What do we think the Animist multiclass archetype might look like?


Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

It works differently than other full classes, so I wonder how the archetype will work. The animist is really cool, and incorporating it as an archetype could make some really interesting characters. Anyone have any ideas?


I'm a bit on the fence about having the archetype still have the split of both Divine prepared casting and Spontaneous casting. I'm thinking that leaning more into the Apparition casting will be more on-theme and will leave it more powerful than trying to split the power with the Divine casting.

So I expect that the dedication feat will give two cantrips as normal, but they will be at least partially chosen by Apparition choice. Whether only one, or both I'm not sure.

There will likely also be the spellcasting feats as normal for multiclass spellcasting archetypes. Probably spontaneous slots and repertoire chosen by Apparition choice.

As a separate archetype feat, you will probably be able to get the first of the Animist focus spells from the Apparition.

As well as the normal two-part feat combo that lets you get Animist class feats at half your character level.

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Another option would be for the spellcasting to be the Divine half and at that point you may as well just pick Cleric archetype instead.

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There may be some way of getting both the Divine prepared and spontaneous Apparition spellcasting, but that is going to be real thin on either half since the archetype spellcasting feats only give one spell slot per level until an upgrade feat at level 8. Maybe the level 8 upgrade feat is when you can add in some of the Divine prepared casting to the Animist spontaneous casting that you get from the archetype at 2nd level.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Maybe its divine spellcasting but instead of the usual breadth feat, theres a level 8 feat that gives you the apparition slots. With up to that point the apparition simply given you access to the cantrip and maybe the focus spell (via a feat).


I'm kind of hoping that there won't be any focus spell access, at least based on what we saw from the playtest. Combining them with Effortless Concentration (something the class seemed to have intentionally restricted) or Fighter's accuracy (for things like Embodiment of Battle that count on a caster base) seems like it'd cause issues. I'm curious how the casting side of things is handled, though, yeah.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Thats a good point.


Considering how the Psychic raised the bar for spellcasting dedications, I'd not be surprised to see Animist Focus Spells accessible through the Dedication. The Embodiment of Battle is only an issue for level 13+ and even then it's not gamebreaking, just strong.


I was thinking of what from the Animist will stay strictly Animist (like Witch has its Patron’s gifts - familiar ability/hex cantrip), and I’m thinking the spontaneous Apparition spells might be it (and possibly being able to select/swap apparitions).

My guess:

Animist Dedication: Select an apparition. You gain that apparition, but nothing else tied to it. Trained spell attack and DCs. Gain 2 cantrips, from the Divine tradition. Trained in Religion and a lore from your apparition.

Basic/Expert/Master Spells: Prepared divine spell slots.

Spell Breadth: Gain additional spell slots.

Vessel Spell: Gain the associated vessel spell of your apparition.

Will Mastery: Master Will saves. Probably add something about bonus against possession.

The spontaneous apparition spells are a bit too…involved, to use. Granting the ability to swap apparitions seems a bit much for a person dabbling into the Animist. Gaining one apparition that they are strongly bonded with.

I’m gonna guess gaining more and having the ability to swap would step too much on what the Animist is and so it shouldn’t be accessible to other classes. Because you’re already a full class, the Animist Archetype should only be one slice of the Animist to augment your capabilities. And if you wanted to have more prepared/spontaneous casting, you’re either getting the opposite of what your caster does, or you’re gonna have to stretch because you’re a martial and you’re pretty good already.

It’s a bit boring/formulaic, but I think it’s consistent with the formula.


Tunu40 wrote:
I was thinking of what from the Animist will stay strictly Animist (like Witch has its Patron’s gifts - familiar ability/hex cantrip), and I’m thinking the spontaneous Apparition spells might be it (and possibly being able to select/swap apparitions).

Personally, I think that is too much to not have in the multiclass Archetype. It wouldn't feel like an Animist after losing that.

For comparison point - Magus. The archetype doesn't lock out spellcasting. Or focus spells. Or even Spellstrike. Many of those things are expensive to get or only work in limited fashion though.

What Magus has exclusive to full class Magus is Arcane Cascade and the ability to recharge Spellstrike mid-battle.

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What makes this difficult to try and analyze is that we still don't really know what Animist will fully look like when released.

Liberty's Edge

SuperBidi wrote:
Considering how the Psychic raised the bar for spellcasting dedications, I'd not be surprised to see Animist Focus Spells accessible through the Dedication. The Embodiment of Battle is only an issue for level 13+ and even then it's not gamebreaking, just strong.

I certainly hope not. The Psi Dedication is in a tier all its own and frankly lies so far outside of the norm (even though the spectrum of balance is so narrow it is only a fair difference rather than cut and dry broken balance to completely upend the scales) that I've been tapping my fingers waiting for Errata. It is as good now as the Alchemist was terrible in the 1.0 iteration.

I'd rather it not be the next step up the power creep ladder and be tuned instead of new options trying to scale up to match how great the Psi Dedication is.

Verdant Wheel

Maybe two cantrips for basic.

Then two parallel options for Prepared and Spontaneous?


Tunu40 wrote:
It’s a bit boring/formulaic, but I think it’s consistent with the formula.

I'm guessing the formulaic archetype too. I would only add that most class archetypes also have:

"Basic [splat] - add a level 1 or 2 class feat", and

"Advanced [splat] - add a class feat equal or less than half your level. You may take this feat multiple times".

So I'd expect to see those too.


Themetricsystem wrote:

I certainly hope not. The Psi Dedication is in a tier all its own and frankly lies so far outside of the norm (even though the spectrum of balance is so narrow it is only a fair difference rather than cut and dry broken balance to completely upend the scales) that I've been tapping my fingers waiting for Errata. It is as good now as the Alchemist was terrible in the 1.0 iteration.

I'd rather it not be the next step up the power creep ladder and be tuned instead of new options trying to scale up to match how great the Psi Dedication is.

Bonuses and penalties are supposed to go from +/-1 to +/-4. It works for a lot of things but not for status bonuses that are, for a weird reason, going extremely rarely beyond +2 (Heroism and Inspire Heroics are the only ones I can think of). So giving access to more +3 status bonuses can be seen as power creep but it can also be seen as unused design space being finally used. I'm all in for new classes pushing the boundaries closer to the limit so they expand the game possibilities instead of being constrained inside the boundaries the other classes are painting. Also, I'd love for Bard to just be a solution among many to give nice buffs.


Easl wrote:

I'm guessing the formulaic archetype too. I would only add that most class archetypes also have:

"Basic [splat] - add a level 1 or 2 class feat", and

"Advanced [splat] - add a class feat equal or less than half your level. You may take this feat multiple times".

So I'd expect to see those too.

Lol, can’t believe I forgot to include those. It’s just such a given. XD

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