Hello all! For our next PF campaign, I have my heart set on playing a shapeshifter. Now, in my own opinion, Paizo hasn't created a decent shapeshifting class or archetype yet. Despite that unfortunate situation, I'm going for the "least bad" option.
My preferences include:1) No animal shifting, I find animal forms boring and don't want to deal with them. I want humanoid forms or some other kind of monster form. 2) No animal companions, don't like 'em at all.
Which shapeshifter class/archetype do you all think is best in the following areas:
1. Versatility (skills, class abilities, spells, etc)
2. Raw physical power and combat ability
3. Mobility (flying, swimming, climbing, etc)
Cheers all, thanks for your help!
You forget draconic sorcerer or dragon disciple.
Druids also have elemental forms at high level.
Would a Draconic Bloodrager's gradual transformation into a dragon scratch your shapeshifting itch?
This is the moment where I want to mention the Shifter from Spheres of Power, but presume that no 3PP stuff is allowed.
Not technically shapeshifting, but a Synthesist Summoner could be reasonably reflavored as such, and there there's lots of options for cool monstrous forms.
The Warped variant of the Sorcerer's Aberrant bloodline has some shapeshifting oriented stuff.
The Kitsune race has an anthropomorphic option that could potentially be pretty monstrous if built around. Skinwalkers also get something a bit similar.
The Brute archetype for Vigilante also lets you basically become the Hulk, which can be pretty monstrous especially if you stack other stuff onto it.
Would a Draconic Bloodrager's gradual transformation into a dragon scratch your shapeshifting itch?
It would, except by the time that come on line, the campaign would likely be over.
That Metamorph sucks. He can't do anything without Alchemy. Goliath Druid wins, because he is after all a 9th lvl caster with a very versatile and powerful spell list.
This is the moment where I want to mention the Shifter from Spheres of Power, but presume that no 3PP stuff is allowed.
I've heard very good things about Spheres of Power, unfortunately I don't think our GM will allow it.
That Metamorph sucks. He can't do anything without Alchemy. Goliath Druid wins, because he is after all a 9th lvl caster with a very versatile and powerful spell list.
Losing extracts hurts a heck of alot, no doubt about it. I'm thinking my character will be depended on to really carry a good portion of the load in melee combat. How does the Goliath druid stack up against the Metamorph in a pure wrecking faces competition?
I think the problem with Goliath Druids as opposed to normal ones is the fact that wildshaping into a giant doesn't really do much. I mean, growing large and getting a strength buff is awesome, but they lack natural attacks and such, and a lot of the ways to gain natural attacks through racial abilities and such are invalidated because it's a polymorph effect.
Being a druid helps with that a bit, in that there are druid spells that grant natural attacks, but that means you're requiring both wild shape AND a spell to be competent at melee, unless you carry around Large sized melee weapons. Though a giant wielding a Shillelagh is potentially amusing.
As said, Metamorph isn't particularly interesting either. The caveat of "no animal forms" limits you a fair bit, unless you just build a caster based around actual polymorph spells (as opposed to a shapeshifting class feature), which grant you access to a bit more than just animals.
That Metamorph sucks. He can't do anything without Alchemy. Goliath Druid wins, because he is after all a 9th lvl caster with a very versatile and powerful spell list.Losing extracts hurts a heck of alot, no doubt about it. I'm thinking my character will be depended on to really carry a good portion of the load in melee combat. How does the Goliath druid stack up against the Metamorph in a pure wrecking faces competition?
They have similar shapechanging abilities from 6th level, they have the same BAB and similar weapon/armor proficiencies - but the goliath druid has full spellcasting and either a domain or an animal companion while the metamorph has nothing extra.
Levels 1-5 the metamorph is a better shapechanger. It might win, if the druid had no time to buff. Maybe.
I think the problem with Goliath Druids as opposed to normal ones is the fact that wildshaping into a giant doesn't really do much. I mean, growing large and getting a strength buff is awesome, but they lack natural attacks and such, and a lot of the ways to gain natural attacks through racial abilities and such are invalidated because it's a polymorph effect.
Giant Form includes all trolls, which all have bite and 2 claws. Mountain troll even is huge size. Most giants have 2 slams.
This coupled with the possibility to add certain natural attacks via spells and improving them via Greater Magic Fang and Strong Jaw should supersede anything the alchemist can come up with.
They have similar shapechanging abilities from 6th level, they have the same BAB and similar weapon/armor proficiencies - but the goliath druid has full spellcasting and either a domain or an animal companion while the metamorph has nothing extra.
The Metamorph does have mutagens, which yield a nice boost to their melee prowess. (Which is not to say it's an even trade for 9th level casting and an animal companion...)
Interesting stuff, lots to consider. What do you guys think of the Beastmorph Alchemist compared to the options already presented?
...unless you carry around Large sized melee weapons. Though a giant wielding a Shillelagh is potentially amusing.
Actually you just have to carry around a medium sized club or staff along with your other gear. In this case, the spell does the rest of the work for you.
When you cast a polymorph spell that changes you into a creature of the animal, dragon, elemental, magical beast, plant, or vermin type, all of your gear melds into your body ... If your new form does not cause your equipment to meld into your form, the equipment resizes to match your new size.
I read about the Beastmorph Alchemist archetype yesterday and it has me intrigued. I'd love to hear from folks that have played it, what is it like? What are it's strengths and weaknesses? What advice do you have for someone who is interested in playing a Beastmorph?
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THe problem with Beastmorph if you build around an ability you get 1/day though you can regain it with 1 hour of work. This can lead to problems with the mutagen running out or having to be careful when you use it.
This can be mitigated by going into Master Chymist at level 8 which increases your mutagen to 3/day effectively.
He's talking about metamorph, not beastmorph.
Sorry, thought they were responding to the OP. That was my mistake.
If Homebrew is viable, I made a Druid archetype that ditches the animal companion to get all the shapeshift spells:
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2pdpq?Druid-Archetype-Wildshape-Master
He's talking about metamorph, not beastmorph.Are you sure?
Actually I was trying to include both the Beastmorph and Metamorph in the discussion.
If Homebrew is viable, I made a Druid archetype that ditches the animal companion to get all the shapeshift spells:
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2pdpq?Druid-Archetype-Wildshape-Master
This looks great but unfortunately 3rd party and homebrew are not options.
This leads me to another question, does anyone know of any ways to increase the duration of polymorph effects, like Monstrous Physique for example? Any feats, traits, magic items, etc? One of the big issues with the Beastmorph is polymorph spells just don't last very long.
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First off extend spell can double the duration. Arcanist can spell tinker it for an additional 1.5x, even on top of Extend spell.
Increasing caster level also works, feats like Varisian Tattoo, Bloatmage Initiate, and Traits like Transmuter of Korada all work to boost caster level. Once you find one you like you can grab spell specialization for another +2. With the right feats/traits you can easily get CL + 5 to your favorite spell making it last 10 min longer (or 15 as an Arcanist) and also making it harder to dispel.
If you ever go mythic, check out Enduring Blessing at Tier 6 which can make 1 min/level spells last all day.
Whether it is possible to assemble something interesting from Skinshaper archetype druid?
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If third party material was allowed, I would say check out the
Skin-changer in the New Paths Compendium from Kobold Press
Whether it is possible to assemble something interesting from Skinshaper archetype druid?
Unfortunately Skinshaper is a rather terrible archetype, so I can't see a good use for one other than an espionage campaign.
That Metamorph sucks. He can't do anything without Alchemy. Goliath Druid wins, because he is after all a 9th lvl caster with a very versatile and powerful spell list.
Goliath druid probably wins, but as a shapeshifter its a lot more MAD to take advantage of that + being a 9th level caster.
Plus metamorph gets access to true resurrection.