Designing the last 4 Implements


Thaumaturge Class

Dark Archive

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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Hey folks, since we have 5 of the 9 implement ideas in the playtest, I thought we could have a fun thread where we design the other possible 4 implements and pitch out some ideas for them.

So far I've come up with the following:

Bell

Concept pitch: Something that allows you to wake the dead and give them orders. Speak with dead into eventually having a minion as your paragon benefit.

Initial Benefit

Adept Benefit

Paragon Benefit

Orb

Concept Pitch: The allows you to both see and work at a distance. The orb should allow you to see glimpses of the past, present and future.

Initial Benefit

Adept Benefit

Paragon Benefit

Sceptre

Concept Pitch: Something that allows you to have a bit more casting to you via staves. Since you'd be able to rotate them daily, I'd imagine a character going all-in on the Sceptre would have a small collection.

Initial Benefit

Each Morning you may prepare a staff as though you were a prepared caster, acting as though you had access to spell slots as a Wizard of your level. While holding your Sceptre in one hand and your prepared staff in the other, you gain the benefits of the Trick Magic Item feat using your Charisma modifier instead of the normal ability modifier used for that skill. If you have Esoteric Lore, you may Esoteric Lore in place of the normal skill check.

Adept Benefit

Your Sceptre and Staff fuse into one, allowing you to free up your hands when using your implement. During your daily preparations, you can magically fuse your Speptre implement and a magical staff together into one item. You prepare the staff at the same time you do this. This fusion lasts until the next time you make your daily preparations.

Paragon Benefit

Each morning you may empower your Sceptre with additional charges for that day by breaking down the magic energy found in scrolls and absorbing them within. When preparing your staff each morning, you may destroy a magical scroll and add a number of charges to your Sceptre equal to the level of the spell of the destroyed scroll.

Crown

Concept Pitch: Since Charisma is the class' key stat, the Crown should enable you to act more as the party face, and benefit more from social roles.

Initial Benefit

Adept Benefit

Paragon Benefit


Yes! I'm all about this. I love the implements wish there were more. More options and access to more of them, favorite part of the class.

Branding Iron

A branding iron that remains perpetually hot. When used to strike an enemy it brands them leaving them with a status debuff of some kind. Adept and Paragon could increase the severity or duration or maybe both.

Broken Chain

A length of chain left behind when something powerful broke free. This one I'm imagining as being similar to the liberator champions reaction.

Banner

A flag hanging from a post that when planted in the ground grants a status bonus to allies within a radius. Adept and paragon could increase the bonus, in crease the radius or maybe both.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

To aid this, the unused Harrow suits are book, key, crown, so they should be thematically or directly covered (example of thematic is latern = star and amulet = shield).


Something to aid in casting scrolls would be nice, either a scroll case or something like the scepter that allows casting scrolls you have on you without drawing them.

Also:
Stone

Concept Pitch: Is bad
Initial Benefit
-10 Speed, -1 Initiative, Steadying Stone feat

Adept Benefit
10 Physical Resistance/Adamantium, -1 Attack

Paragon Benefit
Stupefied 1, duration of your effects is twice as long, +2 to DC of persistent damage you cause.

Some nice ideas in here too.


I would like to see more garments or pieces of clothing so I can convert my 1e Fashion Designer Silksworn Occultist into PF2.


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

It doesn't really fit the paradigm of a handheld item but I want a hat Paizo, thanks.


Given how my PCs always seem to squabble over fancy hats - I understand this sentiment


I plan on converting an NPC rogue in my campaign into a thaumaturge. I don't see an implement with a rogue-like theme, so I am tempted to invent one despite such an invention warping the playtest. A Cloak implement could be good for stealth, but stealth is only one aspect of Dexterity.

The existing implements have associations with the Harrow deck and the Cosmic Caravan and Dragon Empires zodiac astrological signs of Golarion. For example, the playtest rulebook says, "Amulet implements
are associated with the Harrow suit of shields, and the astrological signs of the Bridge and the Ogre."

The Amulet corresponds to the Harrow suit of shields, which represents Constitution. The Lantern corresponds to the Harrow suit of stars, which represents Wisdom. The Weapon corresponds to the Harrow suit of hammers, which represents Strength. The Chalice and the Wand don't mention a Harrow suit. The other Harrow suits are keys for Dexterity, books for Intelligence, and crowns for Charisma.

The PF1 Occultist used implements. The occultist's lists of items that could be use as implements provide us with lists of items with a tradition of occult use. For abjuration implements the suggested items were amulet, armor, bell, bracers, brooch, cloak, holy symbol, and shield. For conjuration implements the suggested items were bowl, brazier, compass, figurine, lantern, and mirror. For divination implements the suggested items were book, crystal ball, goggles, harrow deck, headband, lenses, and planchette. For enchantment implements the suggested items were censer, crown, helm, musical instrument, and necklace. For evocation implements the suggest items were gloves, rod, staff, and wand. For illusion implements the suggested items were crystal, hat, mask, prism, and ring. For necromancy implements the suggested items were bone, coin, doll, drum, robe, and skull. For transmutation implements the suggested items were belt, boots, sandals, vest, and weapon. Chalice is not in that list, though bowl under conjuration comes close.

Sczarni

Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Shield
Gain the raise a shield action.
When you raise the shield you can, in the same reaction, deal the enemy damage equal to the amount of damage reduced by the hardness of the shield back at the enemy. They are shoved back 10 feet.


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Squiggit wrote:
It doesn't really fit the paradigm of a handheld item but I want a hat Paizo, thanks.

Since I had considered a cloak implement, which is another worn item, I figured out how to handle this. For a cloak implement or a hat implement the thaumaturge must grab the edge of the worn item to manipulate it, such as raising the hat, twisting the hat, or tipping the hat, swishing the cloak, wrapping the cloak tighter, and so on. That occupies the hand holding the edge of the worn implement.

Note that an amulet is typically worn, too, so these rules could also apply to amulets.

The rule would be under Implement Empowerment, "When you Strike, you can trace mystic patterns with an implement you’re holding or a free hand to empower the Strike. For a worn implement, such as an amulet on your neck, your free hand grips and adjusts the implement in a pattern. ..." Amulet's Abeyance would change its requirements from "You’re holding your amulet implement" to "You're holding your amulet implement or wearing it with a hand free to grip it."


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

That seems too fussy. You’re already required to use a free hand to trace symbols in the air if you use a weapon implement; I’d require worn implements to allow the same action.

Some specific language clarifying that wouldn’t go amiss though.


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AnimatedPaper wrote:

That seems too fussy. You’re already required to use a free hand to trace symbols in the air if you use a weapon implement; I’d require worn implements to allow the same action.

Some specific language clarifying that wouldn’t go amiss though.

On my reconsideration, AnimatedPaper is right. I went into too much detail. The implement should be held or worn. The thaumaturge gestures with a free hand or the hand holding the implement if the implement is not otherwise busy.

More detail would be warranted if the developers want the importance of the implement to be obvious to enemies. "He is gesturing with his amulet, so that is the source of the magic!"

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Oh wow. I just realised I copy and pasted the wrong verson of my text doc into the post. Thats why there is only 1 filled in instead of all 4.

Well... I'm dumb.


I would like to think the remaining four will end up being Parchment (for all your ofuda/paper talisman/scroll needs), Tome (hello Book of Eibon and Necronomicon), Sacred Object (got to get in some The Exorcist flair), and lastly Ring (The Mandarin wants to tell you about his bling).


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

Don't have a full idea yet, but I would prefer: Tome, Key, Helm, Bell.

Tome: Associated with the Harrow suit of books, this can be a scroll, a carved rock, or any other object with writing on it.
For powers would allow the thaumaturge to prepare a cantrip, possibly accessing the amped versions of those cantrips once per combat.

Key: I almost said ring or trinket, and am open to different exact item for this one. I would like to see something haunt related here. My homebrew Medium had the ability to deploy "haunts" which used the rules for snares, so I think it'd be cool to have something similar here. I not that, something else related to warding/trapping a specific part of the map.

Helm: The fancy hat implement. Taking inspiration from the You're Next feat, I want this to be able to do Find Flaws as a reaction when you reduce an enemy to 0. People have said that facing swarms is an issue; something along these lines would help.
Further powers would be intimidation or diplomacy bonuses.

Bell: Could really be any musical instrument, or even snapping your fingers, but for Reasons I'm calling this a bell. As to powers, I think something specifically anti-mage could fit. Making a reaction that allows you to identify a spell and gain a bonus to any save if successful seems useful. Possibly up to being able to counteract a spell once or twice per combat.

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