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I just finished watching all 3 seasons of the Netflix remake of Lost in Space. Unlike other version of Lost in Space I've seen, this one sometimes has up to 500 humans lost together. There are plenty of combat scenes. The robots have laser weapons built into their hands, but out of 500 humans, there is only one gun in the entire 28 episodes. Someone had to hack security codes to print it, and it never ends up being used in a battle. Folding survival knives were the only weapons anyone had, other than security guards who had stun batons. One of the main characters is a retired Navy seal, so it's not like there is a lack of training with guns.
So this got me thinking do we rely on guns too often in Starfinder? With the Starfinder Socity motto is to explore report corporate. SFS scenarios seem like a good place for some gun/weapon free adventures. That doesn't mean there wouldn't be combat. There could be unarmed combat, weapons could be found, improvised, or created. In Lost in Space, not having guns lead to lots of improvising to overcome situations.
To do a gun / weapon-free adventure, I think there needs to be a reason or mission where the PCs are not allowed to bring their weapons. Tarnished Legacy: Star Sugar Superstar!!! with a little adjustment easy could be done weapon free. Crash Down, could be to, just change it so that the PCs were sent on a peaceful mission when they crash. Some of the encounters might need to be balanced for the lack of high-tech weapons, or more time given to improvise weapons.
In the first Alien movie, the crew didn't have guns and had to improvise some flame throwers.
So what other Sci-Fi movies or TV series also don't use guns but still have to fight scenes or battles? (in a setting where guns exist.)
What do you think of having some adventures that are weapon free or at least start out that way?
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It is simply that the majority of the gameplay's depth and complexity lies in it's combat, and a large portion of your character's stats exist to facilitate combat. Most of the weapons, are guns so most people build their character for guns, so .... most combat is going to involve guns.
So not only do the adventures and scenarios characters are normally put in assume you're going to fight your way through them, but they also don't want to deny you all your shiny options.
I do think the adventure paths seem to have a too many "These npcs cannot be reasoned with and will fight to the death" though.
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For a high-tech setting, especially for Starfinder's ubiquitous UPBs and how easy it is to craft items, completely "no guns" scenarios end up as pretty contrived*.
That said, there will probably be individual encounters/events where restrictions on weapons will be appropriate. Even then, there are ways around those restrictions (via magic, mostly).
*- without a highly specific reason, such as Dune's laser/shield technology interaction
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In Acts of Association, there are several encounters where using lethal force could land the PC in prison temporarily, and or gain Infamy. In these encounters, the PC have their weapons, but using them has penalties.
A lot of the social events at the Lore Spire are the type of event that wearing full armor and weapons might be out of place if you are not working security. The Gladiator theme is the Part of the Outfit ability at 12th level that lets you wear armor to formal events and conceal weapons. This is a pointless ability if the PCs are able to be in full battle gear 24/7
So I'm thinking more in line with social situations or reasons the PCs start an adventure or encounter unarmed. In the case of Lost in Space, it's just supposed to be a group of families moving from one peaceful planet to another. What could go wrong?
If you haven't seen the Netflix version of Lost in Space, it's a lot more than just one family lost in space, at times, it's a bit more Battlestar Galactica minus the giant spaceships.
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The larger system is balanced (ish) around the idea of guns, melee, and natural species weapons being about the same. If your adventures consistently make guns not available, you're really just making people who picked a particular character feel bad with no real upside.
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If you haven't seen the Netflix version of Lost in Space, it's a lot more than just one family lost in space, at times, it's a bit more Battlestar Galactica minus the giant spaceships.
At the start, it's literally a bunch of families being transported from Earth to an already established colony: These aren't soldiers, explorers, or 'pathfinders' in any way but rather a group of civilians that aren't really expecting any trouble (or at least not an attack by a hostile alien that nearly no one is aware of) on a voyage that is pretty routine at this point, so 'packing heat' is not particularly wise considering how dangerous a firearms mishap could be in a spaceship.
Starfinder teams, on the other hand, are typically deliberately jumping into situations ranging from 'hostile' and 'potentially hostile' through 'we have no idea what you are going to find' so being armed is generally a good idea...
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A lot of the social events at the Lore Spire are the type of event that wearing full armor and weapons might be out of place if you are not working security. The Gladiator theme is the Part of the Outfit ability at 12th level that lets you wear armor to formal events and conceal weapons. This is a pointless ability if the PCs are able to be in full battle gear 24/7
One of many, many areas that Starfinder declined to elaborate upon. It would've been so easy to assign special characteristics like "Military-issue" or "Civilian" or "Formalwear" to items to signify they may not be appropriate in certain settings, but no, wear an expensive Abadar suit or a Golemforged Plate, doesn't matter, there's no tools to support giving someone the side-eye for it.
(contrast with CP RED, which handled this really well)
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A lot of the social events at the Lore Spire are the type of event that wearing full armor and weapons might be out of place if you are not working security. The Gladiator theme is the Part of the Outfit ability at 12th level that lets you wear armor to formal events and conceal weapons. This is a pointless ability if the PCs are able to be in full battle gear 24/7
One of many, many areas that Starfinder declined to elaborate upon. It would've been so easy to assign traits like "Combat" or "Civilian" or "Formalwear" to items, but no, wear an expensive Abadar suit or a Golemforged Plate, doesn't matter, there's no tools to support giving someone the side-eye for it.
(contrast with CP RED, which handled this really well)
This becomes problematic when it devolves into a 'no heavy equipment in social situations, so players avoid heavy equipment builds entirely' or 'the social situation you are attending is attacked, but the author can not balance this encounter because the PCs may be at full strength or heavily nerfed depending on the specific party composition' situations...
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The closest Starfinder comes to rules for social situations is in the clothing descriptions. here are just a few examples.
Formal and party clothing both give giving you this penalty. Lacking the proper formal/party wear at a social event, can cause you to take a penalty of up to –4 to Bluff, Diplomacy, and Disguise.
Wearing the proper uniform grants you a +1 circumstance bonus to Disguise checks to appear as a member of the group that the uniform represents.
While wearing couture clothing, you gain a +2 bonus on Bluff, Diplomacy, and Intimidate checks when interacting with individuals who recognize the value of the garments, as determined by the GM. You also take a –4 penalty on Stealth checks to blend into a crowd while wearing couture clothing unless the crowd is also wearing similar garb.
So there are benefits currently to dressing for an occasion. Just not ones used very often. I don't think these situations should come up all the time, but if they happened a little more often, could add a lot of variation to the game.
One of the problems I see is characters that are likely to invest in heavy equipment for combat are also the classes that don't have lots of skill slots to have lots of choices in a social situation. And it's all so hard to invest feats and equipment into being good at unarmed, nonlethal, and armed combat at the same time.
One of the advantages of a tech-heavy society is picking the right equipment for the right job. In Starfinder you are incentivized to sell your gear to get better equipment, not keeping a collection of equipment with more options to choose from. The other issue is if you did have a collection of equipment you need some place to store it, you can't carry everything with you.
I'm curious how CP RED deal with this.
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This becomes problematic when it devolves into a 'no heavy equipment in social situations, so players avoid heavy equipment builds entirely' or 'the social situation you are attending is attacked, but the author can not balance this encounter because the PCs may be at full strength or heavily nerfed depending on the specific party composition' situations...
I was wondering how it would be balanced out. Since unarmed combat is so rare in Starfidner I wonder if it would balance out by everyone being equally bad at it. Since it's unarmed combat the risk is lower too, no one is likely to die.
More unarmed combat might give species with natural weapons more of a chance to use them. Or give characters that invested in combat maneuvers to use them as well.
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This becomes problematic when it devolves into a 'no heavy equipment in social situations, so players avoid heavy equipment builds entirely' or 'the social situation you are attending is attacked, but the author can not balance this encounter because the PCs may be at full strength or heavily nerfed depending on the specific party composition' situations...I was wondering how it would be balanced out. Since unarmed combat is so rare in Starfidner I wonder if it would balance out by everyone being equally bad at it. Since it's unarmed combat the risk is lower too, no one is likely to die.
More unarmed combat might give species with natural weapons more of a chance to use them. Or give characters that invested in combat maneuvers to use them as well.
Spellcasters, species with natural weapons, evolutionists, solarians, and vanguards can operate fine without their guns. Too high a chance of players being immensely mismatched in their power for an official adventure.
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This becomes problematic when it devolves into a 'no heavy equipment in social situations, so players avoid heavy equipment builds entirely' or 'the social situation you are attending is attacked, but the author can not balance this encounter because the PCs may be at full strength or heavily nerfed depending on the specific party composition' situations...I was wondering how it would be balanced out. Since unarmed combat is so rare in Starfidner I wonder if it would balance out by everyone being equally bad at it. Since it's unarmed combat the risk is lower too, no one is likely to die.
More unarmed combat might give species with natural weapons more of a chance to use them. Or give characters that invested in combat maneuvers to use them as well.
You also have to take 'Technomancers with Flight and Junk Armor Spells' and the like into consideration: Hard to punch or even bite a guy in full (if magically improvised) armor who is hovering 10' off the ground and hurling fireballs (sorry, Explosive Blasts) at people.
You'll need buy-in from your players. Vanguards, solarians, and soldiers would be the hardest hit although they do still have skills to use that can help in social, environmental, or other situations; still, there's some balancing to do.
One other issue is that many guns run on batteries, the same as technology often does. It's one thing if you only have one clip for your M1 Garand, but it's another if you can just plug your laser rifle in to charge it up when you have some time.
Once the PCs hit 5th level the whole you can't bring guns to social events disappears. Why? Null-Space Chamber MK1. My players are always armed even when they are not openly armed. The only drawback is a minor 1 full round to get the weapon drawn.
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Luckily Crash Down is for levels 1 to 4. A Null-Space Chamber could help avoid half or more of the skill checks in that adventure if it's packed well.
In Acts of Association, a Null-Space Chamber filled with weapons or casting Explosive Blast will not be useful in a busy restaurant dealing with an angry chef. Casting spells or using weapons is an option, just one that will land you in prison. There are two other encounters in that scenario that also have penalties for using lethal force.
It's nothing new to the game just not something that doesn't gets used a lot.
The null-space grip/stock at levels 6/7 and tattoo fusion at level 8 makes individual guns easily hideable without having to do a group retrieval from a chamber. A level 2 collapsing stock allows sleight of hand checks for 1 bulk longarms, and at level 3 collasping melee weapons are a thing.
In Acts of Association, [...] Casting spells or using weapons is an option, just one that will land you in prison. There are two other encounters in that scenario that also have penalties for using lethal force.
I've seen a number of scenarios that do address this to some extent. Using lethal force on civilians is a clear path to infamy, in almost any scenario. In some encounters, diplomatic solutions are harder, or impossible, if the PCs have drawn weapons. A few adventures give the option of borrowing merciful fusion seals (or some other kind of "loaner" substitute) to reduce potential casualties and collateral damage. And I can think of at least one scenario where the PCs are expected to hand over ALL weapons to security during peace talks, but they are allowed to keep their armor--and most of the NPCs are openly wearing armor because of their warrior culture.
If I may add to the discussion:
- "Settlements" (towns, cities, metropolis, space stations, etc.) of all sizes have gun rules and regulations that everyone must follow to remain civil. Game rules about gun sales are already a thing, but permits, laws and age restricitons may add up.
- PCs are not automatically law enforcers, and going all vigilante may have some consequences. You may need to "call the police" if there's trouble rather than doing it yourself.
- Carrying a weapon may be subject to self-defense only. Guns also have levels to rebalance power according to situations and settings.
- Exploring wilderness does allow you to carry weapons like guns, but urban environments have more limitations, be law enforcement, outlaws, civilians, collateral damage, etc.
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If I may add to the discussion:
- "Settlements" (towns, cities, metropolis, space stations, etc.) of all sizes have gun rules and regulations that everyone must follow to remain civil.
Yes, they're mandated to avoid the civil authority being overthrown by marauding space pirates, spellcasters, shapechangers, and the many, many, many alines that are big threats without guns.
Yes, they're mandated to avoid the civil authority being overthrown by marauding space pirates, spellcasters, shapechangers, and the many, many, many alines that are big threats without guns.If I may add to the discussion:
- "Settlements" (towns, cities, metropolis, space stations, etc.) of all sizes have gun rules and regulations that everyone must follow to remain civil.
Well, many cities have law enforcers, security guards, border guards, patrolling spaceships and other kinds of people capable of defending against such threats.
Licenses to carry and use guns may be a thing as well.
My point is that the setting itself isn't like the Wild West where everyone had a revolver ^^;
It could be an interesting premise, for a short time, but most classes really rely on guns. Even the ones that don't tend to rely on obvious advanced "large" weapons. It's not going to fit the concept of "only having a knife" to defend yourself.
And such a set up is really punishing to players, which is okay for a short time and assuming that encounters are built with decreased player capabilities in mind.
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Starfinder is largely designed around combat and combat simulation (how well it models this is, of course, open to interpretation) much like its Pathfinder and D&D forebears.
It's fun to do stuff like Redshift Rally, where even getting caught investigating your enemies can have severe negative consequences, let alone direct violence against them. But that's the exception, not the rule.
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I agree that the encounters have to be built carefully for situations where the PCs don't have access to weapons or laws prevent lethal damage.
There are not a lot of options to diversify a character for unarmed or nonlethal combat. Even if we get free archetypes in Starfinder Enhanced, there are no archetypes for unarmed or nonlethal combat, and even if there were free archetypes likely wouldn't be allowed in SFS games.
On top of that, there are no unarmed or nonlethal themes I'm aware of. There are no feats for nonlethal combat with weapons. So only a few feats for unarmed combat are the only options.
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Merciful Fusion is a level 2 fusion. Put it on at least one weapon, now that weapon makes music and can do non-lethal damage.
I frequently find myself keeping weapons that are a few levels below my character just because they aren’t generally worth selling. Move the good fusions on your current weapon and move the merciful fusion on one of the older weapons. Worshippers of Shelyn might put it on their best weapons.
Please do not think too hard about a weapon with the Wound critical effect and a merciful fusion. Taking someone’s appendage off doesn’t sound very merciful to me…
On top of that, there are no unarmed or nonlethal themes I'm aware of. There are no feats for nonlethal combat with weapons. So only a few feats for unarmed combat are the only options.
funny thing though. Since a knife is an operative weapon but your fist isn't, at some not absurdly leveled point you do more damage with a fist than a chunk of sharp steel...
Please do not think too hard about a weapon with the Wound critical effect and a merciful fusion. Taking someone’s appendage off doesn’t sound very merciful to me…
It cuts the arm off but then seals the wound? The non lethal bleed is what gives me the confused dog head tilt...
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It cuts the arm off but then seals the wound? The non lethal bleed is what gives me the confused dog head tilt...
Please do not think too hard about a weapon with the Wound critical effect and a merciful fusion. Taking someone’s appendage off doesn’t sound very merciful to me…
Maybe it counts as donating blood to the local blood bank. In which case you're allowed a 10 minute rest before continuing combat.
A crit hit is kind of a crit fail for a nonlethal attack. It goes back to the Starfinder motto "What could go wrong?"
Merciful fusion does make "Non lethal" a really easy option. My group has a couple bounty hunters and they use the fusion to take em in alive.
I have had the Wound crit show up, I ruled the bleed killed the guy. (Random mook to be questioned, ruled for humour and they already had others for questioning)
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Yes, they're mandated to avoid the civil authority being overthrown by marauding space pirates, spellcasters, shapechangers, and the many, many, many alines that are big threats without guns.If I may add to the discussion:
- "Settlements" (towns, cities, metropolis, space stations, etc.) of all sizes have gun rules and regulations that everyone must follow to remain civil.Well, many cities have law enforcers, security guards, border guards, patrolling spaceships and other kinds of people capable of defending against such threats.
Licenses to carry and use guns may be a thing as well.
My point is that the setting itself isn't like the Wild West where everyone had a revolver ^^;
I disagree. I think the setting is basically space spaghetti western.
No where in the setting is in generally implied that there is tightly controlled market for weapons or laws that generally restrict access to weaponry. There might be buildings or even cities that have restricted weapon access, to provide a specific challenge, but when you can literally have spell casters and space monsters popping in to wreak havoc society is just a bit different than what we're used to.
I reject the premise that within the pact worlds "gun control" is universal. Either that, or the PCs must be in some way granted permission to use weapons. Otherwise, the basic premise of the game simply doesn't work. You can argue about whether that is realistic or if it should be that way, but at the end of the day all classes need access to weapons for combat, or the combat challenge rating system would need a complete overhaul.
So you can either make assumption about the setting that help the rules make sense, or you can go the opposite direction and have to make up even more things and make changes to the rules to make everything work out.
There are laws around weapons assumed by default, since the books put forward that to get your equipment you need proper licencing or blackmarket connections and that is why you cannot buy things that are too high level compared to your own.
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There are laws around weapons assumed by default, since the books put forward that to get your equipment you need proper licencing or blackmarket connections and that is why you cannot buy things that are too high level compared to your own.
Which would reasonably lead to the conclusion that anyone carrying an Diamaran Disintegration Dakka Dispatcher was licensed to buy a Diamaran Disintegration Dakka Dispatcher (and thus should be allowed to carry it) or killed the person that was carrying a Diamaran Disintegration Dakka Dispatcher (and thus you shouldn't question them carrying it)
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Thanks didn't know about that one. Merciful Fusion Fixes a lot of the nonlethal issues. Since it's transferable, it's something an NPC or SFS could loan to all the PCs for a mission requiring nonlethal combat.
There's one sfs scenario where the party is at a concert and security is waving down adventurers to put those on everyone's weapons.
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Thanks didn't know about that one. Merciful Fusion Fixes a lot of the nonlethal issues. Since it's transferable, it's something an NPC or SFS could loan to all the PCs for a mission requiring nonlethal combat.There's one sfs scenario where the party is at a concert and security is waving down adventurers to put those on everyone's weapons.
Is that Star Sugar Heartlove!!! By chance? I haven't played that one yet.
I was thinking Tarnished Legacy: Star Sugar Superstar!!! Is another example of needing nonlethal options. Bad Scenario for frag gernades. It looks bad if you use lethal force on the audience or bands, but I did get to use a sticky bomb grenade on the crowd and a holo grenade on stage to good effect.
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I disagree. I think the setting is basically space spaghetti western.Yes, they're mandated to avoid the civil authority being overthrown by marauding space pirates, spellcasters, shapechangers, and the many, many, many alines that are big threats without guns.If I may add to the discussion:
- "Settlements" (towns, cities, metropolis, space stations, etc.) of all sizes have gun rules and regulations that everyone must follow to remain civil.Well, many cities have law enforcers, security guards, border guards, patrolling spaceships and other kinds of people capable of defending against such threats.
Licenses to carry and use guns may be a thing as well.
My point is that the setting itself isn't like the Wild West where everyone had a revolver ^^;
I think the APs and Adventures are more spaghetti western, and the Starfinder Society Scenario are more spaghetti Star Treck in flavor.
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Fundamentally, the issue is Starfinder, being a D&D derivative, hinges too heavily on weapons ( and equipment in general ) for character capability for "no gear" adventures to really be viable as a rule. Yes, you *can* do them, but the degree to which lacking proper equipment cripples a character means that they pretty much have to be customized to a specific party of PCs, and even then they might not actually work. Even with the best effort, you'll likely end up reducing the encounter to a mini-game, and that's assuming you don't have one or more PCs who basically ignore the issue. Good luck balancing a no-weapons encounter when the Solarian or Vanguard in the party can effortlessly destroy opponents that would in turn effortless destroy the weaponless other PCs.
There are certainly systems in which "no gear" works fine as a reasonable challenge condition, but that would mostly be games where character capability primarily comes from character abilities.
There are already several examples of encounters in Starfinder Society Scenarios that are balanced for nonlethal combat. It doesn't matter if the entire party is made of Solarians, Vanguards, spell casters, or species with natural weapons if there are consequences for using lethal force. None of the nonlethal combat encounters I've played in or ran stopped the PCs from using lethal force, but there were consequences for doing so. I suspect this is more common in organized play then in APs
I think the APs and Adventures are more spaghetti western, and the Starfinder Society Scenario are more spaghetti Star Treck in flavor.I disagree. I think the setting is basically space spaghetti western.Yes, they're mandated to avoid the civil authority being overthrown by marauding space pirates, spellcasters, shapechangers, and the many, many, many alines that are big threats without guns.If I may add to the discussion:
- "Settlements" (towns, cities, metropolis, space stations, etc.) of all sizes have gun rules and regulations that everyone must follow to remain civil.Well, many cities have law enforcers, security guards, border guards, patrolling spaceships and other kinds of people capable of defending against such threats.
Licenses to carry and use guns may be a thing as well.
My point is that the setting itself isn't like the Wild West where everyone had a revolver ^^;
What's funny about that, is at least some episodes, especially of TOS are close to spaghetti western flavor. But it wouldn't be fair to say all or even most are that way. And it's more prominent in TOS than later series (but not non-existent).
Fundamentally, the issue is Starfinder, being a D&D derivative, hinges too heavily on weapons ( and equipment in general ) for character capability for "no gear" adventures to really be viable as a rule. Yes, you *can* do them, but the degree to which lacking proper equipment cripples a character means that they pretty much have to be customized to a specific party of PCs, and even then they might not actually work. Even with the best effort, you'll likely end up reducing the encounter to a mini-game, and that's assuming you don't have one or more PCs who basically ignore the issue. Good luck balancing a no-weapons encounter when the Solarian or Vanguard in the party can effortlessly destroy opponents that would in turn effortless destroy the weaponless other PCs.
There are certainly systems in which "no gear" works fine as a reasonable challenge condition, but that would mostly be games where character capability primarily comes from character abilities.
There are already several examples of encounters in Starfinder Society Scenarios that are balanced for nonlethal combat. It doesn't matter if the entire party is made of Solarians, Vanguards, spell casters, or species with natural weapons if there are consequences for using lethal force. None of the nonlethal combat encounters I've played in or ran stopped the PCs from using lethal force, but there were consequences for doing so. I suspect this is more common in organized play then in APs
Encounters with consequences for use of lethal force is different from stripping players of their ability to fight competently.
The merciful fusion passed out to players can handle that, or players can accept the consequences.
And don't forget, that by taking a -4 penalty to attack rolls you can deal non-lethal damage with your rifle...somehow.
Which would reasonably lead to the conclusion that anyone carrying an Diamaran Disintegration Dakka Dispatcher was licensed to buy a Diamaran Disintegration Dakka Dispatcher (and thus should be allowed to carry it) or killed the person that was carrying a Diamaran Disintegration Dakka Dispatcher (and thus you shouldn't question them carrying it)
No. Since it isn't just legal means I mentioned, but also black market means.
Golarion World might be a place that has weapon restrictions, especially in the park area. Instead of an outright ban like Disiesny World, it could be more like Westworld and only allow nonlethal in-theme weapons provided by the park.
Foam two handed swords and merciful laser blunderbuss?
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Dragonkin: RARRRR!!!! Bites someone in half, bashes someone flat with their tail, and sets the building on fire
Ysoki: So glad they confiscated my pistol at the door I feel a WHOLE lot safer.
Yeah, just ban all species with natural weapons or breath weapons, do scans for damaging augmentatiosn on everyone, and forbid evolutionists, vanguards, nanocytes, mystics, technomancers, precogs, witchwarpers, some fighting styles of soldier, and solarions and everything should be safe for the disarmed others.
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This isn't about banning weapons it's about creating situations that require improvising. Or a different flavor of fighting, such as an unarmed bar fight. So what if some species have natural weapons or classes have unarmed abilities? Never said it has to be a fair fight or that improvised weapons couldn't be used. Lethal force doesn't have to be the only option for every combat. A fight doesn't have to be "fair" to be balanced.
Star Trek: kirk vs Gorn.
Alien: Crew of the Nostromo vs the alien.
Lost in space: The Robson family vs an army of genocidal robots with weapons of mass destruction.
Tron.
Every prison escape movie. (at least before the escape)
Most fights in Flash Gorden.
Most fights in the road warrior franchise.
Pitch Black: Has two guns, but mostly just fought over by the humans)
The hunger games: Everyone starts unarmed and has to fight over the weapons to get any.
Mission: Impossible (1996) Tom Cruise as Ethan Hunt never fires a gun.
The Bourne Ultimatum (2007 ) There are a couple of guns fired in the air, but Jason Bourne never touches a gun, never fires a shot.
Anyone remember AD&D A4: In the Dungeons of the Slave Lords. The adventures, being thrown into a set of caverns beneath the Slave Lord Aerie without equipment or spells.
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This isn't about banning weapons it's about creating situations that require improvising. Or a different flavor of fighting, such as an unarmed bar fight. So what if some species have natural weapons or classes have unarmed abilities? Never said it has to be a fair fight or that improvised weapons couldn't be used.
Because the game assumes you have those laser rifles, it has made big sharp pointy teeth as good as the laser rifles. Melee combat is far more effective and varied than ranged in starfinder, and natural weaponry is a very valid form of melee combat.
Because of that balancing if you routinely don't let people use their weapons you're making that character a lot worse a whole lot of upside for that character. If the game had been balanced where Guns were amazeballs and melee fighting was eh giving the melee characters circumstances where they would shine would be evening things out. But instead you're pushing the gun people down with no upside.
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.. did someone chat gtp my post and throw in an ad?
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Starship troupers is a gun heavy movie. It's a movie where Jean Rasczak teaches that violence solves everything. What weapons did Johnny Rico and Zander Barcalow use when they got into a fight? What weapons were used to break up the fight?
Standard combat:
First encounter: kill the low-level minions of the BBG.
Second encounter: kill the mid-level minions of the BBG.
Third encounter: kill the BBG.
Escalating risk combat:
First encounter: Fight the BBG in an unarmed bar fight. (using weapons in the bar will get the bouncers to attack you as well, and security will arrest you as well.) The party can lose the fight, or the party wins the fight, but either way, the BBG gets away. The party has motivation to find and take on the BBG later.
Second encounter: Fight the BBG in a crowded public space using nonlethal damage to protect the crowd. Same results as the unarmed fight.
there can be secondary goals in the fight like protecting someone or thing from the BBG.
Thrid encounter: Party is highly motivated to finally Kill the BBG in the final battle at the BBG's base. Anything goes.
What shirren GM wouldn't want more combat options?