
Voss |

I'm having trouble finding the damage for Large Weapons, as described in the Titan Mauler ability on Page 56. Any ideas where it's hiding at?
Thanks in advance.
It's probably the fighter sidebar on page 91. Increasing Weapon Damage Dice.
1d4->1d6->1d8->1d10->1d12-> +2 bonus.You can never increase weapon damage dice more than once.
So a large greatsword would be 1d12+2.
If it _isn't_ that, its basically a 404 error, rules reference not found. The playtest rules basically ignore size except for moving through, hiding behind and screening.
It really ought to be explicit though, because this feels like an educated guess.

Tiene |
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I ended up cross-referencing it with the bestiary, and it looks like weapons wielded by large creatures use the same damage die as in the equipment chapter. So the only conclusion I can come to is that the only benefit of wielding a large weapon is that you double the rage damage when wielding one. Which is really disappointing. That means if you get a magic weapon you're more likely better off not-using your main totem-feature.

Laik RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32 |
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For now, it looks like Large weapons have the same damage die as smaller one, means they offer no benefits at all most of time (unles you have Titan Maul and raging). That looks lacking, especially when it comes to some really huge,gargrantuan, colossal creatures. A storm giants two-hander doing same damage as human 2-handed?.. Not sure it is a good idea.

Joe Mucchiello |
I'm having trouble finding the damage for Large Weapons, as described in the Titan Mauler ability on Page 56. Any ideas where it's hiding at?
At no time, does the Titan Mauler ability tell you to increase the weapon's damage die:
You can use a weapon built for a Large creature if you are Small or Medium (both normally and when raging). If you’re not Small or Medium, you can use a weapon built for a creature one size larger than you. You also gain access to your choice of weapon at character creation. When you are wielding such a weapon in combat, double your conditional bonus to damage rolls from raging, but you have the sluggish 1 condition (see page 324) because of the weapon’s unwieldy size. You can’t remove this sluggish condition or ignore its penalties by any means while you’re wielding the weapon.

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Titan Mauler seems kind of bad in its current incarnation. Rage doesn't give any bonuses to attack, and by my understanding, bonuses to hit matter significantly more than bonuses to damage in this edition. I don't think applying a further -1 penalty to attack rolls from using your class features is completely thought out. At the very least you shouldn't have to take this penalty whilst raging.
Maybe someone could do the math comparing a Giant Totem large greatsword barbarian with a Fury Totem regular-sized greatsword? I imagine the doubled damage falls short very quickly.

Gozer "Bone Splitter" |
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I was just reading this and coming from someone who played to level 17 with my Titan Mauler in 1e this is both lacking and disappointing. I was hoping to rebuild. Only doubling your rage mod is weak as is a barbarian not being able to benefit from a bard's inspire courage. Rage should not be a conditional modifier or inspire courage shouldn't be. This totem leaves a bad taste in my mouth for the future of the titan mauler.

Captain Morgan |

Barbarians do benefit from Inspire Courage's accuracy boost, and I believe saves against fear though that isn't as relevant. The barbarian doesn't get +1 damage, but that's far less relevant than the +1 to hit. (Part of me feels like Inspire Courage should be a loop hole for the Superstitious Barbarian, though. I dunno, just seems like a barbarian should hear music and get pumped. How do they even know it is magic?
As for the Giant Totem: it is only +2 damage at levels 1-2. It doubles your entire bonus as you level. So it is +7 damage by 19th. Not if that is mathematically favorable but it definitely looks better. Also, I don't think the sluggish 1 stacks with the sluggish 1 from being Enlarged later, which is nice. (Though I don't think being huge sized increases your damage, just your reach.) So it looks like the bigger weapons are best used later on. I guess it will be hard to avoid high quality large weapons at low levels anyway, so you're probably getting them off enemy drops.
There's this weird trend for certain options to look less enticing at level 1 but have big payoff down the road. Not sure how I feel about it.

Tholomyes |

Yes. Until you hit d12, at which point you keep the d12 and add a +2 conditional bonus.
As people have mentioned, Large weapons don't increase damage dice, so this point is a bit off topic, but just since it's here, I have a question that ctr-f couldn't help me solve:
Since you add damage dice with magic weapons/power-attack/ect, does the +2 bonus get multiplied?
My guess would be no, since I can't find anything on it, but if that is in fact the case, I would hope to persuade them to change that, as it makes for weird non-scaling. Compare:
Level 1/4/8/12/16/20, average damage increase from weapon size increase:
any other die: +1/+2/+3/+4/+5/+6
d12: +2/+2/+2/+2/+2/+2

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Draco18s wrote:Yes. Until you hit d12, at which point you keep the d12 and add a +2 conditional bonus.As people have mentioned, Large weapons don't increase damage dice, so this point is a bit off topic, but just since it's here, I have a question that ctr-f couldn't help me solve:
Since you add damage dice with magic weapons/power-attack/ect, does the +2 bonus get multiplied?
My guess would be no, since I can't find anything on it, but if that is in fact the case, I would hope to persuade them to change that, as it makes for weird non-scaling. Compare:
Level 1/4/8/12/16/20, average damage increase from weapon size increase:
any other die: +1/+2/+3/+4/+5/+6
d12: +2/+2/+2/+2/+2/+2
The rage conditional bonus scales with level.
"Gain a +2 conditional bonus to damage rolls with melee weapons and unarmed Strikes. The bonus is halved if your weapon or unarmed Strike is agile. This bonus increases by 1 at level 3 and every 4 levels thereafter."

Alex Mack |

I think the way the damage bonus scales the math should be fairly level throughout the level range.
Cause roughly each time you get a new damage die from an upgraded magic wepon the bonus from Titan Mauler will increase by +1. So the percentage of your total damge provided by the ability stays constant. And the reduction of hit chance will always affect roughly the same percentage of your dpr.
If Enlarging and a large weapon only give you sluggish 1 then the bility likely becomes worth while just for reach. Then again getting AoO with a barb is also not so easy...

Warmagon |
PF 1: -1 to hit for +2 damage where both the penalty to hit and the bonus to damage scale is so clutch that every martial build takes power attack at the cost of a feat.
PF 2: -1 to hit and +2 damage, where only the bonus to damage scales, and you get it for free is a trap?
Doesn't seem that implausible IMO. In PF and 3e, lots of monsters had really bad ACs, and with extra attacks, a warrior's attack routine was biased towards the high end. And there were a lot of potential buffs to attack bonus, which stacked. So Power Attack could destroy vulnerable targets and still offer a modest improvement against reasonably well armored enemies.
In PF 2, AC is somewhat more consistent with level. Extra attack bonuses are more scarce (less stacking, less duration, smaller bonuses). Extra attacks from haste still have the multi-attack penalty. And margin of success matters for crits, so turning 'extra' to hit into damage is also shrinking the range of double damage.
And it's not free, because each totem has the opportunity cost of all the other totems.

Alex Mack |

PF 1: -1 to hit for +2 damage where both the penalty to hit and the bonus to damage scale is so clutch that every martial build takes power attack at the cost of a feat.
PF 2: -1 to hit and +2 damage, where only the bonus to damage scales, and you get it for free is a trap?
Don't forget you are also loosing one point of AC. That's also way more important than t was in PF1!

DoggieBert |

I played Amiri at 5th level at Gencon and I felt like being sluggish was an overly harsh penalty for the benefit from the large sword, so I did some calculations for her with a large vs. medium bastard sword.
Defender: AC 20, no weaknesses, resistances, shield, etc.
Amiri large sword:
- To hit = str (4) + prof (5) + weapon (1) - sluggish (1) = +9
- Avg. Dam = weapon (2d12, avg 13) + str (4) + rage (6) = 23
- DPR = 12.65/19.55/20.7 for 1/2/3 attacks
Amiri medium sword:
- To hit = str (4) + prof (5) + weapon (1) = +10
- Avg. Dam = weapon (2d12, avg 13) + str (4) + rage (3) = 20
- DPR = 12/19/21 for 1/2/3 attacks
The spreadsheet I used for the DPR calculations is here (please let me know if any of my calculations are wrong).
You can see that the large sword barely increases her damage due to being sluggish and it almost certainly isn't worth the other negatives that come with the condition.
I've tried a few other AC values for the defender and gotten similar results, but haven't tried calculating the damage difference at other levels. Feel free to make a copy of my spreadsheet if you want to use it yourself.

Tholomyes |

Tholomyes wrote:Draco18s wrote:Yes. Until you hit d12, at which point you keep the d12 and add a +2 conditional bonus.As people have mentioned, Large weapons don't increase damage dice, so this point is a bit off topic, but just since it's here, I have a question that ctr-f couldn't help me solve:
Since you add damage dice with magic weapons/power-attack/ect, does the +2 bonus get multiplied?
My guess would be no, since I can't find anything on it, but if that is in fact the case, I would hope to persuade them to change that, as it makes for weird non-scaling. Compare:
Level 1/4/8/12/16/20, average damage increase from weapon size increase:
any other die: +1/+2/+3/+4/+5/+6
d12: +2/+2/+2/+2/+2/+2The rage conditional bonus scales with level.
"Gain a +2 conditional bonus to damage rolls with melee weapons and unarmed Strikes. The bonus is halved if your weapon or unarmed Strike is agile. This bonus increases by 1 at level 3 and every 4 levels thereafter."
My bad, I was being pretty unclear when I posted initially; this wasn't about rage per se, but the thread brought up the notion of increasing damage dice, so my question was more to do with how does that interact with a d12 weapon, in terms of scaling. But that's probably outside the scope of this thread anyway.

Windleaf666 |
So the wording on the totem to me seems like you would get double your rage bonus as damage when not raging as well.
Example it would be
So at level 1 when not raging you would get +4 damage and -1 Ac and -1 Attack
And when raging you get +6 damage and - 2 ac and -1 Attack.
Or when not Raging you have -1 ac and -1 attack and gain no bonus.
then when raging you have +4 damage -2 ac and -1 attack

Rhys_Prime |
For now, it looks like Large weapons have the same damage die as smaller one, means they offer no benefits at all most of time (unles you have Titan Maul and raging). That looks lacking, especially when it comes to some really huge,gargrantuan, colossal creatures. A storm giants two-hander doing same damage as human 2-handed?.. Not sure it is a good idea.
It's even worse than that because Regular small/medium characters can use large weapons, and have the clumsy penalty. It's basically hey you get this big penalty, for no bonus, and uhhh yeah you do a bit more rage damage but uh, not as much as other better instincts. It's pretty awful RAW. Honestly Raw there's no mechanical reason to take it over Dragon instinct, just flavor really.
Also it's ridiculous that it says you can use a weapon built for a large creature as though that's a power granted to you by the instinct... it's just something you can do as a small/medium character.
I would at least give my players the damage step increase or get rid of the clumsy while raging. Otherwise you're literally trading -dex for 2 damage with 0 other benefits, that's pretty awful. Not to mention that when you get the additional growth abilities all you're getting is 5 reach since your weapon doesn't increase its damage die either. Not to mention you're now clumsy 2... get the hell out of here with that garbage. lol... Your equipment grows with you... it's pretty awful.
Definitely requires some serious tweaking.

hookhorror31 |

I'm having trouble finding the damage for Large Weapons, as described in the Titan Mauler ability on Page 56. Any ideas where it's hiding at?
Thanks in advance.
I realize I'm putting my two cents in two years later than everyone else, but this sounds odd to me, since every Giant's weapon in the Bestiary has double the original weapons damage dice. In much the same manner as the striking rune adds extra weapon damage dice. I say it makes much more sense if you're going to be the same size Weapons and all as the giants you ought to do the same damage. And you're only clumsy in regards to the wee folk, you know, humans and the like. Otherwise what's the point?