If you stumble across a group of these intelligent undead when they are not aware of you, what would they be doing with their idle time?
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Playing table top RPGs?
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Sudoku
They hold endless staring contests in which, being undead, none of them ever needs to blink.
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* Art: whittling bones into horrific shapes, or painting nightmarish scenes in blood.
* Games: playing with their food, such as almost letting them get away before recapturing them.
* Cuisine: practicing the high art of fine cooking with long pig, or just boiling a basic human stock.
* Brewing: can blood be fermented? Inquiring minds want to know.
* Literature: reading (or writing) elaborate dramas that give catharsis for their odd failure to dominate the world, despite paralysis and conversion attacks.
* Business: assembling caravans to trade the unique flesh and bones of sentients in one area for those in another.
* Laziness: just kind of sitting around, staring into the distance.
* Gambling: you know, tossing the bones.
* Gossiping: Oh. Em. Gee. Did you hear about Halithupt? He was fighting these adventurers, and he just couldn't even paralyze any of them. He finally had to run away. Talk about "impotent"!
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Ghouls have a complicated, ritualized form of courtship not easily understood by living beings that has been noted to include grooming and mutual combat. The events can take months or even years to complete, after which one of the pair will consume the other while the rest of their pack will watch in silence.
They are probably thinking of better ways to ambush people. :)
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They are ambushing somebody else
Pretending to be dead for long periods of time. For the novelty.
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Though most surface ghouls live primitively, rumors speak of ghoul cities deep underground led by priests who worship ancient cruel gods or strange demon lords of hunger. These “civilized” ghouls are no less horrific in their eating habits, and in fact the concept of a well-laid ghoul banquet table is perhaps even more horrifying than the concept of taking a meal fresh from the coffin.
So, they apparently live their "primitive life", which I would suspect mainly consist in scavenging for food and hiding of... predators? I would assume some remnants of their previous civilized life, such as somes means of distraction/amusement/game and a basic hierarchy or pack structure (with the typical challenges etc).
Indeed. Much of a ghoul's life is taken from HP Lovecraft's Dream Quest of the Unknown Kadath, where there is a civilization of them that live as humans do underground. Only, their grisly diet is treated like normal. In addition, I believe they eat Gugs.
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debate philosophy.
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What do Ghouls do when not waiting in Ambush?
Planning the Ambush. No, obsessing over planning the ambush.
In my mind, Ghouls are like gluttonous crack addicts, it's not about being physically hungry, It's about being emotionally, spiritually hungry. They don't need to eat, they are undead. The want to eat, they crave the flesh.
Think about Tigers or lions or other ravenous predators, if they aren't gorging themselves on what they just killed, they are resting from the effort or trying to get the next kill. Since Ghouls are undead, there is no rest. So just eating, hunting, and obsessing over the above.
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They read trashy romance novels. And watch reruns of the Batchelor.
for ghoulosh, yes correct spelling
What do Ghouls do when not waiting in Ambush?
Planning the Ambush. No, obsessing over planning the ambush.
In my mind, Ghouls are like gluttonous crack addicts, it's not about being physically hungry, It's about being emotionally, spiritually hungry. They don't need to eat, they are undead. The want to eat, they crave the flesh.
Think about Tigers or lions or other ravenous predators, if they aren't gorging themselves on what they just killed, they are resting from the effort or trying to get the next kill. Since Ghouls are undead, there is no rest. So just eating, hunting, and obsessing over the above.
I like to think that as intelligent creatures at least a few of them get the brainwave that the craving, as gnawing as it is, is purely a mental and spiritual thing brought on by their condition. So they learn to feed it in other ways.
Ultimately it's about hunger so they train their minds to channel that hunger into other things. The hunger for power. The hunger for perfection in a craft. The hunger to become the perfect torturer. They still feast upon flesh. But it no long becomes obsessive. That I believe is at the core of the more civilized ghoul societies. Control of one's self.
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They sharpen their...accounting skills. When you're undead, nothing is certain but taxes.
What do Ghouls do when not waiting in Ambush?
Planning the Ambush. No, obsessing over planning the ambush.
In my mind, Ghouls are like gluttonous crack addicts, it's not about being physically hungry, It's about being emotionally, spiritually hungry. They don't need to eat, they are undead. The want to eat, they crave the flesh.
Think about Tigers or lions or other ravenous predators, if they aren't gorging themselves on what they just killed, they are resting from the effort or trying to get the next kill. Since Ghouls are undead, there is no rest. So just eating, hunting, and obsessing over the above.
I like to think that as intelligent creatures at least a few of them get the brainwave that the craving, as gnawing as it is, is purely a mental and spiritual thing brought on by their condition. So they learn to feed it in other ways.
Ultimately it's about hunger so they train their minds to channel that hunger into other things. The hunger for power. The hunger for perfection in a craft. The hunger to become the perfect torturer. They still feast upon flesh. But it no long becomes obsessive. That I believe is at the core of the more civilized ghoul societies. Control of one's self.
Well crack addicts are sentient as well. Obsession is like a game of rock paper scissors where obsession always wins.
Rising above the obsession? maybe that's something that makes a ghoul into a Ghast?
They sit around discussing the latest episode of 'Here Comes Honey Boo Boo'....they are evil after all.
They watch reruns of True Blood.
They sit around discussing the latest episode of 'Here Comes Honey Boo Boo'....they are evil after all.
They argue over who would get to suck the fat out of the mom's neck.
What do Ghouls do when not waiting in Ambush?
Planning the Ambush. No, obsessing over planning the ambush.
In my mind, Ghouls are like gluttonous crack addicts, it's not about being physically hungry, It's about being emotionally, spiritually hungry. They don't need to eat, they are undead. The want to eat, they crave the flesh.
Think about Tigers or lions or other ravenous predators, if they aren't gorging themselves on what they just killed, they are resting from the effort or trying to get the next kill. Since Ghouls are undead, there is no rest. So just eating, hunting, and obsessing over the above.
I like to think that as intelligent creatures at least a few of them get the brainwave that the craving, as gnawing as it is, is purely a mental and spiritual thing brought on by their condition. So they learn to feed it in other ways.
Ultimately it's about hunger so they train their minds to channel that hunger into other things. The hunger for power. The hunger for perfection in a craft. The hunger to become the perfect torturer. They still feast upon flesh. But it no long becomes obsessive. That I believe is at the core of the more civilized ghoul societies. Control of one's self.
Well crack addicts are sentient as well. Obsession is like a game of rock paper scissors where obsession always wins.
Rising above the obsession? maybe that's something that makes a ghoul into a Ghast?
Well you'd have to ask the underground ghoul civilizations that question. You can't build a civilization on personal obsession. Not unless you channel it into something more constructive.
Well you'd have to ask the underground ghoul civilizations that question. You can't build a civilization on personal obsession. Not unless you channel it into something more constructive.What do Ghouls do when not waiting in Ambush?
Planning the Ambush. No, obsessing over planning the ambush.
In my mind, Ghouls are like gluttonous crack addicts, it's not about being physically hungry, It's about being emotionally, spiritually hungry. They don't need to eat, they are undead. The want to eat, they crave the flesh.
Think about Tigers or lions or other ravenous predators, if they aren't gorging themselves on what they just killed, they are resting from the effort or trying to get the next kill. Since Ghouls are undead, there is no rest. So just eating, hunting, and obsessing over the above.
I like to think that as intelligent creatures at least a few of them get the brainwave that the craving, as gnawing as it is, is purely a mental and spiritual thing brought on by their condition. So they learn to feed it in other ways.
Ultimately it's about hunger so they train their minds to channel that hunger into other things. The hunger for power. The hunger for perfection in a craft. The hunger to become the perfect torturer. They still feast upon flesh. But it no long becomes obsessive. That I believe is at the core of the more civilized ghoul societies. Control of one's self.
Well crack addicts are sentient as well. Obsession is like a game of rock paper scissors where obsession always wins.
Rising above the obsession? maybe that's something that makes a ghoul into a Ghast?
well I know there has been more than one "ecology of the Ghast" written over the years, not that i have bothered to read any of them. But the Ghast is a higher form of Ghoul, so the Rise Above would fit.
As far as an entire civilization based on obsession, several real world civilizations in history have digressed to that (sodom, Rome, etc) The United States has been criticized by others as being just that (a society based on obsession , ie capitalism)
Entire Communes of Druggies exist as their own sub cultures, so therefor are mini societies.
And of course a society of ghouls is fiction, so it's all baseless opinion and theory anyway.
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I think it depends on how you use ghouls in your campaign. I have generally regarded ghouls as itinerant scavengers of corpses. That explains their presence in tombs. So they're usually involved in acquiring corpses, dismembering them, and eating them. My ghouls do not go out of their way to hunt the living, but are happy to dine on them should a party invade their turf or enter a cemetery at night.
But maybe your ghouls are different. If they hunt the living, or serve a necromancer, or have an underground city, they will have to engage in other activities as well. Give then a back story! Why are they where the party finds them? Then you'll realize what they must be doing with backs turned. They won't be idle---their hunger is too great.
Eating breath mints.
Example: in the Carrion crown AP the party comes across ghouls who are in a hole in the ground ( I know this because the killed us all).
We found their tracks leading to the hole.
We set up an ambush assuming they would come out sooner or later, some how, their intiative beat ours, and they overran and paralyzed all but my inquisitor who was able to kite them until the very last, went down swinging....
What WERE they doing in that hole?
Who fell asleep on guard??
Blasted halflings!
There is only one time in CC where ghast(advanced ghouls) might be considered to be in a hole in the ground, and it is not just a hole. There is a reason why there were there*. There is a place with an actual hole in the ground but there are no ghouls there**.
*Trying to avoid spoilers so I won't say where "there" is.
**My group did not like this one much better. :)
edit:I was the GM in this case.
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Well crack addicts are sentient as well. Obsession is like a game of rock paper scissors where obsession always wins.
Rising above the obsession? maybe that's something that makes a ghoul into a Ghast?
One of the books, Classic Horrors Revisited, I think, mentions that ghouls are more likely to advance as class levels than ghasts, in spite of ghasts apparent advantages over ghouls.
My guess as to why this is has to do with monsters with class levels using an ability array instead of the advanced simple template (+4 to all skills), and it's hard to do both. I suppose you could just use the advanced simple template instead of the ability array though, and start adding class levels right onto the ghast as is.
That having been said, I think ghouls, when not actively working toward their next meal, likely have other hobbies and schemes. Some pass themselves off as mundane serial killers, some dig tunnels under graveyards. You didn't think those warrens of tunnels just got there by chance, did you? Those ghouls were digging. Some play musical instruments to ease their suffering. Others, meanwhile, paint with blood or do bone sculptures. It's not that they're into using gore to make art, it's just that blood and bones are what they have available. If they had oil paints, they'd paint with oil paints instead. Of course their subject matter would be no less gory if they used regular paints, because they are addicts and they're always thinking about their next fix. That would come out in anything they create that is capable to conveying the idea of hunger.
Ghouls aren't just about eating living flesh, they'll eat dead flesh and even undead flesh. A pack of ghouls living under a graveyard is living under a smorgasbord. But when they can't find living to eat, and they can't find dead to eat, their hunger may eventually dive them to turn on each other. I suppose it's far more likely that the one to snap first and attack another one is probably torn apart by the pack though.
Some ghouls in Pathfinder materials have other schemes that go beyond their feeding too, but I won't talk too much about them so it's not spoilers.
Even a ghoul who finds them to put greater schemes in motion still sits down to eat a corpse far more often than humans eat meals.
Anyway, that's my take on it.
I plan to have my party encounter their first ghoul standing waist-deep in a mountain stream in daylight trying to catch fish. The ghoul is frustrated with his fishing attempts and at first will casually speak to the party, unless they attack without parlay. Of course even if they do parlay, conversation doesn't last long as he decides they're probably easier to catch than fish, and taste better too. (He was just really caught-up in catching that fish. You know how it is when you're trying to do something...)
There is only one time in CC where ghast(advanced ghouls) might be considered to be in a hole in the ground, and it is not just a hole. There is a reason why there were there*. There is a place with an actual hole in the ground but there are no ghouls there**.
*Trying to avoid spoilers so I won't say where "there" is.
**My group did not like this one much better. :)
edit:I was the GM in this case.
It looked like a hole, we didnt find out why they were there, because we died.
Canasta?
Somewhere, somehow, a ghoul has perfected chess. Another has perfected backgammon. Yet another scoffed at games and has unified the fundamental forces.
I had two thoughts.
An eternal Farting contest (like has been going on for a decade)
and engaging in the 400,000th chorus of the song that never ends,
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The larger ones never get sad....
Big Ghouls don't cry, right?
They do have lots of friends... ghoul-friends.
Really complicated chess? Knucklebones?
I ran a level 1 intro game once for a brand new campaign, and the PCs managed to roleplay with the ghoul there. Their mental stats are surprisingly high, so I was able to make him a kind of Hannibal Lechter fellow named Vandermeer. This was in a newly discovered temple complex under the graveyard, and the ghoul was more starved for conversation than brains. It was really interesting and went in some unexpected directions. Which should have been expected, since the main PC was a 3.5 half-orc wizard. Sometimes it's better to be a smart player than a smart character. I think there was also a swashbuckling cleric, a gnome rogue, a wannabe-sexy-black-leather-clad-ninja druid/fighter, maybe a fighter/cleric half-orc, and some other unusual PCs.
But it all started with a half-orc wizard, who actually started the dungeon wounded from falling down a hole. I think he had Toughness. His 2nd level was barbarian, and then the rest wizard/earth elemental adept or whatever. Battlefield control/summoner.
But ghouls can actually be quite interesting personalities. Much more so than the average orc or gnoll or goblin.
I guess a bit like hyena pack. So lots meandering around, on the look out for fresh graves and easy targets, then sneaking of for back up if needed. Resting at height. Hiding and avoiding obviously overly powerful opposition. Go back to dig sites to retrieve previously buried corpse so they fester
even interact with evil humanoids to fulfill various roles, under threat of destruction
Skills Acrobatics +4, Climb +6, Perception +7, Stealth +7, Swim +3
Str 13, Dex 15, Con —, Int 13, Wis 14, Cha 14
really do have a nice balanced stat and skill set.
I had a somewhat gnoll influenced pirate town that had a big fenced in cemetary that had roving bands of ghouls. Bodies were thrown over the walls and allowed to be eaten.
Ghouls are actually some of the more interesting undead.
If they are so civilised can we expect to find a ghoul's latrine?
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If they are so civilised can we expect to find a ghoul's latrine?
The undead do not poop sir.
Ghouls don't poop. This came up in a game last week, I swear...
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Ghouls, being undead, are effectively immortal if not destroyed. With an average int of 13 ghouls are actually smarter than most humanoids.
Ghouls can even live among the living (there is actually a feat that allows a ghoul to pass as a living humanoid).
Ghouls hunger for the decomposing flesh of humanoids.
Ghouls can form cities, meaning they are capable of cooperating and forming social structures.
That's what we know about ghouls from the description in the bestiary.
Put that all together and you do get a sort of Hannibal Lecter meets Jeffrey Dahmer sort of vibe.
I can't come up with any reason that ghouls wouldn't play games, form relationships, form religions, plot conquests, develop special cuisines, have vocations, etc. Ghoul cities must have ghoul blacksmiths and ghoul police.
So in many cases ghouls would probably be doing a lot of the same things that adventurers would be doing when they weren't actively ambushing or otherwise fighting adventurers.
The interesting question is what sort of relationship ghouls would have with other undead. Would zombies qualify as food? I don't see why not. Perhaps ghouls provide a valuable zombie pest control service to overall Pathfinder societies. Vampires might be viewed unfavorably since the conversion of a living humanoid to an undead vampire might well deprive ghouls of a potential food source. Or maybe vampires also qualify for food.
I would expect that much of the time passed by ghouls, both "civilized" and "primitive" would revolve around plotting ways to gain access to the rotting flesh they crave. Some of these may become elaborate plots, perhaps to create conflict between countries so that wars will break out and the carnage will fill the ghouls' larders.
If you stumble across a group of these intelligent undead when they are not aware of you, what would they be doing with their idle time?
Licking the tops of all the canteens, waterskins and flasks they have amassed. Not only are they ghouls, they're nasty too...
Are fast zombies fast food? Are zombies used as self-propelled food delivery?
Are there undead matchmakers if you're looking for a ghoulfriend?
Are there secret societies of rappers ruled by RZA Ghoul?
Check out Open Design's Empire of the Ghouls if you can get it. Or it's predecessors the two ghoul articles by Wolfgang Baur from 2E: "Kingdom of the Ghouls" from Dungeon #70 and "Ecology of the Ghoul" from Dragon #252.
Open Design also put out the Imperial Gazetteer which is often subtitled "Ghouls and Vampires of the Midgard Campaign"
Also read The Ghoul by Clark Ashton Smith. Apparently Arabian Ghouls are quite civilized and sophisticated - at least in their speech.
*reads over Ghouls and Ghuls*...
Wait..so..could I make a Ghul Scarred Witch Doctor..?
I kinda want to now.