Using Vicious to your advantage

[Luecian]

So, this all came about when I stumbled upon the Shadow Barbs spell

Shadow Barbs

Spoiler:

School illusion (shadow) [darkness]; Level cleric 4, inquisitor 4, sorcerer/wizard 4

CASTING
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S, M (a single link from a spiked chain)

EFFECT
Range 0 ft.
Effect spiked chain-like shadowy weapon
Duration 1 round/level
Saving Throw Will negates (see text); Spell Resistance no

DESCRIPTION
When you cast this spell, you create a shadowy spiked chain that shimmers and pulses with darkness. The chain exists as long as you carry it; if you ever drop the chain, give it to another, or are disarmed, it immediately vanishes and the spell’s duration ends.

The chain radiates darkness in a 10-foot-radius spread around you, reducing the illumination level in this area by one step, but not below the level of dim light.

You can wield the shadow barbs as a spiked chain as if you were fully proficient with spiked chains. Any additional abilities or feats that you possess that apply to spiked chains apply to the shadow barbs as well. The weapon functions as a +2 vicious spiked chain. Its enhancement bonus increases to +3 at caster level 11th, to +4 at caster level 15th, and finally to +5 at caster level 19th. When the spell effect ends, you can make a Will save against the spell—if successful, all of the damage caused to you by the shadow barbs’ vicious weapon quality vanishes, unless you are dead or unconscious at the time the spell ends, in which case you automatically fail this Will save and the vicious weapon damage remains.

Level 7 for Cleric and Wizard, 8 for Sorcerer and 10 for Inquisitor, I think it is an interesting spell for Zon-Kuthon Worshipers.

So I was wondering the thoughts of others on a Spiked Chain Cleric, or at level 7 would you probably have a better weapon if a Battle/Supporting cleric. And is there anyway to use the Vicious negative feature to your advantage.

By your advantage I am talking about any abilities that kick off when you take damage, or any ways to channel the damage on myself back into the enemy. I know Vicious Damage goes over DR, and there may be a way to absorb it but I would rather do more than simply ignore the damage.

[Luecian]

Going through spells and Domains at the moment, I have not see any real feats that seem to help with what I am looking for.

[Luecian]

So far in my own hunting, I have not found any feats, domains or anything that is helpful sadly. If anyone has any ideas be good to know.

[Markov Spiked Chain]

Spell Storing and Shared Sacrifice?

[Reynard_the_fox]

Hmm, so if you make the will save against your own spell you don't take the damage? How curious... that means that a Cleric will always have even odds, since Wis is tied to both the DC and will saves, but a low-Cha high-Wis Oracle is much less likely to take damage than a high-Cha low-Wis one.

Anyway, Shared Sacrifice is definitely the spell you're looking for.

[Luecian]

Oh Shared Sacrifice is a good one, I did not see that spell till now and thank you for that Markov.

[Luecian]

Reynard_the_fox wrote:

Hmm, so if you make the will save against your own spell you don't take the damage? How curious... that means that a Cleric will always have even odds, since Wis is tied to both the DC and will saves, but a low-Cha high-Wis Oracle is much less likely to take damage than a high-Cha low-Wis one.

Anyway, Shared Sacrifice is definitely the spell you're looking for.

It is an odd beast, it can also be used by Inquisitors, and Wizards/Sorcerers though with Inquisitor being such a late entry spell wise not really worth it and not many Melee Wizards and Sorcerers.

[Major_Blackhart]

I have a combination suggestion if you're interested.

Fey Foundling at first level, and have some levels of cleric, preferably of a neutral god like Gorum. Then, you'll want to branch off into Holy Vindicator as soon as you're able. Stay neutral alignment, choose for spontaneous positive, then eventually get the versatile channel feat for negative energy. You'll then want to get into Holy Vindicator, and you can make amazing use of the Vicious weapon quality using the Faith Healing ability. Get a stanching armor power and/or a scabbard of stanching and you now have a guy who is immune to his own stigmata damage continuing to drain him. Plus you can spontaneously cast empowered and then maximized cure spells to aid with Vicious.

I choose half-orc for weapon specs. Falchion has a great critical threat range to make use of the Holy Vin's critical based abilities, plus you'll be doing more damage with Channel Smite than you will be with the 2D6 from a greatsword.
My suggestion for a weapon? +4 Vicious conductive keen Adamantine Falchion of Speed. If you want +5, you can skip out on keen and pick up improved critical.

[maouse]

so this is a good cheap permanent darkness spell.. I like.. thanks. (cast once, carry forever, HIPS Shadowdancer's best friend... lol) Isn't there some spell that changes positive and negative energy damage for a round (so you heal when harmed)?

[Suthainn]

maouse wrote:

so this is a good cheap permanent darkness spell.. I like.. thanks. (cast once, carry forever, HIPS Shadowdancer's best friend... lol)

Not so much.

Quote:

Duration 1 round/level

[Rerednaw]

Not sure if it's a factor but without items Shadow Chain+Shared Sacrifice means 2 rounds spent effectively buffing instead of fighting.

2 may be an undesirable delay.

Still like the idea though. Concealment+weapon buff in one spell is pretty nice.

[Imbicatus]

Isn't Shadow Barbs a Zon-Kuthon only spell?

[Luecian]

Imbicatus wrote:

Isn't Shadow Barbs a Zon-Kuthon only spell?

In Inner Sea Magic, it says it was developed by Priests of Zon-Kuthon, but others do use it, including Martially inclined Magi as they say.

[Artemis Moonstar]

Speaking of inner sea magic...

Does the darkness effect of Shadow Barbs count as 'effecting an area'? If so, you can always use Shadow Grasp metamagic feat out of the same book... You're a mobile entangle effect! Not sure if it's pfs legal, or even raw, but I'd allow that in my games.

That said... I don't have anything to assist with the vicious quality outside of Shared Sacrifice and Shield Other. Sorry.

... Would Shared Sacrifice work with Shield Other? As written, according to the pfsrd.... Seems that it would.

OKay, I'm designing a Shadow Barbs wielding cleric that has some fun with Shared Sacrifice and Shield Other as well. Little more than a damage mirror, lol.

[Luecian]

Artemis Moonstar wrote:

Speaking of inner sea magic...

Does the darkness effect of Shadow Barbs count as 'effecting an area'? If so, you can always use Shadow Grasp metamagic feat out of the same book... You're a mobile entangle effect! Not sure if it's pfs legal, or even raw, but I'd allow that in my games.

That said... I don't have anything to assist with the vicious quality outside of Shared Sacrifice and Shield Other. Sorry.

... Would Shared Sacrifice work with Shield Other? As written, according to the pfsrd.... Seems that it would.

OKay, I'm designing a Shadow Barbs wielding cleric that has some fun with Shared Sacrifice and Shield Other as well. Little more than a damage mirror, lol.

With how it is written in the book and the SRD (I own Inner Sea Magic), I would say yes since it has a 10 foot radius centered on you. That is kind of nasty and I like it. Not sure if it is PFS legal but that would be one of those rules questions I can not answer.