Monster Mashup - Master Thread

Game Master CaveToad

Now that you're done with the -major- work of looking over things, I'll bring my questions back up (and ask a few new ones):

1: Does Versatile Performance use the Misc bonuses of the performance skill or the skill it replaces?

2: A Sacred Servant Paladin can exchange a single +1 from her 'Divine Bond' to gain a single use of lay on hands for the day. It does not say that it must be used during the Divine Bond (and seems to suggest I can just keep popping it to gain more lay on hands). I doubt it will come up, but I wanted to ensure that we were on the same page here.

I'm sure there are other things, but they aren't coming to me at the moment. :)

1. I would tend to think that you use the Misc bonus of the performance, skill, as RAW that's how I interpret it, however, there may be case by case situations where it would make sense the other way, or wouldn't make sense at all, or if there was some crazy abusive thing that would result.

Edited: words for clarity

@Makoto From reading the description for Sacred Servant.

At 5th level you can bind a spirit for 1 minute per paladin level.
At 5th level you can receive ONE bonus for that period of time, such as one additional use of lay on hands.
At 5th level this ability can be used once per day.

It looks poorly written, some of it sounds like the bonuses are there once selected, and until the next time the servant is called.

I.e., you call the servant, your symbol glows for 5 minutes, you select +1 caster level. For the rest of the day, all spells cast are at +1 CL? Or they are +1 CL for those five minutes?

Going back to paladin, the divine bond supplies the bonuses only for the time the bond is active, minutes/level.

So that extra lay on hands would need to be used in that time the bond is active.

At 9th level, when you have a second use of the divine bond, if in the first use, you selected +1 caster level, the second time you could choose to change your selection and now have +1d6 channel positive. However, if the first time you selected lay on hands, the second time you could not change it to +1 caster level. It's stuck, and expended, for a day, not just until the next use.

Now, since you have an additional +1 at 8th level, you do have an additional option.

At 9th level you call the spirit and select 1 additional lay on hands, and a +1 caster level. Later that day you call the spirit again. You do not have two options this time, one (the lay on hands) is spent, and not restored. The other (the +1 caster level) could be changed to another lay on hands, or another of the options noted.

At 13th level, when you have 3 uses per day, each use will have 3 bonuses you can appply. If the first time you select lay on hands as one of your choices, then the next time you call the bond, you effectively only have two bonuses to apply. If you again select lay on hands, then the third time you call the bond you would only have one bonus to apply.

Make sense?

I just want to congratulate Cave Toad for completing the MONUMENTAL task of getting all the initial reviews done.

^ Second!

doh, i see that I was ninja'd by CaveToad, what he said!

Seriously. I had enough trouble parsing the first few posts, but parsing literally six tables worth of people's tristalt characters with tons of homebrew modifications? That s!#+'s Herculean.

Definitely, round of applause for that, I know it would have taken me forever to get through all of those and hand check all of them - it takes me a while to go through and check mine and I know where everything comes from!

It's possible I am slightly insane. I did want to get through them quickly, so we can get back to playing and kicking ass.

Sure. The very first time I read it, I arrived at the same point as Shaeyl, but I haven't been able to recreate that exact interpretation. Again, it was very unlikely that it would come up (I'll have plenty of uses, and plenty of other ways to heal. :))

3: What are the evolutions you feel simply cannot be taken with Spirit Summoner(Life) [emphasis on the eidolon section]? I have a pretty good idea, and I know what I plan to avoid entirely. :) I don't see anything on the Unchained list, but there are a few things on the normal list (such as undead appearance).

Poison/venom might be 'not lifey', but that's pretty much all I can see. :)

Unnatural aura probably . What about incorporal form, no breath, shadow blend, shadow form and sickening? I am also going with life, though I am not really planning on picking up any of the mentioned evolutions.

None of those were on my list at all. They pared a -lot- of evolutions out for the new Eidolon. And then made some nonsensical changes amidst that! Good aligned Eidolons, as an example, cannot serve as mounts.

None of those were on my list at all. They pared a -lot- of evolutions out for the new Eidolon. And then made some nonsensical changes amidst that! Good aligned Eidolons, as an example, cannot serve as mounts.

I was under the impression the new unchained summoner only existed so GMs could force players to play a inferior/not gamebreaking option. Then you came along to prove me wrong :). And they say I am insane... There might be three of us CaveToad ;).

I -do- feel that there are ways in which the new eidolons are cool and unique (for example, Azatas getting all martial proficiency at first level, several angels getting Truespeech), but I think the cost is rather high.

I lose -eleven- evolution points -and- lose a ton of early access spells that are really powerful (like... I won't get haste until 7th level as a summoner, now. And it'll be a higher level)

Further, some of the requirements are just silly-stupid. A summoner without at least one neutral component can't have an elemental eidolon at all. I can't have a Demonic Eidolon that is trying to corrupt me in exchange for power... things like that.

BUT, in exchange for the flexibility (and the spells, oh god, the spells ;~;), I do gain a lot of set-in-stone power that's kind of cool and easy to overlook. Like my pet advancing as a paladin at 3/4 rate when it comes to using lay on hands. My life-spirit eidolon even gets to heal!

The Unchained Summoner offers more distinct themes.

Definitely that as well. I wish there were a few more options for things to call, though. At the moment, they've turned summoner into a 'binds outsiders'. I'd love to see them able to work with Kami, Magical Beasts, Dragons, and Plants, probably (as archetypes?). I feel like the themes are a little -too- tight, even though I appreciate the themes that it offers (and the fact that it tied it to actually making summoner more of an outsider-binder, than a catch-all), but I do think they went a little too far with one of my favorites.

Unnatural aura probably . What about incorporal form, no breath, shadow blend, shadow form and sickening? I am also going with life, though I am not really planning on picking up any of the mentioned evolutions.

I am thinking of the following aren't very 'life'-y.

bleed
channel resistance
undead appearance
fiendish appearance
frightful presence
no breath

arguments for the following could be made, depending on theme.

incorporeal = particularly themey with SPIRIT summoner - good spirit of life etc
sickening = usually we think of rotting or stench stuff like undead, but maybe it just smells bad like a skunk or like those really stinky flowers. It really depends on the eidolon theme so far. If a player just adds the power, because its cool and useful, I am less inclined than if they can BS something themey past me ;)

Works for me!

So in short, if you want the power (for anything really), at least find a cool way to tie it into the (potentially many-faceted) theme of the character? :)

Should we be making a wish list over abilties/powers/features that we want to augument our weapon (or as custom magic items) or as boons down the line? (Which is probably be a list of stuff that would fit the character thematically and/or mechnically, but that we can't (easily) get any other way.) Though I should probably read through the mythic stuff before making such a list eh?

1. I would tend to think that you use the Misc bonus of the performance, skill, as RAW that's how I interpret it, however, there may be case by case situations where it would make sense the other way, or wouldn't make sense at all, or if there was some crazy abusive thing that would result.

Does this mean that skill size bonuses/penalties wouldn't matter with Versatile Performance (i.e. the size penalty from using intimidate?)

So in short, if you want the power (for anything really), at least find a cool way to tie it into the (potentially many-faceted) theme of the character? :)

Not necessarily. The goal isn't to circumvent the rules by using fluff, but to work on something thematic that might warrant a nod the other way.

Should we be making a wish list over abilties/powers/features that we want to augument our weapon (or as custom magic items) or as boons down the line? (Which is probably be a list of stuff that would fit the character thematically and/or mechnically, but that we can't (easily) get any other way.) Though I should probably read through the mythic stuff before making such a list eh?

I wouldn't bother with a wish list until I can present the framework, and ruleset, otherwise you may just waste time and be disappointed with something that isn't there. There WILL be chances to get special things that aren't really covered by any of the current rules, but I like to be able to monitor those for super shenanigans. I'm pretty tolerant of crazy off the hook power given that brew that we are working with, but I will try to keep things marginally sane.

CaveToad wrote:

1. I would tend to think that you use the Misc bonus of the performance, skill, as RAW that's how I interpret it, however, there may be case by case situations where it would make sense the other way, or wouldn't make sense at all, or if there was some crazy abusive thing that would result.

Does this mean that skill size bonuses/penalties wouldn't matter with Versatile Performance (i.e. the size penalty from using intimidate?)

So Comedy, Keyboard, and Percussion govern Intimidate. As you tap away on your tiny little Fisher Price Xylophone people still aren't as intimidated by small stuff as much as big stuff. Unless its a creepy clown costume, because small creepy clowns are scary. Kidding aside I would take it on a case by case basis. Depending on the nature of the performance such as scary sounds, shadows, ominous music, etc, all could be cause for ignoring a size bonus in those cases.

Ah... yes, it would involve actually using a performance to intimidate—being small and whatnot this would usually involve a combination of illusions, storied, and reasoned arguments as to be afraid (and result in my Intimidate bonus going up by 10 points at the next level). Cool!

Ok, I have heard back from 4 of the 6 remaining characters. Hopefully two of them get back to me, and the rest polish off their final tweaks soon. Thanks everyone for their patience.

I am looking at the map an wondering where the exit is? Is it north our south? No matter where it is, it looks like we are pretty far from it... I had assumed we had headed pretty much straight for the exit...

There were rocks and trees in our way. We headed for "that-a-way-ish"

And none of us actually saw the lake, then there was the getting food part.

Are we in "normal-time" now? Is it morning?

Not yet, I just wanted to get you a rough map.

Morning is coming soon, I will move ahead without the few characters who have not followed up on the feedback. If they appear they need to get their crunch in order before participating.

I will try to have something some time today. Work is a little more busy today so stay tuned.

Ok gang, I had training all day, and I also have it all day tomorrow (Wednesday) but I want to move this along. I also want to put a freeze on changes to builds just for a bit, as its a bit distracting for now. You will have a chance to change before Trial ends.

Also, some people have roleplayed into morning a bit, so I reserve the right to retro or ignore some actions that may not have occurred.

And we are off with a bang (or a bleet or what have you).

Yes, I will get the other groups updated shortly, or today sometime. I have training again so posting will be limited throughout the day until I can get home tonight, the the carnage can begin.

Well, overall, this is an encouraging sign. These goat people will be an excellent source of starting gear!

I am also hopeful we can make friends! :P

A lot of people I've played with are of the opinion that once initiative has been rolled, all chance of negotiations has passed. Are you in that camp CaveToad?

A diplomacy check to change someone's attitude is 10 rounds long, so unless one side surrenders, it's pretty hard regardless.

Talking is a free action for at least a few sentences, individuals may respond however they choose as needed in combat. So you can still parley with the 'enemy' assuming you share the same language....

A Diplomacy check is measured in minutes, sure, but sometimes conflict can be avoided by specific words.

Initiative is rolled once one side has intent to harm, regardless of the other side's intentions. Otherwise how would you adjudicate how much time passes as the aggressor makes their attacks? Etc. Or looking at it differently, if one side is an aggressor and the other side has unknown intentions, an initiative roll signifies them taking note of the aggressive intention and having the chance to react in whatever way they prefer.

This is, of course, my way of looking at things. I don't pretend to speak for the GM.

-Posted with Wayfinder

Just a little update for everyone. I am hammering out the battle maps today. Took a while to fiddle with the right map tool I wanted yesterday so that took a lot of time. I was able to get Table1's map up, then when I went to mod it for the other tables, it failed to load, so starting from scratch on that, sorry for the delay.

Sucks to lose work because the programs doesn't do what you want. Looking forward to this :)

Ok everyone, I have all the maps up for the morning encounter with the goatlings. We have the surprise round and then regular combat.

I wanted to get all the combats started at the same time, but from here on out, I don't have a major need to keep things synched up any more. Some groups may get ahead of others. Post combat, if there is to be cross group communication we will synch it, but a few rounds of combat won't make a difference when there is so much space between camps.

After that, you are on your own time, most groups have a plan and direction in place, so lets get the show on the road. (probably when I get home from work in about 1.5 hours)

Awesome maps! Good luck on keeping up with combat on all the tables! 6 tables where everyone posts at least twice a day means you need 12+ combat posts per day. Maybe you are right in calling it insane :p. Hopefully everything will work out fine though.

Probably a good idea to have everyone post actions, then post a recap with everything completed in init order. One posting by the GM per round.

(Technically, low init's are supposed to declare their actions first to give high init's an advantage when declaring their own actions, then the round plays out the declared actions in init order from highest down.)

What is wayfinder?

Mobile app that lets you just click buttons to format, if I'm not mistaken.

I tried to get it to download on my phone, but it wasn't having none of that. I've become reasonably adept at managing without the app. D:

I can't seem to find it :(. Is the name just Wayfinder? Is it not available for iPhone? I can format without, but it might be faster with better tooling.

I think it may be android only :(

Its in the Android Playstore for $1. Arcanosoft.

Don't forget your hero points for some of the groups who are off to a rough start. Link

who is off to a rough start?

You could read the threads you know, but group one were looking to be in a pretty dire position last time I checked.

You could read the threads you know, but group one were looking to be in a pretty dire position last time I checked.

ah, I am in enough games to keep up with as it is, I was looking for a point in the right direction, thanks!