Jimbles' Dead Suns

Game Master Jimbles the Mediocre

Personally, I enjoyed it and found it quite helpful. Especially the round format, which allowed people (or at least me) to better know who was going even, and who was affecting other people with what.

I thought your presentation was done well. It was always clear what we were waiting for and what our options were, which is where a lot of combats (regular as well as starship) fall down.

I had fun. Ship-to-ship battles can certainly turn into a slog when the dice aren't rolling your way, but I can usually make my own entertainment. :) Probably to everyone else's annoyance, but I figure if I get too 'out there' someone will let me know.

My experience with starship combat so far has been that if you don't have at least one or two people that really 'get into it', roleplaying out what they do, talking smack, and 'making their own entertainment' it becomes really obvious what it is (a succession of repeated dice rolls with only minimal individual consequence).

This is especially true if it ever turns into a slog where you just need one or two good hits to end the fight but it takes 8 or 9 rounds to get them. A lot of things in the game are the same way, in that if you don't really get into normal combat, for example, you can have the same problem. We're just all trained as TTRPG players to buy into those so it never feels like a series of dice rolls. Plus, in those other activities, you can have each individual coming out to shine on their turn, whereas in starship combat, basically everyone is essentially just aiding another on the pilot or gunner.

Anyway, that's how I feel about it in general. As to how you ran it, specifically, I feel your way is a better way to run it, especially in PbP. I just ran a starship combat in both 1-12 and AAT in PbD that I did similarly (though, honestly, not as well), and was shocked at how quickly it went. I was expecting each to take weeks and they both only took a day or two. I had fun in this, more fun than I did running the same thing for my home group in person. The fact that the dice gods were against us on all the attack rolls really was frustrating, but that's noone's fault, just bad luck.

Due to an unexpected meeting today at work, I'll not have time to post until late this evening, if then. We also may have issues with power outages associated with Hurricane (Tropical Storm?) Michael passing through Virginia this evening. Sorry for the delay. 'Bot me as needed to keep things moving.

Inane pedantic question time...

How the hell is the hoverdrone flying? There's no air for the little helicopter blades to use to let it float, and inside the ship gravity is normal.

None of my players noticed this when I ran it, but it bugs the crap out of me for some reason.

Umm ... *hand-waves*

Internal Inertial Motivators®

C'mon, Lauren's an engineer, she should know this. ;)

Perhaps it has multiple modes of movement, including something on wheels or treads? I played in a cyberpunk game where there was a small observer droid that was a small sphere that had sticky treads that allowed it to move up walls and on ceilings.

Whew! Busy weekend, including some actual face-to-face Starfinder (for once) and some surprise doggie diarrhea (don't worry, he's fine now). Sorry for the posting delay.

How the hell is the hoverdrone flying?

Some sort of onboard propellant, I would assume. Personally, I head-cannon that the default for most propulsion systems in Starfinder to be something akin to a combined-cycle engine like the SABRE, able to produce thrust in vacuum as a closed-cycle rocket engine but also able to burn that same propellant with atmospheric oxygen in a more fuel-efficient open cycle whenever feasible. I mean, most of the art tacks on some props for fun, but I think that's more aesthetic than anything else.

Fine, if you want to use, like, real-world physics.

*walks away grumpy*

I had asked a question a while back, but I don't think that it got answered. Would we have been able to recharge any batteries we possessed while in the Lorespire Complex? (Potentially at reduced or no cost, such as in Society play?)

I had asked a question a while back, but I don't think that it got answered. Would we have been able to recharge any batteries we possessed while in the Lorespire Complex? (Potentially at reduced or no cost, such as in Society play?)

Yeah, that sounds pretty reasonable to me.

The only time I won't have photon mode going in combat is when I have just used supernova, which shuts photon mode down until my next turn starts, so things like AoOs won't benefit if I have done that.

I don't think I made it terribly clear in the text, but there was a minute or two between the first and second akata encounters, so Jehir would have lost any points of attunement and would not have been again to regain attunement until his turn in Round 1.

Not sure if the trick attack damage gets rolled twice on a critical.

For the record, it does!

...and would not have been again to regain attunement until his turn in Round 1.

I know that. But the first round was the surprise round where I threw the spear the first time. Nobody else got to act that round. Call it "round 0" if you like, but I was in combat for that, and there is nothing saying photon mode can't be activated in a surprise round.

They finally fixed the avatar selection link, so I changed Miraj's avatar to indicate he is using the holoskin to change his appearance, since leaving to get on the shuttle in Absalom.

Ok, that's going to take me a bit to get used to. :)

GM Jimbles wrote:

...and would not have been again to regain attunement until his turn in Round 1.

I know that. But the first round was the surprise round where I threw the spear the first time. Nobody else got to act that round. Call it "round 0" if you like, but I was in combat for that, and there is nothing saying photon mode can't be activated in a surprise round.

I didn't treat it as a surprise round because I generally treated all parties as aware of each other. You specifically called out that you readied an action, so as a reward for being vigilant I granted you the chance to resolve it before rolling initiative (instead of it acting as your Round 1 action). I know that isn't exactly RAW, so I apologize for the confusion.

They finally fixed the avatar selection link, so I changed Miraj's avatar to indicate he is using the holoskin to change his appearance, since leaving to get on the shuttle in Absalom.

Ha, my first reaction was that someone had posted with the wrong avatar. I fully approve of these holoskin/avatar shenanigans.

Hey. Just a heads up. I'm probably going to be limiting myself to checking in at most 1/day for the next 6 or 7 days. I'm super behind on homework for school, I have exams again next week, and I have a major project for work (server upgrade) this Friday night. Plus it's my daughter's birthday today and I have some other game commitments where I'm running this weekend.

BTW, GM: as I mentioned to you when we started this game, I was already in another Dead Suns game. Figured it was worth mentioning that that game has died. When the Paizo site went down for about two weeks at the end of August our GM never came back after it went back online. And ironically, we were about where we are now when the game died.

The same thing happened to a game I was in. The GM never came back after the site went all kaflooie. I finally got into a Crimson Throne game and *plop*.

Although, we've found a replacement GM and the game is beginning to move along now.

Yup. I’m in a War for the Crown game that lost it’s GM back in May, found a new GM and started moving again, then lost two players when the site went down. We have some great new characters though and things are moving well.

That's a shame. WftC is a great adventure path. Lots of room for roleplayers to go crazy. :)

GM Jimbles wrote:

Looks like you handled the missed grenade correctly, both here and on the map (with one exception - the save DC also takes your non-proficiency penalty).

Really? That bites. Grenades already suck enough. I can never find the rules for the Save DCs of items though when I need to.

Yeah, it kinda looks like damage grenades were really designed to be an NPC item, not a PC item. I think they wanted to make it impossible to grenade your way to victory on even a semi-reliable basis, and they wanted the classes with grenade proficiency to really own it, I guess. I think I remember something from one of the devs talking about how important it is that the envoy gets grenade proficiency, since they are meant to be the ultimate battlefield tactician and grenades are essentially area control.

BTW, GM: as I mentioned to you when we started this game, I was already in another Dead Suns game. Figured it was worth mentioning that that game has died. When the Paizo site went down for about two weeks at the end of August our GM never came back after it went back online. And ironically, we were about where we are now when the game died.

That sucks. I've mostly taken part in SFS scenarios and other short-term PbP commitments; I would hate to lose a game that I had put so much time and effort into. I hope you like this character better than that one!

Speaking of sticking around, a big thanks to all of you for staying glued to this game despite the site difficulties we had back there. We've been at this for about six months now, and you all have been quite consistent. I really appriciate it.

I think I remember something from one of the devs talking about how important it is that the envoy gets grenade proficiency, since they are meant to be the ultimate battlefield tactician and grenades are essentially area control.

Oh my. The image of Diedre with grenades ...

Yeah, nothing could wrong with that.

That sucks. I've mostly taken part in SFS scenarios and other short-term PbP commitments; I would hate to lose a game that I had put so much time and effort into. I hope you like this character better than that one!

I like my other character too, but actually she would be better suited to an Against the Aeon Throne game, since she was an escaped slave from the Azlanti Star Empire.

She was a mystic. If I played her again I would build her differently. We did a playtest of a level 10 adventure, and I found that playing a caster at higher levels becomes quite difficult. This is because the saving throws of enemies improve almost at a 1:1 ratio between CR and Save. I think this is faster than in Pathfinder.

But if you compare the progression of your saving throws, at 1st level the save against your spells is 10 + 1 (1st level spell) + Ability Bonus, so at best 15 or 16 if you have spell focus. Let's say your ability bonus is +3, that would then be 15, or 16 with spell focus.

At 10th level, the save against your best spells are 10 + 4 (4th level spell) + Ability Bonus. Your ability score bonus has probably increased by 3; 1 from gaining levels and 2 from implants. So the save DC is 21, or 22 with spell focus.

So overall while the monsters have gained +9 to their saves, you have gained +6 with your best spells.

So this means that the enemies are saving most of the time, especially when you try to use spells below your maximum level. I had command and hold person but they never ever worked.

This means that for your build you really need to have your casting score maxed and you must take spell focus, just to give your spells a decent chance of sticking. Either that or stick to spells that don't have saving throws. I originally had her start with a WIS of 14 but if I played her again I would switch that to 18.

After doing that playtest I gained new respect for the mindbreaker mystic connection, because their third level ability gives their mind-affecting spells an effect even when the save is successful.

As a note, I have updated my Class/Race/Gender line to include more information. Notably, I have put in the effects of the two conditions I am under.

So Miraj feels a little like Jack Burton in this classic scene from Big Trouble in Little China.

So Miraj feels a little like Jack Burton in this classic scene from Big Trouble in Little China.

Great scene. One of my favourite films.

While you guys are gradually hacking your way into the Acreon's logs, I have a bit of a meta-question for you. Along the course of this adventure, you'll run into various adversaries with abilities or spells that specifically target creatures with the humanoid type. From an adventure design perspective, these effects are meant to affect any of the PCs; however, opening up character creation to more varied races has resulted in a party that's 50% not-humanoid, and the adventure wasn't written to compensate for this in any meaningful way (e.g., the party is very unlikely to be targeted by a spell that affects only creatures with the aberration type).

In the front matter to Alien Archive, it's suggested that GMs may treat non-humanoids as humanoids for the purposes of effects that target type in order to better balance characters across a party. If I were running character creation *right now*, that's what I would likely do, but character creation was a while ago, and I don't feel it's fair to just spring rule adjustments on you in the middle of the game, especially if you built your character with type effects in mind.

So, to my question. Entiren, Jehir, and Lauren - would you feel cheated if I ruled that you counted as humanoid for the sake of effects that target creatures of the humanoid type? Aureum, Didre, and Miraj - would you feel cheated if I didn't? I just want a bit of feedback before I rule one way or the other (thanks to eagle-eyed Entiren for noticing this issue).

If anyone's struggling to wrap their head around how to use medical equipment or the Medicine skill, I put together a handy cheat-sheet for myself a while back; you may find it useful.

For myself, I would be perfectly fine with Entiren being treated as a humanoid for those stated effects. I know that currently this is not to my benefit, but to me it makes sense. He is a Monstrous Humanoid, which is not too far different from a Humanoid.

My main rational behind this is that Starfinder seems quite vague about how it decides what counts as either a humanoid or a monstrous humanoid. (Notably, Nuar appear to be just as much a Humanoid as the Vesk, yet are Monstrous Humanoids)

I have no issues with a decision made either way. I can see the argument for either side and it doesn't really affect Diedre directly.

I know I've dropped a bunch of posts today, but hey - 2nd level! Once you've leveled your characters, please update your profile and your statline (including any gear you've picked up since character creation) before dropping a short post here with a quick list of any exciting new abilities you have.

I picked Scyphozoan for my character because I wanted to play something weird and new and alien and fun.

I didn't pick it because the type gave me advantages.

If you want to house-rule something similar to android (where I count as both humanoid and aberration for effects related to type), I'm totally cool with that.

I think she's leveled.

Level 2: Envoy

HP +6
SP +6

Ref +1
Will +1

Skill Points: 8+1

Bluff, Computers, Culture, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Medicine, Perception, Profession (musician), Sense Motive

Language: Eoxian

Phrenic Awakening: (Scyphozoan, Shirren)
Can use extra two chosen languages to communicate telepathically.

Oh, yeah, I probably should have said what I took when I leveled...

Technomancer 2: SP+6. HP+5. Will +1. BAB +1.
Skills 4+3: Took ranks in Computers, Culture (learning Triaxian language), Engineering, Life Science, Mysticism, Physical Science, Piloting.

I took Energizing Spell as my Magic Hack for 2. That lets me burn charges in a battery for an extra spell slot 1/day (10 charges/spell level). I figure every magic missile counts. :)

Spells Learned: Psychokinetic Hand (0), Summon Creature 1 (1), and traded Holographic Image 1 for Jolting Surge.

For summon creature, the 4 I picked were Shadow Creature, Robot, Protean, and Inevitable. I probably won't get to use it, but an extra body between us and akatas might come in handy.

Entiren has level into Mystic, staying with his starting class. From this, he has gained:

Basic Class Features:
+6 HP
+6 SP

+1 Will Save

+1 BAB

7 Skill Ranks:

Special Class Features Gained:
Channel skill +1: +1 to Perception and Piloting
Mindlink

Spells Learned:
O-Level: Telekinetic Projectile
1st-Level: Lesser Remove Affliction

.

.

.

What is most likely the most 'exciting' thing that he picked up was the new first level spell. It will allow him to ~temporarily negate the sickened condition from the disease, making it easier for him to succeed at the saving throws.

We're in the busy part of my work week, plus this is the end of the term, so grades have to be up to date. I'll try to level up later tonight. I don't think there will be much to do except choose which skills to add ranks to. I'll post when I'm done.

Operative 2:

+6 HP
+6 SP

Ref +1
Will +1

BAB +1

Skills 8+2 :
Acrobatics, Bluff, Culture (Shirren language), Engineering, Medicine, Phys Sci, Profession (Archaeologist), Stealth, Sense Motive, Survival

Class Features:
Specialization (Thief): free skill ranks in Sleight of Hand, Perception

Evasion: If you succeed at a Reflex save against an effect that normally has a partial effect on a successful save, you instead suffer no effect.

Operative Exploit: Nightvision. Who needs flashlights?!

-----

I think that's everything. Working on updating my profile to match.

Miraj has leveled up, taking another level in Operative.

Changes
SP 14
HP 16
BAB +1
REF +5
Will +4
Defensive Ability: Evasion
Skills: 11 more ranks, has a rank in all class skills, including medicine and stealth.
Operative Exploit: Nightvision (gets Darkvision 60 feet)

The main thing to work out is how to explain his sudden ability to see in the dark. He already had lowlight vision from his race. So it might be a late developing physiological change related to his change from winterborn to summerborn. Or he might have been given a treatment that injected some kind of nanobots that have been modifying his retina to be sensitive to whatever radiation darkvision allows one to see. I have no preference.

So, to my question. Entiren, Jehir, and Lauren - would you feel cheated if I ruled that you counted as humanoid for the sake of effects that target creatures of the humanoid type?

In PF games where I am the GM I have a house rule that makes all the various planetouched races coult as humanoids. I think having a blanket immunity to hold, charm, and dominate person is pretty powerful.

I'm pretty sure that Borai don't have immunity to those effects though.

Deathly

For effects targeting creatures by type, borais count as both humanoids and undead (whichever effect is worse).

So I get:

7+CON SP = 9 SP
7 HP
+1 BAB
+1 Fort Save
+1 Will Save
Stellar Revelation: Stellar Rush
4 Skill Ranks:
+1 Acrobatics
+1 Intimidate
+1 Perception
+1 Stealth

What is most likely the most 'exciting' thing that he picked up was the new first level spell. It will allow him to ~temporarily negate the sickened condition from the disease, making it easier for him to succeed at the saving throws.

I'm not sure that I agree with your reading of the spell -

...if the condition is the result of a disease or another ongoing effect, this spell removes the condition but does not cure the disease or ongoing effect, and the target can regain the condition from that effect as normal, potentially immediately.

There's a lot of leeway here for the GM to decide how long the condition is alleviated for (I can see arguments for anything from 0 seconds to 1 hour/caster level, depending on the severity of the disease), but I think that it's important to note that the Fortitude saves required to recover from a disease represent 24 hours (roughly) of healing, and I would argue that lesser remove condition can't alleviate the symptoms of a disease for that long.

Sorry to burst your bubble like that - if you would rather pick another spell, feel free.

Regarding the question posed about humanoids and spells, I have always run adventure paths and modules as requiring the GM to adjust elements written into the text to fit the peculiarities of the PC mix. I'm okay with the changes proposed. Thanks for eliciting feedback.

Don't worry, I probably should have checked with you about this before casting the spell anyway. I was just operating under the adoption that my home group made under similar circumstances, which was that the spell could remove the condition until the next Fort save (or 1 hour/caster level, whichever occurred first). However, that said, I think that I will still keep the spell, as it can be useful.

This is not a drill! New forum avatar images from the Starfinder Core Rulebook have been added! Some of you will rejoice, others will begrudgingly decide that your current avatar is technically better than any of the new ones.

Nice! I finally get to have an icon with antennae!

On another note, I'm traveling a lot over the next week! Hopefully I'll be able to post regularly, but it might be intermittent.

(Also, there's been 12 posts since I last checked, I'll catch up and get a post in tonight sometime)

This is not a drill! New forum avatar images from the Starfinder Core Rulebook have been added! Some of you will rejoice, others will begrudgingly decide that your current avatar is technically better than any of the new ones.

I just looked through the avatars and didn't notice any that I recognized as specifically Starfinder. Is there a filter that makes them easier to spot?

You can apparently sort them by date added (it is in the top right). Starfinder portraits should go from the bottom of the first page to the top of the third page.