Okay, fair point. I usually play Morrigan so I guess he just doesn't feel OP 'cause I too am OP? :PVirgil struggles against Morrigan (although, overall, he's still more powerful), but without the Dr.Doom assist, she isn't too bad. It's really the Hidden Missles that amp her brokeness to eleven.
*Skrull player laughing in the distance*
a wand isn't always fully charged, when you use a wand, you eat up a charge, a used wand isn't as valuable as a new one, it is only common sense that some guy would be more willing to part with a "used wand" that more people can afford and survive a few extra days than waste time with that "new wand" that is going to take a long time to find a worthwhile buyer. so because of this, there will be an increased market for partially charged wands, especially among adventurers, nobles, and guild officers. buying a 5 charge wand of lesser restoration made by a paladin is no different from buying bracers of giant strength is no different from simply buying a belt of physical perfection is no different from buying a nightshirt of resistance.
but then, common sense should trump RAW. while yes, you can find partially charged wands, you don't get a roll for every variant number of charges, it is just one roll for all wands of that type, regardless of what class made them, at the same time, because regardless of the variance in charges, the wand is the same item, the same would apply to buying a cloak or resistance as opposed to a nightshirt of resistance, even though both eat different variant slots, both are technically the same item. it also doesn't matter the variant levels of a +2 sword, a +2 sword is a +2 sword
while i allow partially charged wands, or variant alternate slotted or multi propertied slotting items, i allow a roll for the general item type rather than the individual item, for example, whether the item grants a resistance bonus or spell effect, you get one general roll for resistance bonus items and one for a specific spell effect, whether avaialable in wand, potion, scroll or service but make exceptions that lesser healing items are always available due to the demand.
It's quite different, Rin, because buying a partially charged wand is not in the core rules. Wands are not sold by the charge, just like swords +2 are not sold by the caster level.
It may be logical, it may be easy to figure out...but it's not a core assumption of the standard rules for generating loot.
And so, trying to make the GM roll for a wand with 1 charge, 2 charges and 5 charges as 'different items' is not only trying to get him to roll for a custom item, it's the worst kind of meta-gaming to get around the rules.
In the same way, PFS isn't exactly 'house rules' for this. Sure, you can't craft. The reason you can't craft is the same reason you can't order custom items...it can rapidly lead to messy minmaxing.
So, in PFS, you can only order what's in the SRD, and half-charged wands are not priced there. Likewise, half-priced wands aren't going to pop up as random loot in a city.
As I noted, there's no difference between buying a CLW wand with 10 charges and buying a CLW wand that uses 5 chg/spell. From the perspective of the GM and the game, its a 10 charge healing item, it's not a core item, so its custom, and you can't 'randomly roll' for them. It's GM House ruling all the way.
And letting a player passive-aggressively logic/force you into this so he can pick up healing on the cheap? Worst kind of metagaming.
I mean, seriously, if this was meant to apply, all wands would be priced by the charge. Because you could not only buy wands by the charge, but by the charges they consume. Let's start buying CLW wands that burn 1, 2, 5, 10, 25 and 50 charges, whatever we have the spare change to buy!...keep rolling on that random table until we get what we want, Mr. GM!
Too complex, too metagamey.
==Aelryinth
that is why, i treat custom items under the same roll as their parent item. you aren't rolling for variant charges of the same wand, you are rolling to see if the spell effect is even available on a wand in that particular settlement in the first place. i treat the variant custom amounts of charges as 1 item, much like i don't care whether you roll for a cloak of resistance, bloomers of resistance or a nightshirt of resistance, it is all the same intent, a resistance bonus, you roll to see if the resistance bonus category is even available for sale rather than each resistance item variant. either way, a resistance item will have the same cost, while a partially charged wand will be priced by the charge, but you don't get to roll for every individual level of partial charges. you aren't rolling, wand of CLW 50 charges, Wand of CLW 49 charges, you are rolling for the availability items of CLW in general for that settlement. including all their partially charged variants
Uhm, these arguments sounds partially familiar.
because it comes up at least thrice a month
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With that aside if you use stock monsters they are getting destroyed in less than 4 rounds anyway against optimized groups not really working as a team, which is how most groups play.
I admit I dont know about 'most groups', but I don't believe you on the 4 round thing.
My players will not move around just to get a +1 to attack unless they are struggling to hit the enemy. That is good combat RP, but it is more efficient to just use the full attack most of the time.
What are the enemies doing while the party is busy trying to full-attack them? My monsters (those who sport any INT, anyway) move so as to prevent themselves from being charged, and work to lower the chances of Stefan Von Strong, also known as The Lawnmower, getting off any full attacks.
Earth Elementals have a low intelligence. IIRC it is about a 5, so I don't use too many tactics with them, but lets say they were to go after the sorcerer. If he had fly he would use. If not that he could have popped mirror image. I do know he had mirror image, but I don't remember if he had the fly spell or not. If they pop up beside him he would likely survive, and dropping another fireball on them. Of course the cleric may need to decide what he is going to do, and I don't remember his character well enough to recall his options.
Earth elementals have 6 INT, which is more than enough to fight properly, and make optimal use of their own abilities. And fighting together, tagging out, going for the weak ones, or avoiding the big ones, is something that is achievable with animal intellect. Ever seen a pride of lions hunt? Or a pack of wolves? I'm sure you're more qualified than I to talk about what the sorcerer would do, you having been there and all, but how good were his chances of hitting the earth elementals in melee? Cuz when one of them emerge from the ground and use a standard action to grapple the tiny fire-ball slinging mortal, he needs to make that AoO count, or he's gonna be contesting with that good ole' 35+spell-level concentration DC.
I will admit the tactics make the fight more dangerous, but it I still don't see it going to 5 rounds.
Let's call it 'agree to disagree, then' :)
PS: What is RotR? Is it Rise of the Runelords?
Yep.
-Nearyn
i really don't care whether your resistance bonus to saving throws comes from a nightshirt, a cloak, a pair of bloomers, a dress or even a hair ribbon. it is still just a resistance bonus to saving throws. now, you could tack the resistance bonus onto another item for 50% more, but don't expect to roll for every slot out there in the hopes of finding a resistance item, and while i allow people to kit themselves in bling like the mandarin, but i point out, that kitting yourselves in that many magic rings is both in bad taste and likely to paint yourself a target as well as leave all 10 rings open for theft.
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With that aside if you use stock monsters they are getting destroyed in less than 4 rounds anyway against optimized groups not really working as a team, which is how most groups play.I admit I dont know about 'most groups', but I don't believe you on the 4 round thing.
If it takes you more then 4 rounds to fight something CR appropriate you are either playing with incredibly low level of optimization (lower then Power attack + 2 Handed Weapon), messing up on a bunch of rules, or there is a large amount of fudging being done.
There may be another option besides those, but I highly doubt it. Because really combat is a 3-4 round thing, except at the lowest and highest levels where is is a 1-2 round thing.
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On the wand thing...
Wands have a price per charge. The rules tell you how to determine the value of the wand per charge. This is useful for both determining how to include charged items in treasure spreads as well as for determining aftermarket availability. Consumables by their very nature are quite common in Pathfinder. You can find an average of about 3 scrolls of an individual 9th level spell any small or larger city (barring those with a an expensive component). Potions are in a similar boat (a CL 20 potion of any 3rd level spell is 3,000 gp, available in most cities).
The magic item rules have this to say.
Many items, particularly wands and staves, are limited in power by the number of charges they hold. Normally, charged items have 50 charges at most (10 for staves). If such an item is found as a random part of a treasure, roll d% and divide by 2 to determine the number of charges left (round down, minimum 1). If the item has a maximum number of charges other than 50, roll randomly to determine how many charges are left.
For an item that's worthless when its charges run out (which is the case for almost all charged items), the value of the partially used item is proportional to the number of charges left. For an item that has usefulness in addition to its charges, only part of the item's value is based on the number of charges left.
Here it notes that the prices listed in the item's description are for a fully-charged item and those that aren't fully charged have proportional value. It then immediately (as in the next subheading) discusses purchasing magical items and makes no special exceptions for items that are charged. The result is that things like scrolls, potions, and wands are among the most common sorts of magic items in the typical campaign, which is a pretty rational expectation.
In essence, the rules already allow you to do this. For you to authoritatively claim that you cannot buy used wands in a town, you need a piece of text saying that you cannot because the rules already present the way that you can. I know we're not going to get such from you, and I know you're still going to vehemently exist that your non-existent rules are the RAW, because we've been down this road before and it still leads to the wastelands.
Doesn't hurt that wand-recycling is actually one of the most sensible things that people can do. Craft a wand, use it as much as you want, recoup your investment by selling it off. Since you get at least as much as you invested into it per charge from pawning it off, it means your typical wizard might decide "Man, I'm going to be dealing with some trolls, I'd better make a wand of fireball," only to later after using as many charges as was needed for their purposes go, "Okay, don't need this as much as I used to but it's still got 8 charges left," pawn it and recover the invested money. Then some adventurer comes along and is checking the local pawn shops and asks to see their collection of partially charged wands.
"Fireballs eh? One sec...here, we've got twelve. This one's made out of some kind of bone with five charges, this one wood with twelve, I think this one's copper and it's only got three charges left but it's twice as powerful as the other two,"
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Well, if you can find me where it states that wands are priced by the charge and sold that way, I'll go along with you.
Otherwise, it's a variant item, which means custom, which means under standard rules it's not available.
Well, then you are with me?
People make normally 50 charged wands but it does list the price for partially charged.Because it says: http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items
"Prices listed are always for fully charged items. (When an item is created, it is fully charged.) For an item that's worthless when its charges run out (which is the case for almost all charged items), the value of the partially used item is proportional to the number of charges left. For an item that has usefulness in addition to its charges, only part of the item's value is based on the number of charges left."
So basically the price is easy to calculate per 50 charges. So divide by 50 and the multiply by the charges it has to get the price.
Heck, there are even guidelines to recharge them in the GM's guide. But it says only in vague terms.
Can you buy a partially charged wand in PFS? I'm pretty sure that's a no. Ignoring prestige rules and stuff, of course.Here's another metagame borker: I want to buy a magic sword +2. 75% chance...oops, non available.
Using your wand justification, I'll ask for a sword +2 at CL7. It has no effect on the item, doesn't even raise the save yet (CL 8 to raise the save!). Different item, right? Roll again!
What about at CL 8?
Oddly enough, the saving throw for the unattended item goes up by 1...but there's no increase in price, because CL has no affect on the price of enhancement items. So a CL20 Longsword +2 costs the same as a CL6 Longsword +2.
So, MR. DM, keep rolling that % chance for me. Those are all different items, after all.RAW says they are custom, so, no. The GM is supposed to look for core magic items from the SRD, they even have the tables and % for randomly rolling them!
But not for variant charges, caster levels, or 'cheaper because I'm a race x character with class y' variants added in.There's just nothing there, Lemmy.
==Aelryinth
Technically, yes. Pedantic...time comsuming....but allowed yes.
The GM will likely be upset if you do that for caster level. Heck, he might add a charge because it has a benefit to be a higher caster (dispel) but unless he houserules it away, you can add caster levels your query to get another 75% chance.
Wait, did you just say core items from the SRD? Because that isn't listed anywhere either. Can you point where it says that.
The only time I've had a combat that went for 6 rounds is when everyone was level 1 and kept rolling 1's and 2's for the attack rolls in a horrible wave of bad luck... Did result in the players deciding that one goblin was immortal though and they considered giving random goblin #2 a backstory.
Okay, fair point. I usually play Morrigan so I guess he just doesn't feel OP 'cause I too am OP? :PVirgil struggles against Morrigan (although, overall, he's still more powerful), but without the Dr.Doom assist, she isn't too bad. It's really the Hidden Missles that amp her brokeness to eleven.
Sidenote: I usually play Morrigan, Trish, and Virgil or Ryu (I really like Ryu) while my brother runs Dante, Virgil, and Wesker. Most of the time I've more trouble fighting Wesker than I do with Virgil because I find Virgil easier to defend against (there is a fair chance that both of us just suck at this game though :P).Huh... I always found Wesker to be an easier fight. He is more straightforward, easier to predict. Virgil has greater range and can keep locking you down and dominating neutral with those f@##ing spiraling swords... And they make everything he does safe too!
Wesker is more fun to play, though... He's my main character. Well... He was. I haven't really played UMvC3 in the last 6 months or so.
And yes, I was talking about X-Men Phoenix, not Lawyer Phoenix. :PYeah, well... Jean Grey is a c&%*.
She is no longer the broken piece of uber brokeness she was in vanilla, but she's still annoying as hell. >:(
Yeah. I suck with Jean-Pheonix either way (I'm just not very good with her :P). I can usually take down most of my friends with Morrigan without tagging out (except my brother, we tag out and team-attack frequently when fighting each other), but my brother haaaates me playing Ryu. I usually drop Ryu if I'm getting the stuffing beat out of me by Virgil or Dante and pound the snot out of him. :P
But then, like I said, I probably actually suck at the game because try as I might I'm really not good at using Astral Vision to even a fraction of its potential. :(
I will say that X Factor + Devil Form Virgil is hilariously destructive if your opponent messes up and lets you just slap the snot out of them with your sword over and over (life bar gone in like 2 seconds, and it's depressing if you were in the middle of tagging and he dices up two of your dudes in one go :P).
Nearyn there have been polls on these boards. 3 to 4 rounds is the standard. I am sure my RotRL group will 4 round any CR=APL opponent even with you as the GM unless you alter the monster in which case it is no longer the stock monster. As for avoiding full attacks the giants also live on full attacks so trying to move away is not a logical strategy for them. The PC's have high enough CMDs that tripping them on the way in is not likely. So if the run they they are not worried.
If I were not using max hit points they would only need 1 full round attack to kill most creatures.
Barring GM fiat, a very non optimized group, or some other random luck factor no group should take more than 4 rounds to take on an APL=CR opponent.
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Tsc... I really gotta do something about my -4 penalty to Will saves vs talking about fighting games...
Yeah. I suck with Jean-Pheonix either way (I'm just not very good with her :P). I can usually take down most of my friends with Morrigan without tagging out (except my brother, we tag out and team-attack frequently when fighting each other), but my brother haaaates me playing Ryu. I usually drop Ryu if I'm getting the stuffing beat out of me by Virgil or Dante and pound the snot out of him. :P
Virgil is an a#$$!@~ because not only he's fast as f!#% and incredibly damaging (although, to be fair, most characters in UMvC3 have one-touch death combos), but also his attacks have great range and priority. Also, they are completely safe. Even when they aren't, he can call those spinning blades of his and not only make them safe, but also get the momentum back.
"What's this?! The opponent blocked and consequently my last attack will leave me open to retaliation? Can't have none of that!"
"Where were we again?"
But then, like I said, I probably actually suck at the game because try as I might I'm really not good at using Astral Vision to even a fraction of its potential. :(
To be fair, doing that ChrisG s~~% is pretty difficult... But just spamming Hidden Missiles with Dr.Doom while you abuse Astral Vision goes a long way to increase Morrigan's effectiveness. :P
If we ever meet in person, we should play a few rounds. You'll probably kick my ass, but it'll be fun. Oddly enough, UMvC3 is one of the most fun fighting games around and one of the most infuriating as well. ><'
My main team is... Well... Wesker +2. I can't help but play a bunch of those characters... Wesker on point 90% of the time, though. That RE1 alternate outfit is just too cool! And his combos and hypers are too awesome!
As for wolves that is instinct and them learning from the pack not intelligence. Pack animals can separate creatures even humans from a larger group. If intelligence was the primary factor then humans would be better at tactics without training. You get two random people and the chances of them becoming one cohesive unit within a matter of seconds is small.
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As for wolves that is instinct and them learning from the pack not intelligence. Pack animals can separate creatures even humans from a larger group. If intelligence was the primary factor then humans would be better at tactics without training. You get two random people and the chances of them becoming one cohesive unit within a matter of seconds is small.
Most animals aren't good at hunting initially either. Great white sharks for example have to learn how to hunt seal. If they strike too early their white bellies (which provide concealment from below) gives them away (their tops provide concealment from above) and the seal can evade; if they wait to late they can't get the momentum. They have to learn their attack routine to survive.
Adult wolves have had plenty of time to learn how to hunt. Most of the creatures that you encounter probably know how to use their innate abilities. Rudimentary tactics are rudimentary. :)
Though you might make an interesting argument that tactical viability is divorced from in Intelligence. That's not an unfair argument since Int does not govern tactics in the rules and there are plenty of creatures that use cunning tactics to hunt prey.
I mean, in Jurrasic Park, the raptors set up a trap for the Australian hunter-guy (whose name escapes me at the moment). Remember the famous scene where he goes "Clever girl," and then gets mauled? Yeah, if the GM did that very thing I'd think that was freakin' sweet, not that the dinosaurs had a PHD.
Although i am not 100% sure, i think that you can't buy used wands with the "magic item below Base Value -> 75% chance of being available" rule so you can only buy used wands if one appears as a random magic item for that week.Sure, and they are a snip at only 30000gp, which is just shy of 50% of the WBL of a level 10 character.Fun fact: Summoners allow the creation of wands of Teleport.
This is how well designed the class is...
600 gp/charge. Buying some used wands is pretty easy with magic item availability what it is.
Exactly, so first ask if 1 charge available. If it is make note.
Then ask if 2 charge wand available. If it is make note.
If 3 available: If it is make note.
Continue till you have 10 charge wand (most you likely want) then get it. If it isn't, get enough charge wands to count as 10.
With each 75% chance, you are sure to get 10 charges even if multiple of used wands needed.
That is the exact opposite of what i said.
I am sure that buying partially charged wands is against the intent of the rules (the price in wands is what it is because it includes a discount for buying magic in bulk) and pretty sure that you can't buy a partially charged wand, the same way you can't buy a belt with +4STR +2DEX.| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
you can't buy a belt with +4STR +2DEX.
Why can't you? EDIT: Besides being above the gp limit of a metropolis, I mean.
I am sure that buying partially charged wands is against the intent of the rules (the price in wands is what it is because it includes a discount for buying magic in bulk) and pretty sure that you can't buy a partially charged wand, the same way you can't buy a belt with +4STR +2DEX.
Modules and AP's would disagree with that assertion. You can find partially charged wands as loot all the time. Sell them even.
That would mean it's reasonable to buy one. Though you may not find exactly what you are looking for.
And no it's not the same as being unable to buy the belt you mentioned. A wand with fewer charges is natural as you can make a 50 charge wand and eventually work it down to a few charges.
This is not true of the aforementioned belt.
Virgil is an a+*&$*! because not only he's fast as f&$! and incredibly damaging (although, to be fair, most characters in UMvC3 have one-touch death combos), but also his attacks have great range and priority. Also, they are completely safe. Even when they aren't, he can call those spinning blades of his and not only make them safe, but also get the momentum back.
"What's this?! The opponent blocked and consequently my last attack will leave me open to retaliation? Can't have none of that!"
"Where were we again?"
Haha, yeah totally. XD
To be fair, doing that ChrisG s$$# is pretty difficult... But just spamming Hidden Missiles with Dr.Doom while you abuse Astral Vision goes a long way to increase Morrigan's effectiveness. :P
If we ever meet in person, we should play a few rounds. You'll probably kick my ass, but it'll be fun. Oddly enough, UMvC3 is one of the most fun fighting games around and one of the most infuriating as well. ><'
Absolutely! I'd probably have to drug you into playing Guilty Gear X2#Reload with me as well. It is my waifu. :3
My main team is... Well... Wesker +2. I can't help but play a bunch of those characters... Wesker on point 90% of the time, though. That RE1 alternate outfit is just too cool! And his combos and hypers are too awesome!
Agreed. :)
Sure, look at the random tables for treasure generation in the PFSRD. No wands listed at partial charges. Black and White.
Ashiel has the quote that allows 'randomly found' treasure to be of variable charges. That's loot in a hoard, not randomly rolling in a town. You certainly don't get to pick and choose the wand level.
Items for sale in towns aren't 'randomly found', they are randomly generated...and at full value. At the 'very best', you can find one that might have a random amount less then full value...there's nothing that indicates "I can pick and choose exactly what charges I want in a wand before I buy it." That's pure metagaming. You certainly can't go asking for specific charge levels.
And as Rin noted, that 'randomly found' item is for all potential items with charges, not 'per charge'. Otherwise, you get rapidly into the metagame abuse, again. Saying there is a 75% chance for each of 50 different wands per type via amounts of charges is nowhere implied in the rules, either.
Do you realize that if you're able to dictate charge levels, that means the GP limit on wands of CLW in any place that can sell them is going to be 25 x 775gp, or 19,375 gp in CLW wands ALONE sitting around waiting for you to buy them at all the variable charge levels? And what about all the OTHER level 1 wands?
Uh, no.
==Aelryinth
Although i am not 100% sure, i think that you can't buy used wands with the "magic item below Base Value -> 75% chance of being available" rule so you can only buy used wands if one appears as a random magic item for that week.Sure, and they are a snip at only 30000gp, which is just shy of 50% of the WBL of a level 10 character.Fun fact: Summoners allow the creation of wands of Teleport.
This is how well designed the class is...
600 gp/charge. Buying some used wands is pretty easy with magic item availability what it is.
Exactly, so first ask if 1 charge available. If it is make note.
Then ask if 2 charge wand available. If it is make note.
If 3 available: If it is make note.
Continue till you have 10 charge wand (most you likely want) then get it. If it isn't, get enough charge wands to count as 10.
With each 75% chance, you are sure to get 10 charges even if multiple of used wands needed.
That is the exact opposite of what i said.
I am sure that buying partially charged wands is against the intent of the rules (the price in wands is what it is because it includes a discount for buying magic in bulk) and pretty sure that you can't buy a partially charged wand, the same way you can't buy a belt with +4STR +2DEX.
You can certainly buy one. It's a custom item...you just have to order it first.
Find it randomly? Nope, it's not on the loot generation tables, so its a custom item and not gonna pop up unless DM fiat.
Ditto partially charged wands. Random hoard loot does not fall under the same rules as shopping.
==Aelryinth
i allow the purchase of partially charged wands, but you roll to see whether the spell is avaialable as a wand, potion or scroll as one general roll for all 3, regardless of charges, but you can otherwise buy partially charged to your hearts content, if the wand, potion or scroll is CLW, then the wand is always available due to the demand for CLW spells in any community at any charge level. if you want a resistance bonus, you roll to see if the resistance bonus you desire is available, but it is up to you whether you want to buy it in the form of a cloak, a dress, a hair ribbon, a signet ring, a pair of bloomers, a nightshirt or whatever slot you want. but i also limit one ring per finger, allow a pant slot, an earing slot for each ear and an innerwear slot, because after you get "the big six" i don't care what alternate slotted utility items you buy because "big six" don't stack in the same area, hell, you could have a ring of invisibility, a ring of protection, a ring of the ram, ring of sustenance, a ring of resistance, a ring of wizarddry type 1, a ring of evasion AND a ring of the troll's vigor on the same character and i wouldn't care because after you get your big 6, i don't care what utility items you buy with the cash you find, in fact, allowing alternate slotted items and extra slots, actually lowers the amount of optimization because players will feel encouraged to use some of the lesser items instead of stacking on the big 6.
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Those are two separate paragraphs detailing charged items Aelryinth, and you know that. One explains how the charges are determined when adding them to random loot hordes. The other tells you how much a charged item is worth when not at full charges.
Being deceitful is not very cool.
EDIT: Also luck blades. :|
we're talking generating those items, Ashiel, not the elementary math of figuring the cost per charge. I'm not being deceitful, I'm being quite direct. Trying to shuffle the argument off into 'it's this easy to calculate land' is more properly being deceitful. Do not make unfounded accusations like that, please.
The randomly generated treasure tables for towns do not include variant items. It's really quite simple that way. They most CERTAINLY do not include "I want a CLW Wand with 5 charges." At the very, very best and loosest interpretation, you see if the Item is available at all, and then you RANDOMLY see how many charges it has.
You don't get to pick and choose the charge levels, nor 'keep rolling randomly' until you get it, i.e. towns don't have 50 variants of every possible wand to cater to the PC's who want charge levels A-Y, but don't want Z.
EDIT: Luck Blades: specific trumps general. You still don't get to say "I want to buy a Luck Blade with 2 wishes. Keep rolling until you get one."
--------------
Rin, rings are normally restricted to one on each hand. Are you saying that you allow more slots then is standard?
==Aelryinth
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Dude, you literally said that you can't go out and buy used wands period, not that they can't be randomly generated.
Changing what you're arguing about when you realize it isn't working out for you is dishonest. Cut it out.
Rin, rings are normally restricted to one on each hand. Are you saying that you allow more slots then is standard?
==Aelryinth
i allow a ring on each finger, an innerwear slot and a pants/skirt/leggings slot as well as an earing slot for each ear, which while more than standard, is limited by the fact that i don't care what you have once you gather the big 6, it isn't like allowing a player to invest in extra utility items isn't going to do much. i also allow items on alternate slots, within reason, so you could find gauntlets, stockings, or bracers of strength, but not eyeglasses of strength, but i don't care what minor utility items you buy or use. the pants/skirt/leggings slot is what covers the legs, and the innerwear slot can be anything from a brassiere or undershirt to a loincloth
It always disappoints me you cant ware 5 rings. Not one for each finger one for each appendage which could possibly wear a ring.i allow a ring on each finger, an innerwear slot and a pants/skirt/leggings slot as well as an earing slot for each ear, which while more than standard, is limited by the fact that i don't care what you have once you gather the big 6, it isn't like allowing a player to invest in extra utility items isn't going to do much. i also allow items on alternate slots, within reason, so you could find gauntlets, stockings, or bracers of strength, but not eyeglasses of strength, but i don't care what minor utility items you buy or use. the pants/skirt/leggings slot is what covers the legs, and the innerwear slot can be anything from a brassiere or undershirt to a loincloth
i keep it reasonable by allowing a ring on each finger and an earring on each ear, because i believe having on top of that, the potential for a ring on each toe, a prince albert, a grille, a nose ring and a tongue piercing is just way too much bling and encourages the sacrifice of sensibility to flaunt wealth. but 5 rings on each hand and 2 earrings, means you can wear potentially 12 rings. the reason why i allow a ring on each finger, because a villain called "The Mandarin" in the iron Man comics did that
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UMvC3
More UMvC3
Pathfinder mates. Pathfinder. Besides, I bet I can school both of yall with Zero =P
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we're talking generating those items, Ashiel, not the elementary math of figuring the cost per charge. I'm not being deceitful, I'm being quite direct. Trying to shuffle the argument off into 'it's this easy to calculate land' is more properly being deceitful. Do not make unfounded accusations like that, please.
It's not unfounded. It's true. You are deliberately trying to clump the two paragraphs together to make your argument look better.
The randomly generated treasure tables for towns do not include variant items. It's really quite simple that way. They most CERTAINLY do not include "I want a CLW Wand with 5 charges." At the very, very best and loosest interpretation, you see if the Item is available at all, and then you RANDOMLY see how many charges it has.
First off, I didn't say anything about random loot tables. I was going by the fact that the #1 method of buying magic items is based on the value of the item vs size of the settlement and yes, consumables are very, very common.
However since you want to go there, if you want to argue "it doesn't appear on the random item tables, thus it doesn't exist" then your game has bigger problems since you can't get magic weapons and armors that aren't specific (since there's no way to determine what sort of weapons or armors the enhancements are on, unlike 3.x which had random equipment tables). That means that your % chance of getting a weapon and/or armor is abysmal (you gotta roll it, then you've only got at most a 13/100 chance to actually get a result that tells you what sort of magic arm or armor). God forbid you roll a special ability and roll again, because your world may implode when you have to add a special ability to a specific item (brain meltdown, noooo!!!).
For Everyone At Home
The number and types of magic items available in a community depend upon its size. Each community has a base value associated with it (see Table: Available Magic Items). There is a 75% chance that any item of that value or lower can be found for sale with little effort in that community. In addition, the community has a number of other items for sale. These items are randomly determined and are broken down by category (minor, medium, or major). After determining the number of items available in each category, refer to Table: Random Magic Item Generation to determine the type of each item (potion, scroll, ring, weapon, etc.) before moving on to the individual charts to determine the exact item. Reroll any items that fall below the community's base value.
For an item that's worthless when its charges run out (which is the case for almost all charged items), the value of the partially used item is proportional to the number of charges left. For an item that has usefulness in addition to its charges, only part of the item's value is based on the number of charges left.
It's not complicated. It's not nonsensical. It's just how it goes.
makes one wonder why adventurers ever leave towns when they can generate neigh infinite amounts of wealth by simply asking the shop keeper if he has this or that magical trinket on hand.
makes one wonder why adventurers ever leave towns when they can generate neigh infinite amounts of wealth by simply asking the shop keeper if he has this or that magical trinket on hand.
Metagame reasons clearly, Adventures Pillage and Plunder, so they can go to the nearest metropolis and sell the spoils of their victory, so they can buy better equipment that makes them better at pillaging and plundering, and thus the cycle of banditry never ends, and most adventurers have an obsession with outpacing the gear treadmill, and because of this, they continue a life as wandering bandits, years after they have more than enough gold to retire and live lavishly for a plural of centuries.
makes one wonder why adventurers ever leave towns when they can generate neigh infinite amounts of wealth by simply asking the shop keeper if he has this or that magical trinket on hand.
I'm a little confused as to how being able to buy items equates to infinite amounts of money. Since you buy at market price and sell at pawn price, doesn't that kind of mean that you need to go out and get loads of shwag to come back and buy goodies?
Pathfinder mates. Pathfinder. Besides, I bet I can school both of yall with Zero =P
Pfff... Zero is even cheaper than Virgil...
Now I wanna play UMVC3...I wonder if it's on Steam. >_>
EDIT: Nope. (T_T)
makes one wonder why adventurers ever leave towns when they can generate neigh infinite amounts of wealth by simply asking the shop keeper if he has this or that magical trinket on hand.I'm a little confused as to how being able to buy items equates to infinite amounts of money. Since you buy at market price and sell at pawn price, doesn't that kind of mean that you need to go out and get loads of shwag to come back and buy goodies?
Well... There is a trait that gives characters a 5% discount on crafting costs, so theoretically, you can make money just crafting stuff.
But that doesn't have anything to do with what gear can be found on what settlement or whether or not you can buy partially charged wands
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Now I wanna play UMVC3...I wonder if it's on Steam. >_>
It isn't. Nor will it ever be. Marvel pulled the distribution rights from Capcom, which is the main reason we never got a balance patch after the release of Ultimate (IIRC, you can't even buy DLC in PSN/Xbox Live anymore)...
Well... I guess I'll just have to keep playing Guilty Gear Xrd and Skullgirls Encore.
Now I wanna play UMVC3...I wonder if it's on Steam. >_>It isn't. Nor will it ever be. Marvel pulled the distribution rights from Capcom, which is the main reason we never got a balance patch after the release of Ultimate (IIRC, you can't even buy DLC in PSN/Xbox Live anymore)...
Well... I guess I'll just have to keep playing Guilty Gear Xrd and Skullgirls Encore.
I want Xrd so badly! Bring it to Steam you monsters! Also, what's Skullgirls Encore? I just got Skullgirls on Steam and it comes with Endless Beta, but I've not heard of SG:E. :o
@wraithstrike and Anzyr: I don't really want to continue the discussion of encounter length in here, since it's not the topic of the thread.
Let's just say that after having read wraithstrike's combat summary, I think I've got an idea of why at least some of these short encounters are, well, short.
And while I'm not confident that I could turn every randomly rolled encounter into a 15-rounds battle, without being a spit contrived about it, I feel confident that 'most parties' could not 4-round (or even 6-round) most of my encounters. That includes parties who are so gobsmackingly combat-optimized as to be utterly useless in any other adventuring or challenge-solving capacity.
-Nearyn
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@wraithstrike and Anzyr: I don't really want to continue the discussion of encounter length in here, since it's not the topic of the thread.
Let's just say that after having read wraithstrike's combat summary, I think I've got an idea of why at least some of these short encounters are, well, short.
And while I'm not confident that I could turn every randomly rolled encounter into a 15-rounds battle, without being a spit contrived about it, I feel confident that 'most parties' could not 4-round (or even 6-round) most of my encounters. That includes parties who are so gobsmackingly combat-optimized as to be utterly useless in any other adventuring or challenge-solving capacity.
-Nearyn
Well "your combats" and "monsters directly from the book" may not be the same thing so that may have been miscommunication.
Well "your combats" and "monsters directly from the book" may not be the same thing so that may have been miscommunication.
It could be, but I run monsters straight out of the bestiary most of the time.
-Nearyn
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@wraithstrike and Anzyr: I don't really want to continue the discussion of encounter length in here, since it's not the topic of the thread.
Let's just say that after having read wraithstrike's combat summary, I think I've got an idea of why at least some of these short encounters are, well, short.
And while I'm not confident that I could turn every randomly rolled encounter into a 15-rounds battle, without being a spit contrived about it, I feel confident that 'most parties' could not 4-round (or even 6-round) most of my encounters. That includes parties who are so gobsmackingly combat-optimized as to be utterly useless in any other adventuring or challenge-solving capacity.
-Nearyn
That reminds me of when I was running Flight of the Red Raven for my brother and his friend and rolled a random encounter of 12 wolves. Humorously that fight actually did end pretty quickly because the psychic warrior had learned crystal swarm via a feat so my brother's PC drew their ire and she came up and sprayed the wolves. Didn't kill them but scared the crap out of them and made them run away.
EDIT: Oh and of course all of those wolves had +3 silver wolf dentures and +3 fur coats of displacement!
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That reminds me of when I was running Flight of the Red Raven for my brother and his friend and rolled a random encounter of 12 wolves. Humorously that fight actually did end pretty quickly because the psychic warrior had learned crystal swarm via a feat so my brother's PC drew their ire and she came up and sprayed the wolves. Didn't kill them but scared the crap out of them and made them run away.
Heh, animals :P
Would you recommend Flight of the Red Raven?
-Nearyn
in response to Ashiel's edit: Noooo, c'mon!! Don't pretend there's ham in your sandwich and then go 'lawl no' :'[
Swing for the cheap-seats! Go full-on Michael Bay meets OOTS!! :D
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That reminds me of when I was running Flight of the Red Raven for my brother and his friend and rolled a random encounter of 12 wolves. Humorously that fight actually did end pretty quickly because the psychic warrior had learned crystal swarm via a feat so my brother's PC drew their ire and she came up and sprayed the wolves. Didn't kill them but scared the crap out of them and made them run away.Heh, animals :P
Would you recommend Flight of the Red Raven?
-Nearyn
Overall, yeah, I'd say so. It was fun and the two players were having so much fun that we ended up playing a 12 hour marathon without realizing it (we started the module at 8pm, finished at 8am, then crashed). Beware though, because the NPCs use their treasure! Ooooh, scary. :s
The BBEG, a "monster" even uses a masterwork hammer and potions. D:
It's pretty cool though. I want to try running a few other modules in the near future (just been so busy working). I kind of want to run Wrath of the Righteous with some heavy editing by yours truly (basically killing the mythic taint with sacred fire).
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because the NPCs use their treasure! Ooooh, scary. :s
Oooooh shiiiiieet~~!!! Monsters who use items, rather than rupture into shinies upon defeat?! Forget about vital-striking Witchfires, no this -THIS- is the terror of the deep-darks of the world!! What possible chance could any adventurer have against monsters who are not comically swollen piñatas?!!?
I kind of want to run Wrath of the Righteous with some heavy editing by yours truly (basically killing the mythic taint with sacred fire).
Sounds cool. I -would- ask what your thought is on Mythic, having not really read through it myself, but I'm guessing "killing the mythic taint with sacred fire" is not code for "giving the mythic writers a backrub".
-Nearyn
I want Xrd so badly! Bring it to Steam you monsters! Also, what's Skullgirls Encore? I just got Skullgirls on Steam and it comes with Endless Beta, but I've not heard of SG:E. :oNow I wanna play UMVC3...I wonder if it's on Steam. >_>It isn't. Nor will it ever be. Marvel pulled the distribution rights from Capcom, which is the main reason we never got a balance patch after the release of Ultimate (IIRC, you can't even buy DLC in PSN/Xbox Live anymore)...
Well... I guess I'll just have to keep playing Guilty Gear Xrd and Skullgirls Encore.
Skullgirls Encore is just the name of the current version of the game (you know, the one you have on Steam). They had to change the name as if it were a different game because of some problem with their old publisher. I don't remember the details, but it got so bad that SG was unavailable at Xbox Live at one point.