I think they are just laying the long-term groundwork for, "this spell list goes to eleven" jokes for April 1, 2019
Interesting if cantrips become 1st level spells, or if that should say spell lists from 0-10. I suspect the unlimited casting of cantrips could go away...
Also, a large chunk of the highest level spells are just crazy in power already. If 10th level is some sort of new higher power stuff, I would have trouble wrapping my head around balancing that out with other classes.
Also, a large chunk of the highest level spells are just crazy in power already. If 10th level is some sort of new higher power stuff, I would have trouble wrapping my head around balancing that out with other classes.
On the other hand, the difference in power between some of the higher spell levels isn't always that big. That means 10th level spells don't really have to be that much more powerful than the 9th level ones. To be honest, I'm more excited for the metamagic possibilities. A whole bunch of spells just became plausible metamagic candidates at 20th level play that previously required Magical Lineage support (which meant you had to focus your entire build around them).
Interesting if cantrips become 1st level spells, or if that should say spell lists from 0-10. I suspect the unlimited casting of cantrips could go away...
The Shield spell is a cantrip in the Glass Cannon Podcast playtest. It can be cast as often as desired but apparently has a 10 minute "cooldown", which basically limits its use to once per battle.
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Shield is a cantrip? With a ten minute cooldown!? I'm currently paralyzed with indecision over whether I'm worried or excited over what we're looking at here.
Interesting if cantrips become 1st level spells, or if that should say spell lists from 0-10. I suspect the unlimited casting of cantrips could go away...The Shield spell is a cantrip in the Glass Cannon Podcast playtest. It can be cast as often as desired but apparently has a 10 minute "cooldown", which basically limits its use to once per battle.
I don't have context for this, but what you described sounds like mechanics I don't like in Guild Wars 2 let alone a ttRPG.
Probably just want to keep the progression up to lvl 20. Right now, Wizards gain 9th lvl spells at 17, and no new spell levl at 19 (18 and 20 for sorcerer).
Might smooth the high level spells a bit, making the best spells (like Time Stop or Wish) 10th lvl while keeping the lower tier of 9th lvl spells as 9, or so.
Alternatively, 10th lvl spell might be just Wish and Miracle, with these spells working as any other spell, 9th lvl or less, instead of working as 8th lvl max.
Shield is a cantrip? With a ten minute cooldown!? I'm currently paralyzed with indecision over whether I'm worried or excited over what we're looking at here.
Not exactly. It seems Shield is a cantrip, and the equivalent of quickened spell too (it's 1 action to cast).
It works like a regular shield (which in 2e playtest, can be interposed to reduce damage = hardness). _IF_ the spell is broken by damage, then you can't use again for 10 minutes.
Shield is a cantrip? With a ten minute cooldown!? I'm currently paralyzed with indecision over whether I'm worried or excited over what we're looking at here.Not exactly. It seems Shield is a cantrip, and the equivalent of quickened spell too (it's 1 action to cast).
It works like a regular shield (which in 2e playtest, can be interposed to reduce damage = hardness). _IF_ the spell is broken by damage, then you can't use again for 10 minutes.
That sounds amazing. I'm going to go and watch the podcast now.
Shield is a cantrip? With a ten minute cooldown!? I'm currently paralyzed with indecision over whether I'm worried or excited over what we're looking at here.Not exactly. It seems Shield is a cantrip, and the equivalent of quickened spell too (it's 1 action to cast).
It works like a regular shield (which in 2e playtest, can be interposed to reduce damage = hardness). _IF_ the spell is broken by damage, then you can't use again for 10 minutes.
That is the way it is written up at EN World. I do not recall hearing that the Shield effect indeed lasts a full 10 minutes if it is not destroyed. Then again, with a hardness of only 4, it is on the fragile side. However, I do recall hearing that you do not have to expend an action to raise it each turn.
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I honestly don't know why Paizo even threw out the whole "now you'll have 10th level spells!" thing when they knew they couldn't explain it right now. It comes across as a "these go to 11" statement--sure, it's one bigger, but why does that matter?
I'm presuming it's just so that there's a consistent formula of full casters getting a new spell every other level, without having the abrupt stop where there should have been another advancement at 19th. It's not a game-changer, and it makes a lot of sense in that context.
This would imply that partial-casters like the bards will get 7th level spells at 19th, continuing their formula of getting one new spell every three levels. Don't know what it would mean for the low-casters like Paladins, though, since a continuation of their formula would mean they'd hit 6th level spells which might be a bit much, but I wouldn't be surprised if they get 5th level spells.
My friend's guess that I'm stealing is that 10th level spells are a full-caster's 20th-level capstone. Before, they got their most powerful magic at 17 and 18, effectively a capstone. If a game was billed as high-level, you can bet it'd be one of those two levels. None of the other classes got to use their capstones. With the most powerful magic pulled up into capstone realms where everybody gets some particularly broken stuff (maybe not equitably, but still), then those last few levels can be more easily balanced.
Y'know, this brings up an interesting (to me) tangential point:
There's going to be 20 levels. Wonder if the PF2 adventure paths will actually use them, or if there'll still be 15-25% of the game that doesn't get published support.
Interesting if cantrips become 1st level spells, or if that should say spell lists from 0-10. I suspect the unlimited casting of cantrips could go away...The Shield spell is a cantrip in the Glass Cannon Podcast playtest. It can be cast as often as desired but apparently has a 10 minute "cooldown", which basically limits its use to once per battle.
So its basically a per encounter ability i guess.
Oh good.
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So its basically a per encounter ability i guess.Interesting if cantrips become 1st level spells, or if that should say spell lists from 0-10. I suspect the unlimited casting of cantrips could go away...The Shield spell is a cantrip in the Glass Cannon Podcast playtest. It can be cast as often as desired but apparently has a 10 minute "cooldown", which basically limits its use to once per battle.
The cooldown is triggered by an optional effect. If you don't use the effect, the cantrip can be cast again next round.
Y'know, this brings up an interesting (to me) tangential point:
There's going to be 20 levels. Wonder if the PF2 adventure paths will actually use them, or if there'll still be 15-25% of the game that doesn't get published support.
Giving that Return of the Runelords is going to go all the way up to level 20, and that one of the goals for PF2 is support all levels of play, I'm hoping that APs are going to be from level 1 to 20.
To put it another way, what if Pathfinder 2E is simply going to have spells ranging from levels 1 through 10, rather than 0 through 9
I have the same concern Alzrius, but I'm really hoping that 10th level spell are going to be something new. And it makes perfect sense to introduce them, spell are the primary clase feature of casters, currently they get their most awesome spells at level 17 or 18 and then there is nothing more to look forwards, and it also makes the progression of opening a new spell level every two levels broken at the end.
I think they are just laying the long-term groundwork for, "this spell list goes to eleven" jokes for April 1, 2019
I actually think you might be right.
Almost undoubtedly a mix of a few new spells with just resorting the spell list. It's an opportunity to break with the tradition of where things have "always been" and put them in more appropriate places. Things like True Resurrection, Time Stop, Gate, etc will likely move to level 10. The most powerful 8th level spells like Mind Blank will probably move to level 9, weak 8th level spells like Antipathy / Sympathy could move to level 7, and so on.
It looks like Cantrips will be at wills that like in 5E are somewhat better than the positively worthless 0-level spells of PF1e, and so might actually be useful. It also looks like they, or at least some of them like shield, have optional effects to buff them but that using those buffed versions essentially turns them into encounter spells.
I'm very okay with all of this.
I honestly don't know why Paizo even threw out the whole "now you'll have 10th level spells!" thing when they knew they couldn't explain it right now. It comes across as a "these go to 11" statement--sure, it's one bigger, but why does that matter?
Wizards currently get new spells every two levels, until 19-20, when they get nothing new.
Odds are they are just maintaining spell progression every two levels and doing a massive, across-the-board rewrite of spells.
Taking spells to 10th level is one of the things that least concerns me.
Rewriting all the spells on the other hand ... I disapprove of the changes in Shield, which were necessitated by an underlying change in shield mechanics.
I honestly don't know why Paizo even threw out the whole "now you'll have 10th level spells!" thing when they knew they couldn't explain it right now. It comes across as a "these go to 11" statement--sure, it's one bigger, but why does that matter?Wizards currently get new spells every two levels, until 19-20, when they get nothing new.
Odds are they are just maintaining spell progression every two levels and doing a massive, across-the-board rewrite of spells.
Taking spells to 10th level is one of the things that least concerns me.
Rewriting all the spells on the other hand ... I disapprove of the changes in Shield, which were necessitated by an underlying change in shield mechanics.
Rewritten Shield is something I like a lot. I never took the spell before, but it’s more stylish as a “quickened” spell to block more actively. Being able to cash it in for an emergency four hitpoints is pretty slick, and if cantrips scale, it’ll stay relevant.