has been quests, one-hour mini-adventures intended to last an hour or less. They're great little adventures, but they're a little difficult to schedule for a few reasons. First, there's no easy way to tell a bigger story by connecting a few quests together. Second, the quests—though replayable—offer no gold, XP, or Prestige Points, giving them a reputation of risk for little reward. The most difficult hurdle is that there are only two of them in print (not counting the Goblin Attack demos or Beginner's Box Bash demos).

This year at Gen Con, we're debuting six new 1st-level Pathfinder Quests that take place in and around the River Kingdoms. Each one is a standalone adventure, but they are all loosely tied into a common plot thread, allowing a GM to combine anywhere from two to all six to make a larger adventure as suits the needs of the group and event location. Play them in any order—one can even play the finale quest early—and earn a Chronicle sheet with rewards that scale based on the number of adventures you played.

John Compton and Mike Brock
Developer and Global Organized Play Coordinator

More Paizo Blog.
Tags: Eva Widermann Pathfinder Society
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Grand Lodge 4/5

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Drogon wrote:
I would say, "sure," but I somehow doubt that's actually what you're after. Ordinarily I can pretty easily follow what you say, but in this instance I don't think I can. Being angry for the sake of being angry makes no sense and merely invites criticism. I'm dismissing that anger rather than joining in. I should have perhaps simply left it alone, but felt levity would be better than letting everyone continue to fester in their own bilious feelings.

Anger often doesn't make sense.

Telling people 'you have no right to be angry' does not solve that problem.

Sovereign Court 5/5 Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds

TriOmegaZero wrote:
Drogon wrote:
I would say, "sure," but I somehow doubt that's actually what you're after. Ordinarily I can pretty easily follow what you say, but in this instance I don't think I can. Being angry for the sake of being angry makes no sense and merely invites criticism. I'm dismissing that anger rather than joining in. I should have perhaps simply left it alone, but felt levity would be better than letting everyone continue to fester in their own bilious feelings.

Anger often doesn't make sense.

Telling people 'you have no right to be angry' does not solve that problem.

Fair. I can see how you thought that's what I was saying.

I think, instead, you should read what I said as "this too shall pass." Next time I'll do a better job with the delivery of that statement.

Grand Lodge 4/5

And hopefully next time I won't be reading it directly after waking up. ;)

But 'your anger is but a fleeting thing, you only need endure' is rarely what people want to hear either.

Scarab Sages 5/5 5/5 *** Venture-Captain, Netherlands

1 person marked this as a favorite.
TriOmegaZero wrote:
And hopefully next time I won't be reading it directly after waking up. ;)

Lack of coffee leads to the Dark Side

Lantern Lodge 5/5

Man, I support this decision in its entirety.

Short quests? Things that don't have us asking store owners to stay open after hours? Yes, please. Make them "replayable" (at least for GMs running them for walkins and first-time PFSers), and it'd be perfect.

The race thing doesn't matter. Do what you do, paizo- you'll never please everyone.

4/5 *

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Woran wrote:
TriOmegaZero wrote:
And hopefully next time I won't be reading it directly after waking up. ;)
Lack of coffee leads to the Dark Side

Yes.

Lack of caffeine leads to anger — anger leads to hate — hate leads to suffering.

5/5 5/55/55/5

TriOmegaZero wrote:

And hopefully next time I won't be reading it directly after waking up. ;)

But 'your anger is but a fleeting thing, you only need endure' is rarely what people want to hear either.

How about "it needs to be done", because renaming PFS the planar family society would cost a lot. Its on all our business cards.

Sovereign Court 5/5 Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds

TriOmegaZero wrote:
But 'your anger is but a fleeting thing, you only need endure' is rarely what people want to hear either.

No, but they're certainly not going to hear, "You're right, we're wrong, and we're changing everything back and giving you all puppies, too," which IS what they want to hear. Letting them continue to fling their anger about without any word against them is hardly appealing to most of us, I suspect.

3/5

I had a feeling that this was coming back in early May when I asked for the top 5 classes you would pick for an Aasimar ( Foresight ). Fortunately, I happened to have created several characters of tiefling and aasimar lineage during the time since. I like these races for backstory as well as crunch. While I hate to see options removed from a game, I do understand their removal from non-boon play.

Also, the adding of the other 3 races is a nice opening of the system and I can see certain races being rotated in on a regular basis. Maybe create sort of a Chinese type calendar. For example: Maybe this year is the year of the Serpent - so you can create Nagaji without a boon. This could create a fun way to rotate in various races.

I plan on creating one tiefling and one aasimar over the next month to be put on the shelf for later classes/archtypes that may be released. I have a wayang race boon that is now not really useful but that’s the way the racial cookie crumbles. Will be fun to make some new characters with the new races and see what I can come up with. Happy gaming and here is to Season 6! May the odds ever be….oh crap, wrong forum 

Grand Lodge 4/5 5/55/55/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Maps Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Fromper wrote:

Is anyone really upset about the removal of these races? I know I'm surprised Paizo did this, because I'd expect some players will be upset, but the response on this thread has been far more positive than negative. I can't recall a single post from someone who was genuinely upset by it.

Surprised, yes. I liked Tieflings, even when they had a +1 LA back in 3.5 (though I only intend to use any given race once for the momment). I will miss them but it is nice to see new races even if the picture of the Wayang in ARG looks a little creepy.

I did take some delight last night in yelling across the store to a fellow player (who only plays tieflings) "Hey, their removing Tieflings next season."

I'll wait until Wednesday to tell him he can still play his characters afterwards.

Grand Lodge 4/5

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Drogon wrote:
No, but they're certainly not going to hear, "You're right, we're wrong, and we're changing everything back and giving you all puppies, too," which IS what they want to hear. Letting them continue to fling their anger about without any word against them is hardly appealing to most of us, I suspect.

I need a citation of where this is happening before I accept it.

Expressing disappointment doesn't match what you claim is happening.

4/5

The short quests sound interesting, and honestly think part of the reason people are not overly upset is that we are losing two races and gaining three. Also the fact they are allowing grandfathering in is I am sure appreciated. Since it gives people who have beening wishing to eventually do an Aasimar or a Tiefling at least a chance to get one in.

I am curious if how much Paizo knows on the break down of the PFS race breakdown, and to what degree of precision.

Sovereign Court 5/5 Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds

2 people marked this as a favorite.
TriOmegaZero wrote:
Drogon wrote:
No, but they're certainly not going to hear, "You're right, we're wrong, and we're changing everything back and giving you all puppies, too," which IS what they want to hear. Letting them continue to fling their anger about without any word against them is hardly appealing to most of us, I suspect.
I need a citation of where this is happening before I accept it.

I think you know better, man. The vast majority of people who come to these boards read them without posting their own comments. That has been shown in many a study in many different circumstances. No one wants to read post after post of people being pissed.

And, frankly, Paizo people prove this every day by deleting posts and telling people to cool it, thus getting their post stating "Deleted and cool it" a bunch of "+" button pushes from people who have never commented in the thread (and many from people who have never commented, period).

5/5 5/55/55/5

2 people marked this as a favorite.

Well, we're mechanically losing 10 races and gaining 3. (which is actually part of the problem)

Grand Lodge 4/5 * Venture-Agent, Texas—Houston

Kyle Baird wrote:
One could, theoretically, create an aasimar or tiefling now, get to 1, 2, or 3 xp and after August 14th, rebuild for free into an ACG class without changing the race. Correct?

I do not believe this is the case, as those races are no longer legal to be rebuilt into.

However, you may start a playtest version of one of the classes on an aasimar or tiefling, then convert to the final version of the class once the ACG comes out. This misses out on taking archetypes however.

Liberty's Edge 5/5

TriOmegaZero wrote:
You haven't played some of the scenarios I have then. Individual Cha-based checks, monsters with Cha damage/drain abilities, there are risks to having a 5 Cha and watching your dwarf barbarian go comatose thanks to a good roll on the ability damage die.

This, plus, I've played low-level scenarios where nobody had a good cha or a point in Diplomacy, and things became very challenging.

Sometimes, if you're the Cha-monster with good Diplomacy, you can become the single key to the success of the party. Yes, in most scenarios, you need to have a good fraction of the party competent in combat, but there are scenarios where you're in trouble if everybody dumps everything else to build up their beatsticking abilities.

4/5

Actually I think Kyle is correct, since you only need 1 XP to be grandfathered in.

3/5

I agree with Kyle and David. Under normal conditions you cant rebuild into a race that is not available. However, if you have the 1 xp you are actually grandfathered into that race and it is available for that character only.

Horizon Hunters 4/5 5/5 ***

Kyle wasn't talking about rebuilding into a prohibited race. He was talking about a character already of that race, with anywhere from 1-3 XP, and then rebuilding into a new class from the ACG. The race would remain unchanged.

Grand Lodge 5/5

Jeff Merola wrote:
Drogon wrote:

I'm trying to decide how pissed off new people should be that they never got the chance to play with a summoner or vivesectionist before they got banned.

Or how pissed off a new player should be that they didn't get the chance to play the playtest version of the warpriest before the ACG comes out this August and (psuedo)nerfs the class.

Or how pissed off a new player should be that they didn't get to play during the Zero Year when clerics channeling positive energy both healed the living and damaged undead AT THE SAME TIME (so broken).

Oh...right...They shouldn't be pissed off. It's a game, right?

Again, there's a difference between "No one gets to play these now" and "I can play this now because I started a little bit earlier than you, but you can't."

So you are saying that if they are going to be banned, then all existing characters of those races shouldnt be legal to be played anymore?

No? I didnt think so. That would just be silly. :P

I understand the difference you are showing, but I disagree that its a big deal. Id rather have to deal with the scorn of the people who will make a dozen 1xp tieflings and aasimars before gencon so they can continue playing those for a long time than deal with players who suddenly arent allowed to play their characters that theyve already invested all the time and effort into.
Do you see another way around that, cause I dont? And I mean with still removing the races from open play.

Grand Lodge 5/5

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Duncan7291 wrote:
I agree with Kyle and David. Under normal conditions you cant rebuild into a race that is not available. However, if you have the 1 xp you are actually grandfathered into that race and it is available for that character only.

I assume you mean someone with, for example, a 1xp Aasimar fighter could retrain into an Aasimar Warpriest once the ACG comes out? Cause that would be legal.

A 1xp human fighter could NOT, however, retrain into an Aasimar Warpriest once the ACG comes out, as the race will be out of open access by then.

Grand Lodge 4/5

Seth Gipson wrote:
Jeff Merola wrote:
Drogon wrote:

I'm trying to decide how pissed off new people should be that they never got the chance to play with a summoner or vivesectionist before they got banned.

Or how pissed off a new player should be that they didn't get the chance to play the playtest version of the warpriest before the ACG comes out this August and (psuedo)nerfs the class.

Or how pissed off a new player should be that they didn't get to play during the Zero Year when clerics channeling positive energy both healed the living and damaged undead AT THE SAME TIME (so broken).

Oh...right...They shouldn't be pissed off. It's a game, right?

Again, there's a difference between "No one gets to play these now" and "I can play this now because I started a little bit earlier than you, but you can't."

So you are saying that if they are going to be banned, then all existing characters of those races shouldnt be legal to be played anymore?

No? I didnt think so. That would just be silly. :P

I understand the difference you are showing, but I disagree that its a big deal. Id rather have to deal with the scorn of the people who will make a dozen 1xp tieflings and aasimars before gencon so they can continue playing those for a long time than deal with players who suddenly arent allowed to play their characters that theyve already invested all the time and effort into.
Do you see another way around that, cause I dont? And I mean with still removing the races from open play.

Wow, that's some impressive misrepresentation of my position in this thread. I'm saying that I'm of the opinion that they shouldn't be removed from the list of standard legal races to begin with.

5/5 5/55/55/5

Seth Gipson wrote:
Duncan7291 wrote:
I agree with Kyle and David. Under normal conditions you cant rebuild into a race that is not available. However, if you have the 1 xp you are actually grandfathered into that race and it is available for that character only.

I assume you mean someone with, for example, a 1xp Aasimar fighter could retrain into an Aasimar Warpriest once the ACG comes out? Cause that would be legal.

A 1xp human fighter could NOT, however, retrain into an Aasimar Warpriest once the ACG comes out, as the race will be out of open access by then.

I think it would depend on when the xp was earned wouldn't it? You can retrain in the quasi area in between sessions.

Grand Lodge 5/5

BigNorseWolf wrote:
Seth Gipson wrote:
Duncan7291 wrote:
I agree with Kyle and David. Under normal conditions you cant rebuild into a race that is not available. However, if you have the 1 xp you are actually grandfathered into that race and it is available for that character only.

I assume you mean someone with, for example, a 1xp Aasimar fighter could retrain into an Aasimar Warpriest once the ACG comes out? Cause that would be legal.

A 1xp human fighter could NOT, however, retrain into an Aasimar Warpriest once the ACG comes out, as the race will be out of open access by then.

I think it would depend on when the xp was earned wouldn't it? You can retrain in the quasi area in between sessions.

True, but if you didnt do it til after August 14th, the Aasimar and teifling are no longer legal options to choose. So, really, at that point we are just going on the honor system there. :)

Grand Lodge 5/5

Jeff Merola wrote:
Seth Gipson wrote:
Jeff Merola wrote:
Drogon wrote:

I'm trying to decide how pissed off new people should be that they never got the chance to play with a summoner or vivesectionist before they got banned.

Or how pissed off a new player should be that they didn't get the chance to play the playtest version of the warpriest before the ACG comes out this August and (psuedo)nerfs the class.

Or how pissed off a new player should be that they didn't get to play during the Zero Year when clerics channeling positive energy both healed the living and damaged undead AT THE SAME TIME (so broken).

Oh...right...They shouldn't be pissed off. It's a game, right?

Again, there's a difference between "No one gets to play these now" and "I can play this now because I started a little bit earlier than you, but you can't."

So you are saying that if they are going to be banned, then all existing characters of those races shouldnt be legal to be played anymore?

No? I didnt think so. That would just be silly. :P

I understand the difference you are showing, but I disagree that its a big deal. Id rather have to deal with the scorn of the people who will make a dozen 1xp tieflings and aasimars before gencon so they can continue playing those for a long time than deal with players who suddenly arent allowed to play their characters that theyve already invested all the time and effort into.
Do you see another way around that, cause I dont? And I mean with still removing the races from open play.

Wow, that's some impressive misrepresentation of my position in this thread. I'm saying that I'm of the opinion that they shouldn't be removed from the list of standard legal races to begin with.

Did you notice the :P ?

And I didnt pick that up at all from that post, considering the post you quoted said nothing about not-banning them.

5/5 5/55/55/5

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Jeff Merola wrote:
Wow, that's some impressive misrepresentation of my position in this thread. I'm saying that I'm of the opinion that they shouldn't be removed from the list of standard legal races to begin with.

Don't attribute to malice what can be attributed to the fog of internet conversation.

Grand Lodge 4/5

Seth Gipson wrote:
Jeff Merola wrote:
Seth Gipson wrote:
Jeff Merola wrote:
Drogon wrote:

I'm trying to decide how pissed off new people should be that they never got the chance to play with a summoner or vivesectionist before they got banned.

Or how pissed off a new player should be that they didn't get the chance to play the playtest version of the warpriest before the ACG comes out this August and (psuedo)nerfs the class.

Or how pissed off a new player should be that they didn't get to play during the Zero Year when clerics channeling positive energy both healed the living and damaged undead AT THE SAME TIME (so broken).

Oh...right...They shouldn't be pissed off. It's a game, right?

Again, there's a difference between "No one gets to play these now" and "I can play this now because I started a little bit earlier than you, but you can't."

So you are saying that if they are going to be banned, then all existing characters of those races shouldnt be legal to be played anymore?

No? I didnt think so. That would just be silly. :P

I understand the difference you are showing, but I disagree that its a big deal. Id rather have to deal with the scorn of the people who will make a dozen 1xp tieflings and aasimars before gencon so they can continue playing those for a long time than deal with players who suddenly arent allowed to play their characters that theyve already invested all the time and effort into.
Do you see another way around that, cause I dont? And I mean with still removing the races from open play.

Wow, that's some impressive misrepresentation of my position in this thread. I'm saying that I'm of the opinion that they shouldn't be removed from the list of standard legal races to begin with.

Did you notice the :P ?

And I didnt pick that up at all from that post, considering the post you quoted said nothing about not-banning them.

I've made more than one post in this thread, you know.

Grand Lodge 2/5

Seth Gipson wrote:
True, but if you didnt do it til after August 14th, the Aasimar and teifling are no longer legal options to choose. So, really, at that point we are just going on the honor system there. :)

So Tiefling with beguiling liar racial trait. ✓

Grand Lodge 5/5

Jeff Merola wrote:
Seth Gipson wrote:
Jeff Merola wrote:
Seth Gipson wrote:
Jeff Merola wrote:
Drogon wrote:

I'm trying to decide how pissed off new people should be that they never got the chance to play with a summoner or vivesectionist before they got banned.

Or how pissed off a new player should be that they didn't get the chance to play the playtest version of the warpriest before the ACG comes out this August and (psuedo)nerfs the class.

Or how pissed off a new player should be that they didn't get to play during the Zero Year when clerics channeling positive energy both healed the living and damaged undead AT THE SAME TIME (so broken).

Oh...right...They shouldn't be pissed off. It's a game, right?

Again, there's a difference between "No one gets to play these now" and "I can play this now because I started a little bit earlier than you, but you can't."

So you are saying that if they are going to be banned, then all existing characters of those races shouldnt be legal to be played anymore?

No? I didnt think so. That would just be silly. :P

I understand the difference you are showing, but I disagree that its a big deal. Id rather have to deal with the scorn of the people who will make a dozen 1xp tieflings and aasimars before gencon so they can continue playing those for a long time than deal with players who suddenly arent allowed to play their characters that theyve already invested all the time and effort into.
Do you see another way around that, cause I dont? And I mean with still removing the races from open play.

Wow, that's some impressive misrepresentation of my position in this thread. I'm saying that I'm of the opinion that they shouldn't be removed from the list of standard legal races to begin with.

Did you notice the :P ?

And I didnt pick that up at all from that post, considering the post you quoted said nothing about not-banning them.

I've made more than one post in this thread, you know.

My apologies for not having read all 150+ posts in the thread before posting. :P

Grand Lodge 5/5

BigNorseWolf wrote:
Jeff Merola wrote:
Wow, that's some impressive misrepresentation of my position in this thread. I'm saying that I'm of the opinion that they shouldn't be removed from the list of standard legal races to begin with.
Don't attribute to malice what can be attributed to the fog of internet conversation.

This, more or less.

The first sentence really was in jest. The rest was honest inquiry.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
TriOmegaZero wrote:

And hopefully next time I won't be reading it directly after waking up. ;)

But 'your anger is but a fleeting thing, you only need endure' is rarely what people want to hear either.

Perhaps the best thing to remember is that every time a change is made there will be gamers that will erupt, but in time, eruptions will pass.

Grand Lodge 4/5

Seth Gipson wrote:
My apologies for not having read all 150+ posts in the thread before posting. :P

Apology accepted :P

And I apologize for accusing you of misrepresentation.

Grand Lodge 5/5

Jeff Merola wrote:
Seth Gipson wrote:
My apologies for not having read all 150+ posts in the thread before posting. :P

Apology accepted :P

And I apologize for accusing you of misrepresentation.

Accepted. It happens.

Liberty's Edge 4/5

Removal of Aasimar and Tiefling: hoped for but not expected. They made sense in Year of the Demon, not so much in Rise of the Machines.

It would be nice to see a Wayang Spellhunter who is actually a Wayang.

Only a Kitsune can do "The Robot" properly. Everyone knows that.

Nagaji finally allows the Scales and Tails sub-genre to be welcome. They have been suffering through with Tieflings and green body paint for too long.

I like the idea of the 6 = 1 mini-adventures. It's the kind of thing you can do over lunch before classes. Maybe run 1 or 2 after steamrolling a Season 0 if the store is still open.

Grand Lodge 4/5

4 people marked this as a favorite.

I think this is the point where someone's supposed to jump in and express incredulity that someone would apologize over the internet.

3/5 *

I think that, for the campaign, this is a good move. That said, I wish we'd been given more than a month heads up. Schedules are already crowded with making sure characters are where they need to be for GenCon. This puts a real crunch on trying to get things set up before grandfathering ends, which would be nice to do for character ideas I've been sitting on.

To answer Mark as to why people may not have made their characters before now... there was no urgency, and other ideas may have taken precedence for whatever reasons. For me, it was a matter of alternating the types of characters I play, and preferring not to have too many characters in any given level range at once.

I'm annoyed that I just traded my Undine for a triple-race boon last week. But if there's an easy-to-access, useful way to use that boon, then that's not so bad. Xenophobia annoys me in that, since boons are generally for exotic races, it wouldn't come up in more than 1 or 2 mods. I like some of the suggestions people have given so far for uses, though, including allowing the wayang/kitsune/nagaji racial boons to be used for tieflings/aasimars.

Shadow Lodge 4/5 Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West

1 person marked this as a favorite.
TriOmegaZero wrote:
Drogon wrote:
Oh...right...They shouldn't be pissed off. It's a game, right?
Like I shouldn't be upset that I never got to attend a Beatles/Elvis/Doors/Queen concert? It's just music, right?

My wife went to a Beatles concert ...

I, on the other hand, was at the Rolling Stones concert in Hyde Park.
And I saw the original Dark Side of the Moon tour. Twice. Nyaaah.

Sczarni 5/5

If race boons become useless after a year or so I may get in the habit of crumpling them up or turning them into airplanes to throw at random people. Or trade them for something I may enjoy more.

Grand Lodge 4/5

Kyshkumen wrote:
If race boons become useless after a year or so I may get in the habit of crumpling them up or turning them into airplanes to throw at random people. Or trade them for something I may enjoy more.

A year? Try three years, AND it was after the chronicle sheet with the races was no longer being issued.

Shadow Lodge

Kyshkumen wrote:
If race boons become useless after a year or so I may get in the habit of crumpling them up or turning them into airplanes to throw at random people. Or trade them for something I may enjoy more.

So being able to play a race for a couple of years before anyone else isn't worth holding on to it?

I mean, we know that the elemental races are going to be used as GM boons through at least GenCon 2015, and they've stated they don't want to make a race boon they just gave out worthless, so at the earliest they would wait until the season after they stopped handing the boon out to make them generally available, if ever, meaning even if a specific copy of the boon is handed out with the last batch, it still allows you to play that race at least a year before the general public.

3/5

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Seth Gipson wrote:
Duncan7291 wrote:
I agree with Kyle and David. Under normal conditions you cant rebuild into a race that is not available. However, if you have the 1 xp you are actually grandfathered into that race and it is available for that character only.

I assume you mean someone with, for example, a 1xp Aasimar fighter could retrain into an Aasimar Warpriest once the ACG comes out? Cause that would be legal.

A 1xp human fighter could NOT, however, retrain into an Aasimar Warpriest once the ACG comes out, as the race will be out of open access by then.

Correct, that was the point I was trying to make. Doing to many things at once right now. Sorry for the lack of clarity.

Sczarni 5/5

SCPRedMage wrote:
Kyshkumen wrote:
If race boons become useless after a year or so I may get in the habit of crumpling them up or turning them into airplanes to throw at random people. Or trade them for something I may enjoy more.

So being able to play a race for a couple of years before anyone else isn't worth holding on to it?

I mean, we know that the elemental races are going to be used as GM boons through at least GenCon 2015, and they've stated they don't want to make a race boon they just gave out worthless, so at the earliest they would wait until the season after they stopped handing the boon out to make them generally available, if ever, meaning even if a specific copy of the boon is handed out with the last batch, it still allows you to play that race at least a year before the general public.

By the time I get to making one they will be available. They no longer hold any appeal to me and I would rather pass them along to a random person using the method stated above.


Duncan7291 wrote:
Seth Gipson wrote:
Duncan7291 wrote:
I agree with Kyle and David. Under normal conditions you cant rebuild into a race that is not available. However, if you have the 1 xp you are actually grandfathered into that race and it is available for that character only.

I assume you mean someone with, for example, a 1xp Aasimar fighter could retrain into an Aasimar Warpriest once the ACG comes out? Cause that would be legal.

A 1xp human fighter could NOT, however, retrain into an Aasimar Warpriest once the ACG comes out, as the race will be out of open access by then.

Correct, that was the point I was trying to make. Doing to many things at once right now. Sorry for the lack of clarity.

What if... and work with me here... I've a STACK of GM credit on one character. Let's say that character's level 10+. The credit clearly places him in the more than 1xp range, just never actually played. When I finally build that character, does it get to be Aasimar or Tiefling?

Or should I attach a character sheet that says "Outsider [native]" that no one ever sees or knows about just in case. Do I need to sign and date that character sheet, too?

I guess my point is, who's to know if that Aasimar warpriest wasn't a Human fighter, a Tiefling bard, or maybe a playtest Aasimar warpriest before the 14th. Are we really going with the honor system?


I wish they would also include and characters who started PFS games before the announcement. I can't control the pace of my current PbP (my first adventure with this character), so as it stands, I just have to hope the rest of the group posts quickly enough to finish by then. It would really suck to have the game wrap up on August 15, then have that character sitting in my alias cue forever - cold dead eyes looking back at me with the unspoken question: "Why? Why couldn't that damnable elf post more frequently? Why must I die for his ADHD?!?!"

And there he'll stay, frozen in perpetual angst. No act, mundane or magical, capable of banishing him from the tortuous prison known as "the Alias tab."

3/5 *

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Kyshkumen wrote:
SCPRedMage wrote:
Kyshkumen wrote:
If race boons become useless after a year or so I may get in the habit of crumpling them up or turning them into airplanes to throw at random people. Or trade them for something I may enjoy more.

So being able to play a race for a couple of years before anyone else isn't worth holding on to it?

I mean, we know that the elemental races are going to be used as GM boons through at least GenCon 2015, and they've stated they don't want to make a race boon they just gave out worthless, so at the earliest they would wait until the season after they stopped handing the boon out to make them generally available, if ever, meaning even if a specific copy of the boon is handed out with the last batch, it still allows you to play that race at least a year before the general public.

By the time I get to making one they will be available. They no longer hold any appeal to me and I would rather pass them along to a random person using the method stated above.

Given that I just traded away an Elemental race boon/Paragon of Society for a triple-race boon, I would be more than happy to acquire an elemental racial boon (or any non-wayang/nagaji/kitsune boon for that matter). If it would bring you more pleasure to give away such a boon than hold onto it, by all means I promise to give it a good home. Furthermore, if it is your sincere desire to gain amusement for your boon in the form of throwing paper airplanes at people, I will be at GenCon. If you will as well, we can arrange a meeting for you to throw as many different paper-airplane racial boons at me as you wish, should I be then allowed to keep said boons.

This is a serious offer. I want everyone to enjoy PFS, and if this will make us each happier, I'll do it. In the main PFS room.

PS: In fact, I'll make that deal with anyone. If anyone would enjoy donating racial boons to me via paper airplane at GenCon, message me and we'll arrange it! Any boons that I'm unable to use for worthwhile characters myself, I'll be sure to spread around to those who will.

5/5

Rachel Hill wrote:
Are we really going with the honor system?

The first chronicle applied has to be before August 14th, 2014. Beyond that, it's the honor system.

Grand Lodge 4/5

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Rachel Hill wrote:
Are we really going with the honor system?

Given how much PFS relies on the honor system, I have no problems also relying on it in this case.

Silver Crusade 4/5

Obviously, we'll need some clarification on the grandfathering.

I can agree with Lekku that any PbP that started in time should count as grandfathered in, not just by the finish date, though that's not the rule as it was announced. Hopefully for his sake, and others like him, that will be changed when the new Guide to Organized Play is published with the exact rules.

Also, I'd say anyone with 1 xp before August 14 would seem to be grandfathered in, even if you rebuild after that date. So someone who played their first PFS game as a human fighter back in 2011, and doesn't play their second PFS game until 2015, would be allowed to rebuild into an aasimar warpriest in 2015, assuming 1st level rebuild rules don't change by then. After all, they had 1 xp on August 13, 2014, so they're grandfathered in.

Sczarni 5/5

DrakeRoberts wrote:
Kyshkumen wrote:
SCPRedMage wrote:
Kyshkumen wrote:
If race boons become useless after a year or so I may get in the habit of crumpling them up or turning them into airplanes to throw at random people. Or trade them for something I may enjoy more.

So being able to play a race for a couple of years before anyone else isn't worth holding on to it?

I mean, we know that the elemental races are going to be used as GM boons through at least GenCon 2015, and they've stated they don't want to make a race boon they just gave out worthless, so at the earliest they would wait until the season after they stopped handing the boon out to make them generally available, if ever, meaning even if a specific copy of the boon is handed out with the last batch, it still allows you to play that race at least a year before the general public.

By the time I get to making one they will be available. They no longer hold any appeal to me and I would rather pass them along to a random person using the method stated above.

Given that I just traded away an Elemental race boon/Paragon of Society for a triple-race boon, I would be more than happy to acquire an elemental racial boon (or any non-wayang/nagaji/kitsune boon for that matter). If it would bring you more pleasure to give away such a boon than hold onto it, by all means I promise to give it a good home. Furthermore, if it is your sincere desire to gain amusement for your boon in the form of throwing paper airplanes at people, I will be at GenCon. If you will as well, we can arrange a meeting for you to throw as many different paper-airplane racial boons at me as you wish, should I be then allowed to keep said boons.

This is a serious offer. I want everyone to enjoy PFS, and if this will make us each happier, I'll do it. In the main PFS room.

PS: In fact, I'll make that deal with anyone. If anyone would enjoy donating racial boons to me via paper airplane at GenCon, message me and we'll arrange it!...

Unfortunately I will not be at Gencon as I would gladly throw one your way.

3/5 *

Kyshkumen wrote:
DrakeRoberts wrote:
Kyshkumen wrote:
SCPRedMage wrote:
Kyshkumen wrote:
If race boons become useless after a year or so I may get in the habit of crumpling them up or turning them into airplanes to throw at random people. Or trade them for something I may enjoy more.

So being able to play a race for a couple of years before anyone else isn't worth holding on to it?

I mean, we know that the elemental races are going to be used as GM boons through at least GenCon 2015, and they've stated they don't want to make a race boon they just gave out worthless, so at the earliest they would wait until the season after they stopped handing the boon out to make them generally available, if ever, meaning even if a specific copy of the boon is handed out with the last batch, it still allows you to play that race at least a year before the general public.

By the time I get to making one they will be available. They no longer hold any appeal to me and I would rather pass them along to a random person using the method stated above.

Given that I just traded away an Elemental race boon/Paragon of Society for a triple-race boon, I would be more than happy to acquire an elemental racial boon (or any non-wayang/nagaji/kitsune boon for that matter). If it would bring you more pleasure to give away such a boon than hold onto it, by all means I promise to give it a good home. Furthermore, if it is your sincere desire to gain amusement for your boon in the form of throwing paper airplanes at people, I will be at GenCon. If you will as well, we can arrange a meeting for you to throw as many different paper-airplane racial boons at me as you wish, should I be then allowed to keep said boons.

This is a serious offer. I want everyone to enjoy PFS, and if this will make us each happier, I'll do it. In the main PFS room.

PS: In fact, I'll make that deal with anyone. If anyone would enjoy donating racial boons to me via paper airplane at GenCon,

...

That is unfortunate. If you wish to send me the boon though, I will fold it up into a paper airplane and have someone throw it at me for you. There could even be photo-evidence of the event. I'm amused by the notion.

As for the topic at hand, I agree with Fromper as to how grandfathering should go. I'm not really sure how the PbP would work... but since characters in PbPs are locked while playing, it probably wouldn't be a stretch of the rules to date the chronicle sheet from the PbP with the start date as opposed to the end date. I'm not sure if there's a rule on that or not.

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