Speak unto the thread!
They will need to change the animal of Taldor from a lion to a Pheonix!
I've gotten started touching up my crunch, getting magic items sorted etc. It looks like we'll be off to a slow start so plenty of time for that.
Couple of questions on that front. Can I not have to take Combat Expertise to qualify for tripping feats? (I really hate that feat). Do cohorts/followers follow the same HP rule? (max die). Any players have a preference for teamwork feats they would like? (given my warlord ability to grant them for free).
Aside from that, will any of our characters know/be able to know any other player's characters before the beginning of the campaign?
Noooo I posted in gameplay by mistake, and now it's too late to edit. :'(
Oh, and P.S.: To anyone who gives constant passive party buffs (since there are so many of us), I encourage you to list them in a statbar spoiler so other players can look them up when making attacks/saves
Lexarius: Combat Expertise is actually a really good feat, though. Also, if you take two levels of Lore Warden Fighter, you get it for free on top of a bunch of great class skills and the two normal fighter feats, which you could use for something like mounted combat.
Also, I can already grant Shake It Off, and at level 13 I'll be able to get two more, one of which will be the awe-inspiring Coordinated Charge. So I guess don't take Coordinated Charge or Shake it Off, but Outflank would be a good option, and I believe there's one that helps ranged attackers as well.
Hello! I'm out to dinner with my folks atm, but thought I should check in. Thank you for the choice to include me!
Checking in on the cohort as well!
Also note, I automatically grant my teamwork feats to any within 60 (correct me if I'm wrong) ft radius. That said, I took mostly ranged style feats for those tactician abilities.
Lexarius: Combat Expertise is actually a really good feat, though.
Considering my AC is already sky high AND I'm taking penalties for Power Attack? I really will never use that feat.
Also, if you take two levels of Lore Warden Fighter, you get it for free on top of a bunch of great class skills and the two normal fighter feats, which you could use for something like mounted combat.
If I multiclass then I won't get my capstone ability, which I actually really want since stances are way the hell more awesome than a few extra feats.
Also, I can already grant Shake It Off, and at level 13 I'll be able to get two more, one of which will be the awe-inspiring Coordinated Charge.
That's a good idea, since I have a stance that lets everyone get flanking for free AND use my Cha modifier (so a +6 instead of a +2). Looking forward to coordinated charge...since my mount gets pounce and that means full attacks!
I automatically grant my teamwork feats to any within 60 (correct me if I'm wrong) ft radius.
I thought that took an action to do? Mine certainly does.
And I'm just messing up all over the place, posting with the wrong alias.
And how exactly are you granting your teamwork feats constantly, without using Tactician? I wonder if that's something I can get once I get Coordinated Charge next level.
I've never actually gotten a chance to use a capstone, hmm. Opilio: your banner bonus doesn't stack with mine (and mine is a bit better because I've been dumping favored class into it), but I guess it never hurts to have a second banner if the party gets split.
@Lexarius: cavaliers can grant teamwork feats as a move action, or a swift action at level 9 (so I take a move action now, but at next level I will join Opilio in granting them swiftly). It's still only one per turn, and Challenge is also a swift action, so having multiple people granting them is pretty cool. Mine focus on boosting either defense or mounted combat, and if yours boost flanking that gives cool synergy.
Clarification of ability (and update because of my brain fart):
As a Swift action; Allies within 30ft radius who can see and hear; 8 round duration; 3/d;
My shared feats are: Friendly Fire maneuvers (You can't be used as soft cover) and Coordinated shot (if your ally is threatening and not providing cover to your opponent, you gain +1 to ranged; If they are Flanking, you gain +2)
8 rounds as basically a free action 3 times per day is actually pretty good. I went with ranged to compliment my primary. Also note, that Opilio is actually designed as a melee combatant whether he has his guns or swords drawn, so he will likely be in the fray next to you. Detective Blackhart, on the other hand is only likely to engage in melee if the situation requires it.
Apologies for the misinformation on the early post, I was out to dinner and didn't have the resources at my disposal to remind myself of the ability specifics.
Also, Opilio is a Cohort, not a main, so I wouldn't expect him to keep up in terms of special powers anyways. I did, however, design him with survivability in mind, and while he may be behind in the special powers catagory, I have faith that he's more able a combatant than my main.
I need clarification on how these abilities work together before I make a mistake in calculating:
Eye For Detail:
A grand marshal adds his Intelligence bonus as well as his Wisdom bonus on Perception and Sense Motive checks. In addition, he gains a bonus equal to 1/2 his level on Perception checks opposed by another creature's Disguise or Sleight of Hand checks.
and
Canny Sleuth: A Sleepless detective adds her Intelligence bonus (if any) on all Perception and Sense Motive checks, as well as on Diplomacy checks made to gather information, in addition to adding her Wisdom or Charisma modifier as normal.
Just as a note to all of this, I would LOVE to get 3 times my Int, which would be a +12 bonus, to perception and sense motive! It doesn't say that they don't stack, but then again, getting the same ability twice is kind of smudging the line a bit. If this works out for the optimal, I think I just went from decent P.I. all the way up to the-godd*mned-Batman! lol!
Not sure about the Perception bonus—that's probably a GM question (though I always play Empiricists instead). As for teamwork feats on your musketeer—hmm, yeah, those boost ranged attacks nicely. So Opilio helps with ranged combat, Lexarius helps general melee, and Darren will use switch between cavalry buffs and defensive buffs.
Also, swift actions can be hard to come by—a round you use Greater Tactician in is a round you can't start a Challenge, and you can only grant one of your two feats at a time.
Items other tactical feat-granters may be interested in:
1. Resplendent Coat. Increases tactician range to 60 ft, for an affordable 7k gp (less if we have a crafter).
2. Horsemaster's Saddle. A bit more expensive, lets any creature you ride constantly share combat teamwork feats with you, which can be useful situationally.
3. Ring of Tactical Precision. Increases the benefits of all teamwork feats, and allows feat sharing for fun and profit.
I will have to look into those items when we get into our adventure!
As for now, I equipped Opilio with weapons and armor that will keep him from eating too many bullets/arrows/swords too many times.
Yes, that spat about the special abilities was for our glorious GM... Which now that I think about it, I refuse to accept that GM mean "Game Master" and as an IRL GM myself, I'm specifying that it really means "Glory Monger" Haha!
My ability lets me share a teamwork feat 9 times a day for 9 rounds, so I should probably pick up another teamwork feat. I'm thinking Lookout. Maybe if our martial characters invest in some Shadowed armor we can get more surprise rounds?
Right now I'm grappling with whether to go to Two-Handed style fighting, because Warlord doesn't grant access to Iron Tortoise style, and I can't use Thorne style with a shield. So I'm restricted to just two disciplines to use. (I mean, I could do it, I just would've rather gone sword and board because it fit my character concept more).
Just pointing out also, I'm invested in tripping, so Combat Reflexes might be useful to people.
Where are we on healing/divine magic? I'm going to make a level 6 cleric follower just in case, and I have a level 7 arcane crafter/buff man (if followers are allowed in battle - don't worry, he can turn himself invisible). I assumed the preslotted guy was an arcane caster but he might not be.
@Lexarius: cavaliers can grant teamwork feats as a move action, or a swift action at level 9 (so I take a move action now, but at next level I will join Opilio in granting them swiftly). It's still only one per turn, and Challenge is also a swift action, so having multiple people granting them is pretty cool. Mine focus on boosting either defense or mounted combat, and if yours boost flanking that gives cool synergy.
Unless someone knows a feat to grant extra swift or immediate actions, I will need to seriously ration mine, because I have a LOT of class abilities that use swifts and immediate. Never mind magic items or feats.
@Lex: I would definitely like if our characters knew each other! Being that Opilio and myself both worship Abadar, I feel like we'd have at least bumped into each other at services somewhere in the city. You're a royal guard, and I'm a division head of the city guard, so there would be more than enough cause for use to be in the same circles.
I think its also interesting that Opilio has informed the princess of his romantic feelings, and being of noble blood thereby makes his request for potential courtship legitimate and likely startling to you. It would make for an interesting "Tristan and Isolde" situation!
Oh, right. Lookout is quite good—but only really useful when granted by someone with high initiative. If you trip a lot, the best feat to grant is probably Paired Opportunists.
I've got decent out-of-combat healing (4d6 channel, 6/day), but I'm not a dedicated healer any more than an average paladin. However, I've always thought followers could only be NPC classes, and I'd recommend keeping them out of most combats.
There's some arguments out there that a Silvanshee improved familiar on an arcane spellcaster could lay on hands pretty well, but our best bet will probably be winning fights fast with high defenses and then cleaning up afterwards.
@Lexarius: If you're invested in both tripping and defense, getting Quick Draw and a Quickdraw Shield could let you switch between offensive and defensive styles in the middle of combat. If you're going to be riding your cohort into battle, a Lance can be wielded one-handed or two-handed, and with the right shield you can switch between those modes quickly.
My Standard Tactic will be to drop the challenge on the biggest looking guy first, because it gives everyone +3 to hit for the duration of combat, followed by my tactician ability which to my knowledge does not require maintenance after activation, and prevents you stocky can-heads from hampering our ability to shoot baddies. Following that will be utilizing my other buffs while blasting or hacking my way to victory along side you!
I've never heard that cohorts are only allowed to be commoner classes before. That would also be disproved for this game anyhow, as Opilio is a cohort, and GM LG knew about him before I was cast.
@Robert. Definitely! Very good thoughts on that. I'll have to start putting more into my backstory on that after I square away my crunch.
@Darren. Neither the Leadership feat nor the 'Creating NPCs' section under game mastery specifically state followers must use NPC classes. I just assumed followers were generally important enough to get PC classes. I'm also reluctant to get Quick Draw since I dislike weapon switching (also it is a move action to stow a weapon regardless), additionally, I probably won't be charging all that much - since my mount gets pounce he will charge but I won't so that I can full attack.
Also, as an aside. Should I rename my alias to Sir Lexarius Rubicon?
Lex: I'd say, if you grabbed the leadership feat then feel free to produce "squires" that have healing and buffing capabilities. The more the merrier! If they are non-combatants, though, make sure they'll be safely tucked away when combat starts because dead cohorts and extra human-shields for the baddies suck if you aren't evil, and it honestly sounds like this group is neutral bordering goodly.
Lex:
I think you should double check the quickdraw shield info if you haven't already. I'm pretty sure it says donning and stowing a quickdraw shiled is a free action f you have the quick draw feat.
Also, note there is a difference between "followers" and "Cohorts"
I'd change your Alias (If you can) to include your title if you want to be called by it.
Well, in the extended description of leadership it specifically recommends that followers shouldn't be participating in combat. Followers are generally contacts and agents who will work to help you, but might not literally follow you around (though it's a great way to manage, say, a ship's crew). Keep the captain title if you expect to be and remain a captain of something, Sir if you'd prefer to be a knightly agent over one in an organized position of power.
Quickdraw shield can be stowed for free as long as you're drawing another weapon.
@Opilio: Your challenge, I believe, only gives us that bonus if you're threatening the target. Then again, in another level or two you could get Improved Snap Shot and threaten everyone with your guns.
That was the idea!
It is only those I threaten, but next feat, I threaten out to a 15ft tacos
edit: 15ft radius* Damn phone!
Heh. I mean, I threaten most tacos, but only from a range of about 5'.
I just realized but it seems like we have a lot of range combat guys. As in, a 2-1 disparity between range-melee types.
Opilio is a two way street when it comes to combat. Just as good at ranged as he is in Melee, and Just as good at ranged IN melee as he is with his swords. He makes people better at ranged though.
If you don't include cohorts, it's 2-2, melee to ranged. If you do, it's 2-3; but if you also include mounts, it's 4-3.
I don't include mounts since I'm considering them being in the same space as their rider. Also, if you include our spellcaster, that brings it up to two guys in melee, and 4 guys at range.
Idk generally I like to keep it a half disparity or more on the melee side so that we can keep the ranged types from getting rushed. Also - I only grant benefits for a lot of my abilities if you're within 30ft.
On the subject of followers, I wouldn't bring any along that couldn't turn themselves invisible. Though I wonder how cheesy it would be to bring a dozen lvl 1 gunslingers around to volley shots with on baddies.
The gunslingers wouldn't do much damage, and would be taken out by the first fireball.
Also, if we're not in places where charging is practical, my mount makes an effective physical barrier.
Crap! I should've made a Halfling cavalier with leadership so I could ride my Orcish cohort into battle! Lol!
I'd say dwarf, but let's face it, riding a dwarf into battle is like riding a mule. If they don't want to move they just won't And f*co you for thinking otherwise!
If you're really into shenanigans, an Improved Familiar with the Mauler archetype lets you ride all sorts of crazy things into battle, like a spherical justice robot. (I've actually got a mounted combat monk who's considering that)
If Darren gets a cohort, it'll probably be a halfling squire who rides a regular-sized pig.
I'm always interested in shenanigans!
Maybe not on these characters, but I'm always interested in hearing them.
So... Being relatively new to PvP games, how long does it usually take to get started?
I hope you meant PbP. Because I don't think I signed up for PvP. That said, usually I'd expect a post from the GM by now on the campaign start up, or...at least to answer basic questions. I hope this isn't going to be a continuous issue.
And now that I think about it, just from our character line up it feels like this campaign has a huge potential to be very confusing with a PbP format due to how much positioning, and turn order is going to be. Just wondering if the GM is considering maybe using Roll20 for combats?
The GM specifically said he'd be busy through at least Saturday, and wouldn't be able to start the game until after that.
And I think our multiple cohorts will work much better in PbP than at a table. There are lots of ways to make maps work, and honestly a single google doc can do most of what Roll20 does for people who don't want to learn a confusing new program.
It's not so much the map as it is the player turns. A lot will happen even in a single turn, so I expect a lot of conditional statement (for instance, what happens if I attempt a trip and then base the rest of my actions on the assumption of a success? And then other players act according to what I do, but my actions might be invalid?)
I'm just worried combats are going to get very confusing very fast. Currently in a solo PbP and that is already complicated enough with just one player who doesn't have to worry about coordinating with allies.
Not to mention, one bad thing about PbP is that it is abysmally slow.
By the way, is me tripping enemies going to be a big problem for ranged combat guys? Once my mount gets a few more levels in fighter I'm also planning on grabbing lots of overrun feats to knock people down (lots of opportunity attacks to be had!)
Err... I'd generally avoid too much reliance on Overrun, at least until you get the Trample feat. It's great to get you through enemies to the one you want to hit, but...
When you attempt to overrun a target, it can choose to avoid you, allowing you to pass through its square without requiring an attack. If your target does not avoid you, make a combat maneuver check as normal.
Improved Overrun solves that. I won't be making any Overruns, my mount will. The general plan is Imprv Overrun->Greater->Charge Through with some other feats mixed in. It's too bad Vicious Stomp can only be used with Unarmed Strikes.
Yeah, it's... alright. I think we can worry about it once we start leveling, though.
Meanwhile, my character has spent his last few levels studying nonviolent conflict resolution, so... we'll see how all that turns out.
EDIT: Just realized I forgot to take the campaign's bonus 1st level feat. My options are Quick Draw, which lets me deal more damage without decreasing AC (thanks to quickdraw shields), or Horn of the Criosphinx, which allows a LOT more damage but requires unshielded charges. I'd say probably the first is more useful, since the party already has some damage capabilities and I'm on the "insufficiently armored" end, but if we need more damage-striking capabilities I could take the other instead.
I meant pbp, but I'm on a Phone occasionally, so it might auto correct some things it doesn't understand.
I was unaware of our GM's situation and was becoming conserned. Thank You for the update.
@Darren. I noticed you didn't have Wheeling Charge on your feat selection, if you are going to be doing lots of charging (not gunna lie though, kinda would prefer to have at least someone else in melee with me) then it would be a good feat to pick up.
On that note, does anyone know anything about our 5th? They haven't dropped in yet. I'm also wondering what's up with Velius.
That's because Wheeling Charge is a local feat—technically only available to crusaders of Lastwall. It's nice, but not a game-changer, and I'd probably only take it if we wind up doing a lot of group charging or there's a story reason.
Speaking of which, I'm curious what the GM's opinion is on Story feats—at this level we've got enough options to satisfy all the essential combat roles, and it could be a cool way to define characters as we go.
Stronghold provides cool flavor for anyone with Leadership, as does Dynasty Founder. Blessed and Nemesis are awesome for anyone, but will depend on whether we meet Outsiders or a villain appears as a campaign nemesis. Eldritch Researcher is really cool for a creative caster.
Meanwhile, Darren might be interested in Magnum Opus or the neat Monument Builder feat, though both are primarily flavor related.
@Lexarius: I assumed the 5th player might be associated with the DM in some way that kept them busy during the same time period. I think Velius is simply waiting for the game to start, and has nothing else to say.
Found some interesting reading! My buddy, Movin pm'd these links to me because I mentioned I was anxious about my first real pbp game. If you haven't read them, they're really informative. Also, Thunderbeard, he tells me I'm really lucky to have gotten in a game with you, and he's a smidge jealous. Lol!
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qciy?Building-a-Better-Doomed-Hero-Painlords
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2nr91?DHs-Guide-to-Play-By-Post-gaming
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2rqdb?Painlords-Guide-to-PbP-GMing-Make-Your-Wo rld
Sorry for the unformatted submission, I'm posting from my phone again
Also, I had considered purchasing a villa or something as a higher level character, but that was going to cost me the entirety of my wealth. So I hope, given that we're going to be dealing with nobility and the like, I could get that as a home base sort of thing at done point in this game.
Oh! Thanks. I hadn't realized I had a reputation as a player, which is cool since I don't have the best track record running a game.
I guess we can build you a house at some point?
I do have a Lyre of Building!
Ah, but... I have a second Lyre, and the perform skill to play it until I pass out.
I did fail to grab perform, but that's why I pay minstrels. Lol!
Well, you could potentially have one of your followers be a minstrel... if they can take 10 on the check. If not (due to the fact that it gets stressful after 30 minutes), we're talking a level 8-10 bard/expert, and those people are a lot rarer and probably require about 500-1000 gp for their services... not to mention knowing nothing about building construction, so you're unlikely to get more than badly fitted stone or mud brick walls.
Now, a minstrel with a bunch of engineering knowledge and a +18 fortitude save that lets him keep constantly strumming for much, much longer before he passes out...
(Although an undead bard could keep playing forever)