Pole-arm Expert with Ice base powers help


Advice


I am looking to Create a pole-arm user who has Ice Based powers
I was looking going Fighter (Advance weapon / Armor Training ) and going EIther VMC WIzard for an Ice power or VMC Oracle for the wave Revelation

For Feats I have the followiing
LV1) Weapon Focus /Power Attack/ Combat Reflexes
LV2) Polearm Expertise - Third party feat - Allows for fighting close foes with polearm
LV3) VMC ???
LV4) Weapon Specialization
LV(5) Cut from the Air
LV(6) Lunge
LV(7) VMC ???
LV(8) Improved Critical
LV(9) Critical Focus
LV(10) Smash from the Air

I am open to Ideas but i do want to Stick to the idea of a Pole-arm user that uses Ice Base power

This is also a mythic and i will being going champion
have not pick my abilites but i have chosen my
first Mythic Feat (Mythic - Critical focus

Silver Crusade

I've played a polearm-wielding frost-magic specialist. It works great. I have a few suggestions:

Consider replacing the completely-not-needed Polearm Expertise feat with the Rime Spell feat. Combining Rime Spell with, say, Ice Slick, gives you some very potent frost-based crowd control. Ice Slick also gives you additional +4 AoOs, because foes will try to stand up from prone. Note that Rime Spell gives no save if foes takes any damage!!!!!!

Many players are concerned about the polearm 'can't-attack-adjacent' issue. This issue seems like it should be important, but in my experience it hinders fewer than 1% of attacks. This issue gets attention drastically out of proportion to its impact. It's totally not worth spending a feat to mitigate. In my opinion it's not even worth the (trivial) cost and (non-trivial) extra-weight of Armor Spikes. This after years of experience playing reach builds in Pathfinder.

Consider the trade off between making a full attack and using reach tactics. When fighting a foe with a strong full attack (e.g. ghouls, gargoyles, trolls, giants, etc) you can generally avoid the foe's full attack by using reach tactics and staying out of full attack range. This can drastically reduce incoming damage against these foes. Anytime you can do this is a win for your team. The main failure-point for this approach is your allies, who will tend to blunder into the full attacks you avoid.

As a caster fighting with a reach weapon, consider reserving your Standard Action for spell casting and relying on your AoOs for inflicting damage. When a Cleric uses this approach the build is called a 'reach cleric'. The approach works well for other casters, too. If you go this approach consider dropping some of your higher-level combat feats for spell casting feats. By about 7th level your spells will become more valuable than your melee attacks. Take some spell feats instead.


@ Magda Luckbender I see

what Classes would you recommend for this?

Silver Crusade

Any spellcaster works well. 2/3 BaB builds work best. Mine was a Cleric/Witch Mystic Theurge, which worked pretty well despite the atrocious BaB. Oracle works great!


Oracles have a "Winter Mystery" option that seems decent. It won't give you martial weapon proficiency like the popular warrior oracle mysteries (battle and metal), but this is not insurmountable.


Magus would be a natural choice. Rimed Frostbite is great. Wield a Cruel Fauchard and pick up Power Attack and Cornugon Smash for Shaken/Sicken combo and you'd be a debuffing monster. Entangle/Fatigue/Shaken/Sicken all off one hit. Grab Greater Trip for additional shenanigans.


well I'm thinking of combing this Idea and and Dragon Disciple Idea


@ Ryze Kuja}
What Archetype for Magus?


I'd go Kensai, Black Blade, or maybe just non-archetype Magus tbh. And if those don't interest you, just go with anything that doesn't modify your spellstrike or spell combat.


Isn't the problem with a polearm magus that you can't use spell combat? I mean, without 3 levels of phalanx fighter, as spell combat requires a light or one-handed weapon, and polearms are neither.

I guess 13 levels of mindblade would work instead.


Ryze Kuja wrote:
I'd go Kensai, Black Blade, or maybe just non-archetype Magus tbh. And if those don't interest you, just go with anything that doesn't modify your spellstrike or spell combat.

ok Switched to using a Wakizashi and am Doing Black blade kensai half elf

care to recommend me racial traits i should take?


Half elfs who aren't multiclassing have no need for Multitalented, see if your GM will let you get Fey Thoughts (1RP) instead?

Silver Crusade

Funny! That's now a completely different character from what OP Julius originally asked for. Also, imho, considerably downgraded. :-)

Primary Battlefield weapons (primary weapons): warbows, polearms, shield & anything, rifles

Sidearms (Secondary weapons): thrown weapons, most swords, buckler & anything, pistols

The Sidearm, aka secondary weapon, is what you use when you don't have your primary weapon. Pathfinder game mostly represents this difference pretty well.


Btw, if you want to do a 1h reach build with a Magus, I recommend using a Scorpion Whip (15ft) with Lunge (20ft) and Enlarge Person (25ft), and then definitely get Greater Trip and Combat Reflexes.

Your Scorpion Whip can threaten 20ft with Enlarge Person, and you can Trip in lieu of any one of your attacks.

Rimed Frostbite synergizes with this so well because you can Entangle/Fatigue from such a long range and Frostbite lasts for multiple charges.


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Warpriest or an Inquisitor of Shelyn wielding a Holy Ice Weapon polearm. Properly outfitted you should be doing (with Power Attack) 1d8/10 or 2d6+20ish at level 5.

Silver Crusade

JiaYou wrote:
Warpriest or an Inquisitor of Shelyn wielding a Holy Ice Weapon polearm. Properly outfitted you should be doing (with Power Attack) 1d8/10 or 2d6+20ish at level 5.

Exactly. My PFS Inquisitor-5 of Erastil (Plant[Growth] domain) typically stabs (with a longspear) at +10 to hit for 2d6+17 (no Power Attack) and averages more than 1.5 attacks per round. That's without any combat feats: the PC is a summoning specialist of the Monster Tactician archetype.

@OP: Little need to do that much damage, although it's nowhere near the upper limit if one has feats to spend. I offer it only as a point of comparison.


Can you elaborate a little Magda and JiaYou how you generate those numbers? I have been thinking of making a ranged or reach inquisitor or war priest for our next campaign.


Now I'm interested in Magda's too...for me, 18 str with a two handed weapon and power attack. Holy Ice Weapon adds +level to your damage. Divine Favor would just add more but Magda's got Enlarge Person and then something special going on clearly.

Silver Crusade

The 'something special' is just Bane.

Some numbers:

I previously said +10 to hit for 2d6+17 damage [average 24]. This is slightly incorrect, as damage is actually 4d6+10 [average 24]. I simplified numbers for Bane.

18 STR +2 for swift action enlarge person & +1 longspear & swift action Bane

That's two Swift Actions, so this is either 2nd round or we have some advance warning.

To Hit:
BaB +3 STR +4 Weapon +1 Bane +2 = +10 to hit

Damage

2d6 for Large Longspear + 7 for STR + 1 for weapon + [2+2d6] for Bane

I averaged Bane to +9 damage for simplicity, when it's actually 2d6+2 damage

Thus longspear damage is actually 4d6+10 [average 24 hp per hit].
Again, that's with no feats. Two intrinsic swift-action buffs are slightly problematic.

Those not familiar with the Plant(Growth) domain should check this out. As well as swift-action Enlarge Person, the domain also gives free virtual 5' steps ~5 times/day. Hardly ever take an incoming full attack unless you want to, hardly ever take an AoO, and you can almost always full attack. From a standing start you can Full Attack a foe who starts the round 30' away.


The extra attacks are just AoOs, which this build is apt at generating.

Lack of Combat Reflexes occasionally results in a lost AoO, or the average number of attacks per round would be higher.


Makes perfect sense. And I went a slightly different route but end up similarly, with the Accelerated Drinker trait (I thought to do the Reformation Inquisition for the social buffs and abilities) for a potion in a spring loaded wrist sheath (then realized that combo RAW doesn't work).


Thanks Magda! That archetype seems really interesting. What teamwork feats would you choose for the summoned monsters? Paired opportunist, outflank? You say no combat feats, did you use them on summoning feats then?

Silver Crusade

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@WagnerSika:

@WagnerSika: The great thing about the teamwork feat[s] is that the Inquisitor can change it. Here's a thorough Summoning Guide. [Why work when others can do it for you ...].

Rather than detail how my particular PC is built, I'll show the build template. Here's the minimum build resources (without stat dumping) to do this sort of PC:

Martial Inquisitor (Monster Tactician)
STR:15+2+1 == 18 DEX:10 CON:10 INT:10 WIS:13 CHA:10
Feats Available at 5th level: All of them! You're a total badass even without combat feats. Build for any specialization or whim you want and still be highly effective. For example, perhaps you want to be the very best in the land at Craft(Weave baskets underwater) while still more than holding your own in battle. This build is one way to start down that particular Path to Mastery, as all your feats are available to improve your Craft (weaving) expertise.
Domain: Choose one.
Primary Weapon (at 5th level): +1 Longspear at +10 to hit for 1D8 + 2D6 + 9 ~= average 21 hp per hit @ 10' reach
Primary Weapon (at 5th level, with Plant(Growth) Domain): +1 Longspear at +10 to hit for 4D6 + 10 ~= 24 hp per hit @ 20' reach

My PC is having good luck with Tandem Trip as a Teamwork Feat. I'm still exploring the other good options.

Other specializations that might work well:
* Ice Magic
* Summon Specialist
* Melee Specialist
* Whimsical specialist
* UMD specialist with lots of toys


My favourite teamwork feat for Monster Tactician is Snapping Flank.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Magda Luckbender wrote:
You're a total badass even without combat feats.

This is only sort of true. At 5th level you have 5 rounds of bane per day. With 13 Wis you have 4 rounds of growth. Since you have to activate bane a round before you use it with growth, at most you get 4 rounds a day with that damage.

That isn't to say this is a perfectly good character. Your primary focus of the character can be summons or something and the growth/bane just gravy, but this won't be a full time melee character without additional investment.

Silver Crusade

Dave Justus wrote:
this won't be a full time melee character without additional investment.

Agreed!

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