Power Attack earlier plox, otherwise how do you Cornugon Smash?
If you get Shaman's Apprentice, you probably want to pick up Diehard while you are at it.
Raging Vitality > Combat Reflexes.
You probably want Blooded Arcane Strike and Riving Strike somewhere.
Steadfast Personality stacks with Iron Will to improve important Will saves.
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You can't meet the Cornugon Smash requirements until after level 6.
Why Endurance? If you need a feat, Improved Initiative or Toughness are better (and are on a lot of bloodline feat lists.)
Power Attack should be moved up to level one. It is the best feat.
Crossblooded is going to kill your Will save. Be sure to pick up Superstition or similar to offset.
What bloodlines? (Destined/Arcane?, Abyssal/Arcane?, Undead/Abyssal?)
Per the Familiar Folio you can trade in your first bloodline power for a bloodline familiar (+4 initiative and other good stuff.) If you aren't going for a natural weapon build or Frightful Charger build it may be worth considering.
Endurance is a free feat from Shaman's Apprentice.
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I do not recommend Crossblooded Arcane Is just fine by itself.
Here is my Bloodrager I just posted for someone else.
Half-Orc Primalist Spell-eater Bloodrager
Alternate Racial Traits: Sacred Tattoo and Shaman's Apprentice
20 point buy: Str: 16, Dex: 14, Con: 15, Int: 8, Wis: 12, Cha: 13
Trait 1: Fate's Favored- Paired with Sacred Tattoo you get +2 Luck bonus on all 3 saves...this is better than taking 3 feats.
Trait 2: Dangerously Curious (cause UMD is a Nice skill to Have...scrolls are cheap)
Trait 3: Optimistic Gambler (this is NOT PFS legal cause it is a campaign trait from second darkness. but if you play in a home game where they don't care about where the trait comes from and allows 3 traits and 1 draw back This is the trait to pick up.) This trait comes from the second darkness campaign and is THE BEST trait for a Bloodrager or Barbarian that is not rage cycling like the build below. Gives 1-4 extra rage rounds after you choose to end your rage every time. Basically its better than taking Extra rage feat 2+ times.
Build By Level:
1 HD: Feats- Endurance(from Shaman's Apprentice Trait) and Die Hard, fast movement, bloodrage, Disruptive Bloodrage (Su)
2 HD: Blood of Life(Su) Notice the SU in that ability. This fast healing IS magical and not a EX ability like a majority of Fast Healing
3 HD: Feat-Fast Healer, Blood sanctuary
(because of Blood of Life (Su) your fast healing IS magical...makes Fast Healer actually work for you to increase your amount of Fast healing by 1+ Half CON modifier= 3 currently)
4 HD: Eschew materials, Blood casting, Arcane Bloodrage (Sp)
5 HD: Feat-Raging Vitality, Spell Eating (Su)
(another source of Magical healing in spell eating and Raging Vitality makes your CON effectively 2 points higher and you don't end rage while unconscious so you can fast heal while down to stabilize and get back up)
6 HD: Bloodline Feat- Power Attack
7 HD: Feat- Arcane Strike, Fast Healing/ Increase
8 HD: Greater Arcane Bloodrage (Sp)
(Doesn't every melee frontliner want Displacement to add layered defense to your AC...amazing ability to have as a free action)
9 HD: Feat- Sunder , Bloodline Feat- Iron Will
10 HD: Fast Healing/ Increase
11 HD: Feat-Bloodied Arcane Strike, Greater bloodrage (Need to take bloodied Arcane strike to free up your swift actions for Raging Brutality and Jingasa of the Fortunate Soldier.)
12 HD: Bloodline Feat- Disruptive, Primal Choices: Superstitious & Witch Hunter
(you're giving up Caster's Scourge (Ex) for 2 rage powers. You should already be a caster's worst nightmare with Disruptive Bloodrage (Su), Disruptive feat, and spellbreaker feat. Now add in more damage you're doing to casters and increasing your saves seems more important to me)
13 HD: Feat- Raging Brutality, Fast Healing/ Increase
14 HD: Indomitable will
15 HD: Feat- Eldritch Heritage- Orc ,Bloodline Feat- Spellbreaker
16 HD: Fast Healing/ Increase, Trade out True Arcane Bloodrage (Sp) for Eater of Magic and Spell Sunder
17 HD: Tireless Bloodrage (Su), Feat- Improved Eldritch Heritage (Strength of the Beast (Ex) from Orc bloodline...+4 Str now and +2 more at level 19....this is a +6 str INHERENT boost. Means it STACKS with whatever Enhancement bonuses you may have acquired)
The gear I recommend:
Headband of Cha +2 or GREATER (You don't need to +1 Cha if you go this route to cast your highest level spells)
Jingasa of the Fortunate soldier- This gets you +2 luck AC and 1/day critical negation for 5k...this really is a bargain Item.
Spell Storing and Furious Adamantine Weapon (preferably reach)
Spell Storing Armor (W/armor spikes if you took a reach weapon)
Spell Storing allows you to cast more spells a day by loading them in your down time. They also are a way to free up action economy and using Vampiric touch or a debilitating Touch attack can make you even better front line tank.
You can also drop arcane strike and Bloodied arcane strike for other feat choices and move them around abit. But the jist of it is I have:
Fast healing, Other sources of healing, UMD, Choice of Resist energy, Haste, or 20%->50% miss chance (I go Displacement all the time), Great Saves, and full CL on self buffs.
You can also switch Sunder and Eldritch Heritage around if you prefer the Touch of Rage over Sundering earlier.
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That guy, here is something I've cooked up
half-orc w/ the alt racial shaman apprentice and sacred tattoo
bloodrager (spelleater/primalsit)
stats on 20pt buy
Str: 18 (16+2)
Dex: 10
Con: 15
Int: 07
Wis: 12
Cha: 14
Feats:
1- endurance, diehard
3- blood of life
5- raging Vitality
6- (bonus feat) power attack
7- arcane strike
9- bloodied arcane strike
11- open
13- open
Now, for your bloodline/ rage powers-
this is up to you but you will be throwing at least 2 away for 4 rage powers.
Arcane- provides more defenses and good bonus feats (Iron will, combat reflexes, power attack,
Draconic- easy powers to give away, and keep, wings for when you are in rage, not as good bonus feats as Arcane
Abyssal- my least favorite, gain a free enlarge person per rage, increased strength bonus, and claws
Celestial- really good for evil heavy campaigns, decent to good otherwise.
Anyway, you want these rage powers IMO-
Increased DR x2 (for extra regen)
superstitious
witch hunter.
the other powers you could go for if you so desired are CAGM/Reckless abandon
at level 10, lets assume 16 con, +4 from enhancement, you have DR/4 which translates into fast healing 5, +3 from con, so you are fast healing 8hp every round. now, I am unsure of this, but if fast healing works with rage modified con you are getting 26 con, so 8, so 9 fast healing a turn, at level 12. for no action cost. Plus you can sacrifice a spell to cast CLW-CCW on yourself.
this is nasty without worrying about UMD or wands/scrolls. If Arcane this gets even nastier, with 50% miss chance for enemies.
you have great damage, and saves, the only save falling behind is reflex, which tbh you won't care too much about.
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The ability blood of life only works while raging. Thus it takes your raging con modifier. It is why I take raging vitality because it bumps con while raging +2. It also keeps you raging when you go down. It provides an auto stabilize because your healed on your turn.
In your build rorek55 did you mean fast healer instead of blood of life?
Here is my Bloodrager I just posted for someone else.
build:Carl Jr.:Half-Orc Primalist Spell-eater Bloodrager
Alternate Racial Traits: Sacred Tattoo and Shaman's Apprentice
20 point buy: Str: 16, Dex: 14, Con: 15, Int: 8, Wis: 12, Cha: 13
Trait 1: Fate's Favored- Paired with Sacred Tattoo you get +2 Luck bonus on all 3 saves...this is better than taking 3 feats.
Trait 2: Dangerously Curious (cause UMD is a Nice skill to Have...scrolls are cheap)
Trait 3: Optimistic Gambler (this is NOT PFS legal cause it is a campaign trait from second darkness. but if you play in a home game where they don't care about where the trait comes from and allows 3 traits and 1 draw back This is the trait to pick up.) This trait comes from the second darkness campaign and is THE BEST trait for a Bloodrager or Barbarian that is not rage cycling like the build below. Gives 1-4 extra rage rounds after you choose to end your rage every time. Basically its better than taking Extra rage feat 2+ times.
Build By Level:1 HD: Feats- Endurance(from Shaman's Apprentice Trait) and Die Hard, fast movement, bloodrage, Disruptive Bloodrage (Su)
2 HD: Blood of Life(Su) Notice the SU in that ability. This fast healing IS magical and not a EX ability like a majority of Fast Healing
3 HD: Feat-Fast Healer, Blood sanctuary
(because of Blood of Life (Su) your fast healing IS magical...makes Fast Healer actually work for you to increase your amount of Fast healing by 1+ Half CON modifier= 3 currently)4 HD: Eschew materials, Blood casting, Arcane Bloodrage (Sp)
5 HD: Feat-Raging Vitality, Spell Eating (Su)
(another source of Magical healing in spell eating and Raging Vitality makes your CON effectively 2 points higher and you don't end rage while unconscious so you can fast heal while down to stabilize and get back up)6 HD: Bloodline Feat- Power Attack
7 HD: Feat- Arcane Strike, Fast Healing/ Increase
8 HD: Greater Arcane Bloodrage (Sp)
(Doesn't every melee frontliner want Displacement to add layered defense to your AC...amazing ability to have as a free action)9 HD: Feat- Sunder , Bloodline Feat- Iron Will
10 HD: Fast Healing/ Increase
11 HD: Feat-Bloodied Arcane Strike, Greater bloodrage (Need to take bloodied Arcane strike to free up your swift actions for Raging Brutality and Jingasa of the Fortunate Soldier.)
12 HD: Bloodline Feat- Disruptive, Primal Choices: Superstitious & Witch Hunter
(you're giving up Caster's Scourge (Ex) for 2 rage powers. You should already be a caster's worst nightmare with Disruptive Bloodrage (Su), Disruptive feat, and spellbreaker feat. Now add in more damage you're doing to casters and increasing your saves seems more important to me)13 HD: Feat- Raging Brutality, Fast Healing/ Increase
14 HD: Indomitable will
15 HD: Feat- Eldritch Heritage- Orc ,Bloodline Feat- Spellbreaker
16 HD: Fast Healing/ Increase, Trade out True Arcane Bloodrage (Sp) for Eater of Magic and Spell Sunder
17 HD: Tireless Bloodrage (Su), Feat- Improved Eldritch Heritage (Strength of the Beast (Ex) from Orc bloodline...+4 Str now and +2 more at level 19....this is a +6 str INHERENT boost. Means it STACKS with whatever Enhancement bonuses you may have acquired)
The gear I recommend:
Headband of Cha +2 or GREATER (You don't need to +1 Cha if you go this route to cast your highest level spells)
Jingasa of the Fortunate soldier- This gets you +2 luck AC and 1/day critical negation for 5k...this really is a bargain Item.
Spell Storing and Furious Adamantine Weapon (preferably reach)
Spell Storing Armor (W/armor spikes if you took a reach weapon)
Spell Storing allows you to cast more spells a day by loading them in your down time. They also are a way to free up action economy and using Vampiric touch or a debilitating Touch attack can make you even better front line tank.You can also drop arcane strike and Bloodied arcane strike for other feat choices and move them around abit. But the jist of it is I have:
Fast healing, Other sources of healing, UMD, Choice of Resist energy, Haste, or 20%->50% miss chance (I go Displacement all the time), Great Saves, and full CL on self buffs.You can also switch Sunder and Eldritch Heritage around if you prefer the Touch of Rage over Sundering earlier.
That guy, here is something I've cooked up
build:half-orc w/ the alt racial shaman apprentice and sacred tattoo
bloodrager (spelleater/primalsit)stats on 20pt buy
Str: 18 (16+2)
Dex: 10
Con: 15
Int: 07
Wis: 12
Cha: 14Feats:
1- endurance, diehard
3- blood of life
5- raging Vitality
6- (bonus feat) power attack
7- arcane strike
9- bloodied arcane strike
11- open
13- openNow, for your bloodline/ rage powers-
this is up to you but you will be throwing at least 2 away for 4 rage powers.
Arcane- provides more defenses and good bonus feats (Iron will, combat reflexes, power attack,
Draconic- easy powers to give away, and keep, wings for when you are in rage, not as good bonus feats as Arcane
Abyssal- my least favorite, gain a free enlarge person per rage, increased strength bonus, and claws
Celestial- really good for evil heavy campaigns, decent to good otherwise.Anyway, you want these rage powers IMO-
Increased DR x2 (for extra regen)
superstitious
witch hunter.the other powers you could go for if you so desired are CAGM/Reckless abandon
at level 10, lets assume 16 con, +4 from enhancement, you have DR/4 which translates into fast healing 5, +3 from con, so you are fast healing 8hp every round. now, I am unsure of this, but if fast healing works with rage modified con you are getting 26 con, so 8, so 9 fast healing a turn, at level 12. for no action cost. Plus you can sacrifice a spell to cast CLW-CCW on yourself.
this is nasty without worrying about UMD or wands/scrolls. If Arcane this gets even nastier, with 50% miss chance for enemies.
you have great damage, and saves, the only save falling behind is reflex, which tbh you won't care too much about.
Are you guys sure it works that way?
I am asking because I recently built a character with a very similar concept (black blood primalist/spelleater) but I have been told that the Fast Healer + Blood of Life combo is not supposed to work and "cheesy". Even on these forums there is no consensus, as some argue that the fast healing provided by Blood of Life is extraordinary and not supernatural: Blood of Life (Su) gives Fast Healing (Ex).For example, see here, here and here.
Also, as far as I know Blood of Life does not say you translate your DR into fast healing. Some think it does because the text is convoluted, but as written you get a DR 0/- to which you can add more DR from stuff like the Improved Damage Reduction rage power. Fast Healing remains a separate thing.
That said, if you can point me to sources that clarify your interpretation, I will be happy to use them to defend my build as well :)
Concerning primalist/spelleater builds, a less powerful but interesting combo that seems to work without issues is Spell Eating + Lesser Celestial Totem. A few times per day, you get a healing swift action that scales with your level. To compensate the loss of spell slots, you can use a bunch of 1st level runestones of power.
Also, a Courageous weapon is a very nice item for anyone using morale bonuses.
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Idk where people get that the DR you gain later stacks up. I've never thought this.
But as far as Fast healing being su verse ex. Both bloodrage and blood of life are su abilities. It gives you fast healing while under a SU ability. This makes it magical.
Sure people quote universal monster rules for creatures with fast healing naturally. Yes that is EX.
But just like receiving a charge of infernal healing when it comes from a magical source it is magical source.
Until paizo clears that up with a FAQ I will continue to examine the source of where it came from. Blood of life would say you gain fast healing (ex) if it where to be non-magical. But in this case your taking a purely magical class that is granting SU abilities. Blood of life would have been labeled EX.
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A spelleater's blood empowers him to slowly recover from his wounds. At 2nd level, while bloodraging a spelleater gains fast healing 1. At 7th level and every 3 levels thereafter, this increases by 1 (to a maximum of fast healing 6 at 19th level). If the spelleater gains an increase to damage reduction from a bloodline, feat, or other ability, he is considered to have an effective damage reduction of 0, and the increase is instead added to this effective damage reduction.
- blood of life text.
Bolded for emphasis
Blood of life is an su, unless stated otherwise, the fast healing is SU, ergo it works, specifc>general. Just because -most- general fast healing is ex, blood of life, as is, makes it Su.
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The way I understood that was to be If I have fast healing 5 and I gain DR/5 (defending bone) you just get the Fast Healing 5. Until the DR exceeds the fast healing in which case it takes the highest of the two. I didn't and haven't thought that it stacked up. I just took it as you can not get damage reduction ever.
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That's one way to look at it I suppose, but I feel the other is a valid way as well. As always, I believe a little poor wording causes a confusion, the increase here could mean, the flat out DR increase, or the increase above the fast healing. After showing it to a few people, they agreed, and at the same time thought it was a bit strong.
But I read it as the flat increase as of now. because -
the bloodrager gains 1 additional fast healing when he would normally gain DR/- This leads me to believe any stacking DR adds to the total amount healed.
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It is a strong archetype. Hell you can use every spell to eat and buy scrolls seeing how cheap 4th level spells and under are to get scrolls of. That alone makes it a really good archetype. A bit strong...IDK if we are still talking about a melee character. He still doesn't have planer shaping spells or the ability to stop time. Its a good survival mechanic for the front lines. Something different than DR, AC, or massive Health.
The blood ragers's fast healing is equal to the fast healing he gains from his class. He also has DR/- 0. So the rage power, Increased DR would increase that DR to DR/- 1. If you get DR from another source that source works as it's own DR, as normal. It only matters if something says this can Increase a classes DR it counts as having DR. You can't increase it's fast healing by trying to increase DR.
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The blood ragers's fast healing is equal to the fast healing he gains from his class. He also has DR/- 0. So the rage power, Increased DR would increase that DR to DR/- 1. If you get DR from another source that source works as it's own DR, as normal. It only matters if something says this can Increase a classes DR it counts as having DR. You can't increase it's fast healing by trying to increase DR.
so you're saying I can give him DR on top of what he loses... to not only have DR/- but fast healing??
Honestly, I prefer this.
I'll show an example.
At 8th level a primalist spelleater has Fast Healing 2 from Blood of Life. Also he has DR/- 0.
He has the "Increased Damage Reduction" rage power which says "The barbarian's damage reduction increases by 1/—. This increase is always active while the barbarian is raging."
Since it's an increase you have to have a base. If you took this on a viking fighter that has no DR it wouldn't work. You can't increase something you don't have, but the spelleater has DR/- 0.
So while raging you have Fast Healing 2 and DR/- 1.
If you got DR/bludgeoning from defending bones then you'd have Fast Healing 2, DR 1/-, and DR 5/bludgeoning. Meaning the DR 5 works unless it's bludgeoning, then you're DR 1/- still works reducing bludgeoning attacks by 1.
If you also had 5 levels of Stalwart defender so you're lv13 now. You'd have always on DR 1/-, while raging you'd also have Fast healing 2, DR 1/- and with the bones spell, DR 5/bludgeoning.
If you used the stalwart feat to total defend in addition to this you'd have. DR 6/-, Fast healing 2, DR 6/- and DR 5/bludgeoning.
I hope this clears it up as to how this works.
I do not recommend Crossblooded Arcane Is just fine by itself.
Here is my Bloodrager I just posted for someone else.
** spoiler omitted **...
You need to take Skill Focus (Survival) to take Eldritch Heritage.
Waiting until 6 for Power Attack is a long time.
A reach build doesn't make a ton of sense without Combat Reflexes.
Two feats for 1-5 damage per hit (Arcane Strike + Blooded Arcane Strike) isn't a great investment. I think you'd take Weapon Focus first. It might be more valuable taking it at level 1 when you don't have a magic weapon.
Arcane doesn't fly till 16 w/ FotD I, which is something the OP wanted earlier. Although Spider Climb isn't a bad consolation prize.
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To the OP, Destined is a great Crossblooded bloodline. Destined 4 pretty much negates the will save penalties while increasing your other saves and armor. Cross with Elemental to fly at 8 if that's all that's important to you; elemental 1 and 16 are nice too. Cross with draconic and take the breath attack and wings. If you want only the flight and not much else, you can stick with destined 1 and 16, but if you want to be a dragon, draconic 1 and 16 are just as good. If you do go dragon, make sure to pick up a bite with a trait.
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You need to take Skill Focus (Survival) to take Eldritch Heritage.
Two feats for 1-5 damage per hit (Arcane Strike + Blooded Arcane Strike) isn't a great investment. I think you'd take Weapon Focus first. It might be more valuable taking it at level 1 when you don't have a magic weapon.
I honestly don't mind taking Arcane strike and Bloodied out of my build. I forgot about the skill focus but taking 2 feats out opens room for it.
No room in the build for Weapon focus as the first levels are all about surviving and getting better fast healing.Waiting until 6 for Power Attack is a long time.
This is not too big a problem. as long as you have it prior to level 7+ your fine usually. This is not a make or break thing unless your a player who thinks PA is mandatory at level 1 on a full BaB character. Its not that mandatory that you rush it...but it is one of the better melee feats your going to take.
A reach build doesn't make a ton of sense without Combat Reflexes.
He isn't a reach build but could be with the above change. I recommended a reach weapon in the equipment section but its easy enough to Change out those 2 feats for Skill focus and Combat reflexes. Tho I don't use reach tactics much myself and prefer to stand on their toes with a Falchion.
Two feats for 1-5 damage per hit (Arcane Strike + Blooded Arcane Strike) isn't a great investment. I think you'd take Weapon Focus first. It might be more valuable taking it at level 1 when you don't have a magic weapon.
The bloodied arcane strike is necessary when taking both Arcane strike and raging Brutality as both fight over a Swift action and you want as much damage as possible when doing brutality. No need for it early as 50g can fix your non magic weapon problem.
To the OP, Destined is a great Crossblooded bloodline. Destined 4 pretty much negates the will save penalties while increasing your other saves and armor. Cross with Elemental to fly at 8 if that's all that's important to you; elemental 1 and 16 are nice too. Cross with draconic and take the breath attack and wings. If you want only the flight and not much else, you can stick with destined 1 and 16, but if you want to be a dragon, draconic 1 and 16 are just as good. If you do go dragon, make sure to pick up a bite with a trait.
Flight is a terrible Bloodline power when you can cast Fly from your list or a Scroll from level 1. Breath attack just sucks and is worth trading away.
Natural attacks have more of an issue breaking DR than a manufactured weapon.
Dot