I would say "Epic Story Ritual" :D
My Cleric did something similar once, we were in the tome of an ancient general (one of the good guys) and one of his officers spirit (a dwarf) were cursed to wander the tome. The curse was so spelled that we can't kill (and so release) the spirit. The only way was to find the officers body (which was already destroyed).
My Moradin Cleric used "Planar Ally" to ask Moradin to sent us an ally or some help.
The spell fades and nothing happend. During the night the group heard the sound of anvil & hammer in the distance and next morning a dwarven body made of metal and stone lies in our camp. We then could use it as a new body for the restles soul. :)
| 5 people marked this as a favorite. |
Yeah. Specifically you need to travel to the apocryphal mountains where you use the unobtainium sphere in conjunction with a ritual of the deux ex machina to craft a sufficient quantity of handwavium for your purposes.
DM fiat in other words.
If all that is left of the corpse is its bones, then Gentle Repose wasn't cast, it prevents decay.
I think what you're going to end up with in a situation like this is GM fiat. Some sort of collaboration of powerful clerics and wizards, maybe even a deity. Otherwise the best mechanical application would be a Wish spell, but even that would be put into the category of a GM fiated wish. This is a case where story must accomplish what rules don't cover.
Sure, it's ultimately up to the GM as to whether or not it would work but personally I would allow a carefully worded wish or miracle used in conjunction with true resurrection to work without any problem... provided that the person being rezzed want to return that is.
That last part would be a pretty big catch. After being in the afterlife for 1,000 years who'd want to come back? Unless their afterlife has been horrible for some reason they aren't likely to have any reason to return.
|
Resurrection by a level 100 cleric? I guess not even wish or miracle could do it. Why do you want to resurrect it so badly?
You could try to gate in whatever the outsider is that formed from his soul, if you happen to know his name. Planar Ally/Binding spells might work depending on the number of hit dice. (Provided that the outsider hasn't been killed yet)
Edit: Ninja'd lol. I really need to refresh more often.
Plot magic aside:
Did they die a violent death, aka, not from old age? Then a simple True Resurrection cast by a CL 100 caster(10 * 100 = 1000, and there are ways to boost it that high; massive witch covens for example).
Much simpler, a Miracle could do it imo, since it would fall under the realm of the request part with the 25,000. Still falls under DM fiat, but at least it's mechanically backed fiat.
I didn't think about the time travel angle.
Scepter of Ages is the clear choice. Go back in time, compel the person that unless they come with you they are going to die (which isn't really a lie), and then you have the chance to Marty Mcfly things all up.
I’m going to expand on my answer a bit. As far as I am aware there is no single spell or ability that would allow it though it may be possible to boost a spell high enough I'm not sure. Having said that doesn’t mean it can’t be done. Now several people have mentioned GM fiat. That’s essentially true since they’d have to say whether or not your idea would or could work. However, I dislike that phrase since it tends to be referring to a GM ignoring existing rules or doing something that makes no sense other then it’s what they decided would happen.
This isn’t exactly that kind of situation. There are perfectly valid, albeit powerful spells that could conceivably work but if and how it would work is something the GM will have to ultimately say. Much like a character spontaneously wanting to swing from a chandelier during a bar fight. You should be able to try it, but the GM has to decide if it’s possible, for example can the chandelier support your weight to start with, and if so what are the mechanics, skill checks, etc. that will be involved.
My suggestion would be talk to the GM and simply ask if something like a wish/miracle in conjunction with a true resurrection could work or if, using a skill like knowledge (arcana), you could figure out what might. Perhaps he’ll decide that a wish could tie several resurrection spells together and as long as you have enough total caster levels to reach 1,000 years back. Or maybe he’ll make a judgment call and veto it altogether. Ultimately however I believe you are going to have to take it up with your GM.
Oh and also their actually may be several ways to do it depending on what's allowed, such as using various 3rd party material, but I'm keeping away from that at the moment since idk what's allowed.
there is nothing in PF short of DM fiat
but 3rd party material. such as i think the 3.5 epic level handbook had an epic level spell you could do this with at 100 years per caster level with the side of effect of restoring the target's youth to that of a young adult. allowing such things as the bypassing of death by age.
|
|
You could bring him back as undead, though I'm not sure if that would do you much good. So from Lesser Animate Dead all the way through to Create Greater Undead you have some options. RAW you can do this, but in Golarion you need the mangled soul of the deceased to create undead. This could pose a problem as the soul probably went through the circle of life again:
Birth on the material Plane -> Death -> Become a petitioner -> Become a higher ranked outsider or -> Death -> Return to the positive energy plane to be reformed into a new soul -> Birth on the material plane
Which is why you couldn't resurrect it in the first place. But yeah, RAW it is certainly possible to turn his remains into a mohrg or something like that.
Your DM probably didn't want you to resurrect it in the first place though, so it's best to leave it alone. You certainly don't want to use wish, as it goes beyond the scope of a normal wish and could easily be twisted by the GM.
By RAW you probably can't do it. But have your spellcaster research a special resurrection spell that can only be used with the very specific circumstances of this individual. Make it require extremely rare and expensive material components.
If all that is left of the corpse is its bones, then Gentle Repose wasn't cast, it prevents decay.
Gentle Repose is a great spell, but I'd say that a millennium is a bit too much to expect it to last.
The real question is why is this an issue?
Keep in mind that the rules of magic are mainly intended to set scopes on PC actions. If you as a DM want something to happen, then just make it so. If you want players to work for that something... it sounds like to me like a seed for quest!
Duration 1 day/level
chances are said dead person is now an outsider.. or portion of an outsider, as such I'd not allow the spell to work unless circumstances take this specific case into account. I'd allow linked resurrection spells or the like adding together caster level of the priests if there is a likely reason to assume it didn't pass on to live another life of sorts. Even then perhaps an outsider can be bargained with to return the soul formerly known as XXXXX to life, possibly giving up part of itself to seal the deal. Better have either a very good reason or an offer it can't refuse.
chances are said dead person is now an outsider.. or portion of an outsider, as such I'd not allow the spell to work unless circumstances take this specific case into account. I'd allow linked resurrection spells or the like adding together caster level of the priests if there is a likely reason to assume it didn't pass on to live another life of sorts. Even then perhaps an outsider can be bargained with to return the soul formerly known as XXXXX to life, possibly giving up part of itself to seal the deal. Better have either a very good reason or an offer it can't refuse.
That's a pretty good story idea. Gotta go find the specific outsider that the soul transformed into and convince it to retrogress itself back into a mortal soul. After 1,000 years, what if you're talking to an astral deva or something by this point? 0_0
In Golarion, you'd probably have to strike some sort of deal with Pharasma at this point; especially if that soul has already been judged.
Greetings. I was wondering if there was a way to resurrect someone whos been dead for over 1000 years? Or if there would be a way to bring just the soul back into a new body or any vessal? Even bringing them back as undead. All that is left of the corpse is bones.
Thanks for the help
A miracle used in conjunction with True Ressurection might be able to do such. I would assume it would be a greater use of miracle so required the proper expenditure of resources.
While that falls under the previously stated GM fiat in the end it gives you a point that is possible for an appropriately powerful group to try.
Wish or miracle could do this. Just because RAW includes a definitive list of the capabilities on those spells is no reason at all that there are any limitations on those spells. I agree that 'Fiat sounds cheezy' but wish and miracle are written in such a way that the gate is left open for 'anything's possible'
The publisher does such things with regularity. 'Runelords perfected ioun stones and runelords have found a process for stapling ioun stones to their own forehead'...
It sounds ludicrous but its no new news. It is written to simply be accepted as written, and accomplishing the same feat with a pc is still happily tolerated as 'just not possible'...
If the impossible only works on NPC's well. The guy they're trying to raise is an npc right? Take a lesson from 2e tome of magic. Maybe miracle in combination with cooperative magic. It'll take 21 priests, 1 to cast a miracle, 20 to cast ressurection at the same time under a full harvest moon. How many priests does it take to screw in a lightbulb...
Fiat is the only way, but there are decent ways to bend existing rules without breaking them. Maybe its 20 miracles and 1 resurrection. There's nothing in the wording of wish and miracle that would limits you from even presuming 1 miracle alone isnt enough, unless you'd like for that particular usage of the miracle to not be further abused by the party in the future. After all there is wording in 'reincarnate' that says all it takes is a wish or miracle to revert a reincarnated person back to his original form. Thats kinda what 'miracle' means. It couldn't have happened any other way.
Its the very definition of deus ex machina. A mechanic by which the spellcasting power that is only able to be brought to bear by the gods themselves. A deific intervention which the players have the ability to request simply by casting the miracle spell.
Some GMs work under the assumption that wishes and miracles can only do the things exactly listed under the spell description and thats it. Nothing else. Ever ever ever. But that doesn't have to be the way you run it, and the language of the spell leaves the fiat door open for exactly these occasions.
GM fiat seems to be the clear choice here. Yes there are mechanical applications, but even amidst the mechanical applications there is some GM fiat/discretion needed. If the target in question weren't just a skeleton I'd suggest having a storyline where Gentle Repose was cast regularly on the corpse. Maybe the body was that of a hero and it was placed in a temple, and one of the acolytes' jobs every few days was to cast Gentle Repose on the body. Or maybe, if the GM allows it, Gentle Repose made permanent. Think Snow White in her crystal coffin, waiting for the perfect confluence of divine favor to reawaken. Whatever the choice, there are some available mechanical options, they will just all need to be discussed with the GM prior to game session. As it stands, short of a high level artifact, there are no spells or powers where you can point at the RAW and say, "here, it clearly says, raise a millennium-aged corpse."
@LazarX and Tiny Coffee Golem
No I definitely like MendedWall12's snow white suggestion. Someone should have to kiss him. Collaborative castings and miracles and hexes for seasoning but someone in the party should definitely have to kiss him right on his 1000 year old boney teeth.
Call this party member 'the fated one'
Since there are no clothes around these bones, the now no longer dead but still completely naked dude should stand up, slap the character on the ass and in a deep and churlish voice say 'thanks, toots!'.... And with nothing more than a wink, just walk out of the room... It works better if the dead guy is a surly grizzled warhammer dwarf, but such things have probably already been decided.
Works better in a party full of straight dudes though... Since this man is from a different era, he should definitely have significantly more hair in significantly more places than usual.
|
A couple of times I've wanted a PC who comes from a 1000 years or more before the current campaign.
The first time was in 2nd ed. I imagined a paladin with an intelligent Frost Brand sword. She wore a fireproof glove and, on the same hand, a Ring of Regeneration.
She fell into lava. Died. Her body was destroyed but a combination of fireproof glove encasing a hand holding a sword which protects against heat, with the ring keeping the spark of life in the charred lump of flesh.
Time passes. The lava cools and eventually becomes obsidian. (I'm not a geologist; sue me!) A lot more time passes, and normal geological processes move this obsidian to the surface. Weathering eventually uncovers the sword and the stump. As soon as there is room to do so, the ring regenerates the whole body. She appears naked apart from a glove, the ring and a sword she can't let go.
This is how I got a paladin into the world of Dark Sun.
The other idea is simpler: trap the soul. The gem containing the soul can be crushed and the trapped soul will have it's body and gear regenerated instantly. The soul could have been trapped millennia ago.
Perhaps trapped in "carbonite." Use a higher level Sepita Snake Sigil that doesn't have the time limit.
I think the greatest mechanical hang up here is that the "body" is nothing but bones. This means that a Sepia Snake Sigil, and Trap the Soul are out of the question, because the one traps the body agelessly (if GM fiat allows for permanency), and the other traps the entire body so there wouldn't even be bones left. Of course if you went with Trap the Soul (again you're going to have to use some narrative elements, and possibly some GM fiat) you could say that the bones were of a different corpse, there to throw people off, and that the gem with the trapped soul is hidden in the skull.
I feel like this thread should be renamed 1001 plot hooks using a millennium corpse. :P
Clone specifically says you have to have a piece of undecayed flesh. After 1000 years I don't think there's going to be any flesh left on the bones.
Restore corpse spell?
I am not saying that a miracle or wish wouldn't work but we know that those spells have limitations.
In the begging of Shattered Star a gigantic tsunami (it's not an oxymoron in this case) hits the varissan gulf and possibly more and the book says that while a wish or miracle (the players have access to those through a luck sword and a scroll of miracle) can definitely save the city of magnimar, it also states that a single miracle or wish isn't enough to stop the gigantic tsunami altogether.
Restore corpse spell?
Problem with that is Clone requires the cubic inch of flesh to have been taken from the person's "living body." Restoring the flesh after death doesn't make it fit for the Clone spell. Intriguing idea though. I wonder if there's something else that could work in conjunction with restore corpse...