I guess I really missed something. What are you talking about?
I was impressed by how they managed to work in sexual tension between Wells and Hartley without any direct dialogue.
There was a certain amount of sexual tension between the two of them during the chess game. I thought I'd imagined it at first, until they mentioned later about Hartley's coming out estranging him from his family. I'm thinking there was more to West and Hartley's relationship than just "boss" and "number one guy."
Ok... so when you guys are saying there was tension between WEST (Iris or perhaps her dad) and Hartley, you're actually meaning tension between WELLS and Hartley.
That had me confused for a bit.
Whoops, yeah, my bad. I meant Wells. Edited my one post, but too late for the other. Apologies for the confusion.
|
I enjoyed those hints as well. They provide an extra layer of interesting storyline and motivation to several characters.
Overall, I liked the way they portrayed Pied Piper. Except for the arrogant egg-head bit (which fit really well), he had a lot in common with the version I grew up reading (in the Wally West comics). It'll be interesting to see if they make him go the way of reformed ally to the Flash.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I'm getting really frustrated with this series...
It's very fun and has likable characters, but it suffers from the same problem of Flash's comics: It's a guy who can move at the speed of light vs enemies whose powers is... Shooting an ice gun. Or throwing a boomerang.
Admittedly, The Flash in the series is not as fast as his comics counterpart (yet), but still, he's fast enough that most, if not all, of his battles should be easily won in a few seconds.
It annoys me to no end that every single fight Barry has to hold the idiot ball just because his opponent is not nearly as powerful as him. :/
Still, I really like its characters... So I hold on.
Sorry I missed your point about the comics, I didn't see you mentioned it.
Haha. No problem.
I know why they write it the way they do... But it gets old really fast for me. It frustrates me to see Barry having difficulty to fight a guy with the stamina and durability of a normal human. He could just go on, throw a hundred punches at the guy in half a second and go away... But he doesn't, because the writers have to pretend the guy with a boomerang is a threat. It also annoys me how inconsistent Barry's speed is.
This is the main reason why I don't like Flash comics. Superman and GL at least face other heavy-weight enemies. The only Flash villain that is real threat to him is... literally an evil version of himself. ¬¬'
I mean, they could conceivably make some enemies that could face Flash, like the guy who turns into gas or the one who is invulnerable and super strong... But most of them only present a threat because Barry (and his team of super smart allies) acts like an idiot.
Problem is that they gradually took The Flash's (and Superman's) powers too far, so the only choices they have is to increase the power level of every enemy or give the hero the idiot ball... And since the less overpowered heroes have to be useful, they can't just make every enemy an overpowered monster... So idiot ball it is.
Yah,
The fights in Flash always make me cringe. I think the show is fun but the writers don't really seem to get this part. And at the end of the day, there are ways.
For instance, fighting a guy with sonic gloves? Let his power surround him in an expanding sphere. No matter where you go, you're getting hit.
Of course, in that case "he wanted to lose" both times. That's also valid, i.e., get the Flash to touch the bad tech. Effect happens.
Also,
I'd like to point out that the problem is really hard in this case, since technically it seems the Flash could just go super speed, run in circles, and be able to treat each "combat round" the way a PC* does, thinking about it FOREVER.
(or a member of the TV audience, for that matter)
I'm having a hard time seeing them turning Caitlin into a villain.
Agreed, and they may not do it. I could see it just being a red herring and them using one of the previous incarnations of the character instead (if they decide to have a Killer Frost on this or another show as a foil to Firestorm). The Caitlin Snow version is a relatively new identity of the character, after all.
|
|
It might be that they included her character as a potential villain - something of a "break glass in case of...." feature.
Or as a way to introduce some of the older versions of Killer Frost. Maybe she was friends (or enemies) with Crystal Frost or Louise Lincoln. And maybe that other person was also in love with Ronnie.....
Crystal Frost? Hmmm. Maybe Cait has a sister?
|
|
While I enjoyed last night's episode, and the continued build up to Firestorm, I had one major problem with it - the villain of the week.
From the moment they first introduced her back in the Wally West comics, I never liked Peekaboo, for one simple reason.
I HATE THAT F*$$ING CODE-NAME! IT'S IDIOTIC.
Seriously, what self-respecting super villain would allow themselves to be (or even choose) to be named after a game you play with infants and toddlers?
I liked a lot about last night's episode, but I agree- the villain of the week was boring. That whole storyline was boring. It's funny, but this is a case where the A-Plot actually made the whole series of B-Plots disjointed and uneven. I would rather they have simply spent more time on all the other stuff, and abandoned the "Peekaboo" story (I didn't even realize that was her name; not familiar with the character, and Cisco didn't name her that I recall.)
Nice Easter Egg with Blackhawk Securities. Plus, that teaser at the end. I know they'd been hinting around it, but I honestly never thought I'd see the day when that particular character would appear in a live-action comic show in a serious, dramatic way, and not as a joke. Love it.
Nice Easter Egg with Blackhawk Securities. Plus, that teaser at the end. I know they'd been hinting around it, but I honestly never thought I'd see the day when that particular character would appear in a live-action comic show in a serious, dramatic way, and not as a joke. Love it.
Yeah... That's one character that really shouldn't work in live-action, but they seem to have pulled it off... Hopefully the character's main appearance will be as good as the teaser. :)
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Erm, Caitlin named her. It's not as if all of the villains call themselves the names (mostly) Cisco gives them.
Erm, Caitlin named her. It's not as if all of the villains call themselves the names (mostly) Cisco gives them.
I missed it! :(
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
The one real take-away I got from this episode is that Cisco understands a great many things, but the concept of imprisonment is not one of them.
The one real take-away I got from this episode is that Cisco understands a great many things, but the concept of imprisonment is not one of them.
Yeah he's really kind of bad at that.
I found the drunk Caitlin subplot a bit weird, particularly the whole "Did you sneak a peek at my goodies? it's okay if you snuck a peek, you deserve a peek for all you do" moment. I get that she doesn't drink much, but it just felt insanely out of character for her.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Much like Felcity and Oliver over on Arrow disrupting the planned relationship of Oliver and Laurel, I think the chemistry between Caitlin and Barry has disrupted the original plan of Barry and Iris. That's what I think the 'goodies' part was about.
Felicity and Ollie would a much better couple, really...
Anyway, it's kinda odd to see Cisco being so competent in a fist fight. Didn't see that one coming...
You've never seen one of my female friends drunk then. She is very calm, collected and kinda cold, but the moment ethanol hits the blood stream? Uninhibited woo girl.
Yeah I have friends like that too. Hell, I get really hug happy if I get drunk (it's not unusual for me to hug one particular group of friends, it's just what we do, but the others I'm a bit more reserved with unless I've been drinking), and will often just start hanging off people (so long as I'm sure they don't mind) while chatting with them.
But Caitlin in that episode felt like it was going further than I'd expect even for one of my friends. Maybe it's just that she's so straight laced normally that it's a bit jarring to suddenly see that.
|
|
Nice Easter Egg with Blackhawk Securities. Plus, that teaser at the end. I know they'd been hinting around it, but I honestly never thought I'd see the day when that particular character would appear in a live-action comic show in a serious, dramatic way, and not as a joke. Love it.Yeah... That's one character that really shouldn't work in live-action, but they seem to have pulled it off... Hopefully the character's main appearance will be as good as the teaser. :)
Indeed! I was stoked. Grodd is one of my all-time favorite Flash Villains. Some of the stories they did with him during the Wally West Flash era were really awesome. I hope they keep the build up to him fairly slow.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Anyway, it's kinda odd to see Cisco being so competent in a fist fight. Didn't see that one coming...
Well, it was a fistfight against Hartley, who doesn't seem as if he's the world's greatest athlete himself.
That said, I thought it was kind of cool, although after being slammed against a wall, Hartley shouldn't have been able to pull a WWF and turn the tables like he did.
As for the Caitlin drunk thing, like DM Barcas says, it was more about the continued slow-build of her attraction to Barry than anything. It's been subtle, but the character has been playing things that way practically all season. She didn't invite herself along to the "stakeout" and get all dressed up just because she hoped to hook up with some random person, nor was her questioning Barry about whether he was going to call Linda random either. And the subtext of her convo with Barry at the end pretty much laid it all out right there, even if Barry remains clueless to it.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Felicity and Ollie would a much better couple, really...
God no.
Felicity and Ollie would a much better couple, really...God no.
Anything is better than Laurel and... Well, anyone. Her character is just... so freaking annoying.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Her being relegated to simply "the ove interest" is much better for the show than mashing together two characters who can be interesting apart, but when put together suck all the life out of the room.
Because apparently the only way they could show Felicity was in lov with Ollie was if she became a soap opera character all of a sudden.
|
|
As for the Caitlin drunk thing, like DM Barcas says, it was more about the continued slow-build of her attraction to Barry than anything. It's been subtle, but the character has been playing things that way practically all season. She didn't invite herself along to the "stakeout" and get all dressed up just because she hoped to hook up with some random person, nor was her questioning Barry about whether he was going to call Linda random either. And the subtext of her convo with Barry at the end pretty much laid it all out right there, even if Barry remains clueless to it.
After that episode I wanted to slap Barry in the face for not hooking up with the delectable Dr. Snow. If I had a super-smart hottie after me, and was that clueless about it, I'd certainly be thankful for the slap.
Her being relegated to simply "the ove interest" is much better for the show than mashing together two characters who can be interesting apart, but when put together suck all the life out of the room.
Because apparently the only way they could show Felicity was in lov with Ollie was if she became a soap opera character all of a sudden.
Fair enough... But still, Laurel is so bland and annoying that I feel having her as a major relationship in any character's life makes said character less interesting.
|
Well, most men are clueless. I certainly was because I, somehow failed to notice that a girl was in love with me. And she wasn't too subtle about it either.
She was more subtle than the girl who gave him her number, who he also seemed pretty clueless about until the very end.
It was worth it to seem the look of entitled disappointment on Iris's face as she realized that Barry wasn't hanging on her every word. :D
But yeah, if Barry doesn't want Caitlin, I'll be happy to take her. ;)
The "girl at the bar" is Linda Park, so Wally -- er, Barry -- is almost required to create a connection there, as superior as Caitlin undoubtedly is.
Also, with Ronnie Raymond scheduled to be temporarily separated from Martin Stein shortly, what would be the point of Barry + Caitlin, from the writers' point of view? All it would do is create a triangle from which Barry would immediately extricate himself, because that's how he rolls, even with someone he's been in love with for years.
| 4 people marked this as a favorite. |
@Hama - Fortunately, as long both Panabakers keep working, we don't have to choose.
also @Hama - Speaking as a man, I agree that most of us are clueless. When it comes to that kind of thing I pretty much have to be hit over the head, and that doesn't always work.
But in addition to the basic obliviousness, a lot of guys, if they're not completely hung up on themselves, have this automatic mindset that "someone that hot/smart/successful* couldn't possibly be interested in someone like me", which means that even if they detect signals, they automatically assume they must be misreading them.
*as would apply to both Caitlin Snow and Danielle Panabaker, for example.
Sorry I missed your point about the comics, I didn't see you mentioned it.Haha. No problem.
I know why they write it the way they do...
Problem is that they gradually took The Flash's (and Superman's) powers too far, so the only choices they have is to increase the power level of every enemy or give the hero the idiot ball... And since the less overpowered heroes have to be useful, they can't just make every enemy an overpowered monster... So idiot ball it is.
Good point, and to be honest i do not totally disagree.
Although I would also point out that if flash is running around me at superspeed i could hit him just by sticking out my arm. :)(Granted, at that speed I would BREAK said arm, but still) ;P
Seriously, I think it is less 'idiotball' at this point in the show, as he is just starting out, and has not yet mastered his speed. (Although he is learning almost 1 new trick per episode now, so it won't take long.) :/
Without spoilers, it was recently pointed out in a recent flash comic, very painfully, that Barry's 'only' skill is superspeed. Yes, he can hit you 30 or 40 times before you can blink. But in all of the years of comics, he never actually learned to fight. (IE= Took lessons from a martial artist) Which is why TV Flash is at a disadvantage vs 'Reverse-Flash'.
I thought they pointed this out very well in the Flash/Arrow crossover. Barry says that Ollie is literally standing still when they fight. Yet Ollie is so skilled in fighting he still manages to land a few hits.
I don't know. I do see your point, but I like the way they are dealing with it too. And I like that when I watch it, I don't get a feeling of 'man this would be great if he wasn't such an idjit'. (Well, except about women, but that's ANOTHER story) :)
Personally, despite the fact that flash should be able to run up to Capt Cold and grab his gun, I am also willing to accept the fact that sometimes the bad guy gets lucky and aims at where flash is running to, instead of where he was. :)
ANYway, my 2 cents. I am really enjoying the Flash. More so than Arrow at this point. I'll wait til the rest of the shows this season before pronouncing my final verdict. :)
@Hama - Fortunately, as long both Panabakers keep working, we don't have to choose.The only thing that Kay has done to do with TV or movies since 2011 was a couple of roles (one voice acting) in 2012. Hasn't working in the business since then.
That's funny- until your posts, I didn't even realize Danielle Panabaker had a sister. I thought she was the same girl that starred in the deplorable (to me) No Ordinary Family.
Knowing she isn't, makes me like her a little better.
Good point, and to be honest i do not totally disagree.
Although I would also point out that if flash is running around me at superspeed i could hit him just by sticking out my arm. :)
(Granted, at that speed I would BREAK said arm, but still) ;PSeriously, I think it is less 'idiotball' at this point in the show, as he is just starting out, and has not yet mastered his speed. (Although he is learning almost 1 new trick per episode now, so it won't take long.) :/
True. And in fact, the impact would be exactly the same to him and to your arm, so you would probably break your arm, for him, it would be like being clotheslined by a guy running at mac 2 (or whatever other impossibly high speed The Flash is running at the moment), so his injuries would be worse.
However, that idea goes out the window when your remember that Flash can not only move super fast, but also react at superhuman speed. For him, it'd be like you were sticking your arm in slow motion... It'd be extremely easy to avoid (he can easily dodge bullets!)
Without spoilers, it was recently pointed out in a recent flash comic, very painfully, that Barry's 'only' skill is superspeed. Yes, he can hit you 30 or 40 times before you can blink. But in all of the years of comics, he never actually learned to fight. (IE= Took lessons from a martial artist) Which is why TV Flash is at a disadvantage vs 'Reverse-Flash'.
You don't need any combat experience to avoid being hit by a guy punching in slow motion.
And if he hits fast enough to hit 30 or 40 times, imagine the kinetic force in each of those punches! But even ignoring that... Even assuming each of Flash's superfast punches have as much impact as a normal punch (seems to be the case, actually), they still are 30 or 40 punches in half a second!
I thought they pointed this out very well in the Flash/Arrow crossover. Barry says that Ollie is literally standing still when they fight. Yet Ollie is so skilled in fighting he still manages to land a few hits.
Only because of plot armor, really. You can't have one of the heroes completely outmaneuver the other one, even if they should be able to. It doesn't matter how skilled you are when your target is so fast that it looks like you're standing still. Ask a professional boxer to punch you in veeeeeeeeeery slowly and you'll see what I mean.
Realistically, the only way for a normal human to hit the Flash is catching him by surprise (like shooting him from a really long distance from an angle where you can't see the bullet. In fact, striking at Barry's blind spots is what Oliver does at first). Admittedly, super-speed is one of the most difficult powers to write in a character without super-strength/durability, time manipulation and/or magic-based powers.
Personally, despite the fact that flash should be able to run up to Capt Cold and grab his gun, I am also willing to accept the fact that sometimes the bad guy gets lucky and aims at where flash is running...
Sometimes, it makes sense... Most of the time, Flash is not willing to cause serious injuries to his opponents, which explain why he just doesn't take a baseball bat and beats the crap out of the villain-of-week... But he could, for example, tie them up with rope, disarm them, hit more lightly or even just carry them into a prison cell (he's obviously capable of carrying people without causing them harm).
I enjoy the show because I really like its characters, but most combat scenes make me grind my teeth in frustration...
Yeah, by all rights nobody up to now should have stood a chance against him. Even Hartley/Piper when you think about the fact that Barry should be able to move faster than the sound wave that are bombarding him, or be able to vibratee at a frequency that cancels said vibrations, and so on.
Hopefully we'll get better fight scenes with more villains like Reverse-Flash and Grodd (who as I recall has some telepathic/telekinetic powers which could easily catch Barry off guard).
Good points Lemmy.
And I confess that I agree with your logic.
In my comic collection from the 70's (Which is where I started collecting at) :) I do recall there being a lot of inconsistency regarding the Flash's (and Superman's as well) Super Speed powers. For the first encounter in the issue the villain would completely catch the Flash off guard, despite the fact that he was a primary 'Flash's Rogue Gallery' Villain and they had fought many times before. Then the Flash would come back and beat him with ease. Even as a kid I remember asking, 'Why didn't he do that the first time?' :P
I don't pretend it ever made any SENSE, it just made for a fun read. :)
Then again, I never really had any issue with accepting that Comic book reality was different from Real-reality. When they started trying to make the two merge, THAT is when they started having to come up with all these explanations for things that we as kids had simply accepted as Comic-fact for years. :)
(Eg-When Wally took over as Flash, they suddenly felt that they had to explain why the Flash didn't simply shred himself to ribbons on the dust in the air when he ran at super speed. They came up with a 'Friction Shield' or some such that he generated when he ran.)
Anyway, long-winded way of basically agreeing with you. :)
Just trying to say that while I understand why the disjointed 'Super-speed realisims' may bother some folks, it in no way has detracted from my enjoyment of the show.
Carry on! :D
Yeah, by all rights nobody up to now should have stood a chance against him. Even Hartley/Piper when you think about the fact that Barry should be able to move faster than the sound wave that are bombarding him, or be able to vibratee at a frequency that cancels said vibrations, and so on.
Hopefully we'll get better fight scenes with more villains like Reverse-Flash and Grodd (who as I recall has some telepathic/telekinetic powers which could easily catch Barry off guard).
Do we know how they are re-writing Grodd's origin at this point?
In the original origin, he was from Gorilla City, and was a chief scientist and leader who was ousted for trying to take over. I presume that THIS version will be more 'Planet of the Apes' and less 'Gorilla City'.
Grodd did have telepathic powers in the comics. Usually enhanced by technology so he could affect Supers IIRC. He has never been one of my favorite villains, but I am looking forward to seeing what they do with him.