New class options you're really hoping to see?

[_shredder_]

Maya Coleman wrote:

As a Kineticist fan myself, I'd love something that is basically a stronger Psychokineticist archetype. I just really really really really want to be able to use paper as my main weapon and mode of travel and not die immediately. Yes, I did watch "Read or Die" and loved it. Hence.

As a giant pf1 psychokineticist fan, I would love to see it come back as a class archetype, and all I really want from it is changing the KAS and switching the Fortitude and Will save progressions, so I can play a fully mentally focused kineticist that feels more like a typical cloth caster than a tough martial.

[ornathopter]

Mangaholic13 wrote:

So... Rival Academies having the Monastery of the Unbreaking Waves get a Magus Hybrid Study has given me some ideas...

Namely, some Non-Monk options associated with each House of Perfection:

All four schools could have options for Kineticists.

Options for Untwisting Iron could include:
Fighter options
Monastic Weaponry options

Options for Unfolding Wind could include:
Unarmed combat options
Throwing weapon options

Options for Unblinking Flame could include:
Psychic stuff
New Qi spells

Heck, it could be interesting if, given Wood and Metal having become their own element with genies and planes, if two new schools based around them tried to establish themselves among the Houses (Unbending Tree and Unrusting Metal, perhaps?)

Maybe that could fit into a Lost Omens: Jalmeray/Impossible Lands? It does sound fun.

[Mangaholic13]

I'd also like to see an Eldritch Knight archetype.

...Yes, I know that *technically* the Magus Multiclass counts as one... but it's not a very good one.

I'd prefer something where it gets a variant of Eldritch Archer and Spellshot's Eldritch Shot/Spell-Woven Shot.

Maybe have something like this:

Eldritch Strike [Three-Action]
Requirements: Must be unarmed or wielding a melee weapon
Effect: You Cast a Spell that takes 1 or 2 actions to cast and requires
a spell attack roll. The effects of the spell do not occur immediately but are imbued into the required weapon or unarmed Strike. Make a Strike with that weapon.
Your spell travels through your strike, using your attack roll result to determine the effects of both the Strike and the spell. This counts as two attacks for your multiple attack penalty, but you don’t apply the penalty until after you’ve completed the Eldritch Strike.

[exequiel759]

Eh, I think the only reason why eldritch archer was a thing is because it came out before the magus. As you said, the magus is already an eldritch knight. Technically, a fighter with wizard dedication is the closest to the PF1e / D&D 3.5 eldritch knight, which obviously already exists too.

However, I think there's room (either as an archetype or magus feats, if not both) to instead of using your weapon proficiencies to make an spell attack to instead cast a spell while attacking. Kinda like the PF1e warpriest that used to cast buffs while attacking IIRC.

I wouldn't be bothered if it was limited to self buffs only.

[Zoken44]

Okay, second stab at the Gun Witch, because the criticism was correct: needs to be class archetype.

So normal class archetype stuff would apply and both spell casting and weapon proficiency would be made similar to the war priest. Witch's Familiar is replaced with
Pact Pistol: Has the stats of a flint lock pistol, and serves as your connection to your patron. It does not get the extra abilities that a normal witch's familiar gets and can only prepare master abilities. It automatically gains potency and striking runes as with automatic progression.

It also gains the unique familiar ability: Ready Familiar: when ever you cast or sustain a hex spell, your Pact Pistol automatically reloads with standard ammunition conjured from the ether, OR if you have instructed your familiar to, it will load special (magical or alchemical) ammunition you are wearing.

You gain the Hex Cantrip: Patron's Target. 1 action, with the Hex and concentrate trait. Sustained up to 1 minute.
When you cast this spell your weapon increases it's item bonus by one. in addition when you cast this spell and each time you sustain it you may step, demoralize, stride, recall knowledge, OR begin to aid an ally (as in the action to cast this spell, counts as one of the two needed to aid)

Feats in this archetype would include being able to designate a second 1 handed fire arm to automatically reload with your familiar ability. Being able to essentially exploit vulnerability if you chose to recall knowledge, gaining the intimidating glare feat, and allowing you to add your weapon bonus to the demoralize action you take with the hex cantrip, making the stride you take as a part of your hex cantrip not trigger RS.

[Maya Coleman]

_shredder_ wrote:

As a giant pf1 psychokineticist fan, I would love to see it come back as a class archetype, and all I really want from it is changing the KAS and switching the Fortitude and Will save progressions, so I can play a fully mentally focused kineticist that feels more like a typical cloth caster than a tough martial.

Yes, this would be incredible!!!

[JiCi]

For the Inventor...

INITIAL WEAPON INNOVATION
(for crossbows and firearms only)
Your innovation gains the Double Barrel trait.

BREAKTHROUGH WEAPON INNOVATION
(for crossbows and firearms only)
Your innovation gains the Capacity 3 trait.

REVOLUTIONARY WEAPON INNOVATION
(for crossbows and firearms only)
Your innovation gains the Repeating trait.

[moosher12]

Zoken44 wrote:

Okay, second stab at the Gun Witch, because the criticism was correct: needs to be class archetype.

So normal class archetype stuff would apply and both spell casting and weapon proficiency would be made similar to the war priest. Witch's Familiar is replaced with
Pact Pistol: Has the stats of a flint lock pistol, and serves as your connection to your patron. It does not get the extra abilities that a normal witch's familiar gets and can only prepare master abilities. It automatically gains potency and striking runes as with automatic progression.

It also gains the unique familiar ability: Ready Familiar: when ever you cast or sustain a hex spell, your Pact Pistol automatically reloads with standard ammunition conjured from the ether, OR if you have instructed your familiar to, it will load special (magical or alchemical) ammunition you are wearing.

You gain the Hex Cantrip: Patron's Target. 1 action, with the Hex and concentrate trait. Sustained up to 1 minute.
When you cast this spell your weapon increases it's item bonus by one. in addition when you cast this spell and each time you sustain it you may step, demoralize, stride, recall knowledge, OR begin to aid an ally (as in the action to cast this spell, counts as one of the two needed to aid)

Feats in this archetype would include being able to designate a second 1 handed fire arm to automatically reload with your familiar ability. Being able to essentially exploit vulnerability if you chose to recall knowledge, gaining the intimidating glare feat, and allowing you to add your weapon bonus to the demoralize action you take with the hex cantrip, making the stride you take as a part of your hex cantrip not trigger RS.

On top of this, I want to see expanded gunwands and gunstaves. I want to see rules for costs and levels of a gunwand beyond rank 1 spells, and gunstaves beyond 1 cantrip and 1 rank 1 spell. Or at the very least, I'd like to see them pull a Runelord and implant their stave or wand in a gun they are wielding.

[django77]

Kinetic Knight for Kineticist

[Zoken44]

Expand on Kinetic Knight for me. Because to my mind that sounds like simply taking one of the armor impulses and the weapon impulse, but I'm guessing that's not what you mean.

[JiCi]

If I had to guess, a Kinetic Knight would like Starfinder's Solarian, including with a Solarian Crystal allowing your Blasts to be enhanced with runes.

[Perpdepog]

Zoken44 wrote:

Expand on Kinetic Knight for me. Because to my mind that sounds like simply taking one of the armor impulses and the weapon impulse, but I'm guessing that's not what you mean.

TBH that's the bulk of it, really, at least when you look at the PF1E archetype. You traded out your ability to use ranged blasts for the Kinetic Blade infusion, which got some expanded infusions at later levels that let you do things like rush down guys or strike at everyone around you. (Infusions are functionally the same as impulses, if you are unfamiliar with PF1E's kineticist.)

Aside from that you got armor proficiency, swapped out some Dex-y skills for Diplomacy and Sense Motive, and stole the Resolve class feature from the samurai, which gave you some resistance against some conditions and would let you reroll a couple kinds of save.

[Zoken44]

So, as far as a "Kinetic knight" class archetype for the kineticist...

I would say your total number of impulses is reduced, only one impulse feat at first level and you do not get extra impulse feats at Junctions. And your kinetic blast is replaced with "Impulsed Weapon" where in you take an action, and cause your melee weapon to gain the trait of your element, and you can choose to change the damage to one of the allowable by kinetic blast. You may spend an extra action on this to either give your melee weapon reach, OR deal con modifier damage. And then maybe extra feats down the line to give you more skill proficiencies or let you layer extra effects on to your Impulsed Weapon, or get extra impulse abilities.

[RaptorJesues]

Mangaholic13 wrote:

RaptorJesues wrote:

I honestly just want something that makes lancing frome horseback any good

You mean The Cavalier?

I should have probably put more emphasis on GOOD, the cavalier archeype is quite anemic and gives nothing to lancing specifically

[moosher12]

Because constructs (particularly those that were formerly golems) can no longer be crafted by PCs in 2E, I'd be interested in seeing a caster-oriented archetype that allows you to create a magical construct companion (as opposed to an inventor's construct companion) that might follow the rules of an animal companion similar to how a Mechanic's drone would.

[LinnormSurface]

I definitely am also a fan of having a construct companion archetype that represents the many magical constructs in the setting! As far as other archetypes, I'd really love to see a spellshape-focused archetype, that focuses on things like granting unique spellshapes, improving the action economy of using spellshapes, and of course a healthy amount of spellshape class feats as the standard slightly increased level prereq archetype feats.
A third archetype I'd like to see is a class archetype for Bard that leans into the occult knowledge angle a bit more than the performance angle, likely by making it cast with Intelligence and use occultism for Lingering/Fortissimo Composition and similar effects

More deviant feats would be great too(both new classifications and more feats for existing ones), the decay and regrowth ones that were recently released are quite nice.

I'd also really love to see some more Arcane Sorcerer bloodlines and Witch patrons. Additionally, an Arcane and an Occult patron with a damaging hex cantrip would be nice to have, so that every tradition gets at least one patron they can choose if they want to get a unique damage option.
Also on the topic of Sorcerer and Witch, I think they could use some more feats that care about your casting tradition, like the Sorcerer's Evolution feats and Spirit/Stitched Familiar from Witch.

I think Sorcerer could also benefit from an option that lets you choose some additional spells from your repertoire to benefit from blood magic, and Wizard could use an option to let you add some spells to your curriculum list(frankly I'd love for this to be errata'd in as a class feature, but it'd be alright as a low-level class feat too perhaps). I've also seen people suggest being able to get an additional school via a feat, much like Order Explorer or Multifarious Muse(I'm not really holding my breath for this one, though since I'd imagine it'd have been in Player Core if it were going to happen. That said, I really do think it's important for Wizard to have an in-class pathway to getting 3 focus points. Another possible way to achieve that is with focus spells that any Wizard can learn, regardless of subclass, which might be effects that interact with Wizard-y stuff like letting you reprepare a spell quickly, learn your degree of success on a secret Int check, or other things that make you seem smart and magical. In general I think most classes would benefit from having a few relatively generic and easy to flavor focus spells that any subclass can get, so that you can make sure players who mostly only care about one or two of their subclass focus spells can still fill up their pool without needing to pick up something they won't be likely to use, and allows a little more comfort for subclasses with flavorful but situational focus spells, like many cleric domains.

I think it would also be nice to have some more Druid options, both order-specific and non-order-sprcific, so that you can still spread out into multiple orders, but remaining in one order is also viable. More of the variant orders would be pretty cool too, I think, perhaps a Crystal order that modifies the Stone order or a Swamp order for Wave order?
Additional full orders could be cool too, perhaps a Planar order that cares about the elemental planes as a whole? And of course a Metal order would be nice to get.

It'd also be quite neat to have some more kineticist impulses that play with similar wider interpretations of their elements, or feats that modify an existing impulse but aren't, themselves, an impulse. For example, adding some crystal-themed impulses to Earth would be fitting(maybe Shattering Gem-like effects, piercing crystal shards, attack reflection abilities, maybe even inflicting dazzled or blinded, since in many ways that still fits Earth's defense focus). Earth's more occasional radiation focus might also be an option, but I can understand that being less of a likely pick since it's rather evil-associated. I think you could also get more acid damage effects for Water(since it's often the damage type used to represent extremely salty water), and more electricity effects for Air.

Lastly, I'd absolutely love to see additional support for weapon Monks, whether through stances that add new monk weapons, like Waterfowl Stance(in particular it'd be neat to see a club or polearm stance, just due to personal taste), or through new ways to give weapons the monk trait(maybe something that lets you give weapons the monk trait based on the stance you're in?). In general I think those sorts of potential monk weapon expansions could be tricky to balance, but I also think options that let you widen your available weapon choices are useful, since the monk trait and assorted ancestry traits are kind of awkward future-proofing compared to classes that use agile/finesse(various), classes that use not-agile/finesse(Barbarian), and Fighters with their weapon groups, since those traits all have more significant gameplay implications.

Hopefully formatting this as one overly long post is better than a bunch of small ones, I'm not certain which would be preferable.

[Zoken44]

As far as the Magical Crafter thing goes, I think that could be an interest class archetype for the Inventor. Removing the normal innovation options for unique ones like a Magical Construct, a Staff, or a magical consciousness that can later be slotted into an item to make it function as a magic item.

[Dragonchess Player]

Zoken44 wrote:

As far as the Magical Crafter thing goes, I think that could be an interest class archetype for the Inventor. Removing the normal innovation options for unique ones like a Magical Construct, a Staff, or a magical consciousness that can later be slotted into an item to make it function as a magic item.

Or the inventor can... just take Magical Crafting (and possibly Monster Crafting, if they increase proficiency in Survival). PF2 does not require the casting of spells to craft most magic items.

Although a class archetype that would allow the inventor to change certain magical properties of their innovation during daily preparations could be interesting.

[exequiel759]

I feel the runesmith is kinda going to be the magical craftsmen of the system based on them having free access to the Magical Crafting feat and the formulas for fundamental and property runes. No auto-scaling on Crafting but I feel like that barely matters for most campaigns and, in the few campaigns where crafting would actually matter, as long as you increase it to expert/master/legendary at 5th/9th/17th level its going to be fine.

[Zoken44]

You're assuming they don't add auto scaling on crafting. It's still a possibility