Crafting Settlements are Pathetic.


Pathfinder Online


Six towers is insufficient to support a crafting settlement at a reasonable level. Auction Houses are deplorable, and Guardheim's crafting has taken an untenable hit due to the longer crafting times our users face.

Alderwag is empty. Guardheim will move to secure its core towers on its behalf for both of our benefit. Citizens who wish to make a home in Guardheim are encouraged to form a company and join us, or join our existing company, InGuard. If a time comes when Guardheim is prepared to manage its own towers, we will happily trade them our six for as long as we have held theirs, to make this equitable for both settlements in the long run.

If this is construed as a violation of the NAP my predecessor signed, we will live with the results. Anything will be better than living with the state of being a crafting settlement at this stage. Other than that, we will contest no tower. Our stations will be open to any and all who care to visit. By our Neighbors will we be judged.

Goblin Squad Member

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It looks like a violation to me.

Well, I wonder if Ryan won the pool?

Goblin Squad Member

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Well, assuming towers are actually taken today, I'm calling it here. The NAP didn't last a week (without being violated, that is... I know it's still in effect for other settlements).

Goblin Squad Member

Is Alderwag one of the unused settlements?

Goblin Squad Member

At this stage of the game, you should not need more than 8 - 12 towers. All you need to do is find 2 - 6 towers that are not anyone else's Alpha 6 Towers.

If you are a Trade Settlement, cut a deal with your neighbors that are more "martially" inclined and say, "Access to our markets for access to a few towers in the region."

Goblin Squad Member

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True. the NAP could still last for weeks with a few violations, or it might collapse in a steaming heap when all the other tiny crafting towns realize their value is lessened.

Scarab Sages Goblin Squad Member

Tyncale wrote:
Is Alderwag one of the unused settlements?

It seems to be, which means that if Guardheim would wait until Wednesday, it wouldn't be a violation of the NAP.

Cald - Goblinworks has acknowledged that the Auction Houses need improvements. They've stated that the "empty" entries will be hidden, and auctions will be extended to seven days. They didn't say when these fixes will happen, but I'm hopeful that it will be soon.

Goblin Squad Member

Sorry, not a crafter. What's the issue with crafting settlements and towers? I thought core 6 bring you up to level of NPC settlement but with better times and crit chance?


With a functionless AH, our only advantage was faster crafting. we were at 200% speed last week, but as of Wednesday, even with six towers, we are only 20% faster than any non-crafting settlements.


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2 adjacent crafting settlements seems kin of unnecessary anyway?

Goblin Squad Member

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A large portion of the map decided to go with crafting cities for some reason or another. Not really sure why.

Goblin Squad Member

The Alderwag leadership has not convened yet to discuss our future, so I'm kind of going Alexander Haig here and assuming limited control of the situation.

Yes, Alderwag is currently empty. We do not object to others "borrowing" our core 6 so long as they willingly vacate them if we actually get our act together and begin inhabiting our village before next Wednesday.

Cauld contacted me a couple days ago regarding this, and though Alderwag hasn't offered a formal response, the fact that he reached out in good faith means that we do not consider this action to be hostile or unforeseen.

Goblin Squad Member

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Crafting times haven't changed, they are the same as in Alpha

Edit: Towers aren't doing anything for your crafting times, they haven't been turned on for that. Also, 6 towers equal level 8 feats, which for crafting we are still roughly 15 days away from hitting the ceiling on level 8...

I think I understand the issue better.

There is a display bug that shows 200 or 120 for crafting facility, no matter what it shows the actual number is 120. Your speed has neither increased nor decreased, it was a display error.

Goblin Squad Member

Cald Heurad wrote:
With a functionless AH, our only advantage was faster crafting. we were at 200% speed last week, but as of Wednesday, even with six towers, we are only 20% faster than any non-crafting settlements.

The AHs are not really "functionless". Most players in this early game are simply trying to get theirselves equipped. Thornkeep, of course, has some activity on their AH, and Blackfeather Keep's is working, although on a case by case basis. Some players are PMing other players to pass good back and forth without having to carry the goods all the way to the end point. Saves time and makes use of (currently) otherwise useless coin. The arranged transfer of goods is the best use so far for the AH. The interface is bad, but if you know there are 200 of X listed, it is easy to find, and the trade takes only an instant.


My definition of functionless may be harsher than yours, but I think yours is soft. I think the devs will find their way, but for the moment, the AHs are of little value to anyone.

Goblin Squad Member

Cald Heurad wrote:
My definition of functionless may be harsher than yours, but I think yours is soft. I think the devs will find their way, but for the moment, the AHs are of little value to anyone.

Then dont use them. You can have a fully functioning economy without an auction house.

Goblin Squad Member

Cald Heurad wrote:
With a functionless AH, our only advantage was faster crafting. we were at 200% speed last week, but as of Wednesday, even with six towers, we are only 20% faster than any non-crafting settlements.

The *main* advantage of crafting settlements is to have all the crafting stations, allowing the settlement to make gear for every build. Running to neighbours for class training is a heck of a lot less work than hauling raw materials, refined components and crafted goods across the map and back again. (hint: if you want to find Brighthaven's leadership, look in Keepers Pass).

Crafting speed at T1 is already so fast that one refiner can supply a 100+ character guild (you need heaps of gatherers though). AH is for when the populations are much higher than now and the eonomy is mature (trust me - a centralized system is way more effective then free market for the buildup phase).

Bottom line: the excuses to poach towers sound very much like excuses (although seasoned with rational and well-intentioned arguments), and set a dangerous precedence.
If Alderwag approves of the 'deal' it is obviously a very different situation.

Goblin Squad Member

Ditto you can find the majority of our players centralizing their stockpiles and efforts around Canis Castrum unless we are needed elsewhere or going for something specific, it's just so much easier for moving resources and gear around between people.

The AH is not useful within such small groups, we tend to pool our resources even amongst our multiple settlements with Thannon and let him redistribute as needed (plus it makes it easier for him trade with other settlements), though that is only working because we are mostly in the same timezone.

Goblin Squad Member

I don't think it's really a problem with the crafting settlements. I think the problem is we have 4x as many hexes and 2x as many settlements as we should have started with. A crafting settlement can't really get off the ground until the population density increases, right now it's pretty low except for a few spots on the map.


I don't think you've tried hard enough on other alternatives.

There are settlements that would probably allow you 2 of their towers (for the 4 days until core 6 unclaimed towers can be captured) just to have their PvP windows reduced.

But if your "victims" are allowing it... I'll leave it to the NAP lawyers to debate.

Goblin Squad Member

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Valkenr wrote:
I don't think it's really a problem with the crafting settlements. I think the problem is we have 4x as many hexes and 2x as many settlements as we should have started with...

An example of "Watch what you crowdforge for, you just might get it" ;)


stealthy redhead wrote:

Bottom line: the excuses to poach towers sound very much like excuses (although seasoned with rational and well-intentioned arguments), and set a dangerous precedence.

If Alderwag approves of the 'deal' it is obviously a very different situation.

We don't need excuses. A month from now our crafters would be seriously hampered with six towers. We approached two groups, but one of them did not feel as though they were in a position to work with us, though we had good trade with their leader and developed a good start to a relationship.

At the moment, the Alderwag citizens I've talked to have been non-committal, but expressed interest in our intent. If there is a complaint filed, we will live with the consequences.

Goblin Squad Member

Well in 3 days you are free to take the Alderwag towers if they remain inactive without sacrificing the basic protection of the WoT NAP. Especially considering the fact that towers are not boosting facility quality right now.

But hey, your call.

Goblin Squad Member

As a neighbor from Stoneroot who intends to setup a permanent shop in Guardheim I humbly implore you to wait until Wednesday and follow the NAP agreement.


I had a very good conversation with an additional member of Alderwag tonight (Skag Esel-Ansikt), and I think our settlements are close enough to a consensus that this is in the best interests of both of our groups. Their participation is in a state of flux, and Guardheim is happy to offer them a chance to work with us in creating a more stable environment.

Goblinworks Executive Founder

Duffy wrote:

Well in 3 days you are free to take the Alderwag towers if they remain inactive without sacrificing the basic protection of the WoT NAP. Especially considering the fact that towers are not boosting facility quality right now.

But hey, your call.

... If Alderwag is even occasionally contesting those towers, I'm not sure I'd call it inactive according to the NAP. However, if they aren't recapturing them occasionally they aren't contesting them.

I'm not fully aware of the facts on the ground.

Of course, the NAP "sanctions" only go into effect after somebody asserts that a violation occurred, and I personally won't allege a violation unless it's done against an ally or by a direct rival.

Goblin Squad Member

This whole NAP is to protect the interests of the Settlements by saying that the 6 hexes around them are considered theirs already. If a Settlement says, "yeah, sure, take 'em," then there is no violation, it's consensual.

Goblin Squad Member

Alderwaggers have begun to trickle into the game this weekend. We may start exercising our claims now that we actually have a few players to do so with. I'm sorry this situation caused controversy among the NAP signatories. I honestly didn't think it would be a big deal.

Goblin Squad Member

Shaibes wrote:
Alderwaggers have begun to trickle into the game this weekend. We may start exercising our claims now that we actually have a few players to do so with. I'm sorry this situation caused controversy among the NAP signatories. I honestly didn't think it would be a big deal.

I'm sorry, every time I see your name it mentally reads to me as "Scabies".

Goblin Squad Member

No True Resurrection for YOU, Bluddwolf!


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If there is a more convenient PvP window for you to occupy your towers, Shaibes, let me know and I will adjust ours.

Goblinworks Executive Founder

Shaibes wrote:
Alderwaggers have begun to trickle into the game this weekend. We may start exercising our claims now that we actually have a few players to do so with. I'm sorry this situation caused controversy among the NAP signatories. I honestly didn't think it would be a big deal.

There's no controversy at all. Just a little bit of confusion.

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