I've seen this argued two separate ways.
Either Spell Study can be used to craft items or it can't. I'd like to get a definitive answer. What crafting can Spell Study be used for? Can it be used for scrolls and wands, or is it more limited than that?
From Nethys:
Spell Study (Su): At 2nd level, the sage’s understanding of the spells of bards, clerics, and druids is so great that he can use his own magic in an inefficient, roundabout way to duplicate those classes’ spells. Once per day, a spell sage can spontaneously cast any spell on the bard, cleric, or druid spell list as if it were a wizard spell he knew and had prepared. Casting the spell requires the spell sage to spend 1 full round per spell level of the desired spell (if the spell is on multiple spell lists indicated above, using the lowest level from among those lists) and requires expending two prepared spells of that spell level or higher; if the spell’s casting time is normally 1 full round or longer, this is added to the spell sage’s casting time. For example, if a spell sage wants to use spell study to cast cure light wounds (cleric spell level 1st), he must spend 2 full rounds casting and expend two prepared wizard spells of 1st level or higher.
Thank you in advance.
You need to be able to cast all the spells a magic item requires for every day the item is being crafted. This requirement can be met using any combination of your spells, spells from other spell casters, and spells from magic items.
When crafting magic items that cast spells (for instance scrolls, potions, wands, and staves), you need to be able to cast the spell(s) in question. This spell requirement can't be skipped for these kinds of magic item.
When it comes to other magic items, you can skip a requirement (even individual spells) by increasing the DC by 5. Magic item creation feats are the exception, you must have them.
https://www.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?Name=Magic%20Item%20Descriptions&Cate gory=Magic%20Items
Under requirements:
Quote: A spell prerequisite may be provided by a character who has prepared the spell (or who knows the spell, in the case of a sorcerer or bard), or through the use of a spell completion or spell trigger magic item or a spell-like ability that produces the desired spell effect. For each day that passes in the creation process, the creator must expend one spell completion item or one charge from a spell trigger item if either of those objects is used to supply a prerequisite.
It is possible for more than one character to cooperate in the creation of an item, with each participant providing one or more of the prerequisites. In some cases, cooperation may even be necessary.
https://www.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?Name=Magic%20Item%20Creation&Category =Magic%20Items
Quote: Note that all items have prerequisites in their descriptions. These prerequisites must be met for the item to be created. Most of the time, they take the form of spells that must be known by the item’s creator (although access through another magic item or spellcaster is allowed). The DC to create a magic item increases by +5 for each prerequisite the caster does not meet. The only exception to this is the requisite item creation feat, which is mandatory. In addition, you cannot create potions, spell-trigger, or spell-completion magic items without meeting their spell prerequisites.
I guess RAW they can’t, in that they neither prepare nor know the spell in question, but that same RAW would suggest Oracles can’t meet prereqs. Pretty clear intent is that a character has to be able to provide a cast of the spell, whether through item or otherwise.
Bigger issue is that the resulting item wouldn’t be usable, as it would be an arcane item with a spell that assumptively isn’t on any arcane character’s spell list. So you’d need UMD to use it.
Garahs wrote: {edited} I've seen this argued two separate ways.
Can Spell Study{of the Spell Sage archetype} can be used to craft items? I'd like to get a definitive answer. What crafting can Spell Study be used for? Can it be used for scrolls and wands, or is it more limited than that?
Thank you in advance.
Wizard Spell Sage archetype with Spell Study(Su) gained at 2nd Lvl within.
essentially spend 2 spell level slots ≥N to spontaneously cast one spell of spell level N (minimum N from Bard, Cleric, Druid spell lists) taking N full rounds plus standard casting time (or rounded up in the example) to do so 1/d. At 6th Lvl 2/d, 11th Lvl 3/d, 16th Lvl 4/d.
We can only give you our understanding of how it works and advice. Official Paizo answers (definitive) are not possible.
Crafting any magic item takes considerably longer that the above casting time AND the crafter need supply the spell in question. The specific item crafting feat needs to be read for that type of item, each is a bit different. If you just need to cast or supply the spell in question
->(pedantic reading of one section) NO, as it is not on the specified list which was written before the archetype (so a "future proofing" issue).{see Belafon's post below}
->(reading the section)YES as the intro says you just need to cast or provide the spell once per day. The key is that the caster "spontaneously casts" the spell. The catch is the caster must have enough slots of the appropriate spell level to cover the cost (a bonded object cannot sub in for actual known spell levels).
-> then there's the +5DC escape clause.
If the crafter needs to know the spell AND there's no general escape clause, then it's a No. (I'd have to review each feat, offhand I think that would be unusual as the process gets rather generic)
As per this FAQ you can use scrolls of spells that are not on your class spell list (like a wizard using a scroll of bless) to fulfill crafting requirements.
If you can take the time to activate a scroll during crafting, there's no reason you couldn't take the time to use Spell Study. (Or Spell Kenning, or other similar abilities.)
Belafon wrote: As per this FAQ you can use scrolls of spells that are not on your class spell list (like a wizard using a scroll of bless) to fulfill crafting requirements. part of the issue is "future proofing".
Scribe Scroll feat, "create a scroll of any spell that you know". Many would take this as on your spell list or memorized, but casting a spell would prove that you know it (or temporarily knew it). That certainly implies that a caster could scribe a spell via Spell Study. Once scribed (multiple times) the caster could use the FAQ & scrolls to create the item. While a bit roundabout and costly it meets the criteria.
since you can even use spell-like abilities (or an item that cast the spell for you) to fulfill item creation spell requirements, i think your good.
Dang. I forgot to start with yes you can.
Yes you can use spell study to provide the spell requirements of magic items when crafting. It doesn't matter if you provide the spells, other spell casters provide the spells, or you use magic items to provide the spells. To that end, spell study can be used to cast spells, so I think spell study can provide the spells needed to craft magic items.
Recent threads in Rules Questions
|
