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I don't think it would hurt book sales. Physical books are a niche thing in todays world and if someone is buying the book its cause the specifically want or need a hard copy. No one is buying the book solely for the content when the content is cheap in pdf form or free with paizo's blessing on archives of neyths. Making the pdf available early when the hard copy hits delays wouldn't make people who want the hard book not want it anymore.
Books are a niche thing? Pfui.
If you think that releasing the pdfs wouldn't hurt book sales, you don't know how the world works.
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Every time the idea of digital subscriptions comes up there are people who say they will switch from their physical sub - that the only reason they subscribe to the hardcopy is to ensure they get everything as soon as possible.
Making digital products easier to source will definitely impact on book sales. The magnitude of that impact is a moot point and the upsides may well outweigh the downsides eventually. But unless all those people are mistaken about how theyd respond it would definitely have an impact.
I, for one, would instantly switch to a PDF only subscription if such a thing was offered. If they offered a PDF only rulebook subscription, I would subscribe to both Starfinder and Pathfinder in a heartbeat; as it is I don't sub to either.
I find it hard to believe there are many people out there who are willing to buy the hardcover for 50$ but if you told them its delayed a month they would suddenly refuse to buy it and go with the pdf instead.
I have in fact cancelled my Lost Omen subscription for this reason. I decided I don't want the physical books if they keep getting delayed to hell and back, and I'll be content with my APs and Adventures.
Frankly, I was only subscribed to the Lost Omens line because they aren't that much cheaper as a PDF only, and the free pdf plus free PFS subscription more than made up for it, but with everything going on I decided to downsize.
Which means I'm likely to skip Lost Omens products now, will certainly skip the entire PFS line, and likely won't buy any further SF AP entries (or modules, really) once that cancellation goes through. Whereas with a PDF subscription I likely would purchase all of them except the PFS.
There's a ton of content that isn't freely available. Vast swaths of pretty much all the lost omens books aren't on AoN, and a large portion of at least one chapter of SoM won't be there either.
I, for one, would instantly switch to a PDF only subscription if such a thing was offered. If they offered a PDF only rulebook subscription, I would subscribe to both Starfinder and Pathfinder in a heartbeat; as it is I don't sub to either.
It’s hard to know what the net outcome would be. (The decreased print run size would likely result in an increase in price for the printed product, so some print customers would cancel their subs as you signed up for yours).
Given the essential, core nature of subscriptions to their business one can understand a certain risk aversion to tinkering with it.
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There's a ton of content that isn't freely available. Vast swaths of pretty much all the lost omens books aren't on AoN, and a large portion of at least one chapter of SoM won't be there either.
Not to mention the lovely art.
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I, for one, would instantly switch to a PDF only subscription if such a thing was offered. If they offered a PDF only rulebook subscription, I would subscribe to both Starfinder and Pathfinder in a heartbeat; as it is I don't sub to either.It’s hard to know what the net outcome would be. (The decreased print run size would likely result in an increase in price for the printed product, so some print customers would cancel their subs as you signed up for yours).
Given the essential, core nature of subscriptions to their business one can understand a certain risk aversion to tinkering with it.
Oh for sure. I don’t look down on them for not offering it, even if I am not best served in this manner.
I was merely pointing out that, yes, there’s people that would change their subscriptions and buying patterns if PDF subs were a thing, and pretending that nothing would change, as Svyatoslov suggests, does not seem to fit what I and others have said over the years.
Looking forward to august order generation and shipping dates. Any idea when we will get them?
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Looking forward to august order generation and shipping dates. Any idea when we will get them?
What? no i haven't been refreshing the community service forum frontpage every 30 minutes since thursday looking for it. why would anyone even suggest that?
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Looking forward to august order generation and shipping dates. Any idea when we will get them?What? no i haven't been refreshing the community service forum frontpage every 30 minutes since thursday looking for it. why would anyone even suggest that?
Your only doing every 30 mins? Poser. :)
Your only doing every 30 mins? Poser. :)Looking forward to august order generation and shipping dates. Any idea when we will get them?What? no i haven't been refreshing the community service forum frontpage every 30 minutes since thursday looking for it. why would anyone even suggest that?I’ve had the Customer Service and Secrets of Magic pages up on my phone’s browser. Every time I get a text, I also check the forums. I have a problem.
That problem is my party really needs me to change from Wizard to Magus for us to win the Ruby Phoenix Tournament.
That is a pretty serious problem, how you gonna let your fighting team down like that?
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lol I've been checking for the august thread every day too
That is a pretty serious problem, how you gonna let your fighting team down like that?Your only doing every 30 mins? Poser. :)Looking forward to august order generation and shipping dates. Any idea when we will get them?What? no i haven't been refreshing the community service forum frontpage every 30 minutes since thursday looking for it. why would anyone even suggest that?I’ve had the Customer Service and Secrets of Magic pages up on my phone’s browser. Every time I get a text, I also check the forums. I have a problem.
That problem is my party really needs me to change from Wizard to Magus for us to win the Ruby Phoenix Tournament.
I feel your pain. A couple of the players in the game I'm currently GMing are trying to find ways for me to kill them so they can play Magus and Summoner.
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I feel your pain. A couple of the players in the game I'm currently GMing are trying to find ways for me to kill them so they can play Magus and Summoner.That is a pretty serious problem, how you gonna let your fighting team down like that?Your only doing every 30 mins? Poser. :)Looking forward to august order generation and shipping dates. Any idea when we will get them?What? no i haven't been refreshing the community service forum frontpage every 30 minutes since thursday looking for it. why would anyone even suggest that?I’ve had the Customer Service and Secrets of Magic pages up on my phone’s browser. Every time I get a text, I also check the forums. I have a problem.
That problem is my party really needs me to change from Wizard to Magus for us to win the Ruby Phoenix Tournament.
I feel all of this so deeply. My group picked back up an old game from PF1 within the last couple of months. One of them was a magus and has been chomping at the bit to BE a magus again instead of a Swashbuckler w/Sorcerer multi. And so I keep doin' the refresh dance for their sake! (And mine who am I kidding, Magus was one of my favorite classes when I got to play)
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I just hope SoM will not be delayed. Starting a new campaign soon and one of the players wants to play a summoner.
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An open letter to all GMs:
Just let your players respec.
I swear, it won't break your game.
Signed,
GM of a West Marches campaign where over two dozen players get the chance to do this every time a major release comes out and nothing's burned down yet.
An open letter to all GMs:
Just let your players respec.
I swear, it won't break your game.
Signed,
GM of a West Marches campaign where over two dozen players get the chance to do this every time a major release comes out and nothing's burned down yet.
We were already on hiatus from my 2e campaign, so I just decided I'd wait until SoM came out and to let everyone do re-speccing, because we learned a lot about the game and more options were going to change people's minds on what to be somewhat. (Also wanted to add Free Archetype rule)
I do think that players should try and keep things as similar as possible. A total re-work should just be a new PC IMO.
An open letter to all GMs:
Just let your players respec.
I swear, it won't break your game.
Signed,
GM of a West Marches campaign where over two dozen players get the chance to do this every time a major release comes out and nothing's burned down yet.
We were already on hiatus from my 2e campaign, so I just decided I'd wait until SoM came out and to let everyone do re-speccing, because we learned a lot about the game and more options were going to change people's minds on what to be somewhat. (Also wanted to add Free Archetype rule)
I do think that players should try and keep things as similar as possible. A total re-work should just be a new PC IMO.
Pathfinder 2e also has a very robust system in place already for respeccing and such. it's also ok to let characters retire or step back into an npc/off screen role for a new character if the current one isn't fun.
It has already been delayed twice I think the push back to expecting at the 25th because of shipping issues.
I just hope SoM will not be delayed. Starting a new campaign soon and one of the players wants to play a summoner.hate burst your bubble but you & everyone else should just start assuming every book will be delayed this shipping issue isn't going away until the pandemic is over which won't happen anytime soon. I know it sucks but it's the current world we live in can't wait for secrets of magic guns & gears! & book of the dead!
We already missed our window for the pandemic to be over. There is no going back, I'll just be happy when campanies (both shippers and distributors like paizo) just refactor their estimates to account for how things are different now. It sounds like thats one of the things that happened with the international shipping prices this month.
The August thread isn't open yet buuuuut... I noticed that my US shipping costs (cheapest possible) look like they're Priority again? It says "US Postal standard", but the prices are the same as when there were issues last month.
Customer Service Representative
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The August thread isn't open yet buuuuut... I noticed that my US shipping costs (cheapest possible) look like they're Priority again? It says "US Postal standard", but the prices are the same as when there were issues last month.
Hm, we haven't generated subscription orders yet, so are you looking at a recently placed order or subscription orders for July?
The August thread isn't open yet buuuuut... I noticed that my US shipping costs (cheapest possible) look like they're Priority again? It says "US Postal standard", but the prices are the same as when there were issues last month.Hm, we haven't generated subscription orders yet, so are you looking at a recently placed order or subscription orders for July?
So, if I go to My Subscriptions through My Account: https://paizo.com/paizo/account/subscriptions
I see a list of upcoming subscription shipments.
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2 items. Expected to ship in an unknown time frame.
via Standard Postal Delivery Estimated Shipping & Handling: $20.83
MSRP / Paizo.com Price / Your Subscription Price
S Pathfinder Secrets of Magic Paizo Inc. Will be in your downloads once shipped 49.99 42.49 42.49
S Pathfinder Adventure Path #170: Spoken on the Song Wind (Strength of Thousands 2 of 6) Paizo Inc. 24.99 21.24 21.24
1 item. Expected to ship in an unknown time frame.
via Standard Postal Delivery Estimated Shipping & Handling: $10.02
MSRP / Paizo.com Price / Your Subscription Price
S Pathfinder Adventure Path: Hurricane's Howl (Strength of Thousands 3 of 6) Paizo Inc.
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The S&H is about the same amount that I see when Priority is being used, rather than Standard.
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Customer Service Representative
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So, if I go to My Subscriptions through My Account: https://paizo.com/paizo/account/subscriptions [...]The August thread isn't open yet buuuuut... I noticed that my US shipping costs (cheapest possible) look like they're Priority again? It says "US Postal standard", but the prices are the same as when there were issues last month.Hm, we haven't generated subscription orders yet, so are you looking at a recently placed order or subscription orders for July?
How odd! Doing a quick test order with the same products shows a significantly lower S&H cost for Standard Post than what that page is showing, so I'd hang tight until you get the confirmation email when orders are generated to see what the shipping looks like!
How odd! Doing a quick test order with the same products shows a significantly lower S&H cost for Standard Post than what that page is showing, so I'd hang tight until you get the confirmation email when orders are generated to see what the shipping looks like!So, if I go to My Subscriptions through My Account: https://paizo.com/paizo/account/subscriptions [...]The August thread isn't open yet buuuuut... I noticed that my US shipping costs (cheapest possible) look like they're Priority again? It says "US Postal standard", but the prices are the same as when there were issues last month.Hm, we haven't generated subscription orders yet, so are you looking at a recently placed order or subscription orders for July?
Some more information: This WAS exactly my scenario as late as this morning, right down to the same shipping and handling projection. I just checked it again and it looks like the projected shipping & handling charge is down to $7.74. This seems much more accurate for the AP & Hardcover Secrets and Magic book.
Interestingly enough, the following month's physical shipment, Pathfinder Adventure Path: Hurricane's Howl (3 of 6), is still showing the inflated $10.02 projected shipping total.
I'm posting this so Paizo knows the projected $20.83 on Standard Post wasn't an isolated case. But also to help reassure anyone concerned but not speaking up that it looks like this could just be one of those weird hiccups within the system that works itself out by the time order generations begin. Regardless, I agree that all customers should remain vigilant for any errors once they do receive their order confirmation.
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Customer Service Representative
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For some reference, the shipping costs on the subscription page are oftentimes calculated before we've appropriately measured and weighed the products (so it's using placeholders), so the likelihood of them being inaccurate, is high!
Essentially, it's not something I'd be overly concerned about; the estimate in your confirmation email once the order is actually generated is going to be the most accurate shipping estimate, since the correct dimensions and weights will be in place.
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To note, I think it doesn't even try to do an estimate for international shipping, as I have no shipping value here at all. I don't even have any "expected method". Even the previously shipped items only have the method and not the value.
(This is not a bad thing tbh, there are other, more intuitive, places that I can see these numbers, so just saying for others that might be wondering. :P )
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I hope order creation starts today for august orders. Maybe shipping too.
I wouldn't expect shipping but hopefully order creation! I know they want a bit of time to make sure shipping costs are correct and everything.
One can dream tho :')
Looking at my shipping estimation, it looks right now! It was higher before.
Note: This doesn't mean I've been charged. This is what appears under My Subscriptions.
I know its only estimations, but I looked at my subscription today. Its showing $7.17 for SoM along with SoT2 for August, $9.50 for SoT3 and $7.79 for SoT4, Guns and Gears and Great Bazaar. Not sure how one Adventure path is $2 more than 3 books. lol
I think the prices out further are inaccurate, and will shift as they start actually putting things in boxes. I know my amount changed.