A Song of Silver (GM Reference)


Hell's Rebels

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p-sto wrote:
Bumped her up to level 13 and threw in four Sisters of the Golden Erinyes that I statted out to protect her but it doesn't feel like it will make much of a difference given she needs at least three rounds to buff. Perhaps I should make use of the fact that the archetype that makes her useless in combat is actually pretty awesome out of it. Azatas aren't immune to mind affecting magic and a Raelis has 11 HD. 19 charisma isn't all that helpful in an opposed charisma check when the person who bound you has quickened Ill Omen.

Then just assume that she has those 3 rounds to buff; that's one way to model an intelligent NPC's actions. She's had 4 adventures to learn about the PCs and their tactics, after all.


Of course she does but I can't really think of of a justification for why she would have greater heroism, shadow body and flight hex active at the moment the party arrives. Mage armor and spite sure but not more short term buffs. I don't feel terribly bad about skewing the CR on this particular combat, as I said I feel Tiarise justifies it. Also my players have been using hero points to hamstring opponents. This may serve as a good exercise in resource management for them.

Shadow Lodge Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8

Sinister DM joy moment:

So my players are in the temple of Asmodeus now. They've explored most of the first floor, and were getting really tired of the Devil's Bells effects hitting them every third encounter.
So rather than move up and explore the second floor, they decided to skip straight to the belfry. They bailed outside, flew/spider-climbed up to the belfry, and tried to magic their way in with passwall. Failed caster level check, zap! Stone shape, fail, zap! Finally they resort to bashing their way in with an adamantine axe.
They buff up, roll into the belfry, and have a nice six round long battle with the Asmoden and his herecites. They eke out a victory, only to find that they can't deactivate the bells until they cut the power from the infernal engines--engines they were literally about to find if only they'd gone up stairs! :D
Even better, they don't yet realize that the herecites and the Asmoden will regenerate.

So not only did their plan to skip ahead and cut out the bells fail utterly, the little bit of progress they think they made (killing the guardians) is entirely ephemeral.

It took all my willpower not to cackle madly at the end of the night.

Bonus points, they've burned a bunch of resources on the Asmoden fight, which means they might end up too weak to finish off the enemies in the nave today. However, if they rest tonight, Corinstian gets to make his first Mephisto Manifestation check tomorrow. I don't know what they're going to do if/when Pit Fiends start showing up :)


Regarding Strea Vestori, A Song of Silver states that she was captured and charmed by Natsiel, then moved with her to the shrine below the Silver Star. However, In Hell's Bright Shadow mentions that Strea was "identified as a potential threat, and agents of Thrune abducted her, confiscated her belongings, and turned her over to the Church of Asmodeus, where she was subjected to a feeblemind spell and imprisoned."

I assume that the writers simply had a change of plans for her between writing books 1 and 4 but I'm wondering what the story was behind the original "capture and feeblemind" idea. Any details? :)


Also, book 1 says you can uncover proof of the affair between Corinstian and Aluceda to undermine/delegitimize them; but no such option exists here.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
p-sto wrote:
Bumped her up to level 13 and threw in four Sisters of the Golden Erinyes that I statted out to protect her but it doesn't feel like it will make much of a difference given she needs at least three rounds to buff. Perhaps I should make use of the fact that the archetype that makes her useless in combat is actually pretty awesome out of it. Azatas aren't immune to mind affecting magic and a Raelis has 11 HD. 19 charisma isn't all that helpful in an opposed charisma check when the person who bound you has quickened Ill Omen.

I bumped Nyctessa and Zelhara (2 evil Iconics from the Hell's Vengeance AP) up to level 10. I play them as a Nidalese duo, who have been sent as additional reinforcements. Nyctessa asked to be stationed in a darker place, because of her light sensitivity, so Barzillai chose the records hall, as it is quite crucial to his propaganda. Waiting and sitting there, while watching people scribe all day long became very dull to Nyctessa and Zelhara, so they've decided to roam the streets during nighttime and enforce Barzillai's Proclamations. Those unlucky enough to get caught are brought back to the records hall, where Zelhara tortures and punishes them under the pretext to get information out. Later if the captive don't survive, Zelhara skins them and Nyctessa adds them to her undead army.

I haven't decided what kind of undead helper Nyctessa raises from the skeletons. I'm not in the mood to roll for a dozen skeletons, so I was thinking that she was maybe assembling something bigger or I'll build a troop of skeletons, based upon the troop template.

Note that I've considerably changed the evil Iconics, because the ones I used as written were just to weak...

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Brad Turner wrote:

Regarding Strea Vestori, A Song of Silver states that she was captured and charmed by Natsiel, then moved with her to the shrine below the Silver Star. However, In Hell's Bright Shadow mentions that Strea was "identified as a potential threat, and agents of Thrune abducted her, confiscated her belongings, and turned her over to the Church of Asmodeus, where she was subjected to a feeblemind spell and imprisoned."

I assume that the writers simply had a change of plans for her between writing books 1 and 4 but I'm wondering what the story was behind the original "capture and feeblemind" idea. Any details? :)

That was one of the interlinks I was planning on building into the AP that changed partway through. Obviously, Strea didn't get abducted and magicked up by the church, but by Natsiel. If you want to run with the original plot, that's fine—you can replace Strea in Song of Silver with any missing NPC that the PCs have heard about in the AP.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Axial wrote:
Also, book 1 says you can uncover proof of the affair between Corinstian and Aluceda to undermine/delegitimize them; but no such option exists here.

That option ended up being downplayed when it became apparent that there wasn't going to be any room in the 5th adventure to handle a more significant Nidal element. Feel free to add it back in if you want, but keep in mind I also chose to end up downplaying the Nidal stuff as well because it started to feel like it was going to be too distracting for players, and I wanted to keep the plot focused on Kintargo and its relationship with Chelaix.


James Jacobs wrote:


That was one of the interlinks I was planning on building into the AP that changed partway through. Obviously, Strea didn't get abducted and magicked up by the church, but by Natsiel. If you want to run with the original plot, that's fine—you can replace Strea in Song of Silver with any missing NPC that the PCs have heard about in the AP.

Well, that's a shame. I kind of prefer having Strea getting taken out by Thrune. Seeing as how they want to destabilize/oppress the Tiefling neighborhood.

James Jacobs wrote:


That option ended up being downplayed when it became apparent that there wasn't going to be any room in the 5th adventure to handle a more significant Nidal element. Feel free to add it back in if you want, but keep in mind I also chose to end up downplaying the Nidal stuff as well because it started to feel like it was going to be too distracting for players, and I wanted to keep the plot focused on Kintargo and its relationship with Chelaix.

Oh! What was Nidal's role going to be? Was there going to be some kind of Nidal plot arc?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Axial wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


That was one of the interlinks I was planning on building into the AP that changed partway through. Obviously, Strea didn't get abducted and magicked up by the church, but by Natsiel. If you want to run with the original plot, that's fine—you can replace Strea in Song of Silver with any missing NPC that the PCs have heard about in the AP.

Well, that's a shame. I kind of prefer having Strea getting taken out by Thrune. Seeing as how they want to destabilize/oppress the Tiefling neighborhood.

James Jacobs wrote:


That option ended up being downplayed when it became apparent that there wasn't going to be any room in the 5th adventure to handle a more significant Nidal element. Feel free to add it back in if you want, but keep in mind I also chose to end up downplaying the Nidal stuff as well because it started to feel like it was going to be too distracting for players, and I wanted to keep the plot focused on Kintargo and its relationship with Chelaix.

Oh! What was Nidal's role going to be? Was there going to be some kind of Nidal plot arc?

Nidal's role was going to be distracting, and as such it was cut from the AP. Maybe I'll talk about it in a few years when Hell's Rebels has had a bit longer to set into the minds of folks as it was intended. I don't really want to distract folks at this point from the plot.

So... ask me again in a year and maybe I'll talk then! ;-P


Maybe I just missed something but is there a reason why Asmoden/Andax Tasetas lost an arm in life?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

To torment him? Because evil is cruel? Maybe to symbolize the loss he suffered in losing his God, and also showing that this is in fact not a weakness, because returning his arm does not benefit the party?


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Typical Left handed prejudice. Probably because he wouldn't write right handed.


So how have people gone about dealing with the map for the Temple of Asmodeus? The squares are tiny so I may have miscounted but it seems to be about seven and a half feet across when scaled to one inch squares. Even parsing things out doesn't seem all that straight forward with the central chamber looking slightly more than fifty squares across.

I was considering spending the money to get it printed since it is quite lovely but once I started counting I realized just how big it actually is.

Shadow Lodge Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8

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I drew the whole g~%#*&n thing out, full size.

It's worked pretty well. It's bigger than our table, but the big central area fits on top, and it's easy enough to shift it sideways when they got into the side rooms.

Link

Silver Crusade

Benchak the Nightstalker wrote:

I drew the whole g&%@*#n thing out, full size.

It's worked pretty well. It's bigger than our table, but the big central area fits on top, and it's easy enough to shift it sideways when they got into the side rooms.

Link

Wow! Very impressive!

As another idea. I have a GM who will show us the smaller picture of the map as we go through an area, and then when a combat breaks out, he will just draw that room. Don't know how that would work here, with the big battleground in the middle and the potential for things to go on 2 floors, though.

(I thankfully run online, so I don't have to deal with those shenanigans.)


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p-sto wrote:

So how have people gone about dealing with the map for the Temple of Asmodeus? The squares are tiny so I may have miscounted but it seems to be about seven and a half feet across when scaled to one inch squares. Even parsing things out doesn't seem all that straight forward with the central chamber looking slightly more than fifty squares across.

I was considering spending the money to get it printed since it is quite lovely but once I started counting I realized just how big it actually is.

I think I'm going to draw only the smaller subsections and just describe the big middle part. Maybe I'll also draw the part where the ritual happens, but even reducing this huge temple into subsections, will still be tedious and a lot of work, so kudos to Benchak who drew that monstrosity in full scale.


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Now I want to see if I can draw it on my Chessex Megamat. :-)

Silver Crusade

While we're on the topic of the Temple of Asmodeus, I'm a little confused about how the whole thing plays out. I feel like as it is set up, so long as the PCs don't interrupt the ritual, they can do all of the other rooms, up to and including finding Barzillai in his room. But it also says that they are unlikely to find him there, because they will trigger him sooner. So I'm trying to figure out where the happy medium is here. Assuming they don't interrupt the ritual, at what point will they trigger attacks anyway?


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Eliandra Giltessan wrote:
While we're on the topic of the Temple of Asmodeus, I'm a little confused about how the whole thing plays out. I feel like as it is set up, so long as the PCs don't interrupt the ritual, they can do all of the other rooms, up to and including finding Barzillai in his room. But it also says that they are unlikely to find him there, because they will trigger him sooner. So I'm trying to figure out where the happy medium is here. Assuming they don't interrupt the ritual, at what point will they trigger attacks anyway?

I haven't even thought about that... In the past I would have guessed that my group would charge straight in, but they have been very sneaky during this campaign.

I would guess Barzillai should around one of the major NPCs, so you could make a table and roll it out, but I think the most likely scenario would for Barzillai to check out the ritual regularly. I don't know if that would mess up the CR of that encounter to much.

Shadow Lodge Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8

Barzillai is one of the folks who is mentioned as showing up (along with Aluceda) if the PCs fight the Erinyes in area E33-Special Collections. That's where I had him fight my players (mostly because I wanted some mooks to back him up).


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Benchak the Nightstalker wrote:
Barzillai is one of the folks who is mentioned as showing up (along with Aluceda) if the PCs fight the Erinyes in area E33-Special Collections. That's where I had him fight my players (mostly because I wanted some mooks to back him up).

What is area E33? I don't have the books on me at the moment. Also isn't Aluceda supposed the be in the artifical darkness?

But yeah, I totally agree with you that Barzillai needs some reinforcements with him, else the fight will be very boring, he can't stand on his own.

Silver Crusade

Considering that my players are convinced that the erinyes was the real boss of the Ruby Massacre (They really do need better ways of dealing with flying enemies), pairing Thrune up with some of them is not the worst idea ever.


captain yesterday wrote:
Now I want to see if I can draw it on my Chessex Megamat. :-)

For the really big maps I pick up a few A1 sized 1 inch grid flipcharts and tape a few pages together.

Most of the Pathfinder maps will fit on an A1 1-inch flipchart grid, these days I prefer to draw mine out ahead of time rather than have to draw and erase on the Chessex mats.

Shadow Lodge Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8

Gratz wrote:
Benchak the Nightstalker wrote:
Barzillai is one of the folks who is mentioned as showing up (along with Aluceda) if the PCs fight the Erinyes in area E33-Special Collections. That's where I had him fight my players (mostly because I wanted some mooks to back him up).

What is area E33? I don't have the books on me at the moment. Also isn't Aluceda supposed the be in the artifical darkness?

But yeah, I totally agree with you that Barzillai needs some reinforcements with him, else the fight will be very boring, he can't stand on his own.

The library on the second floor, with the circular book cases. There are 4 erinyes in there, who have status cast on them by Corinstian. Once the PCs damage one of them, it alerts the nave, and the book says that Aliceda and/or Barzillai come to investigate 2d4+2 rounds later.

Shadow Lodge Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8

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PJH wrote:
captain yesterday wrote:
Now I want to see if I can draw it on my Chessex Megamat. :-)

For the really big maps I pick up a few A1 sized 1 inch grid flipcharts and tape a few pages together.

Most of the Pathfinder maps will fit on an A1 1-inch flipchart grid, these days I prefer to draw mine out ahead of time rather than have to draw and erase on the Chessex mats.

This is basically what I do. I got a 27x30, 50 sheet pad off amazon (~26 bucks) and its lasted me from the end of book 2 to almost the end of the AP.

Way cheaper than gaming paper, and it doesn't have that clay coating that gunks up my sharpies.


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Benchak the Nightstalker wrote:
PJH wrote:
captain yesterday wrote:
Now I want to see if I can draw it on my Chessex Megamat. :-)

For the really big maps I pick up a few A1 sized 1 inch grid flipcharts and tape a few pages together.

Most of the Pathfinder maps will fit on an A1 1-inch flipchart grid, these days I prefer to draw mine out ahead of time rather than have to draw and erase on the Chessex mats.

This is basically what I do. I got a 27x30, 50 sheet pad off amazon (~26 bucks) and its lasted me from the end of book 2 to almost the end of the AP.

Way cheaper than gaming paper, and it doesn't have that clay coating that gunks up my sharpies.

I also found a few places online that sell very cheap 2D pdf drawings of furniture and other dungeon accessories in 25mm size. I print those out on adhesive label paper, stick it onto a sheet of 5mm foam and cut them out.

That gives me a bunch of reusable furniture counters that I can throw down on the map for chests, tables, chairs, bookcases and suchlike. It's very handy.


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That's all well and good, but I have two kids in a two bedroom house and got the mat for Christmas.

So, if it's all the same I'd rather use what I have on hand. :-)


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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

So I've ran the temple and I felt like my players weren't properly challenged. They entered through the balcony and at that time Barzillai was in the Library, so they ran into him very early and here is where things went south. Barzillai nearly instantly died to a Flesh to stone, on which I rolled a 1.

The PCs still had to fight the Erinyes, which triggered the status-effect, so Grivenner send up some help. Three rounds after defeating the Erinyes, the PCs had to fight the Vampires, some Acolytes and the Gardener, which was probably the most challenging fight they had.

After defeating them, they still had the Talisman of Pure Good, so our Warpriester of Desna threw it at Grivenner, which ended him and the ritual. For my own curiosity, I rolled a Reflex, which I failed (not surprising though, Grivenner has a Reflex of +2). So with very few major players left in the building, I decided that most Acolytes would flee the temple (mostly to speed things up, as I was frustrated that I failed all my saving throws).

They discovered Asmodens hand and the Desna Warpriest put on the ring, so I had at least that advantage going for me. Asmoden and his minions were doing quite well, until the moment our halfling Oracle figured out, that he could provoke Asmoden by waving his missing arm around. After that happened, Asmoden reacted as written in the Tactics session and the fight ended soon after, with my group being victorious and freeing Kintargo from Barzillai.

Our campaign will interlude here for a while, because we will be running HV from now on. If my players want to come back to Kintargo, to defend it from Cheliax, after Thrune can turn their eyes away from the much bigger rebellion, I will certainly enjoy the rest.

I think to this point HR has been fantastically written and a total joy to run, but I think HR has a major weakness, which are the rebellion rules. I've only run the suggested trimmed down version of it, because I didn't to play "optimise this excel spreadsheet", but we still felt the massive bonuses the PCs got from the rebellion. I don't think the developers accounted for all the bonuses the PCs would get, so my advice to anyone wanting to run the latter parts of HR: Ramp up your encounters or ignore the Rebellion rules.

Dark Archive

Gratz wrote:
I think to this point HR has been fantastically written and a total joy to run, but I think HR has a major weakness, which are the rebellion rules. I've only run the suggested trimmed down version of it, because I didn't to play "optimise this excel spreadsheet", but we still felt the massive bonuses the PCs got from the rebellion. I don't think the developers accounted for all the bonuses the PCs would get, so my advice to anyone wanting to run the latter parts of HR: Ramp up your encounters or ignore the Rebellion rules.

I have yet to start HR - not quite halfway through Shattered Star and want to make sure I spend a lot of prep time on HR to give it all the attention it deserves and really make it come alive for my players. My initial thoughts on the Rebellion have the same concerns that Gratz is voicing - it seems with all possible bonuses that the checks might become irrelevant. I know there are some limitations to number of teams and with some of the events where NPCs might be captured their bonuses go away until they are recovered. Still a lot of the static DCs of Organization checks mean they will become easier as the campaign progresses which seems a little counterintuitive. Seems like as things progress and the Silver Ravens become more of a threat, things should get more difficult. I'm thinking of maybe tying Notoriety score to DCs somehow or maybe allowing certain NPCs to apply their ability bonuses to checks the same way PCs in leadership roles add their ability scores.

Scarab Sages

So, here's what happened in my game, and I don't know what to do to fix it:

So, players burst into the temple in part three, and, players being players, just start shooting up the place. Yes, I made sure to tell them that they enemies hadn't seen them, but they are all so stupidly overpowered that they were just like "Let's do this!"

So they fought and fought and fought . . . for 4 hours, (real time) and killed the high priest, his Vampire lover, the bone devils, the priests, captured the gardener (and are working on converting her to LN), the harrow-caster, it was a giant cluster. (By the time the Skinsaw cultists would have come in, the high priest was dead and so they left.) Thrune came in during a particularly bad spot for the PCs so cast a couple dispel magics from the balcony, and then left after the cleric went down (luckily, later the PCs turned it around.)

The PCs had JUST enough resources to go and kill the blood golems and the dog thing so that they could stake the vampire, and they went home to rest because they were out of EVERYTHING.

So, what do I do now? Does Thrune just sit back in his balcony apartment and wait for the PCs to show up? Seems kind of anti-clamactic.

Silver Crusade

Well, I don't see Thrune leaving town, because he needs to stay near the soul anchor, and he doesn't have anywhere else to retreat. My guess is that he'd try to get whatever reinforcements he could, perhaps at least contacting Hell and getting some devils sent up.

Shadow Lodge

Eliandra Giltessan wrote:
Well, I don't see Thrune leaving town, because he needs to stay near the soul anchor, and he doesn't have anywhere else to retreat.

His tactics say otherwise:

Quote:
Morale If reduced to fewer than 50 hit points, Barzillai uses his ring of spell storing to teleport to an unoccupied family estate in Egorian, where he has stashed enough supplies to recover from his wounds. It takes him a few days to arrange for a second teleport spell to be placed in his ring, after which he returns to Kintargo with allies in disguise, hoping to get revenge on the PCs. See Concluding the Adventure on page 61 for more information. Barzillai is incredibly hard to kill (see his Heartless special ability below), but if he's stunned as a result of hit point loss, his allies try to take his body away to safety until he can be restored.

Being out of the action for a few days doesn't seem like the kind of thing VampByDay wants for Barzillai, though. If the PCs have retreated back to the Lucky Bones, he might consider running a revamped "Defending the Hideout" encounter, with a summoned devil (or even a simulacrum of Barzillai, to keep him present) in place of Tombus and an inquisitor troop in place of the dottari troop.

Shadow Lodge Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8

Did the PCs snag the Resurrection scroll from upstairs, or otherwise prevent the High Priest from coming back? Because if they hadn't, I'd have Barzillai rez Corinstian and continue the ritual.

Alternatively, if all/most of his forces in the temple are wiped out, have Barzillai bail, seem to leave town, and attack the PCs during the ceremony on the Silver Span.

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Benchak the Nightstalker wrote:

Did the PCs snag the Resurrection scroll from upstairs, or otherwise prevent the High Priest from coming back? Because if they hadn't, I'd have Barzillai rez Corinstian and continue the ritual.

Alternatively, if all/most of his forces in the temple are wiped out, have Barzillai bail, seem to leave town, and attack the PCs during the ceremony on the Silver Span.

Having him abandon the city and then come back during the ceremony with reinforcements is the best option at this point.

Dark Archive

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So am I missing something or does the book not say what the maximum Authority Points is? I see the starting amount, and then under Controlling Districts it says the "maximum possible Authority Points drops by 10".

Shadow Lodge Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8

I assumed his maximum is the 100 points he starts with.

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Benchak the Nightstalker wrote:
I assumed his maximum is the 100 points he starts with.

Yup!

Dark Archive

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James Jacobs wrote:
Benchak the Nightstalker wrote:
I assumed his maximum is the 100 points he starts with.
Yup!

Thanks to both of you!


Hi there, I've been DMing this with a group of Melee characters for the most part, and upon finding the Plane Shift traps I wanted to ask two questions before my players can even get to the point of touching them (as I know at least 1 character will trigger the trap if they figure out what it does, just to prove that he's strong will'd enough to survive it, and another will probably activate one on accident).

1. What happens to souls that die in hell? I remember hearing a while back that if you died on the negative energy plane, you become an undead. Does anything weird happen if you were to die when you went to hell.

2. Is there any other way outside of plot and True Resurrection to resurrect someone without the body?

They've been good about stealing their enemies health stock before they can get to them, and haven't had the need to use any of the resurrections that I've handed them so far, so Plane Shifting them to Hell (and their death as they will have no way to return from that) seems like a real cop out. Though they've gotten through everything up till the masquerade relatively easily so I don't want to just remove the trap.

Shadow Lodge Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8

To my knowledge, nothing untoward happens to you if you die in Hell. However, I'm inclined to think that a PC banished to hell is more likely going to be captured and tortured than killed outright. Fate worse than death, that sort of thing.

Nor can I think of any way to rez someone without a body aside from True Rez, Wish, and the like. I suppose maybe Clone? But that's similarly high level and requires some set up.

Options:
The PCs briefly travel to Hell at the beginning of the next book. You could add in a short side trek to rescue their fallen comrade. That sidelines that character for a big chunk of the fourth book though.
For a more immediate solution, maybe the PCs can make a deal with the contract devil Nezramerrian in room E6. He's stuck serving Thrune as a punishment, so he might be willing to double cross his masters for the right price. You can use the infernal contract rules in book five to write a custom "return our friend from Hell" contract (and slip in some fun hidden clauses!).

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I want to check into something here.

A Song of Silver wrote:


Heartless (Su) Barzillai’s heart is ensconced deep under Kintargo in the soul anchor. In its place he has stashed a magical puzzle box known as a Chelish Crux. See Concluding the Adventure for more information on this puzzle box and its contents. Barzillai’s heartless condition renders him immune to bleed damage and grants him a +4 bonus on all saving throws versus death effects. It also grants him the benefits of the advanced creature simple template. If reduced to negative hit points, Barzillai becomes staggered but doesn’t fall unconscious. If his hit-point total drops to a negative amount of hit points that equals or exceeds his Constitution score (–24 hp at his current Constitution score), he doesn’t die—he merely becomes stunned. This stunned condition can’t be removed by any effect as long as he remains at –24 hp or fewer, but is removed immediately if he is healed above this total. A destruction or disintegrate spell (or another effect that completely destroys the body) or a death effect can kill him if the damage caused by the attack reduces him to –24 hp or fewer. Effects like flesh to
stone, imprisonment, or trap the soul that normally bypass damage
reduction instead invoke a clause in his with Mephistopheles—rather than suffering the normal effect from the spell or item, he is struck dead on the spot. (In the case of the talisman of pure good from area E31, a spike of iron impales Barzillai before retracting into the pit created while leaving his gear, and more importantly, his Chelish Crux, behind in a smoking heap—this foreshadows his torment in the infernal realm of Caina in the final adventure.) Finally, reducing him to –191 hp via any damage source results in the utter destruction of his body and kills him. If Barzillai has fast healing active as a result of his judgment of healing, the fast healing effect continues to heal damage until he is actually killed. This healing can potentially restore him to full mobility if it brings him above –24 hp. This ability, plus his PC-equivalent wealth, increases his CR by 2.

TL;DR: Barzillai can't fall unconscious because of falling below 0 hit points, and instead becomes staggered. If someone does a crap ton of non-lethal to him (say, by a sap master rogue), that would suggest that he doesn't fall unconscious when his non-lethal is higher than his hit points, and just goes staggered earlier, right?

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Misroi wrote:

I want to check into something here.

A Song of Silver wrote:


Heartless (Su) Barzillai’s heart is ensconced deep under Kintargo in the soul anchor. In its place he has stashed a magical puzzle box known as a Chelish Crux. See Concluding the Adventure for more information on this puzzle box and its contents. Barzillai’s heartless condition renders him immune to bleed damage and grants him a +4 bonus on all saving throws versus death effects. It also grants him the benefits of the advanced creature simple template. If reduced to negative hit points, Barzillai becomes staggered but doesn’t fall unconscious. If his hit-point total drops to a negative amount of hit points that equals or exceeds his Constitution score (–24 hp at his current Constitution score), he doesn’t die—he merely becomes stunned. This stunned condition can’t be removed by any effect as long as he remains at –24 hp or fewer, but is removed immediately if he is healed above this total. A destruction or disintegrate spell (or another effect that completely destroys the body) or a death effect can kill him if the damage caused by the attack reduces him to –24 hp or fewer. Effects like flesh to
stone, imprisonment, or trap the soul that normally bypass damage
reduction instead invoke a clause in his with Mephistopheles—rather than suffering the normal effect from the spell or item, he is struck dead on the spot. (In the case of the talisman of pure good from area E31, a spike of iron impales Barzillai before retracting into the pit created while leaving his gear, and more importantly, his Chelish Crux, behind in a smoking heap—this foreshadows his torment in the infernal realm of Caina in the final adventure.) Finally, reducing him to –191 hp via any damage source results in the utter destruction of his body and kills him. If Barzillai has fast healing active as a result of his judgment of healing, the fast healing effect continues to heal damage until he is actually killed. This healing can potentially restore him to full
...

Correct.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Thanks, James! I originally wasn't sure how it worked at all, but typing up the question helped solidify what was going on with the mechanic. Glad to see I eventually figured it out.

By the way, one of my PCs is a Shensen fan, so she's heartbroken that she almost assuredly died during the collapse of her music shop. I plan on letting slip that the skeletons found there are almost assuredly not half-elven, so there's a chance she's alive...


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Misroi wrote:

Thanks, James! I originally wasn't sure how it worked at all, but typing up the question helped solidify what was going on with the mechanic. Glad to see I eventually figured it out.

By the way, one of my PCs is a Shensen fan, so she's heartbroken that she almost assuredly died during the collapse of her music shop. I plan on letting slip that the skeletons found there are almost assuredly not half-elven, so there's a chance she's alive...

YAY! Fans!

Silver Crusade

1 person marked this as a favorite.

In updated news of "My players apparently fall for everything" (Seriously, my Mummy's Mask team has a Pairaka div who they think is a waylaid traveler setting up camp for them in the Parched Dunes). They went to see the mercane in the Temple of Asmodeus, and he offered to sell them things. My players were like, "Well, mercanes are usually lawful neutral, so this guy's probably okay." (I swear, I said "usually.") One player who decided to buy something got an actual ioun stone out of the deal. The other guy got a stone of weight. Fortunately for him, the oracle had remove curse as a known spell, and I let him make an intimidate check for a reroll.

But <3 my players.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Eliandra Giltessan wrote:

In updated news of "My players apparently fall for everything" (Seriously, my Mummy's Mask team has a Pairaka div who they think is a waylaid traveler setting up camp for them in the Parched Dunes). They went to see the mercane in the Temple of Asmodeus, and he offered to sell them things. My players were like, "Well, mercanes are usually lawful neutral, so this guy's probably okay." (I swear, I said "usually.") One player who decided to buy something got an actual ioun stone out of the deal. The other guy got a stone of weight. Fortunately for him, the oracle had remove curse as a known spell, and I let him make an intimidate check for a reroll.

But <3 my players.

Lol, tell them to max sense motive.


Hey, how about having the Queen's Hands from the Rival Guide show up in this adventure to attack the PCs? They're just the right level for this volume and they're an elite group of Thrune agents; just the right people for Barzillai to hire if he's desperate to get rid of his Silver Raven problem.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

"District Control: Jarvis End" (pg. 16):

"In addition, control of Jarvis End reverts to the Silver Ravens as soon as they assign an NPC ally and team to patrol the district".

Teams aren't mentioned for the other districts. Is it necessary to assign a team here?

Regarding a dottari troop's volley (pg. 122):

"This attack takes the form of up to four lines with a range of 100 feet. These lines can start from the corner of any square in the troop’s space. All creatures in one of these lines take 4d6 points of piercing damage."

Do all four lines start from the same corner?

Can the troop choose to leave out leading or trailing squares, say if it wished to not harm its allies, or must all 20 squares be hit?

If the advanced template were applied to an inquisitor troop, how would its fast healing be affected?

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Re: Inquisitor troop fast healing

Since the fast healing is based on some of the inquisitors casting cure light wounds every round, and since that spell is level based, it wouldn't increase the amount healed. It might warrant an increase in how many rounds it could be active, but I seriously doubt that most inquisitor troops will exhaust all ten rounds of fast healing in a day, so it's probably not worth examining too closely.

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