Folund |
Hello guys, first of all sorry for the bad english, french native here.
I will begin the campaign Rise of the runelords and i have never played a profane caster, and usually play Paladin/ranger/Inquisitor/ Investigator (What i wanted to play, but party need profane),Im usually the big guy tanky with a big sword and a bit jack of all trades with the skills everywhere. You see what im sayin.
My party need from me to be a profane caster, but i'm not a big fan of mages/wizards, how can i be a profane, and stay a tough guy, who can have many skills and be a face ? Any idea ?
Magus dont tease me if u ask
Joynt Jezebel |
Your English is better than my French.
Not to criticise, but what you call a profane caster, which I think is either the term in French or a translation of it, is called an arcane caster in English Pathfinder.
Now to your questions-
"how can i be a profane (arcane caster), and stay a tough guy,"
You can't really. You don't like the Magus, so that is out. There is the eldritch knight, which does combine arcane caster with ability to fight hand to hand, but that is a prestige class that is both long away in levels and not that powerful anyway.
" who can have many skills"
Wizards spells run off intelligence. That means you have a good int mod to add to your skill points/ level. Same with witches.
"and be a face ? Any idea ?"
Sorcerer spells run off charisma. That means you have a good cha mod to add to your social skill, so you are an OK face. It also means you normally don't have a good int mod to add to your skill points/ level, which stay around 2pts/ level.
You could try a summoner, a cha based caster. Their spells are inferior to sorcerer or wizard but they are very useful and you control a creature called an eidolon which is tough and good in a fight.
Melkiador |
You can’t really have it all
Blaster: Only sorcerer does this well. Other class’s archetypes can come close, but sorcerer has too many damage options.
Face: A lot of options for that. You can either have a high charisma for a good bonus or have a lot of skills to make up for a mediocre charisma. The bard does both.
Armored: There aren’t a lot of armored arcane options and 2 of them are hybrid classes. Magus can be the most armored.
Wonderstell |
My party need from me to be a profane caster, but i'm not a big fan of mages/wizards, how can i be a profane, and stay a tough guy, who can have many skills and be a face ? Any idea ?
Polymorph focused wizard?
Int-based casting gives you a lot of skill ranks. Orator/Student of Philosophy both allow you to become a proficient face by keying social skills to Intelligence.
Then pump Con, retrain HP to max, get a Protector familiar, and look up a couple of polymorph spell guides.
Mudfoot |
Bard? It's arcane, though perhaps not very. But you do get some armour, can fight in a meaningful way and are an excellent face.
I suspect Synthesist Summoner is the best melee arcanist, but your GM might not allow it. I wouldn't. You'll be a mediocre face even though it's Cha based: no class skills and only 2 skill points per level, so want to drop a trait into getting a face skill as a class skill, and don't dump Intelligence.
Folund |
Well guys, thanks for the advice, i affined my research, and got two options now.
Magus or Bard. Magus seems pretty simple and i dont need any archetype, but even with Orator i fear i will not be a good face /skill
Do you know any Build of Bard, who can make me a good Melee Fighter with the arcane flavor and bard buffs, skill list ? I know the Arcane duelist but not sure about others possibility
MrCharisma |
My party need from me to be aprofanearcane caster ...
Firstly, Magus should work well and Bard is totally doable if you prefer it, but ...
Why do YOU have to be an arcane caster?
If someone thinks the party needs one can't they play an arcane caster? Or is this something you've decided to do yourself?
avr |
Depends what the needs being met are. If the group wants someone to cast teleport spells and fireballs then a bard isn't it. A cleric or druid or magus would do that better than a bard. If you go with a magus then there are traits which let social skills run off intelligence instead of charisma, and spending one feat on additional traits gets you two of those traits (this is easier than going for orator).
If the needs are for someone with attack spells generally (things like confusion, not necessarily area damage like fireballs) then there are a lot more options, even that arcane duelist bard you mentioned.
Folund |
Yeah something with control can be good too, I just never builded a Bard and dunno how to do with an arcane duelist, maybe Dex route is better ?
Also for Magus, i know the Student of philosophy trait but it does not do the work, only diplomacy for persuade and bluff for lie.
Gather informations and conceal informations stay very needed for me.
Melkiador |
It's too bad you can't play a Skald. It seems overall closer to what you want to play.
I'm not sure why a GM would ban the hybrid classes. They are generally weaker than the classes from the Advanced Player's Guide, like the inquisitor and summoner. The only extra powerful option from the Advanced Class Guide is the shaman, and that's just because it has a very specific build that can take the best parts of multiple strong classes.
avr |
There are several traits which switch the ability scores. With both the clever wordplay and cunning liar traits you can switch diplomacy and bluff to Int for all purposes.
If the main thought is battlefield control then you need spells which affect terrain or create terrain for that ideally. There are other ways - summoning can drop creatures in the way of your enemies, combat maneuvers or other debuffs can make some enemies ineffective, and there's a few other odd things. A bard has some debuffs.
Say you go with the arcane duelist bard. If you take one level in swashbuckler first that gives you weapon finesse for free and the parry can be useful. Bards are mostly limited to light armor and probably do go the Dex route. For dex to damage as a bard you either take the dervish dance feat and use a scimitar, or take weapon focus with fencing grace if you use a rapier or slashing grace for some slashing weapon.
Next you might take the antagonize feat for some battlefield control. After that you might take riving strike to help with some debuff spells or outright save-or-lose spells.
Does that help?
Kitty Catoblepas |
This build will actually make you weaker, but it may accomplish what you want. It's a little complicated and will take your Swift Action every round you want to cast a spell.
Take the first 5 levels in Wizard.
You will need the following feats:
Light Armor Proficiency
Medium Armor Proficiency
Arcane Armor Training
At 6th level, take the Hellknight Signifier prestige class (work with your GM on satisfying the requirements ahead of time). This class has features that let you cast better in armor.
This will hurt you in the following ways:
Take your swift action every round you want to cast a spell
Take 3 of your feats
Reduce your speed (if you use Hellknight Plate)
This will help you in the following ways:
d8 hit die
better base attack bonus
ability to cast in armor
proficiency in order's weapon
*** another option ***
Take level 1 as Cleric
Take levels 2-6 as Wizard
Take the Hellknight Signifier class starting at level 7
you will need the following feats:
Arcane Armor Training
Warrior Priest
Boon Companion
...and the following trait:
Magical Knack
If you take the Chivalry inquisition (and your Game Master agrees that it should work like a Domain for the Hellknight Signifier's Catechesis ability), you should have a horse Mount that scales with your level.
This option will hurt you in the following ways:
Take your swift action every round you want to cast a spell
Take 3 of your feats
1 level behind in getting spells
Take 1 of your talents
This will help you in the following ways:
d8 hit die
better base attack bonus
ability to cast in armor
proficiency in order's weapon
Animal Companion/Mount ability
Folund |
There are several traits which switch the ability scores. With both the clever wordplay and cunning liar traits you can switch diplomacy and bluff to Int for all purposes.
If the main thought is battlefield control then you need spells which affect terrain or create terrain for that ideally. There are other ways - summoning can drop creatures in the way of your enemies, combat maneuvers or other debuffs can make some enemies ineffective, and there's a few other odd things. A bard has some debuffs.
Say you go with the arcane duelist bard. If you take one level in swashbuckler first that gives you weapon finesse for free and the parry can be useful. Bards are mostly limited to light armor and probably do go the Dex route. For dex to damage as a bard you either take the dervish dance feat and use a scimitar, or take weapon focus with fencing grace if you use a rapier or slashing grace for some slashing weapon.
Next you might take the antagonize feat for some battlefield control. After that you might take riving strike to help with some debuff spells or outright save-or-lose spells.
Does that help?
Yes, thanks it give me somes idea, didint think to use an Arcane duelist with intimidate feats for control purpose, maybe instead regular bard, swashbucler into dawnflower dancer?
As for others guys, i would like to avoid to many dipping
avr |
If you go dawnflower dervish instead of arcane duelist then you probably don't bother with riving strike. I mentioned it because arcane duelist gets arcane strike for free. Instead maybe you go for dazzling display.
Eldritch knights aren't frontliners usually. Most likely they cast mage armor well in advance, mirror image or shield when combat's about to happen, then cast one or two normal wizard spells (attack or battlefield control) if necessary before using their falchion to help clean up. They're wizards who can fight a bit.