And Fnord is right... to determine number of class levels, apply all modifiers in sequence. So take 25 possible levels and first subtract the higher of hit dice or class for a monsterous race, then subtract the CR adjustment of any templates from what is left, and the final number is your class levels. While there are some monster types that this may seem an excessive burden for, there are just as many that doing it any other way would be too great a benefit to. Rather than trying to come up with a list of each and get bogged down into different folks' opinions on the relative value of their chosen race, we're simply going to go with a singular rule.
How to handle the awaken spell then for my dire-ape? Count the HD added by the spell?
4 for ape (CR 3) + 2 for Awaken + 1 for Advanced Template = 7 leaving me with 18 class levels and gold equaling a 21 lvl character?
In that case it's back to the drawing board again as my current concept gets screwed over royally this way and ends up far behind a "normal" lvl 25 character, even before considering the impact on gear.
Then stop trying to be a Monster Race.
Interesting choice.
Ape is CR 2, HD 3. It has Str 15, dex, 15, con 14, int 2, wis 12, cha 7.
Awaken adds 2 HD, changes the int to 3d6, and adds 1d3 to cha. Awakened adds +1 CR.
The way I am assuming that the DM is going to rule is that template CR is added after determining level for base creature HD/CR. Otherwise is just kinda pushes everyone to pick something they can stack a free template on.
For the awakened ape, you would be HD 4, CR +1, classes 20. Wealth of 22.
Since you are using something other than normal PC races, no point buy, so your max int is 18, wis 12, cha max 10. Hope you are going for a non-caster.
Going to be some interesting challenges for you, besides specialized clothing/armor. Do you sleep in the stable or the inn? :)
My stats are probably 95% complete in the profile. I'll polish off the details over the next little bit.
There are some really cool concepts here. Hope I get in and get to play with some of you guys :)
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Quick gold question, I have 21 hit dice with 20 being monstrous. So is my wealth 21/2=10th level or is it 20/2=10+1 class level=11th level wealth?
It's 11th level wealth. 20/2 Monstrous +1 Class Level.
It's MR. dire-ape to you mister, not ape, and with the advanced template too. *wiggles eyebrows*
Starting; HD 4, Str 19, Dex 15, Con 16, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 7.
+Advanced Template (+1 CR): HD 4, Str 23, Dex 19, Con 20, Int 2, Wis 16, Cha 11
+Awakening: HD 6, Str 23, Dex 19, Con 20, Int 12, Wis 16, Cha 14 (as per rolls in his concept introduction post)
So even though he's an advanced dire ape before the awakening (because I just can't figure out a way that makes sense for him to gain the advanced template after awakening for the +4 to int without feeling shamefully much a meta-gamer) I think I read the DM correctly in assuming that the +1 is added to the highest number. 4 for HD, +2 for awakening, +1 for template = 7 leaving me with 18 class levels and gold equalling a 21st lvl char.
Large armor rules are covered in the Core and he'll be using his natural weapons (augmented by feats and magic) for damage dealing and with his planned progression being barbarian/barbarian or barbarian/ranger howevever the build comes together I'm sure he'll find a suitable role for himself in a party.
How do you figure his max mental stats? Wha'd I miss?
Yeah I am just waiting. In case anyone forgot going advanced Aasimar Wizard 7/ Cleric of Nethys 7/ Mystic Theurge 10, so much sweetness so many spells @.@
Waiting is the hardest part. xD
You wanna talk about a lot of spells? Look at Lucifer, the CR 39 3PP monster. THEN you can talk about a lot of spells.
Here's my attempt at a list of what's been submitted so far:
Dm Jelani/Skulda - Advanced Half-Celestial Norn Monk 1
Baron of the Sands - Advanced Oread Monk 20/Fighter 4
OmniChaos - Aasimar Wizard 7/Celric 7/MT 10
Isonaroc - Changeling Witch 20/Savant 5
Monkeygod - Aasimar Inquisitor 20?
Sol-Alar De Xin Min - Advanced Drow Noble Synthesist Summoner 20/Shadow Dancer 4
Ricky Bobby - Advanced Half-Celestial Aasimar Stormborn Sorcerer 20/Savant 1
Xara Ozolins - Half-Elf Master Summoner 20?
Berenzen - Human Ranger 20/Fighter 5
Cuan/Hailani - Back to drawing board
Sigz/Kikubwa - Advanced Awakened Dire Ape Barbarian/Ranger?
Dm Fnord - Advanced Doppleganger Wizard 20
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Surprised no one has sprung for a Solar or Pleroma (though it would be really annoying to only communicate in telepathic images). No dragons either. Also the Lhaksharut is an obvious choice.
From their description:
"Lhaksharuts are tasked with maintaining the separation between different planes of reality, especially the elemental planes. They do not concern themselves with petty trespasses by visitors from one plane to another, nor even the occasional creation of a pocket plane or hijacking of a chunk of one reality to serve as a base within another. What does trouble a lhaksharut is anything that represents a permanent link between planes, or an effort by the denizens of one plane to invade and conquer another. They often find themselves in conflict with the machinations of powerful outsiders who seek to create beachheads on other planes to serve as launching pads for massive incursions......."
WRONG. I'm and Advanced Orread Monk/20 Fighter/4
My bad, fixed. Any other mistakes that someone chimes in on in the next hour can still be edited :P
I am interested in a rogue 20. Haven't looked at any of the prestige classes to make up the other five. I am beginning a background over the weekend and will have more soon. I am working 12 hour days right now so I may not have anything posted until around Monday. I should have a solid concept by then.
The basic concept is an upper-class noble from some old rich city. Race will be either from the core or featured races from the ARG.
Will this be ok DreamAtelier?
Yeah I am Advanced Aasimar Wizard 7/ Cleric 7/ Mystic Theurge 10
Missed the advanced part otherwise I am a lvl short for no reason ;)
Thank you all for the discussion, but I am withdrawing Xara from consideration. Thank you very much and good luck with your game.
Yeah my character is an Advanced Human Ranger 20/Fighter 4. Might draw up an Advanced Elysian Titan/Barbarian 3 just for funsies though.
I am interested in a rogue 20. Haven't looked at any of the prestige classes to make up the other five. I am beginning a background over the weekend and will have more soon. I am working 12 hour days right now so I may not have anything posted until around Monday. I should have a solid concept by then.
The basic concept is an upper-class noble from some old rich city. Race will be either from the core or featured races from the ARG.
Will this be ok DreamAtelier?
As I think of the concept more, I believe that a bard would also fit well for the skills available. I may take an archetype that furthers this idea.
It depends on how the background ends up. So at least one out of two base classes would be ideal to work from.
Edit: aw crap. I keep going back and forth between a druid and a bard. I will make up my mind soon. :)
I was thinking Solar but it has to meany overlapping skills with my Synthesist, as it is she fly's at 440mph and 880mph hasted, that's sonic boom time, O how I wanted to have a pc do that for years. Loving this biulding.
LINK HERE -Just want a PC that dos this in flight-see last part
Just curious, but about how many players are you lookin to take? I'm guessing a small number, as this high a level is never easy to run and more would make it more difficult.
Okay, stats should be completely done now. Went and double checked all the numbers too, should all be good. She no longer needs air, food or water and is immune to cold. So she can totally fly around in space...awesome...
-goes to watch Green Latern-
Just curious, but about how many players are you lookin to take? I'm guessing a small number, as this high a level is never easy to run and more would make it more difficult.
I am not the GM, but I would max out at 6. I would also have the "almost made its" in a notepad or word file in case people drop off. You would think that people would not disappear after spending a lot of time on a 20th level character, but a tourney I am running proved me wrong.
Are these the rules we will use for adding class levels to monsters or will be use the monsters base stats + 25 point buy.
Step 2: Add Class LevelsOnce you have determined the creature's role, it's time to add class levels. The first step of this process is to modify the creature's ability scores. Creatures with class levels receive +4, +4, +2, +2, +0, and –2 adjustments to their ability scores, assigned in a manner that enhances their class abilities. Creatures with NPC class levels do not receive adjustments to their ability scores.
DM said earleir you use the monster's normal stats, with the ability to move around the number of points it would have gained from its hit dice. Ie a 20 hit die monster can move around 5 points. A 12 hit die monster can move around 3 etc..
I believe his original post is somewhere on page 1.
I have a question about the druid wildshape. In the description it does not state if clothes and other items are changed with you when the ability is used.
So the question is: do clothes and items shift with me and any items worn become inert?
I want to know this because; depending on the situation; I may role-play it out for cinematic/thematic appeal.
I have a question about the druid wildshape. In the description it does not state if clothes and other items are changed with you when the ability is used.
So the question is: do clothes and items shift with me and any items worn become inert?
I want to know this because; depending on the situation; I may role-play it out for cinematic/thematic appeal.
The items are melded into your form. Wildshape follows the polymorph rules except for stated exceptions.
Polymorph:
When you cast a polymorph spell that changes you into a creature of the animal, dragon, elemental, magical beast, plant, or vermin type, all of your gear melds into your body. Items that provide constant bonuses and do not need to be activated continue to function while melded in this way (with the exception of armor and shield bonuses, which cease to function). Items that require activation cannot be used while you maintain that form. While in such a form, you cannot cast any spells that require material components (unless you have the Eschew Materials or Natural Spell feat), and can only cast spells with somatic or verbal components if the form you choose has the capability to make such movements or speak, such as a dragon. Other polymorph spells might be subject to this restriction as well, if they change you into a form that is unlike your original form (subject to GM discretion). If your new form does not cause your equipment to meld into your form, the equipment resizes to match your new size.
I have a question about the druid wildshape. In the description it does not state if clothes and other items are changed with you when the ability is used.
So the question is: do clothes and items shift with me and any items worn become inert?
I want to know this because; depending on the situation; I may role-play it out for cinematic/thematic appeal.The items are melded into your form. Wildshape follows the polymorph rules except for stated exceptions.
Polymorph:
When you cast a polymorph spell that changes you into a creature of the animal, dragon, elemental, magical beast, plant, or vermin type, all of your gear melds into your body. Items that provide constant bonuses and do not need to be activated continue to function while melded in this way (with the exception of armor and shield bonuses, which cease to function). Items that require activation cannot be used while you maintain that form. While in such a form, you cannot cast any spells that require material components (unless you have the Eschew Materials or Natural Spell feat), and can only cast spells with somatic or verbal components if the form you choose has the capability to make such movements or speak, such as a dragon. Other polymorph spells might be subject to this restriction as well, if they change you into a form that is unlike your original form (subject to GM discretion). If your new form does not cause your equipment to meld into your form, the equipment resizes to match your new size.
Why thank you! Much appreciated.
I have the alias up. Epic Druid. The name is a placeholder until I finalize that. No crunch is provided. I have answered all the questions you asked of us. If DreamAtelier would be so kind as to provide feedback on my character I would love to hear what you think. Also anyone else is welcome to add any feedback. I have played a 15th level character before even though this game will be a bit higher.
I came up with the background here at work. Slow day so I put my brain to good use.
The background is just up to her making it to adulthood. I can provide additional details for what she has been doing since then.
Yeah I am not working on crunch unless I get picked. Epic is not to be done lightly, it is a scared personal thing that will drive you insane if done for no reason. xP
Applying a couple templates to a monster and adding one level is nothing compared to designing something with 25 class levels. So I went ahead and did mine.
Grand Moff Vixen, I read over your backstory. I liked it for what it's worth. It's decidedly more feminine than things I normally see on these boards, makes me think you're really a girl :P I would flesh out more how she got to be 25th level though. It's no hop skip and jump from 20 year old woman to epic manifestation of nature's will. What's her animal companion? Her favorite animal form? How did she get from Golarion to Astrarium, who asked her into the Guardians?
I'm not the DM for this, but you asked for comments and that's what I was asking as I read it. ^_^ Nice story though.
Applying a couple templates to a monster and adding one level is nothing compared to designing something with 25 class levels. So I went ahead and did mine.
Grand Moff Vixen, I read over your backstory. I liked it for what it's worth. It's decidedly more feminine than things I normally see on these boards, makes me think you're really a girl :P I would flesh out more how she got to be 25th level though. It's no hop skip and jump from 20 year old woman to epic manifestation of nature's will. What's her animal companion? Her favorite animal form? How did she get from Golarion to Astrarium, who asked her into the Guardians?
I'm not the DM for this, but you asked for comments and that's what I was asking as I read it. ^_^ Nice story though.
Thanks! Like I mentioned, I only posted up to adulthood. I will have the remainder before the recruitment is closed. I just wanted to nail that part down. I don't know how I came up with that but once I did it just flowed.
I spose I could add a line that reads:
And she became an arch druid. Boom! level 25. :P
I am still trying to decide what I will play but I would like to know what things a barbarian's rage prevents since the book only says you can't do things that require concentration, but does not give specifics.
While in rage, a barbarian cannot use any Charisma-, Dexterity-, or Intelligence-based skills (except Acrobatics, Fly, Intimidate, and Ride) or any ability that requires patience or concentration.
Basically those skills listed and casting spells. Or if you had some item that needed a concentration roll or something. At least that's how the vast majority of people do it I think.
But there is the moment of clarity rage power (and some others), and rage prophet presitge class if you want to be a spell casting barbarian.
If a monster such as a lillend has access to class features, but I take an archetype of that class is it assumed that the lillend has the alternate class features instead or would I get both?
going to do full crunch later today just to see what i get
Question; Are we limited to one submition? 'Cause I've got another idea.
I have a question for the other gamers. Are you making the characters as strong as you can or only as powerful as you think you need them to be. I have two ideas. One of them is not very optimal. The other one while not being super-character will be powerful, or at least I hope so, and I want to present the correct one.
I just had an image in my head I want to flesh out, I have no idea how powerful my dire-ape will be, might be a good exercise to flesh him out and see.
I go for a concept and then make it as powerful as possible. There's usually a pretty optimal way to do any concept.
Is this still going? I might try my hand at a character like a Lhaksharut.
It's been quiet over the weekend but the DM stated that selection would take place on the 15th iirc.
I have added more info to the background.
I think I am actually going to go for the Lilliend Bard. In the spirit of fairness I think the GM should rule that the lilliend gets the bard achetypes class abilities that will replace the standard performances, other wise I get the archetype abilities, and the standard bard performances, but if he gives me both I won't complain. :)
Just added Familler
Im dropping the whole leadership Feats and skills, its not what Sol-Alar De Xin Min is about she's a sole huntress not a war band leader