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A Guide to Universal Mythic Abilities


Advice


So, out of curiosity, I was looking for a guide to the mythic character, and there isn't one up yet, but I've been spending some time studying the path abilities and I have come up with my own guide, of sorts.. only regarding the universal abilities.

Looking for a bit of constructive criticism, if you disagree with me, say so, but I think this is a fairly good guide for these capabilities regarding the mythic character.

Guide to Universal Mythic Abilities


Woo hoo, first post on a guide discussion thread.

I was hoping someone would make one, so thanks. I'll read it and let you know any comments I have.


Thank you, this is my first time using certain features, so if you have any trouble with the link let me know.


I like that people are starting to look at these new rules and trying to help others get the most out of them.

While I haven't read your ideas side by side to reference with the rules, I think based on memory and a quick check here and there that I agree with you on these observations.


I'm not sure that you can take Extra Path Ability more than once. Usually a feat that can be taken more than once says so in the description of the feat...

Liberty's Edge

I agree with Xykal, I don't believe extra path ability can be chosen multiple times.

That aside, I don't think I would if I could. Mythic Feats are more powerful than they're given credit for in this pdf.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Some of the higher mythic abilities use up a lot of mythic power so I would rate Extra Mythic Power as green. Who wants to be careful how they expend their source of awesomeness, the more you have the more mythic you're going to feel.

I think spellcasters will go through their mythic power pretty quickly.

I like the guide so far but we need the rest of it!


I think the displays of ought to be higher rated depending on build or mixing with the feats. It's costly, but for two surges you can ge an effective +40 to a skill, if you want to abuse bluff and diplomacy especially.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Or auto succeed on a UMD check to cast a high level spell from a scroll of something. You could trade mythic power for level 9 spells cast at mid levels - that's pretty powerful!


I would rate the 'Display of X' line of abilities higher than Mythic Sustenance myself. +20 to the right ability can be a gamechanger. Mythic Sustenance though, is easily duplicated by low-level spells (water breathing, gust of wind, goodberry and so on) and lacks the sheer versatility of the Display ability paths.


The Displays of STAT require expending a mythic power point. Mythic sustenance is a passive ability that's always on. Also, you probably can't expend 2 points to get +40 because I don't see anything that says a mythic circumstance bonus stacks with another mythic circumstance bonus.

Since it requires being Mythic Tier 3, the Extra Path Ability feat can only be taken 4 times, not 5.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

+20 and one use of mythic power to scroll elemental swarm, mass heal, power word kill (to name but a few) seems pretty good to me.


Wycen wrote:

The Displays of STAT require expending a mythic power point. Mythic sustenance is a passive ability that's always on. Also, you probably can't expend 2 points to get +40 because I don't see anything that says a mythic circumstance bonus stacks with another mythic circumstance bonus.

Since it requires being Mythic Tier 3, the Extra Path Ability feat can only be taken 4 times, not 5.

I don't think there is such a thing as a "mythical circumstance bonus" as it just states it as a circumstance bonus.

In any case, I don't think they stack since it's from the same source. It's probably better like that. Imagine spending 20 mythic points to get a +400 bonus to carrying capacity? That kind of strength would make the Hulk jealous.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Sauce987654321 wrote:
Wycen wrote:

The Displays of STAT require expending a mythic power point. Mythic sustenance is a passive ability that's always on. Also, you probably can't expend 2 points to get +40 because I don't see anything that says a mythic circumstance bonus stacks with another mythic circumstance bonus.

Since it requires being Mythic Tier 3, the Extra Path Ability feat can only be taken 4 times, not 5.

I don't think there is such a thing as a "mythical circumstance bonus" as it just states it as a circumstance bonus.

In any case, I don't think they stack since it's from the same source. It's probably better like that. Imagine spending 20 mythic points to get a +400 bonus to carrying capacity? That kind of strength would make the Hulk jealous.

+1


The other one is the feats where you can spend a surge to "treat the roll as a 20"."


I think you may be correct about the extra mythic power feat, so I'll have to fix that part..

As to the +20 skill bonus, it's very circumstantial, yes it can be useful in the right places, and the right builds, I just don't rate it as high enough to be taking it outside of your path abilities. I will make a note of it for skill focused characters.


Ok, added this guide.. as before, thoughts and disagreements welcome

Archmage Mythic Path


Thanks for this too.

I'm not sure I'd make Spell Sieve blue, because counterspelling is generally a poorer choice than blasting/casting against your enemies. Though, with wild arcana, this gives me an idea.

Use Wild arcana to cast whatever spell you need, then save your standard action to counterspell.

Still not what I'd want to do, but these mythic abilities do provide some interesting possibilities.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Competent Caster... seeing how you highest level spells are the ones you have the least of, you're going to get a lot of mileage get out of this ability. What is most important is the fact that you can now cast when grappled. I think it's better than orange.

Shadow Lodge

stuart haffenden wrote:
Competent Caster... seeing how you highest level spells are the ones you have the least of, you're going to get a lot of mileage get out of this ability. What is most important is the fact that you can now cast when grappled. I think it's better than orange.

Using Competent Caster to cast in grapple is a low level strategy at best. Dimension door renders it obsolete at level 7 for every class that might consider taking Archmage tiers. The teleportation school renders it obsolete at level 1. Considering that there are tier 1 abilities that remain useful for one's entire career, such as Eldritch Breach, Enduring Armor, and Energy Conversion, I think orange is very appropriate.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

What happened to flexable counter spell? No need to ready, use any spell the same level - makes countering worth considering.

Scarab Sages

zimmerwald1915 wrote:
stuart haffenden wrote:
Competent Caster... seeing how you highest level spells are the ones you have the least of, you're going to get a lot of mileage get out of this ability. What is most important is the fact that you can now cast when grappled. I think it's better than orange.
Using Competent Caster to cast in grapple is a low level strategy at best. Dimension door renders it obsolete at level 7 for every class that might consider taking Archmage tiers. The teleportation school renders it obsolete at level 1. Considering that there are tier 1 abilities that remain useful for one's entire career, such as Eldritch Breach, Enduring Armor, and Energy Conversion, I think orange is very appropriate.

For the Magus, competent casters is alway useful.

No more having to roll for casting defensively while using spell combat.

ShadowcatX wrote:

I agree with Xykal, I don't believe extra path ability can be chosen multiple times.

That aside, I don't think I would if I could. Mythic Feats are more powerful than they're given credit for in this pdf.

Some of the mythic feats are more powerful than a lot of the path abilities.

Arcane Strike: add bane + mythic bane to your weapon for 1 minute as a swift action. Your +2 weapon can now break epic DR at 5th level.

Vital Strike: one of the most powerful abilities in the entire book. Use it to one-round anything in the game at high level.

I could go on, and at some point a series of guides needs to be written that goes through the entire list of mythic options available on a per class basis.

Shadow Lodge

Artanthos wrote:
zimmerwald1915 wrote:
stuart haffenden wrote:
Competent Caster... seeing how you highest level spells are the ones you have the least of, you're going to get a lot of mileage get out of this ability. What is most important is the fact that you can now cast when grappled. I think it's better than orange.
Using Competent Caster to cast in grapple is a low level strategy at best. Dimension door renders it obsolete at level 7 for every class that might consider taking Archmage tiers. The teleportation school renders it obsolete at level 1. Considering that there are tier 1 abilities that remain useful for one's entire career, such as Eldritch Breach, Enduring Armor, and Energy Conversion, I think orange is very appropriate.

For the Magus, competent casters is alway useful.

No more having to roll for casting defensively while using spell combat.

Being useful for one class that will probably take Dual Path to get access to the ability isn't enough to bump Competent Caster up to green.

Scarab Sages

zimmerwald1915 wrote:
Artanthos wrote:
zimmerwald1915 wrote:
stuart haffenden wrote:
Competent Caster... seeing how you highest level spells are the ones you have the least of, you're going to get a lot of mileage get out of this ability. What is most important is the fact that you can now cast when grappled. I think it's better than orange.
Using Competent Caster to cast in grapple is a low level strategy at best. Dimension door renders it obsolete at level 7 for every class that might consider taking Archmage tiers. The teleportation school renders it obsolete at level 1. Considering that there are tier 1 abilities that remain useful for one's entire career, such as Eldritch Breach, Enduring Armor, and Energy Conversion, I think orange is very appropriate.

For the Magus, competent casters is alway useful.

No more having to roll for casting defensively while using spell combat.

Being useful for one class that will probably take Dual Path to get access to the ability isn't enough to bump Competent Caster up to green.

My point is, abilities that are worthless for one class may be life saving for another. I could have used a wild shaping druid, a cleric that intends to melee or an inquisitor as my example, all will frequently run into circumstances where they will want to forgo casting defensively but wish to continue to threaten their opponent.

And I would expect any Magus to dual path, they are going to want both melee and caster path abilities.

Shadow Lodge

Artanthos wrote:
My point is, abilities that are worthless for one class may be life saving for another.

And my point is that it doesn't matter. Orange is for abilities that aren't bad, but which are overshadowed by other abilities offered by the path. That fits Competent Caster to a T. Maybe it could use a mention of Magus, Eldritch Knight, and Dragon Disciple like Spellbane Counterstrike has in its description, but it should not be a green ability.

Scarab Sages

Then we will agree to disagree.

I believe an ability that may be worthless for a fighter may be very important for a caster, and vice versa. You cannot make a generic rating on a character specific ability.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

And counter spell?


Flexible Counterspell seems to have some merit to it if you're facing a good deal of casters. Though, you can eat through your mythic power points using that. Personally, I would prefer to just use Dispel Magic or Greater Dispel Magic instead of a higher level spell slot.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

But you'll nothing else... at least the mythic option allows you to cast each round and still counter.


I agree that Beyond Morality should be green, but not for the same reasons. It's on my list of "must haves" for my inquisitor in WotR.

Allowing unusual class combinations (barbarian/monks) is nice, but I'm seeing it in a more defensive fashion where the "most favorable alignment" side of things comes into play. You become immune to spells like Holy Word/Blasphemy/Dictum/Word of Chaos and their kin.

A debatable benefit: Some forms of DR are alignment based, usually bypassed by your opposing alignment. Beyond Morality would protect you from essentially all alignments, effectively giving you a universal DR.

I know there are many ways to bypass DR, but alignment or aligned weapons won't be part of them.


For some reason I missed flexible counterspell, just finished adding it, I agree with ace, it can really burn though your mythic power, but it has great synergy with spell sieve.. orange to green, depending on your build.

I made spell sieve blue because it doesn't cost mythic power, that upgrades it from green in my opinion... and it can create an interesting synergy with flexible counterspell.

As to the other point, generally this guide focuses on the three main arcane casters, with some call out to the summoner and the magus, but I'll indicate that for competent caster can be considered green for some builds.

Actually, that's the biggest problem with mythic power guides, they apply to multiple classes, also, some of the abilities can create really interesting synergies as well, making them more useful then they first appear.


I've been looking for something like these guides, awesome! I really like Component Freedom because it's so flexible. The option to ignore the somatic, verbal, or costly material component of a spell based on the specific spell? Free stoneskin! No more getting screwed by a silence spell! No more being captured because your hands got bound!


dotting


Very nice, I'll look through it more fully later.

Shadow Lodge

Are you planning to include the material from Mythic Origins as well as Mythic Adventures?


I've only just got mythic origins this weekend.. so I'm not quite ready to add stuff from it, but I plan too


Archmage Updated with stuff from mythic origins.


You might want to reconsider Mythic Spellpower, in another thread I make that same observation but appears to be that Mythic Spellpower allow you to cast mythic spells without expending any mythic points, so you can cast an augmented mythic fireball and save 3 mythic points.

Also Component Freedom is more than Eschew Materials, you can ignore costly component and focus up to 1000 GP at tier 10. And what makes Harmonious Mage more valuable is that Opposition Research discovery can't be taken multiple times.

Great guide, waiting to see the rest of the paths, Archmage is my favorite too ;)


Correction, you mean the augmented version of the spell.. that may be a valid point, I'll have to give it some more consideration. Ok, I gave it a quick second look, extra mythic power is superior in every way, sense mythic spellpower applies only to mythic spells, and mythic power applies to all mythic uses, I still grade it as red, and as a trap.. if it gave more points then mythic power, then maybe it would be worth it. If you have anything to add that will add new light on the matter, I'm willing to listen.

Componant freedom does have it's uses, it's sort of low on my list of things I might want as an archmage.. perhaps I didn't cover it as well as it could be covered though.. I still won't upgrade it, too many other good stuff to pick up as archmage first, but a metamagic master might want it.. at 3 levels, you can pretty much ignore all spell components, so it is good there, but I still won't take it that many times, some builds might want too.

I've looked at wizard discoveries, and other then some of the discoveries outright saying you can take it multiple times but must apply it to different aspects each time, there is nothing indicating you can't take opposition research multiple times, other then the fact that it's not indicated you can take it multiple times, perhaps because some specialists can't..sense if you roll an elementalist, you have only 1 opposition school anyway.. furthermore, with wild arcana, it still costs you only 1 mythic point to cast any spell on your list, even opposition school spells. If I'm wrong, please indicate where I can find the updated information.

As far as I'm concerned, harmonous mage is good because it does replace 2 feats if your a normal specialized mage, and feats are important, but I won't grade it higher then orange for a number of reasons

First, if you took a specialist mage, you considered what schools you were going to be using least anyway and willingly gave them up.. 2nd, a elemental mage can easily loose all of his opposition schools for 1 feat.. 3rd, wild arcana gives you the option of easily casting opposition spells anyway, if you really need them.. 4th, if you really, really wanted a particular spell on your opposition list.. you can always memorize it using 2 slots.. or if you had split slot (late in the game I admit) you could just memorize said spell by putting it in a higher level slot.


I believe the 3rd Tier requirement in Speedy Summons is just to the ability to quickly summon your Eidolon.


Disagree on the extra feat ability being red. There are a number of mythic feat that added to the right build are devastating and worth losing a path ability or two.


Been a long time sense I responded too, or worked on this, but in retrospect, and after some time playing with mythic abilities, I sort of agree with you, Geflin, but it depends on the build, mainly good for the fighter or the rogue, IMO.

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