Best conditions to inflict?

[Applied_People]

While probably not among "the best," dazzled is markedly better than in 1e.

Sickened looks pretty strong since it doesn't just "tick down" like frightened. It actually requires an action and a successful save to reduce or eliminate it.

Having not yet played a 2e session, I'm guessing there are others that might be better in actuality than they seem on paper.

What does the collective say?

[Deadmanwalking]

Sickened is really great, yes. Frightened is also really great, really. Clumsy is also great. And I think those are the three best 'numbered' conditions most of the time (probably in that order, though duration is also relevant).

Those three are top tier because they reduce AC and that's a really ridiculous damage boost vs. anything approximating on-level opposition in PF2.

I'm less sure of the non-numbered conditions, though anything that removes actions or causes the need for flat checks to act successfully is pretty good.

[Kyrone]

Slowed and Stunned, losing even one of your three actions is nasty, it stops spells with material components, makes it harder to command Animal Companions and Summons and use defensive actions like raise a shield.

[shroudb]

most conditions are really well balanced with each other.

Stunned and slow as an example, are pretty much equivalent for the most part. Prone is slightly better than both, but doesn't scale up, while the other do.

Clumsy makes you easier to hit, while Enfeeble makes you miss AND do less damage. Stupefied... i think it's weaker than both. Yes, it gives chance for spell failure and - to will saves, but the others seem more impactful.

Frightened is easier to inflict than Sickened, and can usually go higher (and both debuff EVERYTHING) but ticks down automatically as opposed needing an action to try to do so.

Drained is pretty severe, but good luck inflicting that.

dazzled is really great "cheap" condition, obviously Blind is the improved version, and as always, deafen is much worse than both lol.

Restrain > Grabbed > Flat-footed

i'd say those are the "pairings"

[Edge93]

Kyrone wrote:

Slowed and Stunned, losing even one of your three actions is nasty, it stops spells with material components, makes it harder to command Animal Companions and Summons and use defensive actions like raise a shield.

Not to mention any of the multi-action attacks that most Martials and many monsters may have.

[WHW]

Stupefied 2 from Redeemer makes Illusionists, Enchanters, and Occult casters drool with excitement. Such a powerful and interesting synergy, especially since spells that benefit from it the most are ones the most fitting for a party that doesn't want to permanently bodily harm their enemies.

[thorin001]

Obviously the best condition to inflict is "dead".

[Asurasan]

Oh man.... I showed up to give a snarky answer like Stunned(30) or something being the best but thorin wins.

[Paradozen]

Inflicting Prone and Grabbed is a pretty available way for martials to lock down a foe. They overlap, but you can do both with Athletics and it means the enemy needs 2 actions just to become properly mobile again.

[sherlock1701]

thorin001 wrote:

Obviously the best condition to inflict is "dead".

Ya beat me to it.

[Jokey the Unfunny Comedian]

sherlock1701 wrote:

thorin001 wrote:

Obviously the best condition to inflict is "dead".

Ya beat me to it.

Ideally, you want to get to Dead 2 or Dead 3.

[Mr. Hawn]

shroudb wrote:

Frightened is easier to inflict than Sickened, and can usually go higher (and both debuff EVERYTHING) but ticks down automatically as opposed needing an action to try to do so.

I thought they only debuffed skill checks since they don't mention attacks or AC like enfeebled and clumsy.

[shroudb]

Mr. Hawn wrote:

shroudb wrote:

Frightened is easier to inflict than Sickened, and can usually go higher (and both debuff EVERYTHING) but ticks down automatically as opposed needing an action to try to do so.

I thought they only debuffed skill checks since they don't mention attacks or AC like enfeebled and clumsy.

clumsy mentions it because it's a dex DC.

frighten/Sickened don't mention it because they mention none specific, they debuff ALL DCs.

It was like that in the playtest as well, and it has been confirmed by the devs and also there are numerous occasions in the book that call out that "AC is a type of DC" (and frighten/sickened reduce ALL DCs):

"Attack rolls are compared to a special difficulty class called
an Armor Class (AC),"

"Checks and difficulty classes (DC) both come in many
forms. When you swing your sword at that foul beast,
you’ll make an attack roll[b] against its Armor Class, which
is the DC to hit another creature."

"Armor Class (AC)
All creatures in the game have an Armor Class. This score
represents how hard it is to hit and damage a creature. It
serves as the Difficulty Class for hitting a creature with
an attack."

"When a creature attacks you, your
Armor Class is the DC for that attack roll."

and etc, too bored to hunt them all down

[Mr. Hawn]

shroudb wrote:

Mr. Hawn wrote:

shroudb wrote:

Frightened is easier to inflict than Sickened, and can usually go higher (and both debuff EVERYTHING) but ticks down automatically as opposed needing an action to try to do so.

I thought they only debuffed skill checks since they don't mention attacks or AC like enfeebled and clumsy.

and etc, too bored to hunt them all down

That was plenty, thanks. Totally changes my perspective on frightened and sickened conditions.

[shroudb]

Mr. Hawn wrote:

shroudb wrote:

Mr. Hawn wrote:

shroudb wrote:

Frightened is easier to inflict than Sickened, and can usually go higher (and both debuff EVERYTHING) but ticks down automatically as opposed needing an action to try to do so.

I thought they only debuffed skill checks since they don't mention attacks or AC like enfeebled and clumsy.

and etc, too bored to hunt them all down

That was plenty, thanks. Totally changes my perspective on frightened and sickened conditions.

they are the strongest -x to DCs since they affect everything.

that's why one is automatically reduced each round (as opposed to being duration based) and the other gives you the option to expel it yourself.

So, while they affect everything, they are also usually the shortest duration ones.

[Captain Morgan]

Stupefied and Enfeebled are probably the most situational, but Stupefied is just so good when used against casters or paired with things that target will.

[Xenocrat]

The key point for stupefied and enfeebled is that the spells/options that grant them tend to be some combination of low level and/or inflict a higher degree of the condition. At 3rd level you can cast Touch of Idiocy and potentially inflict Stupefied 4. Getting Frightened 3 is just as hard and doesn't last as long, and Sickened 2 is a very long shot or very rare at that level (Call of the Grave and ?).

[Appletree]

Ngl stupefied is probably the condition that makes me drool, just because of the caster shutdown options.